AAC vs OGG

[dmb]

Im kind of curios as what you people think is better and more open, AAC or OGG. It seems like aac is open source but it seems like it also supports drm.

[jasmuz]

Open source....then OGG is the real deal (if you use lossy codecs) and FLAC (if you use lossless codecs)

[Emerzen]

Better depends on what your goals are. I've seen other posts on the forum discussing the fidelity of OGG vs. MP3 vs. AAC. Personally, I use OGG as I don't have any portable devices that don't support it. Nothing is more open than OGG, but I'm not sure about AAC. Hopefully, others members w/ more knowledge will weigh in here.

[dmb]

Are there any ipod-like players that support ogg? Does ipod support ogg(i assume it doesn't)

[Brunellus]

iPod does not do ogg. If you can find it, the iRiver H320 or H340 does ogg, is not much bigger than an ipod (thicker and slightly heavier), has an FM tuner and a recorder function.

I have it, and it kicks.

[Sykil]

Unfortunately, the iPod's default firmware doesn't support Ogg Vorbis. :\

Neuros' players have open-source firmware, and they support Ogg Vorbis as far I know---but they're a bit clunky. I'm thinking of getting a Neuros III (http://www.theneuros.com/index.php/Category_Roadmap:Neuros_III) when it comes out, though.

[Sirin]

Im kind of curios as what you people think is better and more open, AAC or OGG. It seems like aac is open source but it seems like it also supports drm.

There are different types of AAC. Which one are you talking about? MPEG 4-AAC (The one iTunes uses)? aacPlus (Most commonly used by WinAMP)? HE-AAC? LE-AAC? AAC-SSR? Which one?

[mrtaber]

Don't forget Cowon's iAudio series...I have the U2 flash player (I don't think it's named after the band)...and it does ogg up to ~Q10--it's great. They also have HD-based players...they do ogg and flac. Very cool.

Mark :)

[bionnaki]

I have an iriver h340 & its great. no software needed - just plug it into ubuntu & drag/drop your files.

anyone know if the iaudios do this as well?

[rubinstein]

As far as I know, AAC is encumbered with patents, so one should avoid it if possible. I saw listening tests that stated, Ogg Vorbis is as good as AAC, so if you don't absolutely need an iPod (I'm doing fine with my Samsung MP3/Ogg Vorbis-Player, thank you :-) nobody should need AAC.

See also http://www.vialicensing.com/products/mpeg4aac/licenseFAQ.html

[adriantry]

Are there any ipod-like players that support ogg? Does ipod support ogg(i assume it doesn't)

I just (yesterday) traded in my iPod for an iMuz (http://www.netac.com/products_show/digital_c700.htm) specifically because it supports ogg.

It's around the same size, feels a little bit clunkier, and doesn't have as many features (e.g. it doesn't have smart play lists, keep a record of how many times a song has been played, or have a rating system).

But it cost less than half the price of an iPod, you copy the files directly to the hard drive through a usb interface (so you don't need any iTunes or gtkpod software), and it plays ogg!

After a whole day, I'm pretty happy. I've just started ripping my CDs to ogg.

PS. I have to say how much I love Konqueror's interface for ripping from CD. It does a CDDB lookup so that all tracks are properly named, and creates a virtual folder for every rippable codec you have installed. I just copy from the ogg folder to my hard drive, and ripping happens automatically. I last tried that a few versions of KDE ago. Things were nice then, but have really got nicer!

[Sirin]

As far as I know, AAC is encumbered with patents, so one should avoid it if possible. I saw listening tests that stated, Ogg Vorbis is as good as AAC, so if you don't absolutely need an iPod (I'm doing fine with my Samsung MP3/Ogg Vorbis-Player, thank you :-) nobody should need AAC.


Except when buying from the iTunes music store. There is no large music store (if at all, actually) that supports Ogg. I have yet to actually see an Ogg Store. There is no multimedia store larger than the iTunes Music Store. I'm not criticizing Ogg, it's just that Ogg Vorbis and Ogg FLAC is not widely supported as much compared to other audio formats, like AAC, MP3, and WAV. ;)

[jonny]

There is no large music store (if at all, actually) that supports Ogg.Really? I must have been dreaming when I last bought music from http://www.allofmp3.com. I probably only imagined them giving me a choice of bit rates, too. And seeing FLAC as an option on their site was just one of those surreal moments that we all have from time to time.

I'm sure I didn't read about their recent successful court case against the big music labels, either. If a thing seems too good to be true, it must be.

[BoyOfDestiny]

Really? I must have been dreaming when I last bought music from http://www.allofmp3.com. I probably only imagined them giving me a choice of bit rates, too. And seeing FLAC as an option on their site was just one of those surreal moments that we all have from time to time.

I'm sure I didn't read about their recent successful court case against the big music labels, either. If a thing seems too good to be true, it must be.

[Luckily ;)] Russia doesn't care that this is a form of copyright infringement.

http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20050307-4675.html

If you visit the FLAC homepage you'll find plenty of devices that support it. Also, since it's less compressed, requires less power to play 'em.

http://flac.sourceforge.net/

If you own devices that don't support flac or ogg... If you need an excuse to buy a new gadget... You got one!

Lastly, if music stores only sell in restricted/crippled formats...maybe find other ways to get your music... Might be less convenient for some, but I can almost guarantee you will spend less $$ and more have "freedom".

[jonny]

There's nothing untoward about allofmp3.com. The music industry doesn't like it, but that's because it doesn't like Russian law.

The Russian courts have rejected attempts to shut down allofmp.com, so it's definitely legitimate for purchases made within Russia. Whether or not it's permitted for foreign buyers is another matter. It's apparently been declared illegal in Germany, and the fact that no other court cases have been successfully brought are pretty good evidence that it's legitimate for personal use elsewhere.

http://www.museekster.com/allofmp3faq.htm#Is%20using%20Allofmp3%20legal? gives a considered view of the position for American users. Their view is that it's perfectly legal.

[xequence]

I use normal, plain old mp3. Everything works with mp3. Most downloadable music is in MP3, or flac for the lossless trackers. I only have 3 CDs that I could rip to ogg, and I couldent listen to them on my sony mp3 player (Which, I have to say, DOESENT SUPPORT LINUX.).

[bionnaki]

this is the player to get:

http://eng.iaudio.com/product/product_X5_feature.php

[majikstreet]

I use normal, plain old mp3. Everything works with mp3. Most downloadable music is in MP3, or flac for the lossless trackers. I only have 3 CDs that I could rip to ogg, and I couldent listen to them on my sony mp3 player (Which, I have to say, DOESENT SUPPORT LINUX.).
same.

[MetalMusicAddict]

If you can find it, the iRiver H320 or H340 does ogg, is not much bigger than an ipod (thicker and slightly heavier), has an FM tuner and a recorder function.

I have it, and it kicks.
I love my H340. Its awesome. :)
I might mod it and put the Toshibia 1.8 60gig drive in it but thats a $180 upgrade just for braggin' rights. ;)

As far as This vs. That most lossy codecs at high bit-rates are indistinguishable. At low bit-rate Vorbis and AAC beat MP3s. Hell even WMA does but most people I know rip at higher bit-rates.

If you look at iRiver stuff give this fourm a look. MisticRiver (http://www.misticriver.net/index.php).

[bionnaki]

I encode with ogg for lossy & flac for lossless.
I used to encode with lame @ aps, but im all ogg -q6 now.

[stimpack]

I have had many probelms with OGG for some reason, would abslutly love to use it, but stick to plain old mp3.

[Brunellus]

I have had many probelms with OGG for some reason, would abslutly love to use it, but stick to plain old mp3.
well, use the format that suits you best, then.

I have a huge (as in >250) CD collection that grows very quickly. I'm very big into my local indie scene--music so obscure & localized that it hasn't made it onto the p2p networks, much less the regular download channels. Probably 60 percent of my new music these days comes from picking up CDs at shows and/or snagging demo CDs.

Maybe 30 percent comes from record-shop bargain bins. A good way to fill gaps in the collection, and an interesting way of blundering into interesting things.

The remainder is downloaded from various and sundry other sources in mp3 format. I consider my use of the mp3 as "legacy support"--all my personal stuff is encoded to ogg vorbis.

To support this habit, I shopped hard for a portable that could handle all my preferred formats.

This is part of what poofyhairguy calls the "real cost of Linux": rewarding those firms in the marketplace who support free and open software, codecs, and standards.