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Thread: Is talking about piracy different from advocating piracy?

  1. #61
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    Re: Linux: 'Cause it's free, open, or better?

    Quote Originally Posted by rune0077 View Post
    That really depends on what "our own interests are". Personally, I would love to see Linux prosper, but I would love much more to see a change in law that means we wouldn't have to throw roughly 90% of every teenager in the world in jail - hence, I would rather support piracy than I would Linux, if it came to a choice (luckily, it don't). Yeah yeah, I know, we don't actually throw them in jail but you get my point.
    Actually, Microsoft has supported piracy in the past. For a long time, they turned a blind eye to China's rampant use of unlicensed Windows software, on the grounds that it would produce vendor lock-in in the long run.

    Respecting license agreements -- whether or not it is treated as a criminal, civil, or contractual matter -- is certainly in the interest of F/LOSS communities, and you will find that a number of these communities will feel the same way about this as this one does.
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  2. #62
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    Re: Linux: 'Cause it's free, open, or better?

    Quote Originally Posted by p_quarles View Post
    Respecting license agreements -- whether or not it is treated as a criminal, civil, or contractual matter -- is certainly in the interest of F/LOSS communities, and you will find that a number of these communities will feel the same way about this as this one does.
    I didn't claim otherwise, I just said that it is more important to me to see the laws on piracy change than it is to see Linux prosper.

  3. #63
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    Re: Is talking about piracy different from advocating piracy?

    I agree with OrangeCrate and p_quarles.

    As much I love free software (both as in beer and in speech) as anyone else on this board (hopefully ), I think there still need to respect to those who want money or have restricted license as part of their software. You may then disagree with it. Then in my book you have the option to go and use the free alternative, not stealing properity(sp?) software.
    This way you can tell people around you how you want the world.

    I think "it should be free or I steal it" (note the "") will backfire greatly if we try to force other people in our way of thinking/acting.


    It may be naive thinking of my side, but I have always been a sucker for mutual respect
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  4. #64
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    Re: Is talking about piracy different from advocating piracy?

    If Bill Gates is for piracy, I don't see how continuing to pirate software is some kind of civil disobedience. You're doing what "the man" wants. Granted, it's his second choice (the first choice is you paying for the license), but it's still in the top two.

    From Gates, Buffett a bit bearish; July 2, 1998:
    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Gates
    Although about 3 million computers get sold every year in China, but people don't pay for the software. Someday they will, though. As long as they are going to steal it, we want them to steal ours. They'll get sort of addicted, and then we'll somehow figure out how to collect sometime in the next decade.
    From Gates: how piracy worked for me in China; July 18, 2007:
    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Gates
    It's easier for our software to compete with Linux when there's piracy than when there's not
    Quote Originally Posted by The article itself
    Microsoft does not break out figures, but sales in China this year are expected to hit about $700 million.

    That is still less than the group’s earnings in California, but up threefold from 2004.

  5. #65
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    Re: Is talking about piracy different from advocating piracy?

    Quote Originally Posted by Artificial Intelligence View Post
    It may be naive thinking of my side, but I have always been a sucker for mutual respect
    Agreed. I choose not to buy and use MS products (as an example), and I use and am committed to FOSS. But, I do respect their right to come to market in their own manner.

    @p_quarles:

    Actually, Microsoft has supported piracy in the past. For a long time, they turned a blind eye to China's rampant use of unlicensed Windows software, on the grounds that it would produce vendor lock-in in the long run.
    It is just a matter of semantics, but I would rather not think of MS's philosophy as "supporting piracy", but more of a strategy of simply giving away the product, with long term penetration goals in mind.

    It was/is a pretty good marketing strategy, and not really any different than car manufacturers offering deep discounts (potentially unprofitable) to stimulate sales, and to support profitable service on the car, or the sale of add-ons and extended warranties later in the sales cycle.

  6. #66
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    Re: Is talking about piracy different from advocating piracy?

    Quote Originally Posted by OrangeCrate View Post
    And, you took away the profit on a finished product,
    That's a wrong assumption... you assume because you can get a product for free (legally or not) that you are also willing to pay for it if it wasn't free... that assumption is totally wrong.

    Furthermore you assume that there is actually a right to make profit... it might be a right to make profit in your country but that might not be the case everywhere...

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    Re: Is talking about piracy different from advocating piracy?

    Quote Originally Posted by hyper_ch View Post
    That's a wrong assumption... you assume because you can get a product for free (legally or not) that you are also willing to pay for it if it wasn't free... that assumption is totally wrong.

    Furthermore you assume that there is actually a right to make profit... it might be a right to make profit in your country but that might not be the case everywhere...
    Supporting freedom for other people is a good way to support it for yourself.

    DRM and other lockins didn't come about because they suddenly thought it would be cool.

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    Re: Is talking about piracy different from advocating piracy?

    Quote Originally Posted by Artificial Intelligence View Post
    I agree with OrangeCrate and p_quarles.
    I agree to an extent here to. The problem is, that most teenagers today have been raised with the notion that pirating software is neither illegal nor unethical, and that it is perfectly okay. I do see ethical issues in pirating, but I doubt my kid brother does, nor any of his friends and peers. Go ten years into the future, and these people will be running the show and setting the rules, at which point anyone who thinks that pirating is illegal will be considered the "old and dying dinosaurs" that everybody else is laughing at.

    I guess my point is, that it is really entirely unimportant what you or me or any "adult" considers right or wrong, because if we want to keep evolving with the world, we really need to take some of our cues from the coming generation.

  9. #69
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    Re: Is talking about piracy different from advocating piracy?

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  10. #70
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    Re: Is talking about piracy different from advocating piracy?

    Quote Originally Posted by rune0077 View Post
    ... most teenagers today have been raised with the notion that pirating software is neither illegal nor unethical, and that it is perfectly okay. ... Go ten years into the future, and these people will be running the show and setting the rules, at which point anyone who thinks that pirating is illegal will be considered the "old and dying dinosaurs" that everybody else is laughing at.

    I guess my point is, that it is really entirely unimportant what you or me or any "adult" considers right or wrong, because if we want to keep evolving with the world, we really need to take some of our cues from the coming generation.
    That's as much as saying that (very) young people are being raised with the notion that taking and eating candies in the supermarket is okay, and as they will become shopkeepers in the future, they will give away all their merchandise and laugh their heads off when we old fossils insist on merchandise being paid for.
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