Linux Desktop Readiness Thread

[Peter Mount]

My philosopy is this:

Any kind of software can wreck your day. So why pay for the priviledge?

For the topic at hand I'd say:

Driver support
Market momentum, i.e. Microsoft's market share
The learning curve involved

I think Dapper is a good example of how the learning curve, at least, can be helped. There is still a lot of work to be done though.

[prizrak]

The learning curve involved

That is much less of a problem lately not really because of how great Dapper or MEPIS or something like that are. According to Vista reviews the interface has been changed around quite a bit. There is also that security thing (the name is escaping me right now) that requires a user to learn some new things as well. As it stands now learning curve wise Linux is pretty close to Vista.

[justicerulesok]

try telling the 'end user/home user/silver surfer' who has £500 in his/her pocket to buy a pc for their kids school work. That they can get a better deal buy going online & buying then downloading what they want.

PEOPLE GET SCARED. acronyms (sp?) the thought of progamming & the lack of a real word retail outlet.

In the UK you buy from Dixons Stores Group (PCW, Currys etc) Comet, Supermarkets. Those with more money than sence go to independants & those who've used a DEll at work end up phoning up cause the internet it scary.

Windows is for those who are scared of PC's (yes they still exist) old people, low income, poorly educated (as in never went to school).

These are the same people who would if captured as a market would be the force behind moving the world.

Every century the is a revoltion from xx80-xx20 where everything changes from one end to the other. the last one was industrial & now we're in the middle of the technological. By 2020 microsoft will be a legend, dead reminiced about but never used.

Justice.

[G Morgan]

Most folks I know, when asked why they wouldn't consider linux, say "Games".

Thats just an excuse for lazyness. I play more PC games than most people but I dual boot and I'm very cautious in what I allow in Windows, most of the time the networking is disabled (so I can turn off all the endless resident scanners, a script can clear as much as 200mb of RAM instantly).

Then Linux gets used for any work, coding, internet, music etc. If I could get full hardware access in a VM I'd have got Xen running by now but it isn't properly posible yet.

[prizrak]

Thats just an excuse for lazyness. I play more PC games than most people but I dual boot and I'm very cautious in what I allow in Windows, most of the time the networking is disabled (so I can turn off all the endless resident scanners, a script can clear as much as 200mb of RAM instantly).

Then Linux gets used for any work, coding, internet, music etc. If I could get full hardware access in a VM I'd have got Xen running by now but it isn't properly posible yet.

While I don't condone keeping an OS as the only one simply because of gaming, dual booting is pretty annoying. There are a few issues with it.
1) If something doesn't work in Linux (which is likely for newbies) you go back to Windows and end up putting fixing Linux off.

2) If I want to play a Windows game and I have Windows as the only OS I just pop a CD in or double click. In dual booting it's a bit more involved.

3) Default option is normally to start Windows and more than enough people turn the comp on and wander off while it's booting to make it a hassle to use Linux.

Dual booting is not really much of a solution despite people using it. If Linux is to convert the gamers it either needs to get all the major games ported to it with extremely easy installs or develop a way of installing/playing Windows games as easily as Windows does.

Having said that I would say that there is a very large percentage of computer users out there who either don't play games at all (not couting Solitaire and the like) or game on consoles as opposed to PCs. Linux doesn't have to run 100% of computers (it might not be feasible on them) but a 20-30% market share on the desktop would ensure support from enough ISV's and OEM's to not have the same issues that it does now.

[G Morgan]

While I don't condone keeping an OS as the only one simply because of gaming, dual booting is pretty annoying. There are a few issues with it.
1) If something doesn't work in Linux (which is likely for newbies) you go back to Windows and end up putting fixing Linux off.

2) If I want to play a Windows game and I have Windows as the only OS I just pop a CD in or double click. In dual booting it's a bit more involved.

3) Default option is normally to start Windows and more than enough people turn the comp on and wander off while it's booting to make it a hassle to use Linux.

Dual booting is not really much of a solution despite people using it. If Linux is to convert the gamers it either needs to get all the major games ported to it with extremely easy installs or develop a way of installing/playing Windows games as easily as Windows does.

Having said that I would say that there is a very large percentage of computer users out there who either don't play games at all (not couting Solitaire and the like) or game on consoles as opposed to PCs. Linux doesn't have to run 100% of computers (it might not be feasible on them) but a 20-30% market share on the desktop would ensure support from enough ISV's and OEM's to not have the same issues that it does now.

1)Thats just a case of disipline and determination. The sort of user that would ignore Linux because of a few problems is the same sort that post the not ready for the desktop threads so aren't a loss.

2)Fair enough but I rarely just decide to play games in the middle of working and if I do there are enough native Linux games to suit that. Admittedly installing Linux games is rarely simple.

3)I have no problem with multibooting. Ubuntu is default on my machine so unless I want to play games I can wander off.

It's just a case of using the right tool for the right job and for PC Gaming that is currently Windows (though not for any technical reason). It will be interesting to see if Linux gaming takes off when Sony preinstall Linux on their PS3's.

[altonbr]

For a summer job in between semesters for my College, I've picked up a job at a place called Siamous Internet. It's a town of 3000 people and everyone uses Windows 98/2000 but want to run XP on there under-developed/old hardware... I would love to suggest XUbuntu, DSL (although convoluted) or just regular Ubuntu if there computer can take it, but the reason why no one is listening to me here in Sicamous? They are a bunch of small town folk that only know of the word "Windows"... they think that the monitor is the computer and that when you open up the tower, that is Windows, when in fact it is actually the operating system.

Education is the only way to spread "linux" or Ubuntu for that matter.

[prizrak]

It will be interesting to see if Linux gaming takes off when Sony preinstall Linux on their PS3's.

I doubt that, there are plenty of devices that run Linux, TiVo is probably the most well known one. Yet MythTV is not even at version 1

[the_blue_pill]

A couple of days ago I decided to change the impossibly boring firefox 'world' icon to the fiery red and gold one. What happened then, methinks, is a textbook example of why 'linux for the masses' still seems distant.

Right click, properties, then click the icon top left. Konq nicely brings up a list of icons and yes there's the one I'm looking for. That was easy. I click and...

Sorry. Kdesktop. You do not have sufficient access to write to /home/harun/Desktop/firefox.

Umm. What?

Now at this point I tried to imagine how people with different experience/exposure to linux would react.
Average Win user (doesn't know anything): 'Why doesn't it do what I want? Teh linux sux!'
Slightly advanced win user (knows a thing or two about user privileges): 'It's a frikkin icon. Why can't I change it? Teh linux sux!'

Novice linux user (doesn't scream when (s)he sees the command terminal): 'What the hell? It's MY desktop. MY sanctuary from the ever watchful, relentless grip of linux. It's not a system file or anything. Teh Linux sux!'
Me (tired and jaded and a novice still, but somewhat of a masochist willing to continue): Sighs and gets to work.

I do a ls -la on the desktop, and there's the desktop item.
firefox -> /usr/share/applications/firefox.desktop
It's a symlink to a root owned directory. Why, I ask? Then I remember that under the clever guise of an OS, linux is actually one giant trial for those willing to test the limits of their intelligence, patience and endurance.

Fortunately there's an 'edit as root' option in right-click -> actions menu. I click it, enter my password (why oh why I ask you) and a text box opens. Towards the end there's a single line:
icon = mozilla-firefox.png

Now even if our average or above average win user has made this far, there's no indication of how to proceed next. The icon I want could be named anything. It turns out just entering 'firefox.png' was enough. That's arguably an easy guess but if you can't, then good luck. You'll have to sift through the myriads of choices in usr/share/icons. Oh and if you happen to upgrade your firefox after this, you'll find that the icon reverts to the original 'world' version.

This obviously is an angry rant but I'm not trying to blame or flame anybody. In addition, this bug might or might not have been fixed - technically it's not a bug at all - but that's not the point I'm trying to make.

The issue is that there are virtually hundreds of such small annoyances floating around, requiring disproportionately large amounts of experience/time/energy to fix. Needless to say average computer users stay away from such a demanding system. Calling such people 'stupid, lazy luzers' doesn't help much either: some people simply prefer to invest their time in something else.

I can understand why activating and debugging advanced hardware features such as wireless and acpi could be difficult, but in this example it's a very simple feature. The problem is not one of efficient software engineering but one of presentation and usability. I request politely that people designing such interfaces polish and test basic features rather than throwing in a bunch of new ones.
/rant

[Yossarian]

No, you make a good point. As far Ubuntu and other Linux-based OSs are concerned, all the right parts are there, they just don't always fit together exactly as you would expect.