A big smack in the face from Blackboard

[L815]

Check out this email I got today from a school Admin.


To All Blackboard Users:
You cannot use the Firefox 3.0 browser to upload files into Blackboard. You will get an error. Blackboard is aware of this issue and is working on a fix, but as of now there is no fix available so please use IE, Firefox 2, or another browser when working with Blackboard.

Blackboard also does not support the Linux OS, although some students have been able to use it successfully. If you do have problems using Linux, Blackboard will most likely not be able to help you solve the problem.

[Canis familiaris]

ummm.. Sorry for being a noob. But what is Blackboard?
I thought blackboards were only boards to write with chalk.

[Mr. Picklesworth]

Yay, yet another web administrator who does not understand that the web is a neutral platform. All a web site should ever care about is the web browser it is inside of, and even that it shouldn't be thinking about since the system is designed to flow in a single direction; a web site is mostly passive from the client side. Any attempt to work in the other direction is either malicious or a failure. It should not care what OS it is in since it lives entirely in a standardized virtual environment.

[dfreer]

ummm.. Sorry for being a noob. But what is Blackboard?
I thought blackboards were only boards to write with chalk.

Blackboard is generally used for online classes or just group discussion outside class, several colleges I know around here use it.

As for the OP, you're lucky they support firefox at ALL. I had a class that required IE 6.0 and MS Office just to turn in assignments that easily could have been done with firefox/openoffice.


Yay, yet another web administrator who does not understand that the web is a neutral platform. All a web site should ever care about is the web browser it is inside of, and even that it shouldn't be thinking about since the system is designed to flow in a single direction; a web site is mostly passive from the client side. Any attempt to work in the other direction is either malicious or a failure. It should not care what OS it is in since it lives entirely in a standardized virtual environment.

I wouldn't blame it on the administrator, it's most likely out of his hands. That should be the way websites work, but reality is often quite different.

[Canis familiaris]

Blackboard is generally used for online classes or just group discussion outside class, several colleges I know around here use it.

As for the OP, you're lucky they support firefox at ALL. I had a class that required IE 6.0 and MS Office just to turn in assignments that easily could have been done with firefox/openoffice.

OK! I understand.

@OP: I understand your sentiments. It seems discriminating when a web developer does that. Personally I take it as the lack of skills of the web administrator.

Anyway you could mask your Firefox in Linux as IE in Windows. I think it is possible.
Also ies4linux is a last resort.

[Polygon]

i wonder what is the issue with firefox 3? a lot of web programs had no trouble with the switch.....

[Samhain13]

The administrator must just be playing safe. If the app uses javascripts and they haven't tested them in Firefox 3, then posting the advisory would be the "safe" thing for them to do. But I do think that it's absurd for the admin to mention operating systems because as another poster has said, web applications are supposed to be platform independent. :)

[Methuselah]

Yay, yet another web administrator who does not understand that the web is a neutral platform. All a web site should ever care about is the web browser it is inside of, and even that it shouldn't be thinking about since the system is designed to flow in a single direction; a web site is mostly passive from the client side. Any attempt to work in the other direction is either malicious or a failure. It should not care what OS it is in since it lives entirely in a standardized virtual environment.

Exactly, it's ridiculous.
The browsers are supposed to be standard compliant as well so it' bad enough that they have to care what browser you're running.

Anyway, it's pretty common for them to say they don't 'support' but the standard ensure that it does work.
Aleks, for example, works on linux with the JRE.

[Canis familiaris]

Maybe use Opera?

[amazingtaters]

yeah I'm not a big fan of blackboard. We use it at my uni, where we suck on the MS teat more than the average bear (as in I know 2 other Linux users on campus and they switched because they saw me using Ubuntu) and they aren't interested in supporting Linux or Open Source in any way. I've talked to IR about using Moodle (basically Blackboard but Open) and they've flat out shut that idea down because open source anything "isn't ready for mainstream use." You'll have to tell me if BB actually works with FF3 or not.

[TBOL3]

I had the same problem with a few of my classes. For some reason, they required me to use windows. No, not IE, windows. I could run firefox in windows, but not in linux. I think it was because they didn't want to support linux. So you said you can mask your computer, making it look like windows, how?

[Canis familiaris]

I had the same problem with a few of my classes. For some reason, they required me to use windows. No, not IE, windows. I could run firefox in windows, but not in linux. I think it was because they didn't want to support linux. So you said you can mask your computer, making it look like windows, how?

I am not exactly sure because I mainly use Opera but I think you need the User Agent Switcher.
https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/59

EDIT: Also you can use FF 2 in WINE.

[original_jamingrit]

Blackboard is a pain. I avoid using it as much as possible. It usable for me on FF3, although the way to use doesn't suit my web browsing habits at all. I have to relogin when I open it in a new tab or windows, and it thrusts pop-ups at me whenever I log in.

Which is odd, because my uni is pretty Open Source conscious.

[Stefanie]

my university also uses blackboard, and it has the same problem. i had to upload my MA paper and it refused to work. i sent an e-mail to the ict guys and they told me the problem can only be fixed by the blackboard devs. apparently there is something new or different in FF3 which does not work well with the blackboard code.

[Kernel Sanders]

ummm.. Sorry for being a noob. But what is Blackboard?
I thought blackboards were only boards to write with chalk.

BlackBoard is an online learning tool used by ALL Universities in the UK and probably further afield too.

It allows you to see what modules you are taking, download lecture notes, view your grades, even submit work electronically, and take multiple choice revision aid tests.

[stinger30au]

dunno if this will help

https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/59

firefox agent switcher.

[youthforlinux]

Use Blackboard, absolutely hate it....use is with FF3 tho...haha....

[solitaire]

My uni uses blackboard, it's been fine with my ff3 all year (beta was working with it!). I don't think it's a problem with bb rather than an it team that don't want to make work for themselves!

[coolglobal]

These web administrators & developers that think IE only are really in the dark ages and quite frankly slaves to the system. As a minimum an internet ready service or site should have been tested and working correctly on IE, safari, and firefox. To do less is just plain ignorant or lazy.

[TBOL3]

Nice, blackboard worked fine with me, but thanks to agent switcher, I am now running the web browser "Leacher" under Windows Vista. :lolflag:

[scottuss]

Don't worry I access bb all the time from firefox 3 running ubuntu. The reason they say it's not supported is because it's too much effort probably. Not that there's anything to support...

[amazingtaters]

BlackBoard is an online learning tool used by ALL Universities in the UK and probably further afield too.

It allows you to see what modules you are taking, download lecture notes, view your grades, even submit work electronically, and take multiple choice revision aid tests.

This of course assumes that your profs know how to use blackboard and actually embrace using the technology. I had 2 professors really use it last year, and then it was only to post up instructions for assignments or powerpoints. One of them updated grades in BB (and he was also the only one to bring his laptop to class.) Overall, and yes I know I'm off topic a bit from the thread, Blackboard is worthless because professors refuse to embrace it.

[Darkhack]

I hate Blackboard to the point where my blood boils. My university uses it extensively and it's in my top 5 most horrible pieces of software I've ever had to use. There are too many problems to list. I will be doing my best to try to get them to change to Moodle or something more sane. Blackboard is a disgrace. I could write a better system in PHP by myself. I mean that in all seriousness too.

[LaRoza]

It works for me, but I do not know what Blackboard they are using at the moment.

I had problems with Blackboard in Opera (which seems to have disappeared now) so it doesn't matter.

[picpak]

Since I'm still in high school this isn't much of a problem, but our computers being installed with Gimp and Audacity is a step in the right direction. :)

[solitaire]

What Version of Black Board are they running?

My Uni is on v7.1 and it's fine with Firefox 3 on Ubuntu. 8.04

[NovaAesa]

Blackboard at my uni works fine with FF3. Funnily enough, it happens that Vista is the hardest OS to connect to the network with. They have to use a "patch", which I'm almost certain is a hack job that the IT staff cooked up. Linux, OSX and XP just have to use a .pac file to connect.

[DrOlaf]

What Version of Black Board are they running?

My Uni is on v7.1 and it's fine with Firefox 3 on Ubuntu. 8.04

+1 for that. There are lots of different Blackboard versions, and they may vary greatly in compatibility issues. I haven't researched those differences extensively, but I do know that some work better with Linux than others.

My University uses v7.3 and I use it with FF3 without any problems.


Blackboard at my uni works fine with FF3. Funnily enough, it happens that Vista is the hardest OS to connect to the network with. They have to use a "patch", which I'm almost certain is a hack job that the IT staff cooked up. Linux, OSX and XP just have to use a .pac file to connect.

+1 for that as well. When our University updated Blackboard to v7 last year, all the new students who showed up with Vista on their laptops had no end of problems in gaining access. Linux users, Mac users, and even XP users had no problems at all.


This of course assumes that your profs know how to use blackboard and actually embrace using the technology. I had 2 professors really use it last year, and then it was only to post up instructions for assignments or powerpoints. One of them updated grades in BB (and he was also the only one to bring his laptop to class.) Overall, and yes I know I'm off topic a bit from the thread, Blackboard is worthless because professors refuse to embrace it.

Some do, some don't. In the courses I direct, I use Blackboard to:

Host webpages I have written to support each weekly class
Host the handouts and accompanying reprints for each class
Host the weekly quizzes (and automatically grade the multiple choice quizzes)
Host the course-specific discussion boards
Provide a shared workspace for students to use as they collaborate on their term presentations

I don't use all of the features, because some of them are redundant. I don't bother with the chat, as almost all of the students that want to chat use their existing IM accounts to reach me via Pidgin, for example.

I'm always interested to find out which Blackboard features students actually value, though. What things would you like your professors to do using Blackboard, and what would you prefer them to do by some other mechanism?

Having said all that, I have to +1 this as well:


I hate Blackboard to the point where my blood boils. My university uses it extensively and it's in my top 5 most horrible pieces of software I've ever had to use. There are too many problems to list. I will be doing my best to try to get them to change to Moodle or something more sane. Blackboard is a disgrace. I could write a better system in PHP by myself. I mean that in all seriousness too.

It's a dog to use. If you think it's bad as a student, try using it as an instructor. For some of the courses I teach that have a smaller enrollment (MS and PhD seminar classes with 10-12 students, for example) I replace Blackboard with a blackboard and we're all much happier. The Blackboard program is only really valuable to me in classes with >25 students, when it makes some tasks easier to manage.

[init1]

Check out this email I got today from a school Admin.


To All Blackboard Users:
You cannot use the Firefox 3.0 browser to upload files into Blackboard. You will get an error. Blackboard is aware of this issue and is working on a fix, but as of now there is no fix available so please use IE, Firefox 2, or another browser when working with Blackboard.

Blackboard also does not support the Linux OS, although some students have been able to use it successfully. If you do have problems using Linux, Blackboard will most likely not be able to help you solve the problem.
I'm almost done with a course I've been taking with blackboard. Usually I use Iceweasel (FF 2 compatible), but I did use FF 3 in Ubuntu a few times and had no problems with it. However, I don't think I've uploaded any files with FF 3, so I'm not sure if that works for me.

[solitaire]

I've only used Blackboard for basic stuff (email to teacher and to get course files.) i've just used BB with individual modules.

I'm thinking of going back in to Full time Education as a mature student and BB is widely used in my Uni I can see a lot of good things (apart from it looking like Novel!) :D lol!!

[Canis familiaris]

As a minimum an internet ready service or site should have been tested and working correctly on IE, safari, and firefox.

And Opera

[Yuki_Nagato]

I didn't think that Internet pages were in any way OS specific. I thought the only thing that mattered to them was Browser type and version.

^
And Opera. Agreed.

[phaed]

All a web site should ever care about is the web browser it is inside of, and even that it shouldn't be thinking about since the system is designed to flow in a single direction;

All that a web site should care about is standards compliance. In an ideal world, everything else takes care of itself.

[mrgnash]

Blackboard is used at my university too, but fortunately, all written assignments have to be submitted in hard copy form anyway. I would refuse to comply with any stipulations requiring me to use Windows/MS Products -- I have done so in the past, and got away with it.

[paulderol]

why aren't university systems using this as an opportunity to provide hands on experience to their CS majors?

It sounds as though Blackboard only exists because regents boards and chancellors don't realize that real options are out there that are both more functional and less of a fiscal investment.

Perhaps blackboard doesn't seem to work well, even if/when it is embraced, because it isn't designed to facilitate learning, it is designed to monetize learning?

[quanumphaze]

I had problems with using Swiftweasel 3 betas for uploading files to Blackboard. The simplest solution is to change the User Agent to Safari on a Mac.

The problem with it is that it doesn't recognise Unix file paths by default. So when you give it "/home/user/Documents/assignment.odt" it chokes expecting something starting with "C:\" with backslashes.

Blackboard supports OS X which uses Unix file paths so it works when you trick it into thinking you use a Mac.

Install the User Agent switcher addon for Firefox and plug in this:


Description: Safari 3.1.1 Mac
User Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS X 10_4_11; en) AppleWebKit/525.18 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.1.1 Safari/525.18
Platform: Macintosh
Remember to switch back afterward so other websites count +1 for a Linux User Agent

[Moustacha]

I had problems with using Swiftweasel 3 betas for uploading files to Blackboard. The simplest solution is to change the User Agent to Safari on a Mac.

The problem with it is that it doesn't recognise Unix file paths by default. So when you give it "/home/user/Documents/assignment.odt" it chokes expecting something starting with "C:\" with backslashes.

Blackboard supports OS X which uses Unix file paths so it works when you trick it into thinking you use a Mac.

Install the User Agent switcher addon for Firefox and plug in this:


Description: Safari 3.1.1 Mac
User Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS X 10_4_11; en) AppleWebKit/525.18 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.1.1 Safari/525.18
Platform: Macintosh
Remember to switch back afterward so other websites count +1 for a Linux User Agent

That's how I managed to uploaded files to BB. It's the biggest PITA when it would only take them a couple of minutes to get it to work with Linux. What happened to the internet being neutral:confused:

[eilu]

My University uses Blackboard too- initially only "for IE only" and I sent them a LONG email to argue that they should support FF and Safari and Opera (with examples, reasons etc), and after six months they started to.

Then they rolled out free WiFi in my Senior year. Except it was for "Windows and Mac only" and I fought for that to- this one actually escalated to a shouting match between me and the IT people because they kept insisting that "Linux has no WiFi" even if I offered to teach them (wouldn't even look at my laptop, just shot it down outright)- and also how they blow a lot of funds on MS XP, MS Office and Antivirus software when there are perfectly good Open Source solutions.

NOW, after I graduate, they do offer WiFi for "Windows, Mac and Ubuntu" which is a start (or so I've been told). There is also word they might be "moving to open source systems soon" or something like that, which is good. Not that anything fast ever happens in my 400-year-old University, but hey :shrug:

Send them lots of emails, explain why they should do it (also on how the 'Net is platform independent). Get other people to do that as well. They'll bow to the pressure sooner or later.

[3rdalbum]

Maxwell Smart: I can't believe I fell for "the old matching-an-exact-plugin-string-when-theres-a-new-version" trick!

Whenever Adobe releases a new Flash Player, there's heaps of websites out there that break. Not because the new Flash Player is incompatible or anything - it's just that web authors tend to write their browser/plugin detection so it will *only* detect the current version. When Flash Player 9 was released, so many websites kept telling me that I needed to "upgrade" to Flash Player 8.

The same will happen when Flash Player 10 comes out. It happened when IE 7 came out, and I guess it also happened when Firefox 3 came out.

[noremac]

My University too uses Blackboard. However I have never had any operating/browser problems. I never used it for anything more grades and the occasional email. All I do know is that it is always down at our school. Frequently getting upgraded and what not. I blame this in part though with our IT department, as they are terrible. Networks on campus are always down.

-Cameron

[scottuss]

I have to say the point about some people not using Blackboard is true, at my uni the lecturers put some notes on BB but not all, and out of 6 or so lecturers I had only 1 actually posted assignment results and online tests on BB.

Uni spent loads of money implementing it and no one uses it to it's full potential. HOWEVER: It has to be said that it was better than what we had before, "The virtual campus" which was actually a huge Java applet (I'm sure you can all imagine the issues with that!) Biggest problem being how dog slow it was :mad:

[Atomic Dog]

Blackboard sucks. I have used it as a student and a TA and I find it clunky, slow, and has possibly the worst message board I have ever seen.

Anyway, the reason open source is not explored more often by universities is because open source offerings don't have salespeople wooing the big wigs and department heads.

[Mateo]

Seems like a very reasonable response. They say:

1) They know there is a problem in FF3 and they are trying to resolve it. How could you expect more from a university IT department?

2) They don't provide technical support for Linux. Well, of course. They can barely afford to provide support for the more popular OSes. They didn't say you have to stop using it, just that they can't help you if it doesn't work right.

Both seem like reasonable responses to the problem. Doesn't sound pushy at all.