GNOME 3 at GUADEC

[jpeddicord]

http://www.vuntz.net/journal/2008/07/10/480-live-from-istanbul-gnome-30

Didn't think it would ever happen. Well, I guess it still won't be for another year and a half going by the current schedule.

[fluteflute]

Gnome 3.0 = Gnome 2.30 (Sep/Oct 2010)

http://blogs.gnome.org/lucasr/2008/07/10/gnome-30/
http://www.vuntz.net/journal/2008/07/10/480-live-from-istanbul-gnome-30
http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=NjU4Mg

Planet Gnome (http://planet.gnome.org/) is the place to watch.

[YaroMan86]

Gnome 3.0 = Gnome 2.30

http://blogs.gnome.org/lucasr/2008/07/10/gnome-30/
http://www.vuntz.net/journal/2008/07/10/480-live-from-istanbul-gnome-30
http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=NjU4Mg

Eee, no planned release date, so far as I can tell. And the phrase "long-term development strategy" gives me the willies. That term can mean many things, not the least of which no longer adhering to their classic 6 month cycle, which Ubuntu's release cycle depends on.

If this is true, what basis will Ubuntu take if GNOME goes on a "longer than 6 months" spree?

[dracule]

Eee, no planned release date, so far as I can tell. And the phrase "long-term development strategy" gives me the willies. That term can mean many things, not the least of which no longer adhering to their classic 6 month cycle, which Ubuntu's release cycle depends on.

If this is true, what basis will Ubuntu take if GNOME goes on a "longer than 6 months" spree?

Gnome wants to be stable. rock solid. complete

look at what happened to KDE, they rushed and now practically nobody used 4.*


really what kind of features could you want right now? I cant even imagine what more could go into a DE, especially since Compiz can modify virtually anything as it is.

[bruce89]

If this is true, what basis will Ubuntu take if GNOME goes on a "longer than 6 months" spree?

Likely Ubuntu would resync with the new GNOME cycle.


look at what happened to KDE, they rushed and now practically nobody used 4.*

I think that GNOME 3.x would be evolutionary, not revolutionary. It would likely get rid of the libgnome* stuff, and make a few weird bits in GTK+ sane.

[geoken]

Gnome wants to be stable. rock solid. complete

look at what happened to KDE, they rushed and now practically nobody used 4.*



It's an open source project. Unless you're suggesting that they develop it in private I don't see how they can stop people from using it before it's totally finished (similar to what's happening with KDE 4).

[Mazza558]

look at what happened to KDE, they rushed and now practically nobody used 4.*



Except KDE4 wasn't finished when it was released. Lots of people had a preconception that *.0 releases are completely solid and bug-free in KDE. It's not till the *.3 or *.4 that people should use them.

[dracule]

Except KDE4 wasn't finished when it was released. Lots of people had a preconception that *.0 releases are completely solid and bug-free in KDE. It's not till the *.3 or *.4 that people should use them.

Well, KDE should have a better scheme.

KDE should have NOT taken KDE 4.0 out of Beta until it was ready.

or at least released it as 3.9, then nobody would have really cared that it was incomplete.

I like Gimps numbering scheme. 2.5 is like a beta for 2.6, they do not label 2.5 as a stable release.

KDE 4.0 is under stable. IMO it should be listed as unstable. they just got a little excited and released it too early.

[bruce89]

I like Gimps numbering scheme. 2.5 is like a beta for 2.6, they do not label 2.5 as a stable release.

It was originally the Linux Kernel numbering scheme. 2.3.x was the unstable release working towards 2.4.x. They gave up after 2.6.x though.


KDE 4.0 is under stable. IMO it should be listed as unstable. they just got a little excited and released it too early.

It was bloody silly I have to say. It may have been because of all the delays they had, so they thought they would release a bad one as 4.0.0.

[verb3k]

Hope it doesn't turn out to be another KDE4.

[PmDematagoda]

They have been taking their time, though currently I don't really mind the old GNOME 2 as well, if you use good themes of course:).

[Vadi]

Yeah, I'm hoping for it not to be the KDE4 fiasco and "evolutionary, not revolutionary". Because revolutionary is a usability problem right from the start.

[Hells_Dark]

Meh is excited about it :P

[mrgnash]

One thing you can be sure of, is that the transition to Gnome 3 will be a hell of a lot smoother than the transition (if it can be called that) between KDE3 and 4.

[dizee]

Meh is excited about it :P
wait, are you meh (http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/meh) or are you excited? ;) :)

[Vadi]

There will be no transition. It's more like a jump, and you're stuck inbetween because not apps are even yet ported or will be (I mean, some programs still use gtk 1 - so for kde3 to go away it will take a long, long while)

[bruce89]

There will be no transition. It's more like a jump, and you're stuck inbetween because not apps are even yet ported or will be (I mean, some programs still use gtk 1 - so for kde3 to go away it will take a long, long while)

I think the incompatible changes between 2.x and 3.x will be smaller that 1.x to 2.x.

[dizee]

KDE 4 was rewritten from scratch wasn't it? but according to the version numbering scheme Gnome 3 is really 2.30. so I wouldn't expect such a massive change if that's anything to go by. plus the gnome guys seem to be more about getting a solid base with gradual changes rather than revolutionary ones, not that that's a bad thing.

[jpeddicord]

KDE 4 was rewritten from scratch wasn't it? but according to the version numbering scheme Gnome 3 is really 2.30. so I wouldn't expect such a massive change if that's anything to go by. plus the gnome guys seem to be more about getting a solid base with gradual changes rather than revolutionary ones, not that that's a bad thing.

That's what I think. There might be a huge UI shuffle and feature addons, but in the end the bottom of it will still be GNOME 2. Of course, they could do it all from scratch, but from what I've been reading it doesn't seem that way.

[Vadi]

Well. KDE is really Qt, with some additions they do that are kde-specific. Like Gnome and GTK, Gnome in some cases does additions to gtk.

Qt 4 was released way back in 2005, and kde 4 builds on qt 4. Unfortunately I couldn't see if qt 4 was a complete rewrite of qt 3, but from what I know quite a few things are changed around.

[bruce89]

That's what I think. There might be a huge UI shuffle and feature addons, but in the end the bottom of it will still be GNOME 2. Of course, they could do it all from scratch, but from what I've been reading it doesn't seem that way.

I don't think that there will be such sweeping changes, perhaps the "online desktop" bits might come to fruition however. One thing's certain - C and GObject will still be used, but perhaps Vala might creep in some places.

[Vadi]

Oi... I tried that online desktop thing a few months ago.

Idk, I just didn't buy in and doubt it would be useful for the majority either. Especially given the lack of popularity of all of these browser-based os's too (different concept, but revolves around the same idea - internet is the main thing).

[bruce89]

Well. KDE is really Qt, with some additions they do that are kde-specific. Like Gnome and GTK, Gnome in some cases does additions to gtk.

Qt 4 was released way back in 2005, and kde 4 builds on qt 4. Unfortunately I couldn't see if qt 4 was a complete rewrite of qt 3, but from what I know quite a few things are changed around.

I suppose the fact that Qt is not maintained by the KDE people caused the large lag here. GNOME's control of GTK+ helps them quite a bit.

I suspect that GTK+ 3.x will integrate the various widget and support libraries GNOME uses just now (libeel, libgnome[ui], gnome-vfs).

[Vadi]

You mean integrate them.

[bruce89]

You mean integrate them.

That's the word.

[chris4585]

I'm happy with gnome right now... I really don't see much they could add or change. I'm happy with little changes along the way than a big change at once.

[VitaLiNux]

The K Desktop Environment community came out earlier this year with their brand new KDE 4.0 release that marked significant advancements to this open-source desktop environment compared to its KDE 3.5.x code-base. Meanwhile, the GNOME community has been living in a 2.0 cycle for quite some time with no signs of a major overhaul, but their six-month release cycles just continue to deliver new refinements and minor improvements. The plans for GNOME 3.0 just put this release out when there is significant API/ABI breakage to GNOME 2.0 / GTK+ or a major rewrite. Well, in addition to announcing Stormy Peters joining GNOME, at GUADEC 2008 they have just announced plans for GNOME 3.0!

The details are still emerging from this GNOME conference taking placed in Istanbul, Turkey. All the information that has reached the Internet so far are several GNOME developers briefly mentioning it on their blogs (aggregated through Planet GNOME). The only real information that has hit the blogs so far is that GNOME 2.30 = GNOME 3.0. This was mentioned on Vincent Untz's blog with a photograph. As of yet, no GNOME 3.0 information has appeared on any of the GNOME mailing lists.

More info through Phoronix.

[kepardue]

Does anyone else think that it's ironic that Gnome 3.0's guesstimated release date roughly coincides with what Shuttleworth said (http://itmanagement.earthweb.com/osrc/article.php/12068_3757246_2) would be the time frame for the Canonical desktop experience folks to spearhead a desktop experience not only as useable as but competitive with OS X? Do you guys think that this will be the fruits of Canonical's first foray into involving itself with the upstreams? I sure hope so... every time I read something by Shuttleworth I like him more and more; he really has a genuine interest in placing the average user experience FIRST. I mean, speaking of Apple, this guy should have some space footage of himself in the Think Different (http://youtube.com/watch?v=4oAB83Z1ydE) commercial.

[geoken]

Hope it doesn't turn out to be another KDE4.

In what way? How did KDE 4 'turn out'?

[GeneralZod]

Well. KDE is really Qt, with some additions they do that are kde-specific. Like Gnome and GTK, Gnome in some cases does additions to gtk.

Qt 4 was released way back in 2005, and kde 4 builds on qt 4. Unfortunately I couldn't see if qt 4 was a complete rewrite of qt 3, but from what I know quite a few things are changed around.

Qt4 isn't a complete re-write, but is very different to Qt3, API-wise - porting KDE to use it sucked up a huge amount of time.

[the yawner]

I wonder what's bound to show up in GTK3...

[fluteflute]

More details: http://liquidat.wordpress.com/2008/07/10/plans-for-gtkgnome-30-surfaced/

(and a german? link: http://derstandard.at/?url=/?id=3410465)

[ghindo]

I'm really excited to hear the details about this project. I'm surprised so little has been revealed so far. :(

Edit: Just saw the post above me, never mind.

[bash]

The K Desktop Environment community came out earlier this year with their brand new KDE 4.0 release that marked significant advancements to this open-source desktop environment compared to its KDE 3.5.x code-base. Meanwhile, the GNOME community has been living in a 2.0 cycle for quite some time with no signs of a major overhaul, but their six-month release cycles just continue to deliver new refinements and minor improvements. The plans for GNOME 3.0 just put this release out when there is significant API/ABI breakage to GNOME 2.0 / GTK+ or a major rewrite. Well, in addition to announcing Stormy Peters joining GNOME, at GUADEC 2008 they have just announced plans for GNOME 3.0!

The details are still emerging from this GNOME conference taking placed in Istanbul, Turkey. All the information that has reached the Internet so far are several GNOME developers briefly mentioning it on their blogs (aggregated through Planet GNOME). The only real information that has hit the blogs so far is that GNOME 2.30 = GNOME 3.0. This was mentioned on Vincent Untz's blog with a photograph. As of yet, no GNOME 3.0 information has appeared on any of the GNOME mailing lists.

Permitting that the GNOME development community will be continuing with their six-month release cycles and they plan on having GNOME 2.26 and GNOME 2.28 stable releases before GNOME 2.30/3.0, this would place their effective release date for GNOME 3.0 in early 2010. In fact, it would be right before the release of Ubuntu 10.4 LTS.

Meanwhile, the next GNOME release is GNOME 2.24 and its release is targeted for September. When we have any other information on GNOME 3.0 we will be sure to pass it along. Share your hopes and expectations for GNOME 3.0 in the Phoronix Forums.

UPDATE: With GNOME 3.0 will come GTK+ 3.0. Lucas Rocha just blogged about GTK+ 3.0 / GNOME 3.0 and that the transition process from GNOME 2 to GNOME 3 is expected to be smooth.

Source: Phoronix (http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=NjU4Mg)

So what do you think? I think it's great news. Curious as to what new things to expect. Maybe a nice visual overhaul or even some new concepts of how the desktop if set-up.

[joshdudeha]

Hmm... 2010 :( .. was getting excited then. :|

[Mr. Picklesworth]

Yah, sounds like there's lots of awesome stuff going on at GUADEC. The whole GNOME Planet is conspiring to drive me crazy by keeping it secret until a big storm of information later on, it looks like. Rather unusual :o

[ghindo]

Someone had already beaten this thread to the punch:

http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=855380

[bapoumba]

Threads merged.

[bash]

Hmm ... I looked and checked if a thread already existed. But found none. Apperently I was wrong. Already wondered that noone would make a thread about this.

[bonzodog]

Here is an article explaining what Gnome 3.0 will be about:

http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20080714-gnome-3-0-officially-announced-and-explained.html

[sharks]

http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20080714-gnome-3-0-officially-announced-and-explained.html

[bapoumba]

Merged 2 threads in here.

[Ioky]

I know it might sound weird, but I think KDE team do the right thing but releasing 4.0. It would release, so people will use it, and found out the problems out much better than release as beta. I mean for some people they just never use beta because they believe it is unfinish and they will wait for the finally version. And release as 4.0 will make the software version go faster, it is a marketing issue, though not much of serious computer user will care, but it is important. As you can see, GNOME already doing that by change 2.3 to 3. So did slackware has done long time ago. I mean, we might not get a rock KDE at the this time, but by whatever it is doing, we will get a more solid and more complete KDE in a long run. What do you get to lost, is not like windows. After waiting for 6 years and get something call "Vista" and yet, you need to wait 3 more years until the next hope come to you.

[Hells_Dark]

http://tirania.org/blog/