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View Full Version : Apparently, mp3 is 100% compatable.



tompickles
November 4th, 2008, 06:11 PM
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/7708268.stm

Check this out.

sydbat
November 4th, 2008, 06:11 PM
Bad link. Goes to 404 page.

tompickles
November 4th, 2008, 06:15 PM
Sorry! Link updated

sydbat
November 4th, 2008, 06:16 PM
Thanks.

I wonder though, does 100% mp3 compatible mean 100% DRM free? Or is it 100% DRM'd?

tompickles
November 4th, 2008, 06:20 PM
Thanks.

I wonder though, does 100% mp3 compatible mean 100% DRM free? Or is it 100% DRM'd?

who knows! But, 100% percent compatible with what? Most people have ipods?

sydbat
November 4th, 2008, 06:23 PM
:lolflag:

Never thought of that. I'm guessing they mean with other, non-iPod type players.

DrMega
November 4th, 2008, 06:24 PM
It doesn't say what it is 100% compaitible with. I would expect it to be 100% compatible with, say, a portable MP3 player. On the other hand I'm not so sure it will be 100% compatible with, say, the empty plastic drink cup that's currently on my desk.

snova
November 4th, 2008, 06:25 PM
Here's my conspiracy theory:

It's an attack on Ogg Vorbis! If you use Vorbis, only select hardware manufacturers will support your music! You'll be locked in!

Bah. It's just an advertisement for DRM. "Ensure artists are getting paid", what bunk.

tom66
November 4th, 2008, 06:37 PM
It doesn't run well if I put my MP3 player in the microwave. It just makes a crackling noise... oh, wait.



It aims to raise the profile of the open MP3 music format and show people what they can do with their downloads.


First off: MP3 is not 'open'. Yes, you can get hold of a specification of it, and for free. But it isn't open; you have to pay royalties to the patent holders to use it if you plan using it outside of a private household... and even then, you're treading on thin ice because technically you're infringing the patent.



The trade body behind the initiative said it should also help consumers identify legal sites.


Umm... copy & paste anyone? I can't see anything which makes it unique from sticking a sticker on your website saying '1000% LEGAL DOWN LOAD'.



The Entertainment Retailers Association devised the logo, which emphasises the fact that MP3 files can be played on any digital player.


My CD player is a 'digital player', yet it can't play MP3 CDs.



HMV, Woolworths, 7digital, Digitalstores, Tescodigital, Tunetribe, and Play.com have all signed up to the scheme, which will show consumers that the MP3 download will play on PCs, Macs, and portable music players.


Of course, don't forget Linux. Remember, we don't exist... we're an illusion.



"The beauty of an MP3 file is that once you have bought it, you don't need to be a computer genius or a lawyer to make it work and you are not locked in to a relationship with a single retailer or hardware manufacturer," he said.


Unless you have acquired a license through a licensed codec, you do need a lawyer because you have broken the law. Although they're probably not going to prosecute anyone, you still have broken the law, their patent, in fact.



... and artists are getting paid.


As if they aren't! They get paid... not as much as they could, though. Stop using this stupid line. It's mostly the record corporations at fault though: they take about 80-90% of the profits. (The retailer and the artist are left with the rest.)

/rant (poor journalism from the BBC & others)

snova
November 4th, 2008, 06:43 PM
Unless you have acquired a license through a licensed codec, you do need a lawyer because you have broken the law. Although they're probably not going to prosecute anyone, you still have broken the law, their patent, in fact.

Very nice. :)

DrMega
November 4th, 2008, 07:48 PM
Unless you have acquired a license through a licensed codec, you do need a lawyer because you have broken the law.

I think that's only true in the US, but I'm not certain.

Paqman
November 4th, 2008, 08:34 PM
So, are we actually debating whether mp3 is playable on anything (because it is) or just giving it a kicking because it's not open and cuddly?

Half-Left
November 4th, 2008, 08:45 PM
So, are we actually debating whether mp3 is playable on anything (because it is) or just giving it a kicking because it's not open and cuddly?

Well you need to pay 30,000-40,000 for a license just for the pleasure, OGG is free.

DrMega
November 4th, 2008, 09:12 PM
So, are we actually debating whether mp3 is playable on anything (because it is) or just giving it a kicking because it's not open and cuddly?

Is it playable on anything? I doubt very much I can play one on my old cassette player that I still have in my cellar (basement).

snova
November 4th, 2008, 09:18 PM
Is it playable on anything? I doubt very much I can play one on my old cassette player that I still have in my cellar (basement).

I think that's a bit of an over-exaggeration...

I, at any rate, am arguing for how clearly this is just a way to make people accept DRM as a fact of life, part of music, and inseparable from "legality".

Paqman
November 4th, 2008, 09:57 PM
Well you need to pay 30,000-40,000 for a license just for the pleasure, OGG is free.

This logo is clearly intended for consumers, not manufacturers.


Is it playable on anything? I doubt very much I can play one on my old cassette player that I still have in my cellar (basement).

Don't be silly.

snova
November 4th, 2008, 09:58 PM
This logo is clearly intended for consumers, not manufacturers.

And that makes it acceptable?

forrestcupp
November 4th, 2008, 10:06 PM
It doesn't say what it is 100% compaitible with. I would expect it to be 100% compatible with, say, a portable MP3 player. On the other hand I'm not so sure it will be 100% compatible with, say, the empty plastic drink cup that's currently on my desk.

Well, that depends on what you mean by compatible. If you're talking about being emotionally compatible, then I guess it could be compatible with the empty plastic cup. Unless the mp3 is a hateful song about plastic cups.

ad_267
November 4th, 2008, 10:10 PM
the open MP3 music format

That is one really badly misinformed article. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mp3#Licensing_and_patent_issues

forrestcupp
November 4th, 2008, 10:11 PM
Well you need to pay 30,000-40,000 for a license just for the pleasure, OGG is free.

What? You can buy the Fluendo Windows Media and MP3 playback pack for $24.94 to be able to legally play mp3's. You wouldn't have to pay 30,000 unless you were going to manufacture and mass produce your own mp3 player to sell.

Paqman
November 4th, 2008, 10:11 PM
And that makes it acceptable?

No, it means that they don't have to pay 30,000 to get mp3 playback.

Seriously, why is everyone getting bent out of shape about a piece of marketing drivel? So some sites selling mp3s have come up with a stupid logo telling people they can play mp3s on any device. Big deal. It's not like anybody complaining on this thread was unaware of this fact.

Half-Left
November 4th, 2008, 11:00 PM
What? You can buy the Fluendo Windows Media and MP3 playback pack for $24.94 to be able to legally play mp3's. You wouldn't have to pay 30,000 unless you were going to manufacture and mass produce your own mp3 player to sell.

And all distros that want mp3 by default, I remember SUSE saying a while back they refuse to pay this greedy amount just for mp3 playback by default.

DrMega
November 4th, 2008, 11:06 PM
Don't be silly.

Who's being silly? Was it not you that said:


So, are we actually debating whether mp3 is playable on anything (because it is)

Paqman
November 4th, 2008, 11:22 PM
Who's being silly?

Alright, just to keep you happy, i'll amend my statement:

"Mp3 is playable on any digital music player or computer, but isn't playable on turntables, discmans, cassette walkmans, ear trumpets, trombones, nose flutes, ***'s jaws, buckets of ham, three-piece lounge suites, ocean-going yachts, abstract concepts, sunshine or jam-based left-handed jousting helmets"

I should have been more specific all along. I apologise.

:rolleyes:

DrMega
November 4th, 2008, 11:47 PM
Alright, just to keep you happy, i'll amend my statement:

"Mp3 is playable on any digital music player or computer, but isn't playable on turntables, discmans, cassette walkmans, ear trumpets, trombones, nose flutes, ***'s jaws, buckets of ham, three-piece lounge suites, ocean-going yachts, abstract concepts, sunshine or jam-based left-handed jousting helmets"

I should have been more specific all along. I apologise.

:rolleyes:

So are you saying that I can play an MP3 on Joe Cameron's The Gigantic Book of Crosswords then?

Paqman
November 4th, 2008, 11:54 PM
So are you saying that I can play an MP3 on Joe Cameron's The Gigantic Book of Crosswords then?

Yes, but you'll have to demodulate the flange widgets. I'd recommend a #2 demodulator with a spark bargle. Take the usual precautions.

oedipuss
November 5th, 2008, 01:10 AM
Ok, so mp3 isn't open.
The fact remains though that it is and will be drm free, and just for that I think it's a very positive thing more sites promote the format. It could be ogg in it's place, but apparently mp3 is more globally accepted, perhaps even for historical reasons.
The big step and main focus was removing drm and promoting interoperability. Switching to an actually open format might become a much easier next step.

I-75
November 5th, 2008, 01:15 AM
Yes, but you'll have to demodulate the flange widgets. I'd recommend a #2 demodulator with a spark bargle. Take the usual precautions.


The Flux Capacitor is as important as the henway.

macogw
November 5th, 2008, 06:40 AM
Thanks.

I wonder though, does 100% mp3 compatible mean 100% DRM free? Or is it 100% DRM'd?

MP3 cannot be DRM'd. That'd violate the MP3 standard. The point is to emphasize that because MP3 lacks DRM it is compatible with all players on the market.

For the people thinking MP3s don't work on iPods: what are you smoking?

beniwtv
November 5th, 2008, 09:29 AM
Meh... I don't really care... It's just another marketing strategy...

But seriously, claiming it works on "any device" is just silly. You know that when a customer approaches you and asks you if he can have Internet access on his digital photo frame, because on your website you say "any device" (seriously, happened to me at the company I was working for).

As for me, unless mp3 can even come close to OGG Vorbis technically, I'm ripping my CD's in OGG Vorbis with Sound Juicer. Period.

Cheers,

t0p
November 5th, 2008, 01:39 PM
DRM... make sure artists get paid... what a crock!

DRM has been touted as an "anti-piracy" device, but that's a crock too. The so-called organized pirates (whoever they are) don't care about DRM. They will always be able to find ways to circumvent DRM. The only people who will be messed about by DRM are the consumers, who won't be able to play their music where and when they want unless they go to the trouble of re-ripping and re-encoding their collection. What is the world coming to when you have to rip your CDs to be able to play them on your computer?

As for mp3 v ogg: mp3 is ubiquitous and all-pervasive. Mp3 will be the de facto "standard" for a long time to come. It isn't open or Free... but it might as well be. It's too late for ogg.

Oh, and as for the often-touted "superiority" of ogg: it isn't really noticeable when you're playing music on a typical portable device and listening through those tiny ear phones. Serious hi-fi enthusiasts with big expensive machinery and speakers and the like may be able to detect the difference. Most people don't care.

handy
November 5th, 2008, 02:21 PM
who knows! But, 100% percent compatible with what? Most people have ipods?

iPods play mp3 too.

jacko999
November 5th, 2008, 03:17 PM
it means it is 100% compatible with mobile devices at its 100% DRM free so can be converted to work on any device (well pretty much any)

oedipuss
November 5th, 2008, 04:48 PM
Serious hi-fi enthusiasts with big expensive machinery and speakers and the like may be able to detect the difference. Most people don't care.

Not to mention they won't use a lossy compression format if they can avoid it, and with today's hard disks it's easily avoidable.

Still, the major turning point is DRM. If there's another cheaper format available, and if it makes sense to use that instead of mp3, it will be possible to just do that. Will it happen? I guess not, 'MP3' has become synonymous to digital music , or downloaded music, even to the portable device itself.
It's just that it won't be impossible anymore, if more and more shops start selling mp3s instead of specific locked formats.

SunnyRabbiera
November 5th, 2008, 05:05 PM
Well i heard because of DRM being so big that recently the patent holders of MP3 dont really care who user the format anymore.
I think Mp3 will probably become a mostly open format in the future, from what I know of whats happening behind the doors of thomson the us holder of the patent there was much talk of letting go of most of the control they demanded for so long.
The market has changed so thomson in light of todays economy might no longer enforce its claim very soon... it might not be able to afford to.

malleus74
November 5th, 2008, 05:17 PM
I'd love to use the ogg format for my music, but I'd hate to lose any more quality converting that many mp3's. I'm not about to go through that many cd's again to get the same or slightly better quality than I have now. Plus, what brand name portable digital players support ogg?

Bottom line, mp3 is what people know, and it won't change any time soon. You have to have the ability to play mp3's in a distro, especially one that is tailored to new users.

Mr. Picklesworth
November 5th, 2008, 05:27 PM
So... you guys are getting the exact opposite impression from this that it's meant to have? The point is that music here is available in plain MP3 instead of a DRMed format. That way people can still legally purchase music, but own it in a way that permits format shifting without any evil barriers.

Sure, MP3 isn't the greatest format freedom-wise since it isn't open source, but this is a good start. To do something like this requires a huge presence, which the MP3 guys have and the free alternatives generally lack. Good on them.

The only problem for them is convincing the silly users that not all audio files are MP3s.