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Thread: Firefox 1.5 Backport

  1. #151
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    Ubuntu Development Release

    Re: Firefox 1.5 Backport

    You must only be in your 20s or 30s poofy

  2. #152
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    Re: Firefox 1.5 Backport

    Quote Originally Posted by Limulus
    Perhaps (though, I can't do it either, so i don't really know , but another concern was that because Backports is now official (and has been since late into Hoary), they also have to support those packages for the duration of the release itself... So for the developers, its do we let people install via a script that works ok for another three months, or do we take time off from the dapper one to make a breezy version that will need support (bug fixes, etc.) for over a year? I think you can see why they chose the path they did
    One option would be to issue a deb of 1.5 that:
    - just placed it in /opt and set up shortcuts, like I said,
    - and didn't remove 1.0.7.
    And they could say: "hey, this will be the *only* deb of FF 1.5 in this Ubuntu release. Forget about bug fixes!"
    That way, we could enjoy being somewhat bleeding edge, and still be able to turn to the old official Ubuntu-version if 1.5 gets a huge bug that will make it dangerous to use.

    Quote Originally Posted by Limulus
    So as you can see, they're trying for relatively stable releases, not necessarily the latest software; we who want FF 1.5 right now are perhaps not the target demographic for Ubuntu... as I mentioned in the other post, maybe the alpha and beta releases (flight/colony/whatever) are the way to go.
    But I don't want bleeding edge all over the place, but I want to utilise the power of an upgraded version of the software that I use way more than all other software.

    - Ketil

  3. #153
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    Re: Firefox 1.5 Backport

    Quote Originally Posted by kleeman
    You must only be in your 20s or 30s poofy

    LOL. 23.
    Those folks who try to impose analog rules on digital content will find themselves on the wrong side of the tidal wave.
    - Mark Shuttleworth

  4. #154
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    Re: Firefox 1.5 Backport

    Quote Originally Posted by poofyhairguy
    Yet.

    I hope for a better future.
    Hope is never enough. Automatix isnt either.

  5. #155
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    Re: Firefox 1.5 Backport

    Quote Originally Posted by kaaredyret
    Hope is never enough. Automatix isnt either.
    Can you explain this statement? Why is Automatix never enough?

  6. #156

    Re: Firefox 1.5 Backport

    Quote Originally Posted by poofyhairguy
    Automatix is VERY easy to use
    I tried it last night. I installed "Midi capability", "Eject CD from Drive" and "Ctrl-Alt-Del". The first one didn't work as far as I can tell. I also noted a general lack of explanation of exactly what it was going to do (can we say 'informed consent'?) and a lack of an uninstall feature. Then this morning I went into Synaptic and I noticed that it had replaced my sources.list without telling me first. That wasn't very nice. So I uninstalled it. Fortunately it made a backup of my old sources.list first, or I would have been *pissed*.

    I see now why they say you shouldn't run programs as root

    Edit: I went over to the Automatix thread to get some help (I basically copied in the above text) and eventually got some help, but the guy who runs it, "arnieboy" acted like a jerk about it. Anyway, I will be taking the info from Automatix that work on my system and incorporate them into my page.
    Last edited by Limulus; January 13th, 2006 at 08:34 PM.

  7. #157
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    Re: Firefox 1.5 Backport

    Quote Originally Posted by aysiu
    Can you explain this statement? Why is Automatix never enough?
    Oh, this tool is just not enough to push Ubuntu much further, thats all I meant. I used it myself, but I only use it because I have been all around the forum, looking for how to's, help, etc.

    Users should be able to get the most out of Ubuntu without having relying on community support. Its wonderful to have the community and it does make some open source/closed source products special, but usability is not about bringing desperate people together but about making things work.

    Again, just in case: forget about me and my rants, but reflect a little about the core of the problem: how to improve Ubuntu and make all this work, out of the box.

    I put a lot of effort into my installation, and it still wasnt enough. Some issues cannot be resolved, some took days, weeks to resolve, using obscure how-to's. I am very grateful for the help, but think about all those that gave up, all those that looked at the how-to's and thought "jesus", all those that wasnt into all this sudo stuff and editing config files, all those that just didnt understand and all those that refused.

    I have been listening to (geeks, thats what they were) telling people like me "take it or LEAVE IT" for ... 10 years I think. The problem for Linux is, that so few take it.

    I have been working with usability for some time now, and I have been listening to A LOT of rants. Did I get upset, tell people to take it or leave it, or just ignore them? No, certainly not. Feedback is feedback, and even angry persons can have a valid point. They cant even speak on behalf of a lot of people. Critisism is important.

    Ubuntu Linux still isnt good enough for me, and I wont stop telling you why. I really dont care about whether or not this gives me friends in here, because I am here for two reasons: finding how-to's (a problem in itself that I need them at all) and to make you guys THINK! I read your replies with satisfaction, because if I provoke you then it makes you reflect a little, that is my hope at least.

    If you want Linux to gain a lot of new users and supporters, then please understand that these users could be unlike yourself. Users are costumers: their satisfaction is important to you. If people spread the word "Linux is too complicated" then its really not good for "the community".

  8. #158
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    Re: Firefox 1.5 Backport

    Hey Kaaredyret, I know what you mean, but let me tell you that Breezy is much faster and more "out of the box" thing than Hoary was. So, take it easy. Ubuntu is still, unbelievably polished, but young distro!
    Expect that DD will be even better, although I really am satisfied with Breezy. I spent much more time tweaking the stuff, doing this, doing that in Hoary! Breezy worked almost instantly (both were installed clean).

  9. #159

    Re: Firefox 1.5 Backport

    Quote Originally Posted by aysiu
    I think Ubuntu is designed to be installed by a Linux expert (or novice who's willing to learn to be an expert) and used by a computer novice.
    That reminds me, way back when, of when I got my first computer: a Tandy 1000 SX A friend of my mom's set it up to run DOS; I recall it took a while and there was a lot of command line magic I totally had no clue about at the time...

    I'm starting to think that Ubuntu needs some sort of tutorial file (animation?) sitting near the center of the desktop when there's a clean install. Even just something to teach the newbies about Synaptic (an almost alien concept of installing programs to someone migrating from Windows). The more I think about things like Automatix, the more I get annoyed; I've been looking at the code and most of it is just installing packages (there are a scripts that do neat things, but they could probably be done with packages too ;P).

    Maybe I'm just biased; its been almost a year since I first tried Ubuntu (my first real taste of Linux and once I discovered Synaptic, I was like a kid in a candy store ^_-

    But getting back to your comments about setup, I suspect its really that way for most OSs; just think how much better Windows would be for a newbie if you got an expert in to setup all the antivirus, antimalware, firewall, misc. security stuff, put Firefox and Thunderbird on, maybe even remove Windows Media player and replace it with one of the alternatives... that sort of thing.

    Ubuntu definitely has the security aspect down though

  10. #160
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
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    1,377

    Re: Firefox 1.5 Backport

    Quote Originally Posted by kaaredyret
    Oh, this tool is just not enough to push Ubuntu much further, thats all I meant. I used it myself, but I only use it because I have been all around the forum, looking for how to's, help, etc.

    Users should be able to get the most out of Ubuntu without having relying on community support. Its wonderful to have the community and it does make some open source/closed source products special, but usability is not about bringing desperate people together but about making things work.

    Again, just in case: forget about me and my rants, but reflect a little about the core of the problem: how to improve Ubuntu and make all this work, out of the box.

    I put a lot of effort into my installation, and it still wasnt enough. Some issues cannot be resolved, some took days, weeks to resolve, using obscure how-to's. I am very grateful for the help, but think about all those that gave up, all those that looked at the how-to's and thought "jesus", all those that wasnt into all this sudo stuff and editing config files, all those that just didnt understand and all those that refused.

    I have been listening to (geeks, thats what they were) telling people like me "take it or LEAVE IT" for ... 10 years I think. The problem for Linux is, that so few take it.

    I have been working with usability for some time now, and I have been listening to A LOT of rants. Did I get upset, tell people to take it or leave it, or just ignore them? No, certainly not. Feedback is feedback, and even angry persons can have a valid point. They cant even speak on behalf of a lot of people. Critisism is important.

    Ubuntu Linux still isnt good enough for me, and I wont stop telling you why. I really dont care about whether or not this gives me friends in here, because I am here for two reasons: finding how-to's (a problem in itself that I need them at all) and to make you guys THINK! I read your replies with satisfaction, because if I provoke you then it makes you reflect a little, that is my hope at least.

    If you want Linux to gain a lot of new users and supporters, then please understand that these users could be unlike yourself. Users are costumers: their satisfaction is important to you. If people spread the word "Linux is too complicated" then its really not good for "the community".
    the best thing about Linux is that you have a vast choice. I am not telling about only other Linux distros, but also FreeBS, Solaris, Windows and so on. So if you feel that Ubuntu is not up to your expectation, try other OS. You may find the one which suits your needs if not perfectly but close.

    While I understand your point to improve Ubuntu, I guess it is easier to switch to something more suitable then to make so much efforts to tell people that Ubuntu is not good here and there.

    I started with Windows, then eventually switched to SuSE, tried acouple other distros and ended up with Ubuntu, because it suits all my current computer needs. However, on my laptop I use XFCE and E17 both compiled from CVS/SVN, Amarok, Mplayer, Gaim from CVS, experimental InitNG, FF and TB 1.5 and a number of other programmes compiled from source and I am not a comuter geek at all. I do it because it's very easy.

    While on the desktop I have a mostly pure Ubuntu without much alterartions and it suits most of my family. So the point is that one chooses the system which fits one's needs.

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