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Thread: I understand now why Linux will never be 'the preferred OS'

  1. #41
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    Re: I understand now why Linux will never be 'the preferred OS'

    my dad was used to windows only. we got him HP business laptop with SUSE preinstalled. needless to say it all worked out of the box. We then replaced SUSE with Kubuntu (to avoid paying a licence to access their repo+suse repos are old). we changed the menu to classic so it looked like XP he was used to and a bit more like win 7 that he had at work. we then showed him the alternative software. most he already new as we used and still do open source software on windows. at the time we just asked him to give it a try and if he feels it is too alien for him, we would buy him windows and install that. he has no issues and every once in a while i would ask him how the PC is doing and he says his PC runs just fine.

    so to sum up. transition is very easy if:
    1. hardware is linux compatible --> manufacturers are responsible for that - they should either create drivers or if they give access people will create drivers for them. when drivers are opensource every user is "responsible" for their improvements and is encouraged to post bugs, queries, feature requests...
    2. windows users already use opensource programs on windows - for example we already used Firefox, Inkscape, GIMP, Libre Office (before open office or old MS office 2003), Thunderbird, a bunch of KDE apps... on windows. since they are the same on linux users have no issue moving between OS.

    for the few software my dad needed we found good alternatives (gramps for genealogy, k3B for nero and digiKam for photo organisation). slowly but surely all machines in that household moved to linux.

    i still have some windows machines, because i need osme windows specific software. and when thinking about getting a new PC i am conflicted. on one hand i think Kubuntu will be enough, but then for specific signing software for tax reports and a few other things they want windows (software is only made for windows). while i still have win 7 on one of the PC it is only supported for about 1 more year. and then what? so i might need to load with windows.
    Easy to understand Ubuntu manual with lots of pics: http://ubuntu-manual.org/
    Do i need antivirus/firewall in linux?
    User friendly disk backup (suitable for older PCs): Redobackup Less friendly disk backup (works on new PC): Clonezilla

  2. #42
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    Re: I understand now why Linux will never be 'the preferred OS'

    Quote Originally Posted by mastablasta View Post
    i still have some windows machines, because i need osme windows specific software. and when thinking about getting a new PC i am conflicted. on one hand i think Kubuntu will be enough, but then for specific signing software for tax reports and a few other things they want windows (software is only made for windows). while i still have win 7 on one of the PC it is only supported for about 1 more year. and then what? so i might need to load with windows.
    I keep a Win 7 VirtualBox VM around to do taxes and occasionally run Microsoft Access. I'm not really worried about support since I'm not using the OS for much that could endanger it. If anything, the half-hour waits that Windows can impose while updating make me think about turning off updates altogether. I've never understood why Windows takes so long to install updates. I can run dist-upgrade on Ubuntu and have a fully-updated system in just a few minutes, even when the update list consists of hundreds of packages.
    If you ask for help, do not abandon your request. Please have the courtesy to check for responses and thank the people who helped you.

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  3. #43
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    Re: I understand now why Linux will never be 'the preferred OS'

    re-updates - i think the issue is slow download speed. it takes it way too long to download 250 mb of updates over optic fiber. at least that is what i noticed.

    it is faster on win10 at work for example where we have our own repositories. update goes to our company repo, they test it and then deploy it. updates are then a lot faster and on par with what you would see in Ubuntu (well minus the reboot and then long kernel patching or whatever it is doing).

    another problem (as least with older version) if you don't use it regularly the microsoft "malware scanner" runs and takes CPU priority. it can really hog the CPU, bringing system to a crawl. add updates to that and you get a slow system. worst still this scan can not be disabled. you can kill it but it just restarts. with regular OS usage this is done while PC is idle and may not be so noticable. on win 10 (at least on enterprise edition) this is solved in a different way.
    Easy to understand Ubuntu manual with lots of pics: http://ubuntu-manual.org/
    Do i need antivirus/firewall in linux?
    User friendly disk backup (suitable for older PCs): Redobackup Less friendly disk backup (works on new PC): Clonezilla

  4. #44
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    Re: I understand now why Linux will never be 'the preferred OS'

    Quote Originally Posted by vasa1 View Post
    You haven't made things easier for yourself by having a multitude of desktop environments:
    Code:
    cinnamon2d.desktop  cinnamon.desktop  kodi.desktop  plasma.desktop  ubuntu.desktop  ubuntu-xorg.desktop  xbmc.desktop

    Any pointers on how to uninstall unwanted desktops...?

    Originally installed Ubuntu from ubuntu website. Then deliberately followed instruction to install KDE desktop. Not sure how the others showed up.

  5. #45
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    Re: I understand now why Linux will never be 'the preferred OS'

    Quote Originally Posted by Tadaen_Sylvermane View Post
    Transitioning to linux isn't hard. I put my grandparents on it many months ago, maybe a year. I haven't heard a peep from them about the computer "problems" like I used to hear every couple weeks. That anecdotal experience tells me Linux is easier to use than Windows, also safer.

    Really though it goes to how flexible people are. Everyone seems to forget that "It just works" on either Windows or Mac involved them learning the ins and outs for a long time to make that happen. But when they switch or try linux they give it 5 minutes and say to hell with it. In the end my personal experience is Linux makes more sense, is easier, and just works. I've used both Linux and Windows extensively over my life. Linux wins. Think outside the box and you would be amazed at the results.

    I'm guessing your grandparents only use it to surf the net, youtube etc.

    I'd be surprised if they were using VPN connections, apps like spotify, teamviewer, kodi, cctv software, dropbox, accessing server connections because I found most of the installation of setups behind these misc items/tasks are no where near as straight forward as windows.

  6. #46
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    Re: I understand now why Linux will never be 'the preferred OS'

    Quote Originally Posted by frappe792 View Post
    I'd be surprised if they were using VPN connections, apps like spotify, teamviewer, kodi, cctv software, dropbox, accessing server connections because I found most of the installation of setups behind these misc items/tasks are no where near as straight forward as windows.
    that may be true, but that has nothing to do with the OS itself. the developers of software should provide proper install packages (e.g. snap, binary tars...) or instructions (e.g. for PPA).
    Easy to understand Ubuntu manual with lots of pics: http://ubuntu-manual.org/
    Do i need antivirus/firewall in linux?
    User friendly disk backup (suitable for older PCs): Redobackup Less friendly disk backup (works on new PC): Clonezilla

  7. #47
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    Re: I understand now why Linux will never be 'the preferred OS'

    Quote Originally Posted by mastablasta View Post
    re-updates - i think the issue is slow download speed. it takes it way too long to download 250 mb of updates over optic fiber. at least that is what i noticed.
    I've watched the updater sit idle for minutes on end before it even starts downloading the updates. Perhaps that malware scan that you mention is happening in the background, but in true Windows fashion, there is no explanation provided to the user about what is actually taking place.

    Originally installed Ubuntu from ubuntu website. Then deliberately followed instruction to install KDE desktop. Not sure how the others showed up.
    If you want a KDE desktop, use the Kubuntu flavor instead of ordinary Ubuntu. If I were you, I'd reinstall the entire OS from a Kubuntu image like this: http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/kubuntu/xe...-live/current/
    If you ask for help, do not abandon your request. Please have the courtesy to check for responses and thank the people who helped you.

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  8. #48
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    Re: I understand now why Linux will never be 'the preferred OS'

    Quote Originally Posted by frappe792 View Post
    You are totally missing my point.

    What I am saying is why don't the developers get together and make a bullet proof desktop linux operating system that works out of the box - like android tablets?
    I agree with everything you have written, but the day to day user, ie my brother wouldn't even bother with linux. Many people simply don't have the time and/or patience for it.

    Linux has the capability to eliminate windows from the scene, by developing their own dummy version of linux for people like my brother, my mum..... I don't understand why that hasn't happened yet.
    There is no one-size-fits-all operating system. Windows appeals to some, and more people use it because they just don't see another choice out there, or don't care enough to choose. Some people choose Mac OS because they like it better, or because they simply don't like Windows. That said, for both Windows and Mac OS X there is a central authority which decides on features, supported hardware, look and feel, and they have a pool of developers who are paid to make it happen.


    Linux is not an offering by any company. There are literally thousands of sources/organizations supplying the software you get on Ubuntu. Each software project is maintained and managed by a group of developers who may not even know the other members of their project, or speak the same language, or live on the same continent. Sometimes the software is developed by a commercial entity who then releases the app or a limited version of it as Open Source. Others are developed from the ground up by a bunch of guys who want to solve some specific problem. From the very beginning, Open Source has been a few developers getting together with a single common goal (a small goal, not a whole desktop) and they make something that best solves their problems. Linux is an Open Source project, but not what you're thinking. Linux is a kernel, nothing else. The rest you see can mostly work on many different operating systems, sometimes including Windows or Mac OS.

    There is no single group who decides what Linux is going to look like, how it will work, or ensure it works with all hardware.

    A linux distribution is a group of people (or sometimes just one person) who defines a purpose for the distro and target hardware, then starts compiling kernels and building software into the repository. The managers of the distro decide what shows up on the initial install, and a few minor details but they don't generally own ANY software found on the installation. Some distros do own software, but it may be optional.

    For example, Canonical owns and manages Ubuntu and all its flavors. Canonical provides software and services for profit, and they manage *buntu in order to have a reliable platform on which that software runs. They also supply this forum, and the forum serves as a level of technical support because that's why we have forums in the first place. However Canonical does not own the kernel, the just use it. They don't own the system logger, they just use it. They don't own gnome, they just use it. Every aspect of the thing you see on your screen is owned by somebody else, with very few exceptions. Everything you think of as a desktop (network drivers, video drivers, whatever) is owned by some group upstream.


    My wife runs Windows 10 on her laptop. I run a mac and several Linux boxes. I have Windows on a VM for software testing. My wife has all sorts of problems with her Windows box. My mac is a PITA sometimes. Generally speaking the linux boxes run smoothly. The reason is that I have been heavily involved in Linux for decades, and I'm not so familiar with the others.

    Linux runs on the fastest computers in the world, far larger than anything Windows runs on. It also runs on hardware far too small for Windows. If you have a smart phone and it's not a Windows phone, then it runs Linux or some other UNIX. Nothing still on the market, to my knowledge, runs anything else. If you have a wired or wireless router, it almost certainly runs Linux, FreeBSD or some variant. Most commercial big-business routers, firewalls, and switches run some sort of UNIX, and a lot of times you can dig around and find that it's Linux under the covers. Most web servers are running on Linux. Most mail servers run on some version of UNIX.

    Even if you're running Windows, you almost certainly can't do a day's work on a computer without also using Linux. Even if you work at Microsoft.
    Last edited by 1clue; December 7th, 2017 at 09:57 PM.
    Help stamp out MBR partition tables. Use GPT instead!

  9. #49
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    Re: I understand now why Linux will never be 'the preferred OS'

    Quote Originally Posted by frappe792 View Post
    I'm guessing your grandparents only use it to surf the net, youtube etc.

    I'd be surprised if they were using VPN connections, apps like spotify, teamviewer, kodi, cctv software, dropbox, accessing server connections because I found most of the installation of setups behind these misc items/tasks are no where near as straight forward as windows.
    I am a big Kodi user. On Windows I have to manually update it every time there is an update, on Ubuntu the PPA does it automatically. I share my media using NFS, which Kodi can connect with easily on Windows, but you try and connect directly with an NFS server on Windows. Without a lot of messing about you can't.

    I am a licensed CCTV operator and Linux is the go to OS in the CCTV world, installing Dropbox is easy, connecting to a VPN is easy too. I have never used Spotify or Teamviewer so I can't comment.

  10. #50
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    Re: I understand now why Linux will never be 'the preferred OS'

    Quote Originally Posted by frappe792 View Post
    Any pointers on how to uninstall unwanted desktops...?

    Originally installed Ubuntu from ubuntu website. Then deliberately followed instruction to install KDE desktop. Not sure how the others showed up.
    Open up Synaptic, search on the desktops you want to remove, right-click on them and then select "Mark for complete removal". When you've selected the things you want to remove, click the Apply button at the top of the window.
    Help stamp out MBR partition tables. Use GPT instead!

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