View Poll Results: What does "ready for the desktop" mean to you?

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  • Any person can install it on any computer without any problems

    1,609 34.95%
  • Anyone can use it once it's already been installed and configured

    2,414 52.43%
  • Every commercial application works on it

    453 9.84%
  • Nothing--it's a nonsensical term

    704 15.29%
  • It automatically detects most hardware without the need to hunt down drivers

    2,236 48.57%
  • It comes preinstalled on computers so novice users don't have to install it

    889 19.31%
  • It's suitable to the needs of most beginner users but not necessarily to most intermediate ones

    568 12.34%
  • Windows and nothing else... not even Mac OS X

    46 1.00%
  • Works on my desktop

    1,199 26.04%
  • Other (please explain)

    166 3.61%
Multiple Choice Poll.
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Thread: Linux Desktop Readiness Thread

  1. #7861
    Join Date
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    Ubuntu 16.04 Xenial Xerus

    Re: Linux Desktop Readiness Thread

    Left out a few things too... in particular the reason why Windows is not ready for the desktop. Well - no longer ready for MY desktop at least.

    That reason - the addition of WGA. I have used computers since early C64 days, and worked on them since punch card days. I have dealt with any amount of problems with different systems - hardware/driver/OS/user failures all included. I expect a certain amount of hassle to get things running correctly. Windows is no better than other things I have used - though it has become more difficult to fix over the years when something DOESN'T work (registry diving etc). The constant changing of how a well-understood option is accessed has been a major problem.

    But the END of acceptance came with the addition of code that can ON ITS OWN, and WITH NO CONCEIVABLE BENEFIT TO ME shut down my system and deny access to potentially critical information. What if I'm in e-mail consultation with my lawyer? What if I have a couple of stock transactions to complete NOW? What if my updated resume needs to be sent NOW while the job is unfilled?

    I thought that the battle over serious inconvenience with software and related products had been won when Lotus lost its 'key disk' protection after the howls of outrage of businesses who couldn't get the functionality they paid for. MS has constantly been trying to bring the bad old days back (with painful product keys, and activation, and restricting updates) and now they have succeeded. With Vista, they have even gone a step further and impacted even hardware costs (for video card DRM 'features' etc) - again with no benefit to me - the end user.

    So - the debate should die now. It is Windows that is NOT ready (anymore) for the desktop..

    Oh yes...


    but I am serious....
    |Intel E6550 2.33 | Intel mb/gfx/snd | 4 Gb RAM | Seagate 500Gb | 64 Gb SSD|24" LCD |14.04/16.04 | AMD A10 5800K 3.8GHz / ATI gfx| Asus A88X-Pro mb/snd | 8 Gb RAM | Corsair Force 128 Gb SSD | Seagate 3+2TB | USB 2TB | Sony 40" | Ubuntu 14.04/16.04 |

  2. #7862
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
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    110

    Re: Linux Desktop Readiness Thread

    I have read numerous posts here stating that hardware and peripherals do not work out of the box with linux. I have to say that I have experienced many windoze boxes where things don't work OTB and those machines were configured at the factory! I use kubuntu feisty and adding printers is a breeze. capturing video is no problem. Downloading digital stills even easier. My mom and dad use kubuntu. My sister uses kubuntu. When I setup a linux box for someone I do whatever config need be done so that person doesn't have to. That is what dell and HP and toshiba etc. etc. do at there factory is it not? Open source OS' and software open doors for people to create new and better products. Check out the openmoko phone due out in september. Use your imagination and opensource can make it reality. All three shrek movies were made on linux machines.

    " All the big film studios primarily use Linux for animation and visual effects. Perhaps no commercial Linux installation is larger than DreamWorks Animation, with more than 1,000 Linux desktops and more than 3,000 server CPUs." Linux journal

    Linux not ready for desktop??!!
    the windsor unified school district in CA just made the switch from windows to linux. 5,000 students and 250 teachers working off of a linux based thin client network.

    wake up and smell the coffee dudes.

    If you can't get your linux install off the ground then pay someone who knows how, to do it for you.
    Charlie

  3. #7863
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
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    Brooklyn, NY
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    Gutsy Gibbon Testing

    Re: Linux Desktop Readiness Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Peyton View Post
    I don't see how Linux should be given extra points here just because WMV is a Microsoft codec. The fact is that it's a Windows world, and as such, one can reasonably expect to find a lot of WMV-encoded videos out there.

    And I'll remind some of you that, as bionerual said, this isn't a Windows versus Linux debate, so I don't know where you guys are taking this.
    You seem to have missed the point. Ubuntu doesn't get any extra points for WMV being an MS codec. The point is that if a codec is already installed on your system then of course the video will play if it needs it. WMV is just one example of a codec and is hardly the most popular one. MOV (Quicktime) is loads upon loads more popular than WMV and to play that in Windows you either have to install Quicktime or, if you know about it, Quicktime alternative. In Ubuntu it is the same exact thing, OGG will play out of the box, WMV and Quicktime will need to be installed. Considering that it is installed automatically upon trying to play it, I don't see a problem.

    W/e this debate is about, this argument has been brought up and I responded to it.
    Since I get asked alot, I am originally from Ukraine but am Russian by nationality. My nick means specter in Russian.

  4. #7864
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
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    Boston (British Expat)
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    Ubuntu

    Re: Linux Desktop Readiness Thread

    one can reasonably expect to find a lot of WMV-encoded videos out there.
    Expecting it and believing it to b reasonable are two very different things. just because the world is messed up doesn't mean I have to ignore it and play along. nothing ever changes unless people make a stand and I stand against the use of wmv, quicktime, realmedia etc; I don't think using those formats or supporting them is at all right or what we should be doing.
    42 is not an anwser, it's an error code. the universe is saying 'Error 42: meaning to universe not found'
    Programmer, Teacher and Artist

  5. #7865
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    Nov 2006
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    Re: Linux Desktop Readiness Thread

    Prizrak, I don't think I missed any point. You're misunderstanding me and are arguing a different case. WMV may or may not be the most popular codec. However, it does exist, and encountering it isn't too uncommon. As I said before, it's a Windows world, and we have to gauge things according to that. No, you may not be interested in making Linux mainstream or what-not. In that case, you can safely ignore my posts because they don't apply to you. My posts, and bionerual's as well it looks like, are geared towards the if you want to make Linux more mainstream path.

    DoctorMO, I never claimed that WMV's presence is reasonable (or unreasonable, for that matter). I only said that one can reasonably expect to find it.
    Last edited by Peyton; July 5th, 2007 at 04:35 AM.

  6. #7866
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    Ubuntu 9.04 Jaunty Jackalope

    Re: Linux Desktop Readiness Thread

    Why is it that most of the people who seem to be in favor of or in support of Ubuntu/Linix have been here a long time (i.e. lots of bean) and those who are arguing against it in one way or another have been here only a short time (i.e. very few beans)? If you only have a few beans, perhaps you should hold your yorr tounge until you have a bit more experience.

  7. #7867
    Join Date
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    perdita
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    Re: Linux Desktop Readiness Thread

    Users should not be judged by the number of their beans but by the content of their posts.

    But instead of just complaining about problems, it is good to ask for solutions. So spending more time on the forums might indeed make them more Ubuntu friendly.

  8. #7868
    Join Date
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    Ubuntu 8.10 Intrepid Ibex

    Re: Linux Desktop Readiness Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Peyton View Post
    Prizrak, I don't think I missed any point. You're misunderstanding me and are arguing a different case. WMV may or may not be the most popular codec. However, it does exist, and encountering it isn't too uncommon. As I said before, it's a Windows world, and we have to gauge things according to that. No, you may not be interested in making Linux mainstream or what-not. In that case, you can safely ignore my posts because they don't apply to you. My posts, and bionerual's as well it looks like, are geared towards the if you want to make Linux more mainstream path.

    DoctorMO, I never claimed that WMV's presence is reasonable (or unreasonable, for that matter). I only said that one can reasonably expect to find it.
    Then your point is irrelevant. I'm no more likely to come across a .wmv file than I am a .mov, and indeed, most videos anyone is likely to encounter these days comes in a flash player, so the format and player are self contained (and indeed, available to both Linux and Windows users). What you're saying is that since .wmv exists, we should all make sure .wmv works out of the box! That is a ridiculous idea, particularly when many people will never encounter a .wmv anyway. I can't remember the last time I watched anything in .wmv format, to be perfectly frank. Flash is possibly the MOST common media format at the moment, and it isn't available out of the box in any system, as far as I'm aware. So should we make Flash work by default in Ubuntu? Of course not. Proprietary issues aside, it just isn't important. If people want to watch a Flash video, they'll just install the Flash player. There's no problem here, and any Windows user who argues that Ubuntu 'isn't ready' because of it has obviously never installed Windows themselves. Ubuntu is ready for the desktop, and has been ready for ages - what we need is for retailers to start pre-installing Ubuntu on machines (which is starting to happen).

  9. #7869
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    Gutsy Gibbon Testing

    Re: Linux Desktop Readiness Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Tomosaur View Post
    Then your point is irrelevant. I'm no more likely to come across a .wmv file than I am a .mov, and indeed, most videos anyone is likely to encounter these days comes in a flash player, so the format and player are self contained (and indeed, available to both Linux and Windows users). What you're saying is that since .wmv exists, we should all make sure .wmv works out of the box! That is a ridiculous idea, particularly when many people will never encounter a .wmv anyway. I can't remember the last time I watched anything in .wmv format, to be perfectly frank. Flash is possibly the MOST common media format at the moment, and it isn't available out of the box in any system, as far as I'm aware. So should we make Flash work by default in Ubuntu? Of course not. Proprietary issues aside, it just isn't important. If people want to watch a Flash video, they'll just install the Flash player. There's no problem here, and any Windows user who argues that Ubuntu 'isn't ready' because of it has obviously never installed Windows themselves. Ubuntu is ready for the desktop, and has been ready for ages - what we need is for retailers to start pre-installing Ubuntu on machines (which is starting to happen).
    Thanks you saved me quite a bit of typing

    windows is certainly not ready for the desktop.

    Yeah let's see.


    After installing windows XP SP2 on my computer:
    - intel pentium 4 2.4 Ghz.
    - Integrated soundcard "SoundMax"
    - 512 MB RAM
    - 128 MB nvidia graphics card
    - HP deskjet 3420 printer
    - HP scanjet 2400 scanner
    - LG CD and DVD burners

    I made a review:

    Installation:
    - The CD initially boots into some textmode installation, very hard to deal with, then in the middle of the process it is required to format partitions from textmode and then it copies itself to continue the process. This install process is average in regards of simplicity.

    Dual Boot:
    - The installer totally ignored my other partitions, I had to implement Grub manually in order to recover my other operating systems.

    Hardware compatibility:
    - Windows said that it was installed, so I booted into it, the first thing you notice is some kind of welcome to windows animation, it was silent, I could eventually figure out that sound wasn't working.
    - When the animation ended and I got outside the tutorial, I could notice that the resolution was very small! this monitor+graphic card combo allows a max of 1280x1024, but windows wouldn't allow me to choose more than 400x300!

    - tried checking if it detected my printer, I went to control panel, etc. But it simply couldn't detect my printer.
    - The same happen happened to my scanner.

    I don't know what should I do, is MS requesting me to get an OEM system instead of the computer I built? I don't really have that money, I am not sure why almost all of my hardware has totally failed to be detected.

    Software:
    This is one of the points in which windows is terribly lacking, let's see:
    - Notepad: VERY limited, you can't even enable auto indentation, and it only supports MSDOS text file format...
    - WordPad: Not too much options, I couldn't find basic things like spell check, openoffice writer or even abiword are like 45 times more complete than this.
    - MSPaint : Has anyone tried doing serious art work on this? No point of comparisson to the Gimp.
    - Calc : It is kind of good although I miss expression evaluation, it is a little faster than an actual simulation of a real calculator.
    - Games : VERY few games, although minesweeper is good.
    - Internet explorer 6: I don't think it actually had theme support? And no tabs? wtf?

    I couldn't find any spreadsheet software or presentation software.

    Multimedia:
    - I tried windows media player but it can't play my DVDs, it keeps poping out something like "incompatible format" I decided to give up. When it plays it is kind of good, although it takes almost all of my screen and is slow.

    - Burning CDs/DVDs is either very unfriendly or missing, I couldn't find a way to burn stuff...

    Customizability:
    - Widnows XP comes with 3 themes, blue, silver and green, I think I was able to change the font size. I can also change up to 4 icons: My Computer, My documents , Recycle bin and Recycle bin (full)
    Be happy it saw your drives to begin with. I was building a system for my father a few months ago, and as he is a bit of a gamer and doesn't change his system too often (once 3-4 years or so) we went for fairly powerful components among which was a SATA II RAID. XP SP2 setup could not see the drives if the controller was in RAID or native SATA mode (AHCI I think it is). In order to get the RAID to work I had to find a floppy disk and use a floppy drive from the old system and then install the driver that way. A frigging floppy in 2007, seriously...... Before anyone mentions that Vista could probably pick that controller up without a problem, it doesn't have enough compatibility to be useful. The nVidia card wouldn't work for sure, half of the software would most likely need to be upgraded/replaced. Not to mention that the amount of power the OS requires would have made the entire upgrade completely pointless.
    Last edited by prizrak; July 5th, 2007 at 01:50 PM.
    Since I get asked alot, I am originally from Ukraine but am Russian by nationality. My nick means specter in Russian.

  10. #7870
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    Re: Linux Desktop Readiness Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by m.musashi View Post
    Why is it that most of the people who seem to be in favor of or in support of Ubuntu/Linix have been here a long time (i.e. lots of bean) and those who are arguing against it in one way or another have been here only a short time (i.e. very few beans)? If you only have a few beans, perhaps you should hold your yorr tounge until you have a bit more experience.
    Nobody's arguing "against" Ubuntu or Linux. If I didn't like Ubuntu, then I wouldn't have an account in an Ubuntu forum.

    Tomosaur, while I'll admit that WMV isn't extremely common, there still are places where one will encounter it (did so the day before last when I was trying to watch a press conference). Even so, simply go back to the post that initiated the WMV argument and select the next point.

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