View Full Version : Less Distros, More Apps
Bungo Pony
February 13th, 2008, 09:37 PM
I've been using Linux for almost a year now, and I must say I enjoy it. However, there's some things that I'm noticing. A lot of focus is on making the OS more user-friendly and easy to install. I personally believe that this has been achieved in Linux. All it really needs is maintenance.
Now, the problem lies in the apps to use on the user-friendly OS. There still isn't a lot, and there's little appeal in the ones that exist which make Linux a must-have for Windows users. You know what the most appealing app is? Compiz-Fusion / Beryl. I've seen on this message forum that some users got turned onto Linux solely because of this one app. Although many view this app as useless, it looks fantastic, arouses curiosity, and presents a challenge: can I run that on my PC?
You know what would be even better? Take Compiz-Fusion and integrate it into a video editor. Throw some home movies on youtube (or even on DVD) and people will wonder how the heck you got the video to go up in flames. Or change scenes with a rotating cube. THAT would bring a must-have app to Linux, and encourage more to try it out.
Don't get me wrong, there's lots of great distros out there, but just like game consoles, it's the software that will determine the success of the platform.
LaRoza
February 13th, 2008, 09:59 PM
I don't understand. Distros are different collections of apps. The only thing Linux distros have in common is the Linux kernel, everything else is extra.
The great number of applications and options available are the reason for the many distros.
SunnyRabbiera
February 13th, 2008, 10:06 PM
So what is it do you want, for linux to become closed source and no one have choice?
Linux is about choice you know...
lespaul_rentals
February 13th, 2008, 10:10 PM
So what is it do you want, for linux to become closed source and no one have choice?
Linux is about choice you know...
+1
awakatanka
February 13th, 2008, 10:25 PM
So what is it do you want, for linux to become closed source and no one have choice?
Linux is about choice you know...
Did you all even try to read the OP? What he just saying that he wants a killer app for linux. His example is just a example, a video editor with all those cool effects like they have in compiz.
He didn't used the word closed software, he just wants killer applications that attract people to linux.
There are a few applications that can be must have application they onl need to mature. I for example like mythtv but hate the way it looks it needs better theme's and must be a little more user friendly. The people from xbmc are making a port for linux and if it's going as good as the xbox version then it could be a killer application. And there other project that can become the must have applications.
But for one person its the games that attract them to a platform for the other it's video editing and for another one it's something else.
btw you have to see every distro as it own operating system with there own idea's how something need to look and work, less isn't alway better.
LaRoza
February 13th, 2008, 10:49 PM
Did you all even try to read the OP? What he just saying that he wants a killer app for linux. His example is just a example, a video editor with all those cool effects like they have in compiz.
He didn't used the word closed software, he just wants killer applications that attract people to linux.
The so called "killer apps" for Windows and Mac OSX are not open source, so you can't expect the community to make them. The Linux platform is ready, if Adobe and friends want to port to Linux, that is their decision.
kiwinsn
February 13th, 2008, 10:50 PM
You want to get more people to Linux?
Research Ultimate Edition. Works out of the box for most users.
I researched, downloaded the Live CD, tried it in dual boot for less than 24 hours and then ditched M$.
The latest edition includes Gnome and KDE so install and use KDE...which is very similar to Windows and I think you'll get a few converts.
LaRoza
February 13th, 2008, 10:52 PM
You want to get more people to Linux?
Research Ultimate Edition. Works out of the box for most users.
I researched, downloaded the Live CD, tried it in dual boot for less than 24 hours and then ditched M$.
The latest edition includes Gnome and KDE so install and use KDE...which is very similar to Windows and I think you'll get a few converts.
OpenSuSE is also very complete. I could see someone with no experience in Linux installing it and being able to use it. It comes with Flash and Java and such.
It also comes with GNOME and KDE, or on separate CD's. The GNOME version has a customized menu that would be familiar to a Windows user, I don't know what the KDE version has. (I didn't like the menu though) It also has Compiz.
jaytek13
February 13th, 2008, 11:01 PM
It really does seem all of you are giving knee-jerk reactions to the OP without actually reading his post. He said a killer app, and gave an example of something original... He didn't say "killer app" in reference to some proprietary commercial app available on windows.
But, most forums do experience the "I'll skim a post then post my initial reaction without full understanding" syndrome.
LaRoza
February 13th, 2008, 11:05 PM
It really does seem all of you are giving knee-jerk reactions to the OP without actually reading his post. He said a killer app, and gave an example of something original... He didn't say "killer app" in reference to some proprietary commercial app available on windows.
But, most forums do experience the "I'll skim a post then post my initial reaction without full understanding" syndrome.
"Take Compiz-Fusion and integrate it into a video editor." That doesn't make sense, and is stated by the OP.
Linux (and all software by definition) is written by programmers. Programmers usually write software for two reasons, they want to, or they get paid to do it.
The only way to get software on demand is to pay for it or write it yourself.
My opinion on the OP would be less than friendly to state outright, which is why I didn't address anything specifically.
Bungo Pony
February 13th, 2008, 11:06 PM
The so called "killer apps" for Windows and Mac OSX are not open source, so you can't expect the community to make them.
Why does it matter if it's open or closed? It's software, and somebody wrote it. Open or Closed source has nothing to do with the quality of the software. Good programming and good ideas make good software. Money is only a motivational factor.
The apps need to shine in order to attract people to use Linux. Compiz / Beryl did a great job of that, and it's popularity pretty much forced Canonical to include it in Ubuntu. And if someone wants the app bad enough, they'll find a way to install it and get it working, which includes buying the hardware required to use it.
LaRoza
February 13th, 2008, 11:11 PM
Why does it matter if it's open or closed? It's software, and somebody wrote it. Open or Closed source has nothing to do with the quality of the software. Good programming and good ideas make good software. Money is only a motivational factor.
The apps need to shine in order to attract people to use Linux. Compiz / Beryl did a great job of that, and it's popularity pretty much forced Canonical to include it in Ubuntu. And if someone wants the app bad enough, they'll find a way to install it and get it working, which includes buying the hardware required to use it.
The goal of programmers is not to please other people. We write software for two reasons, one, we get paid to do it, or two, we want to.
The people who make the "killer apps" that Windows and Mac OSX are known for are paid to write it by people who want to sell it. Linux developers write software for totally different reasons.
Compiz and its temporary fork did attract a lot of people to Linux, and are quite unique, but they are not the type of projects that most programers do. We never sit down and think "I think I will write software to make people use the same OS as me".
SunnyRabbiera
February 13th, 2008, 11:17 PM
Right, its a totally different philosophy here in the linux world.
But every day something new comes to linux, thats its main attraction as it doesnt lock people down and just rely on killer apps.
awakatanka
February 13th, 2008, 11:24 PM
The goal of programmers is not to please other people. We write software for two reasons, one, we get paid to do it, or two, we want to.
The people who make the "killer apps" that Windows and Mac OSX are known for are paid to write it by people who want to sell it. Linux developers write software for totally different reasons.
Compiz and its temporary fork did attract a lot of people to Linux, and are quite unique, but they are not the type of projects that most programers do. We never sit down and think "I think I will write software to make people use the same OS as me".
What you are saying is that they made it for them self and nobody else. And i thought they also wanted to make it so others can use it to.
Why can't simple users give feedback about something without being flamed with quotes like make it you're self our you want it to be closed source.
His example is a good one in my eyes a video editor with a fading effect like burning our rotating effect's our other useless effect from compiz. In video editors they have some use. But dunno if they exist already in "linux" because i didn't use video editing for a long-time now.
LaRoza
February 13th, 2008, 11:31 PM
What you are saying is that they made it for them self and nobody else. And i thought they also wanted to make it so others can use it to.
Why can't simple users give feedback about something without being flamed with quotes like make it you're self our you want it to be closed source.
No, I am saying that humans need to be motivated. What motivation do developers have to fulfill the OP's request?
Feedback is not a demand.
There are two things to do:
* Start a project
* Join a project
See: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=689178
Those are the only ways to get what the OP wants. Telling others to do it isn't feedback, it is a demand.
I got the impression from the OP that it was a demand for others to do all the work. Perhaps the OP didn't mean it like that, but that is what I heard.
If that video app doesn't exist, looks for a project to contribute (money, time, code, whatever) to, or start your own.
If you can't do that, well, there is nothing that can be done.
Note: I am not against commercial software, in fact, I am using a non GPL app right now and it is my favourite application to use. I am being realistic when I say "start your own" or buy it.
p_quarles
February 13th, 2008, 11:31 PM
The bottom line is, in my humble opinion, this: If someone has a good, specific, and detailed idea for a new application, it's likely that someone with the necessary programming skills or financial clout will want to work on it.
It's fine to post about wishlist items in places like this, but it's unrealistic to think that anyone is going to take up a project based on a short description in a community chat forum.
I also think it's unrealistic to call for a "killer app" for Linux, at least not an open source one. Any source code that is released under a recognized open source license can be ported to any other platform. So, a truly "killer app" would obviously be very high on the list of many developers for porting to Windows and OS X.
smiggs
February 13th, 2008, 11:40 PM
People who create Distros are not the same people who make applications. However I have found that the people who make Distros often fund the people who make applications, there are a lot of developers who work for distribution creators like Canonical. Each distribution lives and dies by it's ability to form a cohesive environment with quality applications. So having lots of Distros often means that you get lots of developers being paid to develop applications.
I say more distros and more apps, please.
Oh and my Linux killer app is Amarok, it's created by people who want a quality music player and boy do they provide it.
awakatanka
February 13th, 2008, 11:45 PM
No, I am saying that humans need to be motivated. What motivation do developers have to fulfill the OP's request?
Feedback is not a demand.
There are two things to do:
* Start a project
* Join a project
See: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=689178
Those are the only ways to get what the OP wants. Telling others to do it isn't feedback, it is a demand.
I got the impression from the OP that it was a demand for others to do all the work. Perhaps the OP didn't mean it like that, but that is what I heard.
If that video app doesn't exist, looks for a project to contribute (money, time, code, whatever) to, or start your own.
If you can't do that, well, there is nothing that can be done.
Note: I am not against commercial software, in fact, I am using a non GPL app right now and it is my favourite application to use. I am being realistic when I say "start your own" or buy it.
It's indeed more realistic to find a project you think can be a good project and give feedback to the dev people of that project.
But what's wrong to express you're thought with others in community cafe, maybe he find some people that thinks the same as he does and out of that grows a new project our he is pointed to a project he can give feedback.
I see to often the quotes do it you're self our you want closed software and the only thing he maybe wanted to was to discuss about something to see how other people think about his idea and maybe share his idea, nothing wrong with that as long as it doesn't end in flaming.
Vitamin-Carrot
February 13th, 2008, 11:53 PM
He wants the same effect in a movie editor i think
but that doesnt help the fact that i am still lost
biggest pull for be was that linux is free and Vista is not and that can bee said in more ways than one ... do a google for Bad vista
karellen
February 14th, 2008, 12:10 AM
I think Linux has enough applications already, all they need it's more polishing and increased stability/performance
Vitamin-Carrot
February 14th, 2008, 12:50 AM
I find gutsy to be very stable.
While running compiz and emerald at the same time I can still play my games like Doom3 and unreal tournament. the applications that come with ubuntu are everything a user really needs on a standard home based desktop. the ony thing that really lets ubuntu down for me is the lack of develpment of games by studios this of course defined by the larger market share microsoft ... if you want to make more money target the larger markets out there, its simple busness practices really.
So we increase the amount of ubuntu machines out there the bigger the demand and the bigger the demand the more companies are willing to develope for the operating system.
To me it makes sence anyways. I have been known to put 1 and 1 together and come up with Q
LaRoza
February 14th, 2008, 12:52 AM
I find gutsy to be very stable.
While running compiz and emerald at the same time I can still play my games like Doom3 and unreal tournament. the applications that come with ubuntu are everything a user really needs on a standard home based desktop. the ony thing that really lets ubuntu down for me is the lack of develpment of games by studios this of course defined by the larger market share microsoft ... if you want to make more money target the larger markets out there, its simple busness practices really.
So we increase the amount of ubuntu machines out there the bigger the demand and the bigger the demand the more companies are willing to develope for the operating system.
To me it makes sence anyways. I have been known to put 1 and 1 together and come up with Q
That makes sense. It is difficult to justify a company making an app if they feel there is no market.
pt123
February 14th, 2008, 03:16 AM
I would prefer more quaity apps. There are too many apps that just re-invent the wheel.
The collaboration to build complex applications is poor in Gnome.
KDE is much better at doing this take for eg. Amarok , K3B & KTorrent.
Vitamin-Carrot
February 14th, 2008, 03:19 AM
Right so what’s the one thing the larger market share have to get their product out there that ubuntu and other open source OS's don’t?
Marketing?
Best way to raise awareness of any product is to advertise but advertising costs ... it costs a lot. There is such a thing as free advertising and I’m sure every proud ubuntu user does it and that’s by "Word of Mouth" but sometimes that’s not enough especially if someone will just brush it off as the ramblings of an elitist.
I myself admit that I can when discussing ubuntu with windows users sound like a bit of a zealot (as my vista loving roomy has so eloquently dubbed me)
Another problem with "Word Of Mouth" is that it lacks the visual element unless you sit the person down in front of a machine with ubuntu and all its bells and whistles. Not many people would actually have time to take a tour of another operating system. (found this out when i was the head IT monkey and manager at a PC retail store)
Another good way is by means of the internet. I sure we all visit sites that have those lovely flash ads on a certain part of the page being displayed, issue with that is getting them there sites get paid for these ads and some sites get paid lots which depends on the site and how many hits it gets.
I like many others visit many forums so a signature image can help there, and users will see it. Not many forums I visit allow flash in the users signatures.
Maybe someone could set up a donation account that fans of ubuntu could donate marketing funds to? Just a thought I’m sure there are many advocates with there own ways of marketing this wonderful operating system.
Maybe its just time to make the push towards more product awareness amongst the majority.
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