The Dream OS

[Soeasy1]

This is the forum thread for the brainstorm idea "The Dream OS"


NOTE: this is entirely a concept, and very far fetched. Technologically, im sure it has many obstacles and flaws.

The Dream OS would consist of Largely touch-screen and voice-base UI There would be no applications, only plug-ins running in one Master application. Everything would be able to run in the same "port"(basically a window) a port would be able to seamlessly move between text-editing to web-browsing to drawing to 3d animation(note my focus in this is not the actual plug-ins themselves, but the underlying infastructure). If the user was designing a web page, but wanted to make a graphic for it, he could have a drawing plug-in active in one port, and a graphical web designer in another port. When the user finished making his graphic, he could save it, then simply click and drag the image from the image-editing port, to the html-editing port to add it to the web-page.

About Me: I'm a programmer, and a long time windows user. I just recently discovered the wonderful world of open-source and linux. This idea of a dream OS has long been in my head, and knowing more about linux now, i feel that this dream is closer than ever.

CLOSING NOTES: I understand that this idea is extremely far-fetched, and site admins, feel free to take this off of the brainstorming page to make room for more rational ideas, its probably better off in the forums for refinement anyways

This Forum is for discussion and refinement of this basic concept. if you simply want to say "good idea!" or "wow, your an idiot" then you'll be better off posting on the brainstorm idea itself

[cardinals_fan]

Why is that idea in brainstorm?

[loell]

i'll close my eyes first to grasp the concept. http://www.mysmiley.net/imgs/smile/sick/sick0011.gif

[fatality_uk]

The idea is so limiting! It's non-sensical. No one would want to give up perfectly good apps so think of how many applications are currently available and each would have to be re-written as a plugin.
No thanks.

[Redache]

Very futuristic. Kind of like that thing Sun came up with in the Early 90's that seemed to go nowhere.

I don't think anything will be done like that for a long time because people are stuck into how GUI's are right now and have been since the Xerox GUI (Ok there's differences but the same basic idea is still there) unless there's some revolution in how people will use their computer I can't see an OS like the one mentioned popping up.

Plus that's A LOT of people who'd have to relearn how to use a computer and it's been hard enough getting most people to get by with point 'n clickification. Imagine if they had to use some imagination to do it...shocking.

[frup]

I can't understand how that is a better way.

A port sounds like a desktop switcher
A plug-in has exactly the same function as an application.
The ability to have multiple windows open seams to be negated which makes much of the functionality of drag and drop useless.

When using a computer I like to be quiet, I don't want to be speaking every 5 minutes.

Using a mouse and keyboard is nice because I get to rest my arms on the desk and not use much energy, touch screens are cool and all, especially for kiosk like systems but for actual work they seem to be more tedious.

If I have a touch screen/voice only computer I would want it flat on the desk/lap. I would be craning my neck downwards to look and every time I did an action my vision would be obscured by my arms and hands. The screen would get dirty and require attention, not to mention banning all small children from using my machine because of their snot,sticky fingers and tendency to poke objects with similar functions, most likely they would destroy the screen.

On the other hand I see merit in the idea of having everything unified and feeling as one. An application does not have to be a plug-in of the desktop/web browser to do that. Following a good HIG and GUI standard can ensure everything feels unified.

I suppose in a way desktop widgets are approaching what you mean. Personally I have no use for them at all. Plug-in also seem to waste more resources than low level programs written to perform a selected task.

I do not think having CAD, GIMP, Firefox and Evolution all open at the same time a long with a text editor or two and extremely important data/documents would work with the concept as I understand it.

[frup]

Plus that's A LOT of people who'd have to relearn how to use a computer and it's been hard enough getting most people to get by with point 'n clickification. Imagine if they had to use some imagination to do it...shocking.

I think the next input revolution would most likely be muscle twitching or direct brain interfaces, similar to prosthetics. Anything short of that isn't enough of a revolution IMO.

[Soeasy1]

Well, thanks for the feedback. To clarify a few things, i meant this as an alternative method, not at all as a replacement for mouse and keyboard, and the existing application-window mindset. I personally have no problems with the current system, The most important change there is really the seamless integration between programs, which we are moving closer to every day.

I apologize if you found the idea stupid or a waste of time:(

EDIT:direct brain interface would be cool too

[Soeasy1]

@fatality_UK:
This is merely an idea, i understand it would take a total reworking of existing apps, which is the largest reason it would be so difficult. I did not mean this at all as to be a replacement for the current system, its just an idea

EDIT: very interesting link in your sig, mind if i add it to mine?

[fatality_uk]

This is merely an idea, i understand it would take a total reworking of existing apps, which is the largest reason it would be so difficult. I did not mean this at all as to be a replacement for the current system, its just an idea

Never wrong to throw an idea out there and see what happens!!! :)

[cardinals_fan]

Well, thanks for the feedback. To clarify a few things, i meant this as an alternative method, not at all as a replacement for mouse and keyboard, and the existing application-window mindset. I personally have no problems with the current system, The most important change there is really the seamless integration between programs, which we are moving closer to every day.

I apologize if you found the idea stupid or a waste of time:(

EDIT:direct brain interface would be cool too
It's not that I found it a waste of time, it just doesn't belong in Brainstorm. Brainstorm's purpose is to take clear, well-developed ideas and put them out for developers to implement. This idea is a dream and little else.

[bruce89]

It's not that I found it a waste of time, it just doesn't belong in Brainstorm. Brainstorm's purpose is to take clear, well-developed ideas and put them out for developers to implement. This idea is a dream and little else.

Putting them to the wrong developers though. Probably better than filling real bugzillas with rubbish though.

[Soeasy1]

Yes, I understand now, and tried to make it as clear as possible that the idea, while possible, has so little chance of success due to the fact that it would require such a major reworking of so many well functioning apps.
But you're right, it didn't belong in the brainstorm section, this was my first visit to the community portion of the site and at first it seemed like a good place to post, My apologies.

[lyceum]

There are two things I would really like to see. One would be Ubuntu to include some cool looking backgrounds and themes for those of us that do not see "Human" as being poo. The other defalts really aren't very cool either.

The other would be set up all windows with the user's choice of installed notepads (Tomboy, Leafpad, etc) in a way that would allow the user to flip the program they are using over and write notes that can be read alone of the next time you open the ap. Example: Tomboy is installed. You open GIMP and draw a picture. Now, I have to go to work and have no time to finish the picture, but I can write notes so I remember what I want to do. I grab the window with my mouse and hit alt+F12 and pull and the window flips so I am looking at tomboy on the back of the picture. This way I open the notes by opening the picture and do not take up any more space.

Also, I know people working on the brain to PC thing. They have one that works, but you have yo cut open you skull and "install" it. They are working on one that users can just put on the head, no cutting.

[Soeasy1]

The notes thing is a really good idea. And on the brain interface thing, I've seen something on tv where the user wheres a helmet that measures certain brain waves and then figures out how much the user is focusing on a little metal ball on a table. two players compete to focus on the ball and if the user is focusing more than the other user, the ball moves slowly towards the guy who's less focused, and once it gets past a certain point, that person loses. It uses a simple helmet-ish thing(not solid, its really a few straps shaped to a head) with some sort of electronic sensors attached, and apparently dosnt require any sort of calibration to each individual users.

[lyceum]

The notes thing is a really good idea.

Thanks.


And on the brain interface thing, I've seen something on tv where the user wheres a helmet that measures certain brain waves and then figures out how much the user is focusing on a little metal ball on a table. two players compete to focus on the ball and if the user is focusing more than the other user, the ball moves slowly towards the guy who's less focused, and once it gets past a certain point, that person loses. It uses a simple helmet-ish thing(not solid, its really a few straps shaped to a head) with some sort of electronic sensors attached, and apparently dosnt require any sort of calibration to each individual users.

The people I know that are working on this actually have people with the chip plugged into their brains and they can move a mouse and type by thinking about it. This idea trips me out. Imagine someone in a coma, you plug in and we could see their dreams. That is a little beyond what they are doing, but if the get the chip working on the outside of the brain, the possibilities are wild. I cannot wait to see the video games that come out to work with it :D

[cardinals_fan]

The other would be set up all windows with the user's choice of installed notepads (Tomboy, Leafpad, etc) in a way that would allow the user to flip the program they are using over and write notes that can be read alone of the next time you open the ap. Example: Tomboy is installed. You open GIMP and draw a picture. Now, I have to go to work and have no time to finish the picture, but I can write notes so I remember what I want to do. I grab the window with my mouse and hit alt+F12 and pull and the window flips so I am looking at tomboy on the back of the picture. This way I open the notes by opening the picture and do not take up any more space.
Have a look at Project Looking Glass (http://www.sun.com/software/looking_glass/). I think that it's pretty dead now, but they had that exact feature.

http://xs229.xs.to/xs229/08301/4953.jpg.xs.jpg (http://xs.to/xs.php?h=xs229&d=08301&f=4953.jpg)

[FlyingIsFun1217]

My dream operating system would be one with an interface that has a mix between gnome and xfce, and had binary compatibility with Windows, Mac, Linux (2.6).

FlyingIsFun1217

[rated727]

If I have a correct picture of what you have in mind you are about to embark on reinventing the wheel.

My (possibly incorrect) understanding of your proposal suggests that (as one example) Windows + JAVA is functionally close to the OS you propose and JAVA applets serve similar function to your plug-ins.

"If the user was designing a web page, but wanted to make a graphic for it, he could have a drawing plug-in ... "
You might want to search Wikipedia for "object linking and embedding"

And you have only mentioned the user-interface (highest level) of an OS. Please keep in mind that there are several layers below the UI. the lowest level of every OS is hardware and processor interface, (Do you have a plan for keeping up with that ever changing current?
One alternative might be to build your own GUI + plug-ins that can ride atop a Linux kernel.


I will not suggest that there is anything wrong with starting such an ambitious project. It will probably be fun! (for at least the first 3 to 7 years) but after all those years in development and testing, will you be satisfied when you and your mother are the only ones running such an OS?


The Frenchman threw a lighted stick of dynamite on the kitchen floor -- because he wanted to see linoleum blown apart.

[rated727]

I don't think anything will be done like that for a long time because people are stuck into how GUI's are right now and have been since the Xerox GUI

OMG,

there's a mouse in the house!

[rated727]

I think the next input revolution would most likely be muscle twitching or direct brain interfaces, similar to prosthetics. Anything short of that isn't enough of a revolution IMO.

I doubt that I could work with a direct brain interface. Whenever I get frustrated, images of horse-mounted men with big axes and fur hats gallop across the landscape of my mind raping and pledging.

Where's my towel?

[frup]

...and the window flips so I am looking at tomboy on the back of the picture. This way I open the notes by opening the picture and do not take up any more space.

That's interesting and useful, the idea that you could attach note data to any document without having to right click etc and add it, just "turn it over" like you would a photo and type/draw anything on the back... that's where having a stylus/touch screen could become useful... just being able to scribble notes on your documents.

I can type at 45 words per minute, which is probably slow amongst Ubuntu users but fairly fast compared to the general population I think.. Most people can write faster than they can type... I'm probably slightly better and typing.

A good OCR like app to then read the scribbles and convert them to type would be required if you took this approach.

[lyceum]

That's interesting and useful, the idea that you could attach note data to any document without having to right click etc and add it, just "turn it over" like you would a photo and type/draw anything on the back... that's where having a stylus/touch screen could become useful... just being able to scribble notes on your documents.

That is exactly what I had in mind, but not every computer works with touch or a stylus. But, my Wacom tablet has a pen :)

[lyceum]

Have a look at Project Looking Glass (http://www.sun.com/software/looking_glass/). I think that it's pretty dead now, but they had that exact feature.

http://xs229.xs.to/xs229/08301/4953.jpg.xs.jpg (http://xs.to/xs.php?h=xs229&d=08301&f=4953.jpg)

Very cool! Too bad it is dead. Maybe Compiz can steal, sorry, borrow, some of their ideas :D

[bruce89]

there's a mouse in the house!

Whit, it's moose in the hoose ye dafty.

[dracule]

I think the next input revolution would most likely be muscle twitching or direct brain interfaces, similar to prosthetics. Anything short of that isn't enough of a revolution IMO.

engadget posted a review of "NIA"

it is a headband that you were that you "hotkey" to what ever you want.

you train it by training your brainwaves.

It picks up brainwaves, muscle movements and eye movements.



Here:
http://www.hothardware.com/Articles/OCZ_NIA_BrainComputer_Interface/?page=1



The OCZ NIA is a very unique input device and possibly the first true brain-computer interface to hit the retail market. However, the NIA isn't a replacement for traditional input methods, it is merely a powerful supplement. Whether your input device of choice is a standard keyboard and mouse or a gamepad / joystick, the NIA will give you a lot of extra flexibility. Not only will you be able to control numerous commands with your mind, face muscles and eyes, you'll also instantly benefit from the response time advantage your head has over your limbs. This could mean a 100ms boost in response time, which can make all the difference in a tense game.

Looks promising.