Can I Let Windows 10 Go?

[Quarkrad]

Currently experimenting with win10 on kvm and so far very impressed. I dual boot with win10 but hardly use it so looking to go 100% Linux. I currently enjoy a Samsung SSD that, when purchased, I upgraded the firmware using a Samsung utility via windows 10. Eventually I will move to m2 form factor (at the moment nice to have rather then need to have!) and would like to stay with samsung but could go with another supplier. It seems to me many many manufacturers do not support Linux so I could be stuck not being able to update any hardware if I went 100% Linux. So perhaps I need to keep my windows partition(s). If one is 100% Linux and buys say, a year old bit of hardware that has firmware update(s), is there not a big danger that said hardware could not be updated?

[oldfred]

My Samsung NVMe drive has a bootable ISO for firmware updates.
The Samsung Magican is Windows for consumer use.
I found an old Linux version of Magican in commercial area, but never got it to work for updating my old Samsung SATA SSD.

Vendors are adding firmware update support here, but mostly just newer hardware and not all vendors.
https://github.com/rhboot/fwupdate/b...ster/README.md
https://fwupd.org/lvfs/devicelist &
https://fwupd.org/vendorlist

[crip720]

For general hardware I would recommend having a small Windows partition for bios and firmware updates. There are usually ways of doing it from Linux, but usually faster and easier just to boot into Windows, do update and then go back to Ubuntu/Linux. Some hardware/computer makers will have ability to do this from Linux, but each one has to be checked.

[mastablasta]

i was wondering the same thing. i have very old windows XP machine, but i was thinking if maybe it is time to change it as i haven't boot to windows for almost 2 years now.
if i upgrade the hardware, then windows XP won't work anymore. so i am not sure if i should "upgrade" it (use the good components and replace some with newer stuff) or replace it and continue to use the old machine in some other way.

anyway, i was wondering is it possible to do firmware updates using FreeDOS? what about some windows rescue disk of sorts? and then run it though that?

[oldfred]

Most of my old Windows systems required me to download the update file, perhaps extract it, and run an exe file to update BIOS. But that could be from FreeDos or Windows. Some even had a DOS image with updates, so all you did was create the bootable drive. That may have been back with floppy drive days?

Many new systems now have 3 ways, from Windows, from UEFI reading update file from any FAT32 formatted partition or drive, or the update from a DOS executable.
Both my 2014 Asus and 2016 Gigabyte update directly from within UEFI, and I make the FAT32 ESP larger so I can save updates into it. But have to change default permissions in fstab, now to be able to use it.

[DuckHook]

Windows tends to muck up a lot of Linux things. It defaults to hogging the whole disk and does not even pretend to work well with other OSes. It also defaults to secure boot and fast boot, which play havoc with Linux partitions. It just assumes that no one would want any other OS on their system and conducts itself as a self‑absorbed preening princess. Most of all, having it hang around on bare metal when it is not really necessary is a massive additional security risk.

I would understand why a Windows partition is necessary if you game or must use apps that require bare metal access, but if your Windows needs are met by a VM, then to me, it makes no sense to put up with the added complexity and security exposure.

I've never had a problem installing firmware through alternate methods. The most simple one is a DOS‑based USB stick. I've yet to run across a major OEM who does not offer such firmware upgrade alternatives, but I freely admit that my experience is anecdotal and highly limited at that.

I've been running pure Linux boxes now for about a decade and so happy for the simplicity and ease of mind in not having to deal a Windows partition. However, my Windows use is so little as to be insignificant, so it may not be a good reflection of your needs.

[TheFu]

Have a well-known brand of usb3 7-port hub that needed a firmware update to correct some known linux/bsd disconnect problems. The only update tool ran under 64-bit Windows and required a usb3 port to work. Usb2 ports and 32-bit Windows don't work, which is what my laptop had. The vendor understood my issue and offered to provide a patched device, but wouldn't commit to sending **my** hub back, just a similar hub that had been refurbished.

I have an old slide/negative scanner that only works with XP. Fortunately, VM usb2 passthru works for that.

Unfortunately, there are still times when Windows is necessary. and it needs to be on real hardware. I tried the firmware update using usb3 passthrough, but that failed.

[DuckHook]

…Unfortunately, there are still times when Windows is necessary. and it needs to be on real hardware. I tried the firmware update using usb3 passthrough, but that failed.

A good counter‑example to my post above. Were I confronted with this sort of problem, I would take the offending piece of equipment to a friend's or a relative's PC, buy them a beer, and ask them for the favour of the use of their Windows box.

[TheFu]

A good counter‑example to my post above. Were I confronted with this sort of problem, I would take the offending piece of equipment to a friend's or a relative's PC, buy them a beer, and ask them for the favour of the use of their Windows box.

Exactly. Took it to our weekly LUG meeting and asked someone running Windows to help.

[mastablasta]

ok, but that's external hardware.

Linux is spreading in out house. They way we go about it is - give it a try, see it it fits, if not we will buy&install windows later. We now have for example we now have 4 PC + RaspberryPi + HP home server on linux. 2 of these have windows. one has windows XP, which i haven't really used in a while. another one has Windows 7 Starter (if only it had home i could upgrade the RAM and get a bit more out of this PC).

anyway the external components are the classic mouse, keyboard & speakers, and then we have video cameras (important for online school right now) and printer/scanner. they all had linux support from the start. drivers were in kernel or in some cases were provided by manufacturers.

this install & see if it works out also went surprisingly well so far. since we don't play online much and some older games are just as fun if not more than latest ones (we can't afford latest ones anyway), we managed to install and have fun with a number of native games or via Playonlinux. sometimes there is a lot more work that goes into install, but in the end they work well. i write down the method for next time and move on. i think if "anticheat" software issue is resolved in some way so it works on linux, then most online games would work as well. again we don't game online (except a bit of CS:GO), so for now its fine for us.

we had some issues with "online schooling" when they sent MS office docs. but we managed to work around that using my work account. it's actually one of the things i miss on linux. a good office application. libre office is just now as friendly and is behind MS office in most areas for about 7 - 10 years. ease of use for us that work with mouse and don't know all the shortcuts is just not there. anyway with strong modern PC and enough disk space, VM would be a very easy solution if i really needed the office apps (e.g. for school).

government went to OS agnostic signing app, most services are web based and can be accessed from any OS. and also i if really needed windows it could be done via VM.

so the only thing windows would now be needed is is UEFI or some other internal hardware needed a firmware update. which is why - if it works via FreeDOS or other option it is not really an issue as well. in the old days you can do it with DOS floppy drive and some jumper move, but i imagine they have other methods now. i did that only two times. once when i upgraded BIOS on a Pentium II PC with special socket that could hold 1.6 Ghz Celeron and it required a BIOS upgrade and second time when i had issues with motherboard and was hoping BIOS upgrade would resolve them. it didn't really...

edit: also windows might be needed to manage NTFS drives (internal/external)- which i have quite a few. windows tools are needed to repair windows file systems. however, maybe windows system repair disk or ultimate boot CD could handle that. there are also Hirens boot CD, SystemrescueCD...