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Thread: Administrator as Root

  1. #21
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    Re: Administrator as Root

    Quote Originally Posted by offgridguy View Post
    To clarify, I prefer the approach that fedora takes, where the root account is established with
    a password upon installation, then when functions arise requiring administrative permissions
    you are prompted for the root password to fulfill those functions,

    I am still wondering which other linux distro's offer a similar feature?
    "then when functions arise requiring administrative permissions"
    Again, it's root permissions, even though your doing administrative tasks it's root permissions.

    Yes all the Redhat distros make you setup a root password when you install the operating system, Redhat, Centos, Fedora etc...
    This behavior is by design.

  2. #22
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    Re: Administrator as Root

    Quote Originally Posted by offgridguy View Post

    I am still wondering which other linux distro's offer a similar feature?

    .
    All Linux distros offer the same thing as does Windows. it is called least privelege.


    You run everything as an ordinary user and elevate privelege to authorise an administrative action.

    In Linux there is ROOT and there is Admin users who usually use "sudo" and enter their own password to authorize actions (entering own password confirms the action) the ability to do so is there group membership.

    In windows everyone thinks you do everything as Administrator, well there is a Administrator account in windows aside from the one you create when you first install it. UAC in recent version is similar to the confirmation model used with sudo (and i said similar not the same) it is just that in Windows it defaults to the user being an administrator, well most Linux distros default the first created user aside from root to being admin also.

    You should in all OS use a limited ordinary account (least privelege) for day to day tasks and when required elevate the privelege or login with a elevated account.

    In all Linux distros you can if you want login as root, including Ubuntu, and you can use sudo also if preferred or in some you just su (su to root or to any other user), and in all Linux distros it is suggested you run as Least privelege, it is just in Ubuntu root is locked in so much as it has no password set by default.

    You might be interested in these: (I am not a fan of opinionpedia but these are decent)

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compar...ation_features
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Princi...east_privilege


    Peace
    Last edited by haqking; February 27th, 2013 at 12:39 PM.
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  3. #23
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    Xubuntu 15.10 Wily Werewolf

    Re: Administrator as Root

    Quote Originally Posted by offgridguy View Post
    To clarify, I prefer the approach that fedora takes, where the root account is established with
    a password upon installation, then when functions arise requiring administrative permissions
    you are prompted for the root password to fulfill those functions, this doesn't mean running
    as root, rather root privileges are quickly and easily available.

    I am still wondering which other linux distro's offer a similar feature?
    All distros have a root account.
    All distros allow the existence of non-root accounts which have reduced priviledges.

    It is many years since I installed a distro that didn't require creation of a non-root account as part of the install procedure, maybe 20, if I recall correctly.

    So in effect, all distros have this "feature". Ubuntu is unusual in using sudo rather than su for admin tasks, and thus requiring your own password rather than the root password. But that's the only noticeable difference.

  4. #24
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    Re: Administrator as Root

    Quote Originally Posted by The Cog View Post
    Ubuntu is unusual in using sudo rather than su for admin tasks, and thus requiring your own password rather than the root password. But that's the only noticeable difference.
    Do other distro's lock the root account?

  5. #25
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    Re: Administrator as Root

    Quote Originally Posted by haqking View Post
    In all Linux distros you can if you want login as root, including Ubuntu, and you can use sudo also if preferred or in some you just su (su to root or to any other user), and in all Linux distros it is suggested you run as Least privelege, it is just in Ubuntu root is locked in so much as it has no password set by default.

    You might be interested in these: (I am not a fan of opinionpedia but these are decent)

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compar...ation_features
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Princi...east_privilege


    Peace
    Thank you for the reply and the links, although
    you can log in as root in any distro, as you said,I find the
    method's so remarkably different between fedora and ubuntu, the latter being hidden in effect and only accessible through the
    Command Line Interface. The former being present and visible,
    only requiring a password when permissions are required. In effect making it easier to
    perform administrative tasks using the GUI, at least for the uninitiated.
    Thanks again.
    Last edited by offgridguy; February 27th, 2013 at 02:03 PM.

  6. #26
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    Re: Administrator as Root

    Quote Originally Posted by offgridguy View Post
    Thank you for the reply and the links, although
    you can log in as root in any distro, as you said,I find the
    method's so remarkably different between fedora and ubuntu
    , the latter being hidden in effect and only accessible through the
    Command Line Interface. The former being present and visible,
    only requiring a password when permissions are required. In effect making it easier to
    perform administrative tasks using the GUI, at least for the uninitiated.
    Thanks again.
    really ?

    You give root a password during install thats about it as you do with most distros other than Ubuntu and a couple of others i believe.

    Other than that things are the same, your own account uses sudo to authenticate an action.

    I am in F18 right now, if i want to perform an admin action I will use:

    sudo <command>

    same as in Ubuntu or any other distro using sudo.

    I rarely if ever need to use the "root" account or its password so may aswell be locked as in Ubuntu.

    If i do the methods as the same in Fedora or Ubuntu except that you need to give Ubuntu root a password first (which is what you do during a fedora install) its just a "when" thing.

    Peace
    Feel Free to Bitcoin Tip: 135Rp4pwwYTHEJ4u8bxKaDQiC91N9LUoV2

    Backtrack - Giving machine guns to monkeys since 2006
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  7. #27
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    Re: Administrator as Root

    Teapot and tempest.

    Fedora, etc., allow ordinary users to be added to the wheel group. The sudoers file can, optionally, be edited to allow a user in the wheel group to, for example, do a "sudo command" without being prompted for a password.

    By default, Ubuntu does not have a wheel group. (It doesn't prevent the creation of one.) So, I can't execute "sudo command" without a password prompt, because I need to be in the wheel group to enable that.

    If someone wants to use the more traditional approach to acquiring root privileges in Ubuntu, and they know how, they can easily do that.

    In Fedora, I can do "su -", for example, enter a password, and become root. I can't in Ubuntu. The root user exists, though.

    In Fedora, I can do "sudo -i" and escalate my privileges to root for as long as I wish. Ditto in Ubuntu.

    In Ubuntu, do a "sudo whoami" and see what it says.

    As for the Windows Adminstrator comparision, it's been more than 10 years since I used Windows. But, I do recall that some versions of Windows tried to generate a false sense of security by prompting for a password to do almost any little thing. The easiest way to avoid this annoyance was to simply run as a Windows Administrator. Unix/Linux uses an entirely different design. If a Linux user is frequently asked to acquire root privileges trying to accomplish routine tasks, then, more than likely, that user is doing something very wrong.

  8. #28
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    Re: Administrator as Root

    Quote Originally Posted by offgridguy View Post
    Do other distro's lock the root account?
    Not as such. But the distro I used before Ubuntu (Mandrake) did not allow root to log in using the GUI. This could be reconfigured, just as the root password in Ubuntu can be unlocked, but it was the default. I believe it is normal to discourage permanent login as root.

    I have never tried Fedora. But Mandrake was Red Hat based, and I'm sure I remember a popup password prompt when trying to launch admin tasks, just like I see in Ubuntu. But I had to enter teh root password, not my own. What is this "huge difference" between Fedora and Ubuntu that you refer to? I'm not being sarcastic - I just don't see much difference.

  9. #29
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    Re: Administrator as Root

    Quote Originally Posted by The Cog View Post
    I have never tried Fedora. But Mandrake was Red Hat based, and I'm sure I remember a popup password prompt when trying to launch admin tasks, just like I see in Ubuntu. But I had to enter teh root password, not my own. What is this "huge difference" between Fedora and Ubuntu that you refer to? I'm not being sarcastic - I just don't see much difference.
    Maybe not a big thing but
    as an example, i can be accessing a file , ubuntu gives access denied,or permission denied, fedora prompts for password.
    Last edited by offgridguy; February 27th, 2013 at 06:25 PM.

  10. #30
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    Re: Administrator as Root

    Quote Originally Posted by offgridguy View Post
    Maybe not a big thing but
    as an example, i can be accessing a file , ubuntu gives access denied,or permission denied, fedora prompts for password.
    In both cases, the user -- you -- lacks the necessary privileges. The Fedora tool follows the more traditional route, which is to deny access. The Ubuntu tool also denies access, as it should, but adds the nicety of popping up a dialog to let you log in as the root user.

    So, the difference is that the Fedora tool assumes you are clever enough to know, or learn, how to temporarily bump up your privileges on your own. There's no difference in the underlying structure.

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