ATi Open drivers are coming of age... :)

[sdowney717]

i have an x1300 sitting around and cant use it. i need svideo out and they dont offer it on r500 chipset

[rajeev1204]

What exactly is the point of open drivers for 3d ? for example, games use proprietary technologies and the open source driver is incapable of running them.

For example, in id's games, there is a module called s3tc, tc is for texture compression and s3 has the patents for it,so it will never make it to the open source driver.And so, will never run a game with that .

Give me the proprietary drivers anyday.

@handy,which 2d applications are you talking about really? What is this 2D?

Iam sorry to say handy,but many have not probably understood why just opening a driver wont solve anything.

If by 3d you mean compiz, then we dont buy expensive graphics cards with shader model 4 for just that,do we?

good day.Sorry for the harsh post.Just opened my eyes when i reached point of no return with the open source driver.And on top of it,AMD dropped support for older cards so no proprietary drivers for me either.That means no gaming either.

Due to the reasons mentioned above, the drivers can never be fully functional.Will never come of age unless every single app using it and many other things we probably miss out are also open .COuld be hardware,software running on them and other legalese.

rajeev

[forrestcupp]

For example, in id's games, there is a module called s3tc, tc is for texture compression and s3 has the patents for it,so it will never make it to the open source driver.And so, will never run a game with that .

Anything can be reverse engineered with time. The Wine team has reverse engineered most of the features in DirectX, and I doubt if s3tc is more complicated than that.

[Hyporeal]

What exactly is the point of open drivers for 3d ? for example, games use proprietary technologies and the open source driver is incapable of running them.

For example, in id's games, there is a module called s3tc, tc is for texture compression and s3 has the patents for it,so it will never make it to the open source driver.And so, will never run a game with that .

Why can't open source drivers use patented techniques? You can already download the proprietary drivers for free, so there's no issue with fees. The patent publicly describes the technique, so there's no issue with secrecy. Why would S3 care whether ATI's drivers are open source or not, as long as the licensing fees get paid as usual?

[u.b.u.n.t.u]

I think ATI and Nvidia should open source their drivers and work closely with the linux community.

I buy their hardware, and a customer ought to be able to expect a fully working product on linux.

[jrusso2]

Any video card should be able to do excellent 2d. Its 3d performance that counts. I have ten year old cards here that do great in 2d.

[handy]

What exactly is the point of open drivers for 3d ? for example, games use proprietary technologies and the open source driver is incapable of running them.

As mentioned above by forrestcupp, reverse engineering is alive & well in the open-source community. Wireless users may be most aware of this.

The point of having open-source drivers, is that the code is open for all. It can be kept up to date with the kernel, mesa (which is where the GPU open-source is intended to reside & is in the process of being developed now) & the xorg-server.

Those who have been putting up with the terrible ATi driver support over the last years will be free of that burden.

Give me the proprietary drivers anyday.

That is your choice.

Though it is possible in the future that the only drivers provided by AMD for the ATi GPUs used by the distros will only be for their newest GPUs, due to the competition between AMD & nVidia.

I've not read that anywhere, it just seems like good business sense to me.

Time will tell.

@handy,which 2d applications are you talking about really? What is this 2D?

When I run the open-source drivers on my 24" iMac running an HD2600Pro GPU, the refresh speed of everything (opening, closing app's resizing & moving windows, scrolling in intensive graphic screens, the Firefox refresh speed - scrolling - on any site with many tabs open) is near instantaneous. Watching any form of video is perfect, as there is not the slightest hint of lag ever.

Using catalyst there is lag, in all of the above.

Iam sorry to say handy,but many have not probably understood why just opening a driver wont solve anything.

Actually, I think you have the bull by the horns. You will find as time goes by, that the open-source GPU drivers that are currently being worked on will do all & more than the proprietary ones. I know you won't take my word for it, though the proof will be in the pudding as 2010 goes by there will be some serious changes occur re. the support provided by the open-source drivers for many GPUs.

There are people already using the ATi open-source drivers for 3D games, though not the most demanding of them. I have used the open-source drivers & run some 3D, without any graphic aberrations, but with too much lag.

If by 3d you mean compiz, then we dont buy expensive graphics cards with shader model 4 for just that,do we?

I never use compiz or the like, I don't even have icons on my desktop, or a screen background. I personally consider that beyond making things as easy on your eyes as possible, anything else is a waste of resources. I know, there is no accounting for taste.

good day.Sorry for the harsh post.Just opened my eyes when i reached point of no return with the open source driver.And on top of it,AMD dropped support for older cards so no proprietary drivers for me either.That means no gaming either.

It is a drag when support disappears. I can't say for sure, hopefully there will be useful open-source support for your GPU?
Everything does reach an age where it is no longer supported though, hopefully your GPU is not there yet.

Due to the reasons mentioned above, the drivers can never be fully functional.Will never come of age unless every single app using it and many other things we probably miss out are also open .COuld be hardware,software running on them and other legalese.

rajeev

I think you will find that you are wrong on this. As I said before, keep an eye on the progress of the open-source ATi drivers over the coming year or so.

All the best.

[handy]

What exactly is the point of open drivers for 3d ? for example, games use proprietary technologies and the open source driver is incapable of running them.

For example, in id's games, there is a module called s3tc, tc is for texture compression and s3 has the patents for it,so it will never make it to the open source driver.And so, will never run a game with that .

I just happened to be poking about on the Neverwinter Nights Linux forum & read about a little Linux tool for handling S3TC:

Quote: Posted 08/11/09 14:02 (GMT) by CainGG

If it's the S3TC issue, you can install a program called driconf that will let you force S3TC to "on" for practically any video system...it worked for my Intel GM45 and it might work for you too.

There are always more than one way to skin a cat, especially in the FOSS world.

[holastickboy]

I have always seemed to have Nvidia cards on my linux pc's because the software just seemed to run much better. I managed to get a video card upgrade the other day to a Ati Radeon 3650 and was appalled about how primitive the ati drivers were, and what a big fuss it was to get my dual screens working properly (and not stretch games across both screens). I hadn't used an ATI card on linux for years, and I thought that in my hiatus that things would have improved, which they have to a small degree. I commend the people working had to make the open source drivers better!

[rajeev1204]

I just happened to be poking about on the Neverwinter Nights Linux forum & read about a little Linux tool for handling S3TC:

Quote: Posted 08/11/09 14:02 (GMT) by CainGG

If it's the S3TC issue, you can install a program called driconf that will let you force S3TC to "on" for practically any video system...it worked for my Intel GM45 and it might work for you too.

There are always more than one way to skin a cat, especially in the FOSS world.

This is good information thanks.And thanks for the replies to my long post,i appreciate that you took it positively.I still dont know how to multiquote so i didnt reply to that post of yours.

BTW,I finally got a brand new AMD RADEON 4850 .And the proprietary drivers are working great.

But i have read that Radeon HD open drivers are catching up soon so thats good news.But it still wont solve the s3tc or other issues without a little R and D.

Anyways,lets hope for the best.

T.C.
rajeev