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Thread: To make the gods aware

  1. #1
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    To make the gods aware

    Gods,

    I posted the following thread: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=894786

    and received the following message regarding the thread:

    Hello,

    It is against forum policy to give support on illegal activity. The Wifi Predator states in the article:
    Quote:
    *Note: It is illegal to use a wireless access point that you are not authorized to use.
    However, the basic question you wanted to ask is not illegal. I suggest two ways around this:

    1) Repost your question, but remove the illegal references.

    -or-

    2) Use a google search for the terms "DD-WRT compatible"

    The second option is likely to get you the most speedy results.

    Thank you,
    dmizer
    I sent the following replies:

    I am aware of the legality of using unauthorized access points as I am aware of the forum policy. The WiFi predator it an extended range repeater. I would think that reminding people that it's use on unauthorized networks is illegal is a plus and not a minus.

    What you've basically said is that if I post a tutorial on how to make a spear (a legal item) that's just fine, but if I tell someone that it is illegal to kill their neighbor with it then I have broken policy -- are you a lunatic?

    Not only that, the policy in question:
    "Adult Content/Violence/Illegal Activity: Messages containing sexually oriented/violent/illegal dialogue, images, content, or links to these things will be deleted. Messages with links to or suggesting illegal activity will also be deleted. Posting or linking to any of these could result in a ban." does not apply.

    I have just reread the article that I posted and I have found no reference to using unauthorized access points and no reference to encryption cracking. Therefore the link that I posted has no "suggest[ion of] illegal activity" and in fact explicitly states what NOT to do. The link contains only one suggestion on use and that is a connection to a fully public and legal access point being announced as "Free Wireless Internet." In fact, I have found two places (including the one your quoted) where it explicitly states other activities are illegal.

    It would seem to me that if it is against forum policy to post illegal activities then posting information that is readily available anyway which includes no instruction on performing illegal activities but does contain warnings of the legality of possible things that could be done with the equipment can only be good.

    Further it would seem to me that you did not carefully read the context of the article that I posted and simply profiled the device based on your own bias and to that, sir, I would ask "What have you been doing?"


    Xan
    An additional thought, I did not post a question regarding a DD-WRT compatible router, I posted a question about a router with the applicable antenna. I have tried googling fro an answer (as I always do before posting here) and have not found many promising results as most non-commercial router and access point providers do not post specification beyond signal range for their antennas.


    Again, best wishes,

    Xan
    Now, I post here for two reasons. I fail to see how I erred in the original post and I would like make it known that this interaction between myself and a Mod has transacted.

    I would like to have this post reopened or at least to have someone explain to me why posting material stating that something if used in a certain waY is illegal and not to do this is the same as posting a link to content "Suggesting Illegal Activity."

    Best wishes,

    Xan
    Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning.

  2. #2
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  3. #3
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    Re: To make the gods aware

    OK'

    1.Asking a staff member if he/she is a lunatic is not appropriate or tolerated.
    You can count your self lucky I am have yet taken further action regarding that

    2. I willconsider your request here and come back soonest
    This account is not active.

  4. #4
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    Re: To make the gods aware

    My language may have been a bit more colorful than necessary, but I honestly was floored by the whole thing and honestly did find the assumption to be lunacy, hence my question. I will try to be a bit more respectful in that arena, but the idea that asking a technical question about something is objectionable simply because someone might decide to use it in a harmful or illegal manner completely diminishes both moral of the members of the board and the free exchange of idea and advice.

    If we ban this particular post because it's contents could be used for illegal purposes, then all posts on anything regarding bittorrent, encryption, automatix (illegal media codecs can be installed with it), default passwords, password replacement, Windows SAM injection, bios/cmos reset, security vulnerabilities, hashing functions, and chrooting from a live cd should also be banned. It is one thing to outright state that one should steal, destroy, or harm using elecronic tools and subroutines it is quite another to post material explaining how to make these tools and how to use them -- especially if that material contains explicit warnings regarding what is illegal and what is not.

    Please, I implore you to see that freely available information is paramount to our everyday freedom and that it should be a person's decision to break the law. We all have the freedom of action and we should not try to restrict that with ignorance. Security through obfuscation is a terrible idea that insures that those who are simply curious must seek information from less-than-reputable sources. This is where coruption begins.


    Xan
    Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning.

  5. #5
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    Re: To make the gods aware

    Looking at the device I am strugglung to work out what "legal" purposes it could be put to . And I guess that is why it can not be sold in the USA.

    The removalof your post was in line with the Forum Code of conduct.

    We do this to ensure the Forums position and to protect its owners from litigation.

    You state "that it should be a person's decision to break the law" then surely it is the Forums right to make the decision not to break any laws.

    This is a moderated forum and we reserve the right to edit content.
    This account is not active.

  6. #6
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    Re: To make the gods aware

    Honestly, I'm floored, because I don't know an illegal purpose that this device could be put to, except connecting to insecure access points and you don't even really need it for that, you can do that with a laptop in a city and a laptop and a car in the country.

    I intend to use it for the following -- all legal -- reasons:
    1. I work for a major university and live about a half mile from campus, with this device I can connect to our corporate wireless, to which I have an accound with full access and permission.
    2. To connect to my home wireless internet from my garage on the hill.
    3. To connect to a friends wireless down the road for the purposes of gaming.

    This article contains nothing about Haciking or cracking any kind of encryption... the only thing it does is extend the capabilities of a wireless device.

    Also, I can't see how posting a link to information housed at another site is breaking any laws, when the content of the post contains no illegal information.

    Anyway, you're the admin and I'll live with it, not that I have a choice, but information should not be suppressed and I find this decision to be disheartening.

    Xan
    Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning.

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