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makis
October 23rd, 2005, 10:08 PM
Hi all,

It is well known that M$ conquers the world, mainly because of their office formats (.doc, .xls, .pps, etc) , and the games (active X , etc).

OpenOffice 2, saves by default on the new OpenDocument format, suggested by OASIS as the new global open standard.

More information about OpenDocument format, here:
http://opendocumentfellowship.org/Resources/FAQ

You can participate for the domination of the new open format! For more follow the link:
http://opendocumentfellowship.org/petition/

Inform your friends about OpenDocument!

Thx

PS If a moderator thinks that this issue is as important as I think, may he please sticky this thread for a period of time? Thank you!

Lovechild
October 23rd, 2005, 10:10 PM
Boycott Shampoo - demand real poo!

anyways, signed

Malphas
October 23rd, 2005, 10:12 PM
Signed.

xequence
October 24th, 2005, 02:57 AM
Sure, why not :)

BWF89
October 24th, 2005, 03:38 AM
Signed.

drizek
October 24th, 2005, 04:46 AM
signed.

chimera
October 24th, 2005, 05:39 AM
signed(although I couldn't care any less because I don't even use MS office/any MS products)

jeremy
October 24th, 2005, 05:44 AM
I am not signing this one. I beleive that we should just carry on doing things our way, and that Microsoft will just slowly become less relevant.

drizek
October 24th, 2005, 07:15 AM
signing petitions is "doing things our way". the only way fore MS to become less relevant is if we encourage the use of open standards.

ThirdWorld
October 24th, 2005, 07:41 AM
I signed, however I concur with jeremy and drizek. In time Microsoft will become less relevant. Im convinced that more goverments and large corporation will back up open source projects like linux Ubuntu and openoffice.org and in the next 5 years windows will loose at least 25% of their global share market. Europe, China, Latin America and India will be the greatest linux consumers in the world.

BWF89
October 24th, 2005, 02:12 PM
signed(although I couldn't care any less because I don't even use MS office/any MS products)
You should care. If MS Office had the ablilty to read OpenDocuments than there would be no need to save your files as .doc if you had to send them to your friend that uses Microsoft Office.

But I doubt the few thousand signatures this has so far is going to make a difference. Microsoft said that they didn't include the ability to save as PDF files until they were getting on average 1,000 emails a month complaining about not being able to do so. But hey how long does it to sign a petition? I only account for 1 computer but I signed.

BoyOfDestiny
October 24th, 2005, 02:18 PM
OpenDoc plug-in for MS Office users

http://www.theage.com.au/news/breaking/opendoc-plugin-for-ms-office-users/2005/10/20/1129775888552.html

Not everything you want feature wise, but at least giving some exposure to the format is good in my book.

gray-squirrel
October 24th, 2005, 03:00 PM
Signed.

I think, however, we need to use every avenue possible to get people to make the switch as well, which many of us are already doing.

And we need to go beyond a plugin - if Microsoft has the ability to read WordPerfect and WordStar documents (not to mention HTML) without any extra stuff, the same should be the case for reading OpenDocument files.

Master Shake
October 24th, 2005, 03:22 PM
Signed.

Does AbiWord for Windows support OpenDocument?.

makis
October 24th, 2005, 11:22 PM
Signed.

Does AbiWord for Windows support OpenDocument?.

It is in progress my friend. Look here:
http://opendocumentfellowship.org/Applications/HomePage

As regards some doubts about this petition, let me tell you my story. I do my PhD; my supervisor sends me .docs; demands .docs in order to make corrections. The university has M$ office mainly because of the .doc and .xls. The secretaries send to everybody documents in .doc; for a symposium in England and a congress in Sweden, last summer, they demanded .doc for the abstracts, and so on. PDFs are only used for documents not allowed to change.

What should I do then? Make my revolution and say “u know what, I demand the .X format”? Or “accept my format or I will abandon my PhD, I will not go in any congress, I will stop being scientist”?

In my opinion, we have to accept that most of the companies, universities, institutions etc follow the rules of M$. If we have business with them, we have to follow their rules. If we stay at home, or have personal businesses, or we are independent, then yes, we can make our revolution. But this, unfortunately, little changes the world (companies, universities, institutions etc governs, we don’t :().

But imagine now if I could send the document in open format and my supervisor could directly open it in any application! Why would then someone use M$ office? M$ would lose all its governance on the field!



That’s why I also believe that M$ will not implement the open document format in office 12, no matters the number of the signatures. The institutions though, may see the demand and the public acceptance of the new format and follow the Massachusetts Commonwealth example.



Even if this will not happen, we anyway have to give our fight.

majikstreet
October 25th, 2005, 12:08 AM
signed.

drizek
October 25th, 2005, 01:09 AM
Update, October 24: In a statement, a Microsoft spokesperson said to date the company had not heard from customers that ODF was a priority for them.

"Microsoft strongly supports standards, and will continue to respond to customer demand," the unnamed spokesperson added.

ummm... i dont know what to say

newbie2
November 2nd, 2005, 06:11 PM
Massachusetts' CIO defends move to OpenDocument
http://lxer.com/module/newswire/view/46672/index.html

Kimm
November 2nd, 2005, 06:56 PM
Signed

Nu-Buntu
November 2nd, 2005, 07:51 PM
So MS hasn't hear from customers that Open Doc isn't important, yet the state (excuse me, COMMONWEALTH) of Massachusetts dumps them over the lack of it? Hello? Right hand, meet left hand!

blastus
November 2nd, 2005, 09:54 PM
As regards some doubts about this petition, let me tell you my story. I do my PhD; my supervisor sends me .docs; demands .docs in order to make corrections. The university has M$ office mainly because of the .doc and .xls. The secretaries send to everybody documents in .doc; for a symposium in England and a congress in Sweden, last summer, they demanded .doc for the abstracts, and so on. PDFs are only used for documents not allowed to change.

Yet another case that proves that if you want to do business with someone, you have to deal with proprietary binary MS-Office file formats. In North America, many employers demand MS-Office .doc format for resumes. Imagine that, if you want to submit a resume online, you may have to buy MS-Windows and MS-Office! Without the efforts of Sun/OpenOffice.org to reverse engineer these formats, we would have no choice but to use MS-Windows and MS-Office--and Microsoft would be delighted with that.

Unfortunately I think that even if Microsoft supported OpenDocument (which they have said is a locked-in, incapable, and unsuitable file format designed specifically for OpenOffice.org), they will certainly not make it the default file format. This is from the same company that has originally said that they will not support tabbed-browsing in Internet Explorer because no-one wants it. Their native file format will be their new proprietary XML Schema file formats. There is no way in hell they will inform users about or encourage them to use OpenDocument.

As OpenDocument will not be the native format in MS-Office, I don't believe the situation will change. We will still have everyone demanding the use of proprietary MS-Office file formats even though an open format is readily available. For example, MS-Office can read/write RTF, yet everyone demands the use of .doc. for even simple things like resumes. Replace RTF with OpenDocument here and I think the outcome will be the same.

Furthermore, even if Microsoft did make OpenDocument the native format (which they never will), there is a good chance that they will extend the OpenDocument standard with proprietary extensions, and make a *standard* that is incompatible with OpenDocument--just like they tried to do with HTML, CSS, Kerberos, Java, JavaScript etc... Some of those *standards* are proprietary (like Java) but EEE (embrace-extend-extinguish) strategies are still applicable. At that point we may have to call it MS-OpenDocument.

The problem is not only with Microsoft (although they are a huge part of the problem), it is with policy makers that are too narrow minded to think outside of their Microsoft-centric worldview. However, I think that if Microsoft decided to *support* reading/writing OpenDocument and if they could *support* a pure OpenDocument format, it would be a step in the right direction. OpenDocument is kind like a good seed that is trying to grow up in the midst of a field of thorns and weeds of proprietary MS-Office file formats. It's gonna take a very very long time and Microsoft will do everything in their power to fight it.

GreyFox503
November 3rd, 2005, 07:41 AM
OpenDocument has one problem: Microsoft Office can't read it :)

I use OpenOffice.org, but it can be a pain in the rear having to resave some paper as *.doc to send to a MS Office user. I can't remember if Office 12 will be able to use OpenDocument, though I think its at least a possibility.

newbie2
November 3rd, 2005, 01:52 PM
"An amendment to a piece of important Massachusetts legislation is to be debated on Thursday at the State Senate. If adopted, it could slow down or even reverse the decision to use the OpenDocument format.

[ED.- Please, anyone who lives in Massachusetts, contact your senator as quickly as possible and warn them about the possible consequences of this amendment! The movement towards Open Standards is far too important to let it be stopped through such suspicious means! - Tsela]"
http://lxer.com/module/newswire/view/46754/index.html

makis
November 7th, 2005, 04:35 PM
This is a MUST read! (http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20051029212458555)

It is probably the best article written on OpenDocument. It is very thorough and clearly explains why a government like MA would choose OpenDocument.

varunus
November 7th, 2005, 04:47 PM
Signed.

A plugin isn't enough for OpenDocument to become useful; we need it to be able to be read natively for OpenOffice to really work well with MS Office. That way, I can send an OD file to an MS word user without having to tell them "go download this plugin."

Hopefully they will listen to a petition; I'm sure it wouldn't take much time for them at all to implement it. They could even just bundle the plugin that was linked above, frankly.

Though, I don't really trust MS to listen to an online petition, might as well sign and hope...

blastus
November 7th, 2005, 08:10 PM
This is a MUST read! (http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20051029212458555)

It is probably the best article written on OpenDocument. It is very thorough and clearly explains why a government like MA would choose OpenDocument.

I've only read about 20% of the article so far and just skimmed through the rest--I'll read the rest when I have more time. Wow. That article buries the hatchet and settles the issue once and for all.

newbie2
November 10th, 2005, 02:39 PM
"Big guns in the software industry are massing behind OpenDocument as government customers show more interest in open-source alternatives to Microsoft's desktop software."
http://news.com.com/OpenDocument+format+gathers+steam/2100-7344_3-5942913.html

newbie2
November 19th, 2005, 09:16 AM
"We expect that the Legislature will return for a special session on December 19th or 20th to consider the economic stimulus bill, so we believe that is the deadline by which you should send your comments."

http://www.fsf.org/news/odf-stimulus.html

DimaIL
November 19th, 2005, 11:50 AM
Signed.
but I have question: Which other programs do support this format than OpenOffice?

Dima

makis
November 20th, 2005, 03:44 PM
Signed.
but I have question: Which other programs do support this format than OpenOffice?
Dima

Look here: http://opendocumentfellowship.org/Applications/HomePage

As it is new format, I believe that after a period of time almost all the above listed applications will implement it as their native standard.

newbie2
November 24th, 2005, 09:28 PM
Linux News Responds to Washington Technology on OpenDocument
http://lxer.com/module/newswire/view/48341/

newbie2
November 28th, 2005, 02:52 AM
November 27, 2005
Massachusetts open source fight becomes partisan
http://blogs.zdnet.com/open-source/?p=506

BWF89
November 28th, 2005, 03:03 PM
November 27, 2005
Massachusetts open source fight becomes partisan
http://blogs.zdnet.com/open-source/?p=506
Thanks for the updates. My favorite:

That's funny. Microsoft was fully capable of supporting this standard. They simply chose not to, and now have the gall to accuse IBM and Sun of promoting a preference for their own software. Even if IBM and Sun are trying to promote a co-developed format, neither one of the companies has absolute control over the format, as Microsoft currently does with OpenXML. The accusation calls to mind something about pots calling kettles black. Frankly, Microsoft's accusation is far more insidious.

newbie2
December 16th, 2005, 06:01 PM
Thursday, December 15 2005
Microsoft's Yates' to MA: How About 2 Standards? - Transcript

I notice three salient things, from my point of view. You may notice other points, particularly if you are technical experts, but here's how it struck me.
http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20051215014700305

zero0w
March 22nd, 2006, 07:20 AM
Not sure if it's related, but recently I found a Firefox ODF Reader extension that would allow users to read ODF without downloading the whole 75-100MB OOo packges (at least on Windows / Mac):

https://addons.mozilla.org/extensions/moreinfo.php?application=firefox&id=1888

This would solve a lot of headache for dial-up users and others who just want to view OpenOffice.org documents.

Ptero-4
March 22nd, 2006, 08:03 PM
signed(although I couldn't care any less because I don't even use MS office/any MS products)
Signed too. And yeah. I can't care any less about this 'cause I don't/won't have/use M$ Office/any other M$ products.