Trying to learn how to program

[orphanlast]

I'm thinking about learning how to program stuff... In fact. I'm thinking about taking on a project that is probably bigger than I can swallow.

What's a good programming language that doesn't require a plug in for Windows (people keep suggesting python, but I had to install a plugin to run a program running python). I want a solid programming language.

And if possible, what's a good compiler? I would really like to have a visual compiler. Something like Google App Inventor http://www.appinventorbeta.com/about/ ... again, if that's possible.

I'm so sick of hearing about a program and conceptualizing how it would work. And then I use it and realize "oh... it can't do this or this or this... I thought it did..." and then after about five years and five different new releases of the same program, they finally put those functions in and everyone calls them brilliant and revolutionary. I seriously think up this crap years and years before these people do. Why not make something to show them how its done.

[searchfgold6789]

C and its variants - doesn't require a plugin necessarily and runs on Windows but hard to learn. I bet there are many tools out there to help your program using C, C# or C++. It's pretty much the "standard" program language and has been for a long time.

[orphanlast]

I've been researching high and low for a compiler or IDE similar to Google app inventor and the closest thing that I can come up with is Microsoft Visual C++. And yet is still seems to fall short.

Has anyone ever given any thought to making something like this for PC's? Are there any suggestions people might have for something like this out in the current market? Is anyone working on something like this as a fun pet project?

I think there'd be a high demand for it. If someone doesn't jump on it now, I guarantee eventually people are going to and when it does, it's going to be big.

[3rdalbum]

Runtime Revolution. Not free, but "compiles" to multiple platforms and uses a language similar to Hypertalk (from Apple's Hypercard). Has an interface designer.

It's a little bit lower-level than App Inventor, because you do write code in Runtime Revolution, but it's very easy to write in.

[CptPicard]

You already have a few concepts rather wrong or at least you call them by odd names. A "plugin"? Do you mean the Python interpreter?

And calling Google App Inventor a "compiler"... well, it's some sort of an IDE-style application building environment.

IMO, many beginners have this odd idea that they must have a "solid" language that does not require a runtime; and then they seem to be accepting something much more than the Python runtime they just shunned.

It is the old strange attitude that sometimes manifests itself in the idea that the closer to the hardware you are, the more "real" your programming is, and that as a beginner you'll be a Real Man if you just try to start all the way from the bootloader, as if it really teaches you something of value.

A beginner is not going to be learning valuable things fast starting from C. This is not to even say that C is particularly incredibly "hard"; it's just "hard" in a non-helpful way -- that is, there is lots of nitty-gritty that gets in the way of gaining an understanding of the big picture of programming. It is, in my view, far easier to dig down from the large scale than vice versa, as the low level details are just specifics of architecture and so on, and not the big huge truths that apply across all programming.

So I would say you just stick to Python, it's a very good starting point. May want to take a look at Java or C# as well; and if you're really adventurous, Scheme.

[orphanlast]

You already have a few concepts rather wrong or at least you call them by odd names. A "plugin"? Do you mean the Python interpreter?

Yes

And calling Google App Inventor a "compiler"... well, it's some sort of an IDE-style application building environment.

After doing a bit more research I figured that out, my second post is a little more knowledgeable about that.

I would say you just stick to Python, it's a very good starting point. May want to take a look at Java or C# as well; and if you're really adventurous, Scheme.

Thanks -- I've been thinking for a little while and blender is made with Python. So it does have some diversity. But would it not help to have an IDE to at least assist or shortcut some steps? Especially as a crutch for someone starting out until they can stand on their own. Because it helps to be able to see something get developed as you're learning. Otherwise it can feel like you're just at a freakin' stand still and that's just frustrating.

If you think it'd be of any assistance, what Java based IDE would you recommend?