[SOLVED] Installing ubuntu and then use MATE and/or how to install UEFI grub?

[david503]

I just totally got burned by installing Ubuntu MATE and then later connecting my windows drive. Apparently grub/BusyBox couldn't hand the basic idea that another drive exists in the universe and it dropped me down to (initramfs) prompt.

I know that's probably not MATE's fault directly but I'd rather try again by installing regular ubuntu (and maybe choosing a different bootloader than grub (or BusyBox I guess- is that the same thing? It's using BusyBox).

Anyway the real ubuntu installer was more complex if I remember correctly and I'd rather use real ubuntu and then just switch to the mate window manager after it's running without being absurdly flakey and switching down to an (initramfs) prompt. So can I install the MATE window manager over regular ubuntu? Thanks

[TheFu]

You can switch the GUI if you like. There are about 50 different choices. The GUI is just another program. There are some caveats when switching between different GUIs since some settings can conflict if they use the same libraries.

I would be surprised if the installer had anything to do with the issue you are reporting. Could it be something else? What do the system log file show?

OTOH, installing Ubuntu takes 8-15 minutes these days, so it isn't really much of a commitment to do a fresh install, provided you have backed up anything you want to retain.

[david503]

Right but what if this happens down the road when I do have stuff I want to retain? The uncertainty is unnerving. For example right now I can't even get to the log files, I'm stuck with this horrible (initramfs): prompt which I have no idea what to do with. Hell- I can't even get in to look at the log files.

[CatKiller]

The term "booting" is a contraction of "pulling up by your bootstraps." When the computer is booting, it is not able to read files. That ability needs to be loaded in later. In that state, the computer can only load into RAM, and execute, a specially-prepared INITial RAM FileSytem telling it how to load the next part, and where to load it from. You've changed the where to load it from part by adding another drive, and not updated the initramfs accordingly, so it can't proceed. BusyBox is a tiny shell environment that's small enough to be contained in the initramfs. Since the computer can't figure out what to do, it's launched that so that you can tell it what to do.

It has absolutely nothing to do with whichever desktop environment you're using. That comes way later in the process.

With appropriate skill, it is possible to recover the system just using the limited tools available in the intiramfs and BusyBox. A more user-friendly method is to boot into a live environment, use chroot to use the framework of the live environment to fix your installed environment, and then reboot. Or you can use the live environment to backup your files before you nuke. Installing anew will give you a non-broken system in about 10-15 minutes.

To answer the question of the thread, as already noted you can easily add or remove different desktop environments at will.

[deadflowr]

You can respond to oldfred's request in your other thread:
https://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2408298

[TheFu]

Right but what if this happens down the road when I do have stuff I want to retain? The uncertainty is unnerving. For example right now I can't even get to the log files, I'm stuck with this horrible (initramfs): prompt which I have no idea what to do with. Hell- I can't even get in to look at the log files.

I would boot from a USB flash drive and have a look around on the disk and at the logs.
Pretty much anything can be fixed from the "Try Ubuntu" environment that is available by all *buntu ISO image desktop files - mate, xfce, lxqt, gnome3, and KDE each can be used in this way.

As a guess, I'd check the boot.log since that is likely where the issue is, if there is anything there. The answer could be in the BIOS boot priority settings if the 2nd disk is higher priority and it has a minimal boot environment. Any chance the 2nd disk ever had **any** linux installs previously? CatKiller's idea seems like an excellent idea.

Ah ... and the info that oldfred asked for (boot-repair info) would be very helpful. Be certain that all disks are connected at the time. If a Windows disk was added as the other thread claims, then using the live boot flash ubuntu and a chroot, then installing grub and updating grub will let it find both the Ubuntu and the Windows installations. A mention of that other thread was very helpful. Many thanks deadflowr.

[david503]

How come windows doesn't have this problem when I connect a new drive?

(Oh, and yes, I have the ubuntu drive higher priority in bios.)

Also:

It has absolutely nothing to do with whichever desktop environment you're using. That comes way later in the process.

Yes I'm well aware- but it's nonetheless a different distro, right? I mean the options in the install are even different.

But still, like I said, I know it's probably a grub problem not a distro problem...

[ajgreeny]

How come windows doesn't have this problem when I connect a new drive?

(Oh, and yes, I have the ubuntu higher priority in bios.)

Most normally it does not happen in Ubuntu either, so as others have suggested, I suspect this is not directly related simply to adding another drive.

Boot to a live Ubuntu system and see if the Windows drive is mountable from that or if it throws a lot of errors when you try mounting it.
Also run terminal commands

sudo fdisk -l | grep /dev/sd*
sudo blkid -c /dev/null

We might get some better clues about what went wrong from that.

[david503]

Ok quick question- the ubuntu mate dvd is also a live disk, right? Like you mean I should boot into it and there's a live mode instead of an install mode?

Alternatively I've got a recent knoppix disc and an ALT Regular Rescue disc that buned last night to run smartctl on this drive thinking it's a hardware problem (that's actually what they told me to do on the MATE forum when I posted about this problem.)

So the ubuntu mate disc has a live mode is that what you mean right?

[TheFu]

Yep. "Try Ubuntu" or something like that. I'm assuming you got the ISO from an official source. Non-official places can mix whatever they want.

If there's a Rescue Mode offered, that can be handy too. It is always best to use the same release that you installed to try and fix things since the programs will be built with the same libraries. If you use a different release/version, it is possible that some configs had changed and the older tools won't work with the newer versions. For example, for a few years, it wasn't safe to use fdisk with GPT partitioned disks. We had to use parted instead. Between 16.04 and 18.04, network configurations have been completely changed. And the versions of grub are different between every major release, I would expect.

Why doesn't Windows have issues like this? Because they ignore non-MSFT OSes. Just for fun, install any Linux, get it working, reboot a few times to be certain life it great. Then install Windows. I hope you didn't need any of that data.