20.04 issues

[Phil Binner]

I think I'm about to revert to 18.04 on my main machine. I already had to do it on my Media machine. The main problem is with connecting to my NAS, but there are other problems, and although there is lots of help available from this forum the amount of time required to chase down solutions makes using Ubuntu difficult.

The main issue is with support for Samba. I upgraded to 20.04, and suddenly I couldn't connect to my NAS. I went through solutions on this forum and discovered that support for Samba has been withdrawn. I got help, and after re-installing several packages, editing fstab and smb.conf (after I'd re-created it) and a few other things, I finally got a grudging connection to the NAS. It was only grudging though. It takes about a minute after each restart and goes through a series of errors before eventually getting there. When I got connection on my main machine I thought I'd sorted it and, unfortunately, updated my media machine before I'd discovered the restart problems. As with the main machine, I could connect but never very well. I never did manage to connect Kodi. My media machine is responsible for my Amazon Prime and Netflix accounts, and also for my personal video and music collections, so access to the NAS is essential. I had to abandon 20.04 and go back to 18.04.

There are other problems too; nothing extreme and nothing I couldn't work through with help, but overall I think I'm going back. This is a shame. What do you guys think about it.

[Autodave]

Did you upgrade 18.04 to 20.04 or did you do a clean install of 20.04?

[DuckHook]

You need to go for the solution that works for you; not one that works for others.

My own anecdotal experience was relatively trouble‑free. Just a sound issue that was soon fixed. But that was me, and I'm not you.

A few things to note:

• I've always considered SMB to be a bit of a kludge. It is Linux's attempt to work nicely with MS‑based infrastructure. Those who need it have to use it, but Linux's native network storage protocol is NFS. Since moving my whole internal network to NFS, I've had nothing but great results/throughput/ease.
• Staying with Bionic is a perfectly valid strategy. A number of my servers are still on Bionic and I have no plans to change them for at least two more years. At some point, you will have to make the jump, but that gives you three years to iron out bugs and let others figure out solutions on which you can piggyback.
• A possible strategy would be to build a backup NAS that uses NFS, then mirror it to your SMB server. You could experiment with connecting to this backup server via NFS. Once the bugs are ironed out of that, changing to NFS should be a cakewalk.
• I multiboot between three OSes in part due to just such a strategy: work out all the bugs in an implementation before going all in. Until then, my main OS is still the old reliable one.
• The closer you keep your install to its default state, the less problems you will have with version upgrades. Many of the issues that people run into are because they've filled their installs up with too many PPAs, accessories and customizations. KISS is as important in Linux as it is in most other aspects of life.

Last but not least, since you've stated that you have no specific technical question, I've moved this thread to Ubuntu, Linux and OS Chat as the more appropriate forum for a non-technical discussion.

If you later think of a specific technical issue, please start a new thread dealing with that specific item under the appropriate sub‑forum.

Good Luck!

[Phil Binner]

I'm getting a bit screwed up on the timelines here. This is a chat line; fine. Where did my last post go.

[Phil Binner]

Hi to Autodave. First I did an update on my media machine. When That caused problems I did a clean install on my main machine to sort the problem. I got connection to the NAS after help here, and thought that would solve the media machine problems. But the connection was grudging at best, and I never got Kodi to connect. That was when I reverted to 18.04. The main machine is still on 20.04, but it has issues and I will shortly revert it to 18.08 too.

Hi to DuckHook Thanks for trying to sort out the messaging. I'm still not sure what happened to my post but no matter. I was probably rambling.

I would like to make a point, but it's a complex one and I would like other people to contribute if they are interested.

I have a number of computers, some I use and some I just don't throw away. There are three static computers, one Windows and two Xubuntu, I run my business from a Windows computer and my TV from an XUbuntu computer. The other static XUbuntu computer is one I keep trying to get to a state it could run my business, but I keep failing. I also have three laptops, one each for me and my wife (also my business partner) and one spare, They are all windows.


Because I use both Windows and Ubuntu on a regular basis I know that Ubuntu is a vastly superior operating system, but I still can't migrate my business systems. There are three reasons for this:
1: We are tied to MS Office. I keep intending to try Softmaker, and maybe it will be a solution. I can assure all listening that Open Office is not a viable alternative. Even Apple use MS Office. I have tried running MS Office in Wine, but I have failed.
2. Other software. It's a tough call, but until Ubuntu is generally accepted, many third party developers won't have ubuntu versions. This problem is certainly improving, but it's a long way from being solved. It will probably be exponential as resolution approaches. Ubuntu need to do everything possible to get accepted.
3. Upgrades. Ubuntu's general approach to software updates is way superior to Windows. I used to live in dread of windows saying "do not unplug your computer" just as I was about to set off to catch a plane. But this latest update took away support for SMB without providing a seamless replacement. In my past life I was an IT project manager, and all our implementations had Windows computers accessing a Unix network. They worked together perfectly. Windows might have its shortcomings, but it would never consider removing support for the enemy.

Bottom line is, the guy who walks off the street into a computer shop needs to know that what he buys will work, with his emails and his letters and his NAS. This latest upgrade won't. Please do better.

[DuckHook]

Just a couple of clarifications:

…Windows might have its shortcomings, but it would never consider removing support for the enemy.

Windows does not play nicely with others. For instance, it does not have native support for either the EXT file system or the NFS network protocol, both of which are native to Linux. It does not accommodate multibooting into alternate OSes and will hog the entire HDD/SSD at install. I could go on for pages. In almost every mixed OS environment, it is the non-Windows OS that must take extraordinary measures to accommodate Windows; not the other way around. That your previous experiences have been seamless is not a testament to Windows, but to those other OSes.

…Please do better.

This forum is comprised entirely of end users such as yourself. Ubuntu's developers rarely (if ever) visit, so directing comments such as "Please do better…" to forum members will not produce any results.

With respect to your issues, I would be the first to acknowledge that Ubuntu is a high hurdle to clear for general business use. Most of the documents, behaviours and apps in the business world are geared almost entirely towards Windows (with Apple as an afterthought and Linux not even that), so trying to run a business on Linux is an uphill struggle. It can be done, but it requires a degree of dedication that may be impractical.

In general, I've found that the best way for a SOHOs (Small Office Home Office) to implement Linux is not to dive in head first, but to use a graduated and experimental approach. Find a spare machine to install 20.04, treat it as an experimental server, work out the bugs in that one first, then roll out the real implementation after you are thoroughly comfortable with your test rig. Especially when it comes to infrastructure devices like routers, gateways and, in your case, servers, I would not jump into a version upgrade without squashing the bugs on a test rig first.

Only you can decide whether the results justify the value of your time spent. You still have three years of support for your server. Also three years on vanilla Ubuntu, so there's still plenty of time on those. Granted, Xubuntu will be reaching EoL in April of 2021, so that deadline is coming up, but if you approach it methodically, I suspect that the solutions will not be overly difficult. And since your server is already fine again, you only have to focus on the Xubuntu box(es).

You've been a member of these forums long enough to know that we encourage everyone to use what works for them. There's nothing wrong with continuing to use Windows where this is most appropriate, such as in your business or for your spouse, and I don't see why you should change those OSes. It seems to me that, at this point, it's just a matter of ironing out the few bugs that are tripping up SAMBA in your implementation of Focal. For that, I would encourage you to post in the appropriate forums (Ubuntu Servers, Cloud and Juju for your server and General Help for your desktop machine) when you have the time and feel the inclination to tackle them.

[Phil Binner]

I am encouraged. I still have Xubuntuy 20.04 running on this machine, so I'll leave it for a while longer and try to sort out the issues with connection to the NAS. (Not a server, by the way, just a simple raid NAS).

Another issue, you mention that "Xubuntu will be reaching EoL in April of 2021". That sounds like the whole flavour, not just the LTS. I hadn't picked that up from their website. I will certainly miss it.

[ajgreeny]

It's just Xubuntu 18.04 that loses support in April 2021, not the whole of the Xubuntu flavour; Xubuntu 20.04 has support until 2023, ie, three years from release like all the Xubuntu LTS releases.