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Thread: Why does Ubuntu have so much trouble upgrading smoothly?

  1. #11
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    Re: Why does Ubuntu have so much trouble upgrading smoothly?

    The problem with concluding that Ubuntu has "so much trouble upgrading smoothly" is that we never see the threads that are never started when updates go perfectly smoothly and without a hitch. People don't complain when things go right. We can have no earthly idea what the ratio of failures to attempts may be.

    Jumping to any conclusion based on 100 or 300 posts is invalid. That may represent one percent of attempts. It may represent 50 percent. We don't know. Given the millions of users of *buntu, I favor the notion that this represents a small fraction of users. But I can't state that categorically.

    You have fallen into two simultaneous logical fallacies, I think:

    "Argumentum ad ignorantiam": The argument from ignorance in that you don't know the number of smooth upgrades and, lacking that information, you assume the number to be small because you don't know about them. ("UFOs can't be definitively proven to be real, so they must not exist")

    You compound that fallacy with a Hasty Generalization: You see complaints, so you conclude that many, most or all attempts end in failure. ("All Indians walk in single file. At least the one I saw did.")
    Last edited by QIII; 3 Weeks Ago at 02:50 AM.
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  2. #12
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    Re: Why does Ubuntu have so much trouble upgrading smoothly?

    Quote Originally Posted by QIII View Post
    The problem with concluding that Ubuntu has "so much trouble upgrading smoothly" is that we never see the threads that are never started when updates go perfectly smoothly and without a hitch. People don't complain when things go right. We can have no earthly idea what the ratio of failures to attempts may be.

    Jumping to any conclusion based on 100 or 300 posts is invalid. That may represent one percent of attempts. It may represent 50 percent. We don't know. Given the millions of users of *buntu, I favor the notion that this represents a small fraction of users. But I can't state that categorically.

    You have fallen into two simultaneous logical fallacies, I think:

    "Argumentum ad ignorantiam": The argument from ignorance in that you don't know the number of smooth upgrades and, lacking that information, you assume the number to be small because you don't know about them. ("UFOs can't be definitively proven to be real, so they must not exist")

    You compound that fallacy with a Hasty Generalization: You see complaints, so you conclude that many, most or all attempts end in failure. ("All Indians walk in single file. At least the one I saw did.")
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  3. #13
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    Re: Why does Ubuntu have so much trouble upgrading smoothly?

    Quote Originally Posted by QIII View Post
    The problem with concluding that Ubuntu has "so much trouble upgrading smoothly" is that we never see the threads that are never started when updates go perfectly smoothly and without a hitch. People don't complain when things go right. We can have no earthly idea what the ratio of failures to attempts may be.

    Jumping to any conclusion based on 100 or 300 posts is invalid. That may represent one percent of attempts. It may represent 50 percent. We don't know. Given the millions of users of *buntu, I favor the notion that this represents a small fraction of users. But I can't state that categorically.

    You have fallen into two simultaneous logical fallacies, I think:

    "Argumentum ad ignorantiam": The argument from ignorance in that you don't know the number of smooth upgrades and, lacking that information, you assume the number to be small because you don't know about them. ("UFOs can't be definitively proven to be real, so they must not exist")

    You compound that fallacy with a Hasty Generalization: You see complaints, so you conclude that many, most or all attempts end in failure. ("All Indians walk in single file. At least the one I saw did.")
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  4. #14
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    Re: Why does Ubuntu have so much trouble upgrading smoothly?

    Do not agree that upgrades are problematic.
    My spouse's laptop came with Ubuntu LTS 12.04 when we bought it several years ago. Since then, it has been upgraded to LTS 14.04 then to LTS 16.04 with no issues whatsoever; however, I intend to complete a new installation on spouse's laptop with Xubuntu 18.04 in the near future after backing up all personal and data files.
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  5. #15
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    Re: Why does Ubuntu have so much trouble upgrading smoothly?

    Quote Originally Posted by him610 View Post
    Do not agree that upgrades are problematic.
    I agree with your disagreement.

    At the time of the 18.04 release I had three ageing or inferior laptops running Xubuntu 16.04 or 17.10. I upgraded each of them to Xubuntu 18·04 but while one failed dismally the other two were successful. So I installed Xubuntu 18.04 afresh on to the one on which the upgrade failed but I still had problems with suspending. A hardware specific problem?

    Cutting a long story short, the two oldest laptops are now in the process of being disposed of. The third is in daily use and shows no signs of the upgrade not being 100% successful.
    Last edited by PaulW2U; 2 Weeks Ago at 04:03 PM. Reason: Corrected versions upgrades were made from
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  6. #16
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    Re: Why does Ubuntu have so much trouble upgrading smoothly?

    Quote Originally Posted by QIII View Post
    The problem with concluding that Ubuntu has "so much trouble upgrading smoothly" is that we never see the threads that are never started when updates go perfectly smoothly and without a hitch. People don't complain when things go right. We can have no earthly idea what the ratio of failures to attempts may be.

    Jumping to any conclusion based on 100 or 300 posts is invalid. That may represent one percent of attempts. It may represent 50 percent. We don't know. Given the millions of users of *buntu, I favor the notion that this represents a small fraction of users. But I can't state that categorically.

    You have fallen into two simultaneous logical fallacies, I think:

    "Argumentum ad ignorantiam": The argument from ignorance in that you don't know the number of smooth upgrades and, lacking that information, you assume the number to be small because you don't know about them. ("UFOs can't be definitively proven to be real, so they must not exist")

    You compound that fallacy with a Hasty Generalization: You see complaints, so you conclude that many, most or all attempts end in failure. ("All Indians walk in single file. At least the one I saw did.")
    Didn't even consider that honestly. Just see so many, why would someone report something did what it was supposed to do. My apologies for not thinking this thought all the way through to all. I guess I let my own experiences dictate what is happening to everyone else. Maybe I am doing something wrong. I'll need to do some testing. Appreciate the responses both for and against. Opens my mind a bit. Can't believe I never even thought from that perspective.

  7. #17
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    Re: Why does Ubuntu have so much trouble upgrading smoothly?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rubi1200 View Post
    I think a lot depends on how much tinkering went on before the upgrade; adding PPAs, customizing desktop environments, tweaking system settings etc.
    Agreed, the less tinkering the more likely for a smooth upgrade but then the less reason to "upgrade". People usually think they would rather "upgrade" than clean install because they have custom settings, but "upgrade" is more likely to fail because of those custom settings. So there is really no point to "upgrade", clean install is a lot faster comparing to "upgrade" on a pristine system(where "upgrade" likely works)

  8. #18
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    Re: Why does Ubuntu have so much trouble upgrading smoothly?

    Quote Originally Posted by QIII View Post
    The problem with concluding that Ubuntu has "so much trouble upgrading smoothly" is that we never see the threads that are never started when updates go perfectly smoothly and without a hitch. People don't complain when things go right. We can have no earthly idea what the ratio of failures to attempts may be.
    People also have problems with clean installs. Those threads appear every once in a while.

  9. #19
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    Re: Why does Ubuntu have so much trouble upgrading smoothly?

    I upgraded from Trusty to Xenial with no issues. Before I upgraded almost everyone I asked opined that I needed a fresh install as if it was gospel or something. It would be interesting to know just how many successful upgrades on average there really are.

  10. #20
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    Re: Why does Ubuntu have so much trouble upgrading smoothly?

    I upgraded my ubuntu 16.04 to 18.04 and didn't faced any problem in upgrading...Also not seeing any major change in performance till now...But I too suggest a fresh install instead of upgrading not because of any performance issues but because of my mind set...

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