Arrogance amongst certain Linux users

[DevilsRejection]

Someone posted this, and I'm greatly upset:

"#2: This one isn't too great either, because if people don't know how to burn an iso, they shouldn't be trying to learn linux"

listen hot shot, i bet someone had to teach you how to turn on a computer.

the linux community shouldn't be like this at all. now i know that most of you are tip top, and love to help people, but not everyone is.

if anything is going to stop adoption, it's the wrong vibe from the users. i feel like i'm in a mac forum, where if you ask for advice you get an answer, then a little joke about how much feature XYZ sucks in windows.

[aysiu]

I think you both kind of have a point, to be honest.

On the one hand, elitism of any kind ("Silly new user, how dare you try to learn Linux when you can't even burn an ISO? Ha ha ha!") is a bad attitude.

On the other hand, you're lying to yourself if you imagine you can install and configure a Linux distro if you can't even figure out (through a Google search or whatnot) how to burn an ISO.

It's just an indicator that you're going to run into a lot of trouble later. You think things are tough learning how to burn an ISO? Well, just wait until you try to configure your X server or use ndiswrapper to get your wireless working.

You can view it as elitism or someone can express it as elitism if she wants to, but it's also the plain truth: if you can't figure out how to burn an ISO, your only hope in the world of Linux is to have a Linux expert friend who will install and configure it for you, or to buy Linux preinstalled from a vendor like System76.

Some of the "how to burn an ISO" guides I've found to be rather cryptic, so I created this one that I think any dummy can make sense of:
http://www.psychocats.net/ubuntu/iso

[Toxicity999]

That's an elitist philosophy that is found way more commonly other places, here atleats most people are helpful 5 helpful for every not atleast. Of course as we obtain a larger user base these views are skewed but I never... well rarely see a post with only responses like that. I do agree though that those who actually talk like that need to rethink their position. If you're not giving or getting help, and you're complacent wit hyour OS don't moleste the forums with useless slaps in the face to people new to the OS. My personal View anyway.

[Henry Rayker]

I agree with aysiu's second point. Honestly, if you can't read a guide to burn an ISO, odds are you won't stick around to ask questions about how to get this or that to work; you're not going to search to find the answers as to why your wireless won't work or why your screen resolution is smashed.

I think he could have phrased it as, "if you can't figure out how to burn an ISO, you should probably wait before trying to set up an operating system"...it's not just Linux, but any OS (I've never set up an Apple OS, so maybe not those...don't know what goes into it).

That's equivalent to selling ammunition to someone who doesn't even know what a gun license is...you're just asking for trouble.

[aysiu]

Yes, the phrasing could be better, but there's still truth in there.

[Toxicity999]

I think you both kind of have a point, to be honest.

On the one hand, elitism of any kind ("Silly new user, how dare you try to learn Linux when you can't even burn an ISO? Ha ha ha!") is a bad attitude.

On the other hand, you're lying to yourself if you imagine you can install and configure a Linux distro if you can't even figure out (through a Google search or whatnot) how to burn an ISO.

It's just an indicator that you're going to run into a lot of trouble later. You think things are tough learning how to burn an ISO? Well, just wait until you try to configure your X server or use ndiswrapper to get your wireless working.

You can view it as elitism or someone can express it as elitism if she wants to, but it's also the plain truth: if you can't figure out how to burn an ISO, your only hope in the world of Linux is to have a Linux expert friend who will install and configure it for you, or to buy Linux preinstalled from a vendor like System76.

Some of the "how to burn an ISO" guides I've found to be rather cryptic, so I created this one that I think any dummy can make sense of:
http://www.psychocats.net/ubuntu/iso

I totally aggree with your secondary position, though if someone were to warn something more like, "Well in all honesty if you can't figure out how to burn an ISO as an actual image compared to a file you may run into trouble later on but please refer to xyzabc.com/fluffypeanutbutter to learn how to do so on a windows system of if you have another linux system around you can do so with xyz."

More helpful than "OMFG You dare query the Penguin Overlord? I SMITE THEE!"


A point to both sides but again we all learned how to burn an ISO at some point (most of us probably on out own granted.) But that slow webbing of knowledge leading us to mastery of the terminal and DE could presumabley be learned quickly, even after setbacks like these. Who knows.

Edit: You beat me to it you crazy kitty! (just playing)

[aysiu]

It ultimately boils down to "Are you willing to roll up your sleeves?"

You don't have to burn an ISO, especially if you buy from System76 or order a pre-pressed CD from ShipIt. Learning to burn an ISO is just learning one task. But you must be willing to learn in general (if not to burn an ISO, at least other tasks).

If you think, "Ah, learning to burn an ISO is too much trouble," well then anything else you'd have to do to install a new operating system will be too much trouble.

I'm just going to keep repeating myself... it's fun.

[BoomStiX]

Someone posted this, and I'm greatly upset:

"#2: This one isn't too great either, because if people don't know how to burn an iso, they shouldn't be trying to learn linux"

listen hot shot, i bet someone had to teach you how to turn on a computer.

the linux community shouldn't be like this at all. now i know that most of you are tip top, and love to help people, but not everyone is.

if anything is going to stop adoption, it's the wrong vibe from the users. i feel like i'm in a mac forum, where if you ask for advice you get an answer, then a little joke about how much feature XYZ sucks in windows.

Hehe, well, first off, i've been using computers for about 15 years now. Second, just because I said if someone doesn't know how to burn an iso and that they shouldn't be using linux because of it, doesn't mean I don't like/try to help people.

Third, don't try getting everyone all riled up because of something that was misinterpreted in your head. Here let me explain it top to bottom for you real quick, first, if you don't know the basic fundamentals to a computer, which burning a iso is kind of one of them, its becoming much more common nowdays to burn isos, you shouldn't try moving forward in the computer world until you get your basic computer fundamentals straightened out. Its just a fact dude.

So my suggestion to you, keep it down else threads I think are gonna start getting locked. Theres no need to start spilling blood over crap like this.

[Old Pink]

1. Why is this in Feisty Fawn discussion?
2. Why does this deserve it's own thread? Why not just either reply to the thread in which that was said, or PM the person responsible.
3. I personally agree with the statement. If you can't burn an .iso and install from a Live CD, you're not ready for Linux really, are you? What are you going to do when you see a terminal?
4. Even if you were right, don't blame the community for one person's opinion.

[BoomStiX]

1. Why is this in Feisty Fawn discussion?
2. Why does this deserve it's own thread? Why not just either reply to the thread in which that was said, or PM the person responsible.
3. You may be right, but don't blame the community for one person's opinion.

To be honest with you, I have NO idea how this became a Feisty Fawn thread, it doesn't even belong here does it? I was looking through here because i've been posting in this section of the forums and saw this thread, looked and sure enough it was one of my quotes I have said, and it was just done with so much misinterpretation that it needed to be cleared up. But yeah, this doesn't belong here, we should get this thread moved or deleted.