# The Ubuntu Forum Community > Ubuntu Community Discussions > Mobile Technology Discussions >  Firefox OS smartphones due 2013 as Mozilla reveals partners

## vasa1

"Mozilla has officially named its Boot to Gecko mobile platform, which will now be known as Firefox OS, and has signed up a clutch of carriers who have promised to back the new smartphone competitor. Deutsche Telekom, Etisalat, Smart, Sprint, Telecom Italia, Telefonica and Telenor have all jumped on board with the HTML5-based OS, while ZTE and Alcatel One Touch will both be creating devices expected to launch in early 2013."

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## forrestcupp

I can't see it seriously competing with Android or iOS. I like having more to an OS than just being based on a web browser, whether it be Firefox or Chrome. Aside from that, I think it's probably too late for them to push their way into the game. I think Microsoft is going to be the only one that has any chance at that at all, and I think that chance is slim.

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## Dlambert

> I can't see it seriously competing with Android or iOS. I like having more to an OS than just being based on a web browser, whether it be Firefox or Chrome. Aside from that, I think it's probably too late for them to push their way into the game. I think Microsoft is going to be the only one that has any chance at that at all, and I think that chance is slim.


I agree with you there, it's like starting a new car company and trying to dominate sales. Impossible.

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## Dragonbite

> I can't see it seriously competing with Android or iOS.


Does it really have to compete with them?  If it covers costs and makes Mozilla a little money (or a lot of money!) then isn't it a success even if it holds the #4 or #5 slot?

Mozilla has always been more for freedom and openness so any success of this phone should be a win for everybody (even if they don't use it, Linux or open source).

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## irv

Firefox OS Powered Smartphones Launching Early Next Year
ff.png
With so many OS's out here my head is starting to spin. I'm running Ubuntu, my wife is running Chrome OS on her Chromebook, now we have Firefox coming to a cell phone. What's next?

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## kaldor

Good to see that this is actually going to happen.

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## Dr. C

> Firefox OS Powered Smartphones Launching Early Next Year
> ff.png
> With so many OS's out here my head is starting to spin. I'm running Ubuntu, my wife is running Chrome OS on her Chromebook, now we have Firefox coming to a cell phone. What's next?


A cell phone that becomes a desktop computer.

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## Artemis3

> now we have Firefox coming to a cell phone. What's next?


Ubuntu, or some other Linux distro. Don't want no stinking Android  :Capital Razz:

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## Lightstar

As much as i love mozilla and firefox, I think they should stick with their applications.

I have no interest in a firefox OS.  I'm quite happy with android.

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## Primefalcon

Personally I wont touch a smart phone until I can have som raw flavour of Linux running on one.... This locked down Android IOS kinda defeats the point IMO of a computer in your pocket (hardware they're more than powerful enough.... but software.... they're too locked down on what you can do

until then... a small netbook/tablet running skype suits me perfectly.. since I am honestly more interested in the carry around compouter aspect tbh

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## irv

> A cell phone that becomes a desktop computer.


Or a Desktop that becomes a cell phone:
phone.png

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## Primefalcon

> Or a Desktop that becomes a cell phone:
> phone.png


heh, google voice, I use that all the time free calls to the u.s and canada ftw.... tbh I barely use a house phone anymore at all, last time was nearly a year ago

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## irv

> heh, google voice, I use that all the time free calls to the u.s and canada ftw.... tbh I barely use a house phone anymore at all, last time was nearly a year ago


Or just hang out with friends and family.
Hangout.jpg

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## Retlol

I don't think the mobile OS market has settled down at all.

As long as it's on your mobile phone, people will use pretty much any OS.

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## Dragonbite

One thing that makes this interesting is the (sole?) use of HTML5 for applications including those that have to touch the deeper framework.

This could provide ramifications if it develops a means to get deeper into the system securely with HTML5 applications on the possibilities of desktop applications and servers.

It runs in line with trying to move applications to cloud apps, could theoretically push into a "write-once-run-anywhere" scenario that Java failed to fully attend, and otherwise possibly reduce the barrier for programs and even reduce resources/footprint.  Possibly.

I do hope that Firefox is able to benefit from this in the way of cold, hard cash because if this is what they can do with their current budget, I wonder what they could do with a larger revenue stream!

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## forrestcupp

> Or a Desktop that becomes a cell phone:
> phone.png


Lol. I used to use my desktop as a phone back in the dial up days. I remember trying to use the built in speakers and microphone on my monitor, and getting a lot of feedback.

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## irv

> Lol. I used to use my desktop as a phone back in the dial up days. I remember trying to use the built in speakers and microphone on my monitor, and getting a lot of feedback.


By the way I always love Dr. Seuss
Dr Seuss.png
The Dr. is in.

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## nec207

Does anyone have any screenshots what this new Firefox OS is going to look like and what features it will have.

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## tjeremiah

I was hoping it would come to pcs so I can install and try from there.

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## Dragonbite

You can get a picture of it here ().  Applications are supposed to be all HTML5.

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## irv

> Does anyone have any screenshots what this new Firefox OS is going to look like and what features it will have.


Check out this video. Very cool.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GdZxb...layer_embedded
Edit: In fact watch all the videos on this page: http://play.google.com/about/?utm_so...paign=gplaunch
Edit: here is a photo on this link. http://www.geeknewscentral.com/

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## cfg83

tjeremiah - 




> I was hoping it would come to pcs so I can install and try from there.


You can go here : 

https://wiki.mozilla.org/Gaia/Hacking

You will find this : 




> _As of July 13th, B2G Desktop Builds are working for Linux, Windows and OS X.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 			
> 				An installer for windows that works out of the box is available from
> https://github.com/downloads/sihorto...ia-desktop.exe
> ...


It didn't work correctly on my Windows XP 32-bit.  It needs msvcp100.dll, which I think is a Visual Studio 2010 dependency.  On my W7 64-bit that has Visual Studio 2010 it doesn't run perfectly, but you get a good sense of it's look and feel.  I also like the test apps.

Carlos

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## Primefalcon

I was scoffing when I first heard of this... but the more I think of it.... the more I think this will be a win for openness and the closer we get to just throwing Linux on these babies

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## Dragonbite

I don't think Mozilla has to penetrate the market nearly as much as Google, Apple and Microsoft have to, in part because they don't have (greedy) share holders breathing down their neck for profit!

Each video I see of it, it looks (and responds) better and better.  I am hoping that this thinks different enough to carve a (sustainable) niche out for itself.

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## BrokenKingpin

> I can't see it seriously competing with Android or iOS. I like having more to an OS than just being based on a web browser, whether it be Firefox or Chrome. Aside from that, I think it's probably too late for them to push their way into the game. I think Microsoft is going to be the only one that has any chance at that at all, and I think that chance is slim.


I agree for the most part. I would much prefer a mobile OS that uses more of the technologies from Desktop Linux, like Meego or Tizen. But as you said, these OSs will have a hard time getting any market traction, even if they are technically better than the competition.

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## Carl.Spackler

I would love to have the ability to nuke android and install ubuntu or mint on my EVO LTE. It's a bit disappointing to not have something aside from android on a great piece of hardware.

Maybe just creating a phone OS that does not rely on Microsoft, Google or Apple to legislate the direction of is what is needed and leeching private data - more of a community mobile OS that is secure and privacy oriented. An OS that can be ported to a variety of existing android based hardware.

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## BrokenKingpin

> I would love to have the ability to nuke android and install ubuntu or mint on my EVO LTE. It's a bit disappointing to not have something aside from android on a great piece of hardware.


I can see using the Ubuntu core (although maybe a bit heavy for a phone), but a custom DE would need to be created for that small of a screen.

I personally liked Maemo, which was based off of Debian with a GTK interface.

There is also Open WebOS, which I think has the most potential to make any penetration into the market.

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## cfg83

BrokenKingpin -




> I can see using the Ubuntu core (although maybe a bit heavy for a phone), but a custom DE would need to be created for that small of a screen.
> 
> I personally liked Maemo, which was based off of Debian with a GTK interface.
> 
> There is also *Open WebOS*, which I think has the most potential to make any penetration into the market.


Thanks for posting this.  Yet *another* OS I need to study,  .

Carlos

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## vexorian

> I can't see it seriously competing with Android or iOS. I like having more to an OS than just being based on a web browser, whether it be Firefox or Chrome. Aside from that, I think it's probably too late for them to push their way into the game. I think Microsoft is going to be the only one that has any chance at that at all, and I think that chance is slim.


The mobile market is currently very healthy. Although Android and iOS are dominating it, there are still many players on it. Things like Symbian and WebOS have market slices that ARE lucrative (5% of a lot is quite a good amount)  and are realistic targets for Firefox OS if they do a good job.

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## ugm6hr

If this succeeds in being a suitable replacement for the Nokia Symbian not-so-smart-phones (e.g. 5500 Xpressmusic) - then they are on to a winner.

Cheap android phones abound, but none are usable below the £100 mark (prepaid UK price). If this is actually lighter than Android, it may fill that gap nicely.

Good luck to them.

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## mr john

I wonder if it will be clunky and slow like their web browser.





> none are usable below the £100 mark (prepaid UK price).


When I got my HTC Desire it cost £350. The reason why I never got the Nexus or the Galaxy 2/3 was that my Desire was a good size and was perfectly capable of running nearly all the same apps that my workmates Galaxy Nexus had. I couldn't justify spending another 350+ for a phone that is not much bigger and runs the same apps.   I eventually  stopped my desire in favour of the Samsung Europa which cost me £29.99 +£15 top-up. It normally retails at £39.99+£15 but I got a discount. This would be considered by many to be a downgrade  rather than an upgrade. The screen is small, but it runs all the same apps as my Desire and also practically all the same apps as my workmates Galaxy Nexus. It runs them quickly and it fits in my pocket better than my big phone.  The main apps I use are email, tunein radio, cardiotrainer (gps), micoach, facebook, skype, spotify and some spanish language apps because I moved to Honduras in June. If I lose or break this phone it's only 40 quid down the drain as opposed to £350 or more. Maybe to some this phone is unusable, but I actually quite like it. I might still get the S3 next time I visit home though  :Smile:

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## vexorian

I wonder if it will be very customizable and freer with less privacy issues and more standard-following like their browser.

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## Dragonbite

> I wonder if it will be very customizable and freer with less privacy issues and more standard-following like their browser.


That's one thing  that I like about the idea of the Mozilla phone... their dedication to freedom and openness.  They are one of the examples of FOSS that is working and without controversy (or drama).

I hope that it is good enough (for me) that I this dedication to the FOSS philosophy is able to push my decision away from the "shiny" alternatives.

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## IWantFroyo

A phone really needs more than a web browser. And a lot of the time phones are offline (unless you have a ridiculously large data plan).

This is going to be interesting.

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## cfg83

mr john -




> ...
> 
> When I got my HTC Desire it cost £350. The reason why I never got the Nexus or the Galaxy 2/3 was that my Desire was a good size and was perfectly capable of running nearly all the same apps that my workmates Galaxy Nexus had. I couldn't *justify* spending another 350+ for a phone that is not much bigger and runs the same apps.   I eventually  stopped my desire in favour of the Samsung Europa which cost me £29.99 +£15 top-up. It normally retails at £39.99+£15 but I got a discount. This would be considered by many to be a downgrade  rather than an upgrade. The screen is small, but it runs all the same apps as my Desire and also practically all the same apps as my workmates Galaxy Nexus. It runs them quickly and it fits in my pocket better than my big phone.  The main apps I use are email, tunein radio, cardiotrainer (gps), micoach, facebook, skype, spotify and some spanish language apps because I moved to Honduras in June. *If I lose or break this phone it's only 40 quid down the drain as opposed to £350 or more*. Maybe to some this phone is unusable, but I actually quite like it. I might still get the S3 next time I visit home though


You have hit my POV on the nose.  I can't ju$tify the co$t of an expen$ive $martphone that i$ vu£nerab£e to being  £o$t or broken.  I just don't want to spend time worrying about it.

Carlos

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## cfg83

IWantFroyo -




> A phone really needs more than a web browser. And a lot of the time phones are offline (unless you have a ridiculously large data plan).
> 
> This is going to be interesting.


The HTML-based apps are *supposed* to be self-contained downloads onto your smart phone, so they don't need the web (think local HTML folder hierarchy).  Also, HTML5 allows for off-line data storage, so HTML5 apps will be able to remember their context.

If the Firefox OS phones are released in Brazil on schedule and for the el cheapo price of $50 then I will be tempted to figure out how to get one in my grubby little hands after they are released. 

Carlos

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## vexorian

If all the cellphone did was really browse the web and make phone calls , then I would get it if it had a decent price. Because really, I can't think of more uses for a cell phone, so I would rather not pay for features I would not be using anyway (And yes radios, cameras and apps, I am talking about you).

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## KiwiNZ

With Android, Windows and IOS I believe there is enough Cellphone OS's.

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## vexorian

I bet someone in the 80s said something like that when windows 1.0 appeared - Between Unix, Amiga, MS-DOS and Mac OS we got enough PC operating systems.

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## KiwiNZ

There has been other attempts at phone OS's. WebOS, Symbian to name two and they have gone the way of the Dodo.

There has been attempts at other OS's . OS2 Warp,  for EG however there is still only two main contenders for the desktop.

It is a market that cannot have numerous OS's.

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## Dragonbite

> With Android, Windows and IOS I believe there is enough Cellphone OS's.


And WebOS and Symbian

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## Mikeb85

> There has been other attempts at phone OS's. WebOS, Symbian to name two and they have gone the way of the Dodo.
> 
> There has been attempts at other OS's . OS2 Warp,  for EG however there is still only two main contenders for the desktop.
> 
> It is a market that cannot have numerous OS's.


And it's a shame because the Linux phone OS has the most technical disadvantages (being run on Java).

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## vexorian

^ Big deal. Windows 8 runs on .NET. iOS probably has some sort of layer too. 


PS: Ubuntu's main apps primarily run on python.





> There has been other attempts at phone OS's. WebOS, Symbian to name two and they have gone the way of the Dodo.
> 
> There has been attempts at other OS's . OS2 Warp,  for EG however there is still only two main contenders for the desktop.
> 
> It is a market that cannot have numerous OS's.


You missed the whole point. Believe it or not, smart phones are a very young market. The Home OS' starting years were unrecognizable from today - Windows didn't even exist. Even 20 years later, ubuntu was just started. It would have been silly to appear in the 2000s and say that it is not necessary to make ubuntu - Windows and OS/X already had the market and there were plenty of distros. But today, ubuntu is in a good position and has caused many great changes in the Linux Desktop. I don't think new Operating systems are ever unnecessary. At the very least, they force the dominating OSes to stay awake and keep innovating.

But why care about market domination? That only matters if you are a monopolyst wanting to grab control over the world. Let apple and google fight over that. But if you are a small company looking to increase some profit, like mozilla. Then even 1% of the market pie would be great news for them. Ignoring the very mainstream part in which iOS and Android are fighting, the remaining set of mobile OSes is a very alive market with plenty of opportunities for smaller companies. I am not saying this is going to work, but that it _can_ work if Mozilla does a good job. And if it is not Mozilla which refreshes this smaller part of the market, then it will be another company.

And of course, there is such a thing like having ulterior objectives. This is true for google. They want Android and give it away for free, but it is primarily to protect their mobile market. Firefox OS may as well be a Mozilla move to promote Firefox as a mobile browser and put more weight in the HTML5 battle over flash (very important due to google's monopolisitic Pepper Flash deal).




> And WebOS and Symbian


 Those are good targets for Mozilla actually. Symbian is doomed to death and WebOS remains unheard of for most people. Nevertheless, they ARE holding market share that a small OS that works well can reclaim.

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## Porcini M.

Here's a pro-Firefox OS article:

http://rawkes.com/articles/there-is-...out-firefox-os

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## cfg83

Hello -

Here is a tasty little tidbit that I like : 

*Mozilla Gains Global Support For a Firefox Mobile OS* - 2012/07/02
http://blog.mozilla.org/blog/2012/07...fox-mobile-os/



> _Device manufacturers TCL Communication Technology (under the Alcatel One  Touch brand) and ZTE today announced their intentions to manufacture  the first devices to feature the new Firefox OS, using Snapdragon  processors from Qualcomm Incorporated, the leader in smartphone  platforms. The first Firefox OS powered devices are expected to launch  commercially in Brazil in early 2013 through Telefónicas commercial  brand, Vivo._


Carlos

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## mr john

ZTE aren't exactly known for making quality phones.

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## vexorian

If you want quality phones , get iphones or high end droids.

This is a different market. It is no shock they are starting in Brazil. Down here in latin America it is silly to get an ultra expensive phone. Say 500 USD in a phone. It may be economically accessible (it is to me) but chances are you are gonna lose or get it stolen within three months. It is more practical to go for cheap phones.

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## mr john

I live in Honduras, one of the poorest countries in Latin America, and have a $39.99 Samsung phone with capticitve screen, Android 2.3, GPS and all the usual apps. If you're going to spend even a small amount of money on a smartphone you don't go ZTE when there are better alternatives available for the same price.





> And of course, there is such a thing like having ulterior objectives.


I love when people start talking about IT companies having ulterior motives  :Smile:

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## vexorian

a) If you think $39.99  for a cell phone is low, then you are probably not in the target market of the ZTWatever firefox OS phones. But note that more than that brand are gonna make them. 
b) You should avoid replying so quickly because when I said "ulterior motives" I was trying to say motives that are not very obvious. I was just having issues thinking of a good word at that time. 

In case of firefox OS, Mozilla may be looking forward to promote HTML5 and their mobile firefox browser, thus gaining marketshare may be a secundary objective. 

This is something we already know of Android. Google is investing a lot of money in that thing they are giving away for free and we can tell it is a defensive move against mobile monopoly. A suspiscion that was proven correct these days when we learned that Apple can replace Google maps and force sillier alternatives on people with no warning.

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## Elfy

> ...
> I love when people start talking about IT companies having ulterior motives





> ...
> b) You should avoid replying so quickly because when I said "ulterior motives" I was trying to say motives that are not very obvious. I was just having issues thinking of a good word at that time. ...


I'd not say that replying with a quote 6 days later is too quick, what I would say is, quoting something now that was edited out 6 days ago quite frankly looks like posting to start an argument.

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## rasmus91

Well, it should atleast function better than their firefox browser for android. I definitely prefer FF on my Windows PC as well as my Ubuntu PC, but on my phone its chrome, because it is so much better than the mobile version of FF. Looking forward to see these phones when they come out though, but i dont think they would make me want to swap from android anytime soon.

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## cfg83

rasmus91 -




> Well, it should atleast function better than their firefox browser for android. I definitely prefer FF on my Windows PC as well as my Ubuntu PC, but *on my phone its chrome, because it is so much better than the mobile version of FF*. Looking forward to see these phones when they come out though, but i dont think they would make me want to swap from android anytime soon.


Yeah, I would definitely tend to favor the "native" browser for any mobile device, aka Safari for iPhone and Chrome for Android.

Carlos

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## cfg83

Hello -

Here is something I just found : 

*Meet the Mozilla OS Developer Phone* - Sep. 21, 2012
http://www.geek.com/articles/mobile/...hone-20120921/



> _Its no secret that Mozilla has been working on a mobile OS. Previously codenamed Boot2Gecko, the project focused on a purely HTML5 based system that worked in many ways like current mobile devices. As the project grew into Mozilla OS, the company has laid out a partnership with ZTE that will have real world devices in certain markets early next year. Testing for this OS had previously consisted of a compiled ROM that would be flashed over a handful of Android devices. Now, Mozilla has moved into full fledged product evaluation mode with their own custom developer phone.
> 
> As expected of any developer device, theres no branding to be found. No one at Mozilla was willing to confirm that ZTE was the manufacturer of the developer device, though the phone bears a vague resemblance to a couple of previous generation ZTE Android phones. The 480 x 800 display isnt winning any beauty contest, but certainly gets the job done. The phone uses microUSB for power, a 3.5mm headphone jack and a 5MP camera. The phone is powered by a 1.5GHz processor, but no mention of how many cores or the manufacturer.
> 
> ..._


Carlos

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## WinterMadness

> Personally I wont touch a smart phone until I can have som raw flavour of Linux running on one.... This locked down Android IOS kinda defeats the point IMO of a computer in your pocket (hardware they're more than powerful enough.... but software.... they're too locked down on what you can do
> 
> until then... a small netbook/tablet running skype suits me perfectly.. since I am honestly more interested in the carry around compouter aspect tbh


they have a fsf compliant version of android. I forget the name but its all free software. problem is, I think it only runs on one phone

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## kio_http

This is good news indeed, I would have loved it if nokia had stuck to meego though as that was really an outstanding and unique OS.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gfE3B6L-Otw

Nokia n9 demonstration with meego.

Until something decent and open comes out no smartphone for me. I will definitely never go for iOS or Windows phone.

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## litiform

I don't like any of the Android hardware. Hopefully FirefoxOS can get on some good hardware.

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## sandyd

*Welcome to the new Mobile Technology Discussions forum*

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## Dragonbite

> *Welcome to the new Mobile Technology Discussions forum*


Awesome!

Now I wish I had a smartphone!

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## zikalify

I hope these devices are very low cost.

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## Dragonbite

> I hope these devices are very low cost.


They are supposed to be for less expensive phones, but are going to be released in limited markets, Brazil I think.

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