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View Full Version : Dell Selling Mandriva-Preloaded Lappy



drizek
September 18th, 2005, 06:04 AM
in case you missed it, dell france(not sure about other parts of the world) is now selling a laptop preloaded with mandriva.

lappy(110l): http://www1.euro.dell.com/content/topics/topic.aspx/emea/topics/offers/merchandising/fr/fr/pam1?c=fr&cs=frdhs1&l=fr&s=dhs
/.: http://linux.slashdot.org/linux/05/09/17/1539212.shtml?tid=147&tid=184

TravisNewman
September 18th, 2005, 06:07 AM
gaaah why won't this ever happen in the US!?

And why is it always laptops?

Artificial Intelligence
September 18th, 2005, 06:15 AM
Nice, very nice!
First step :)

drizek
September 18th, 2005, 06:15 AM
gaaah why won't this ever happen in the US!?

And why is it always laptops?
there is always walmart, and i was just looking at microtels site and they have some nice xandros stuff too. they have a pretty decent desktop for $99!

im not realy sure what it is about laptops. they are selling more than desktops now. and this is aimed at college kids, so they obviously need lappys.

also, laptops ussually have more dell-made parts than desktops. so they have more control over it and can add any drivers needed for their hardware. when you think about it, if the major OEM's really embrace linux, they can start to design software around hardware instead of designing hardware around windows.


and the reason why dell doesnt do this in the US is because MS is a ****** ass company that doesnt like to play fair.

matthew
September 18th, 2005, 06:17 AM
That's it. I'm buying my next computer in Europe.

XDevHald
September 18th, 2005, 06:30 AM
That's it. I'm buying my next computer in Europe.
I second that, I'll start next month :D

Ok, good night, going to bed :)

weasel fierce
September 18th, 2005, 06:42 AM
http://www1.us.dell.com/content/products/compare.aspx/precn_n?c=us&cs=04&l=en&s=bsd

Not just EU ..

drizek
September 18th, 2005, 07:11 AM
but this is a consumer notebook aimed at college kids. its a pretty big first step. and dell would be the last company i would have expected tohave linux preinstalled on a consumer product.

oh, and i just configured a $31,962 system with dual 3.6ghz xeons, 16GB ram, 4x300GB 10,000 rpm hard drives in RAID 0 and a 512mb quadro fx 4400. now i know what i want for christmas...

TravisNewman
September 18th, 2005, 07:20 AM
but this is a consumer notebook aimed at college kids. its a pretty big first step. and dell would be the last company i would have expected tohave linux preinstalled on a consumer product.

oh, and i just configured a $31,962 system with dual 3.6ghz xeons, 16GB ram, 4x300GB 10,000 rpm hard drives in RAID 0 and a 512mb quadro fx 4400. now i know what i want for christmas...
Isn't it great configuring your dream machine on Dell?

I'd love to have that rig.

bjweeks
September 18th, 2005, 07:30 AM
This is great but have you noticed the Dell is using commercial distros like Redhat and Mandivea.

Goober
September 18th, 2005, 07:30 AM
That is awesome, computers coming with linux pre-installed. Truly awesome. An excellent first step.

Galoot
September 18th, 2005, 10:33 AM
Ubuntu and H-P seem to be getting along well, at least in South Africa and Europe. So says Google (http://www.google.com/search?hs=zQF&hl=en&lr=&safe=on&rls=en&q=Hewlett-Packard+ubuntu&btnG=Search), anyway.

bjweeks
September 18th, 2005, 11:17 AM
Doesnt HP sell its laptops with MS-DOS to keep Microsoft happy, then include Ubuntu in the box?

papangul
September 18th, 2005, 11:31 AM
Just how could Dell escape MS's censorship?

bjweeks
September 18th, 2005, 11:52 AM
They could tell Microsoft and Intel to go shove it but then Dell would die. Amd and linux time will come.

xequence
September 18th, 2005, 03:59 PM
Dell france is selling it, and mandriva is from france...

The only thing holding back the big companies from putting linux as default is microsoft. Theyd put the price of windows up if anything happened...

matthew
September 18th, 2005, 11:54 PM
http://www1.us.dell.com/content/products/compare.aspx/precn_n?c=us&cs=04&l=en&s=bsd

Not just EU ..
Excellent.

Ubunted
September 19th, 2005, 12:25 AM
The only thing holding back the big companies from putting linux as default is microsoft. Theyd put the price of windows up if anything happened...

Thus enhancing the odds of customers choosing Linux for an even more substantial discount.

mstlyevil
September 19th, 2005, 01:06 AM
IMHO I think that the reason that Linux is being offered in parts of Europe and Africa is there is a real demand for Linux in those places. If more people requested Linux in the US, Dell and the other PC makers would offer it. You can request no OS when ordering and load your own if you wish though.

drizek
September 19th, 2005, 01:55 AM
the problem is that MS can use piracy as an excuse to stop linux from being sold by OEMs. they just have to say that nobody really wants to use linux anyway, and all the people who buy computers preloaded with linux are just pirates who aregoing to wipe linux off their Hdds and put a pirated version of windows on there. and because of this, they reward OEMs like dell for helping to stop piracy by offering them rebates.

and im pretty sure that that is actually true to an extent. piracy is in the short term a much bigger problem for MS than opensource is. but in the longterm, opensource is going to be hurting em real badly.

mstlyevil
September 19th, 2005, 02:47 AM
You can for a discounted price buy a Dell without a operating system. Almost no one buys their computers that way though.

Galoot
September 19th, 2005, 05:15 AM
MS can ... reward OEMs like dell for helping to stop piracy by offering them rebates.
The only reward that means anything when compared against "You can install Linux for free" is "We'll actually pay you money to install Windows." That not only seems unlikely (though maybe I'm clueless as to how MS works), it seems to be something that would raise the hackles of antitrust folks.

drizek
September 19th, 2005, 05:38 AM
its not unlikely, it goes on all the time.

do you really think that dell, hp, ibm and gateway "recommend" windows xp as it says on just about every page of their websites all on their own? no, microsoft recommends that they recommend windows to their customers, or else. they give rebates to OEMs who make windows the only possible oS on their computers, and that is why we have no major OEM's selling linux in the US to consumers in the US.

the antitrust folk are worthless.

Galoot
September 19th, 2005, 06:21 AM
they give rebates to OEMs who make windows the only possible oS on their computers, and that is why we have no major OEM's selling linux in the US to consumers in the US.

the antitrust folk are worthless.
Agreed.

My point, however, is that paying only X% for Windows is still more expensive than paying nothing for Linux. One of these days a PC manufacturer will figure it out and get around the MS rebate tactic by creating an independent spin-off company.

Brunellus
September 19th, 2005, 01:14 PM
This is generally good news for GNU/Linux on the whole, but I have to look at this with a certain amount of healthy skepticism.

The laptop they're offering is a budget laptop pitched at students, and sold directly to them. I see a few problems with this:

1) The price point. USD 999 for a bottom of the line laptop is a bit steep. Where I am, I can get a Toshiba for a hundred dollars less on the open market...and that comes with Win XP, which leads me to

2) Who's going to be buying these, anyway? It's the rare college kid around here who isn't reasonably computer (er, Windows) savvy. How willing are they going to be to jump into a whole new OS--one where their apps won't work, and which doesn't have .exe files to install from?

I'm going to get flamed for this for sure, but set aside the party line for a minute and consider that.

Where price is equal, Dell should be pitching its Linux preloaded laptops at the guys who would be enthusiastic adopters: scientists, engineers, etc. Linux for the masses should be pretty damned cheap in order to entice the hoi polloi. A kilobuck bottom of the line notebook doesn't cut it here, IMO. But imagine what an 800 dollar Pentium M machine with Linux would do for the market....

drizek
September 19th, 2005, 04:10 PM
This is generally good news for GNU/Linux on the whole, but I have to look at this with a certain amount of healthy skepticism.

The laptop they're offering is a budget laptop pitched at students, and sold directly to them. I see a few problems with this:

1) The price point. USD 999 for a bottom of the line laptop is a bit steep. Where I am, I can get a Toshiba for a hundred dollars less on the open market...and that comes with Win XP, which leads me to

2) Who's going to be buying these, anyway? It's the rare college kid around here who isn't reasonably computer (er, Windows) savvy. How willing are they going to be to jump into a whole new OS--one where their apps won't work, and which doesn't have .exe files to install from?

I'm going to get flamed for this for sure, but set aside the party line for a minute and consider that.

Where price is equal, Dell should be pitching its Linux preloaded laptops at the guys who would be enthusiastic adopters: scientists, engineers, etc. Linux for the masses should be pretty damned cheap in order to entice the hoi polloi. A kilobuck bottom of the line notebook doesn't cut it here, IMO. But imagine what an 800 dollar Pentium M machine with Linux would do for the market....
but its in france, and computers are more expensive there. it is cheaper than a similairly speced windows box i assume. its kinda hard to go and configure one cause im not exactly fluent in french ;).

also, from the /. article, i assume that mandriva is going to be doing the support calls rather than dell. so its important for mandriva to get a feel for it with a limited userbase before they go all out and hopefully eventually have mandriva preloaded as an option on all of dells pc's.

N8MAN1068
September 19th, 2005, 05:03 PM
The real issue, isn't price or what distro is comes on. At least, that SHOULDN'T be the issue.

What matters most, is the support. You can config and buy the biggest baddest GNU machine out there, but when it goes down, who do you call? Someone has to be responsible for knowing the OS from top to bottom, as well as the hardware it's running on, and how it all interacts. Unfortunately, smaller distros like Ubuntu can't handle that. If after awhile someone finds enough time to read all of the forums+google to find what they need, i'm sure they'll switch.

I can say that I've tried a handle of distros, but settled on Ubuntu because of the community support. If it wasn't for the support, i'd be back on XP in a hearbeat.

drizek
September 19th, 2005, 05:15 PM
yes, its important to use a distro with good support, at least until you get the hang of it. i think mandriva is perfect for this because they do make a pretty good distro, they obviously know it from top to bottom and they are based in france too. i wouldnt be surprised if dell germany offered suse on some pc's in the future.

Brunellus
September 19th, 2005, 05:18 PM
The real issue, isn't price or what distro is comes on. At least, that SHOULDN'T be the issue.

What matters most, is the support. You can config and buy the biggest baddest GNU machine out there, but when it goes down, who do you call? Someone has to be responsible for knowing the OS from top to bottom, as well as the hardware it's running on, and how it all interacts. Unfortunately, smaller distros like Ubuntu can't handle that. If after awhile someone finds enough time to read all of the forums+google to find what they need, i'm sure they'll switch.

I can say that I've tried a handle of distros, but settled on Ubuntu because of the community support. If it wasn't for the support, i'd be back on XP in a hearbeat.
Price is an issue, for all the reasons you describe. What's at stake is luring a user from a known environmnet to an unknown one.

Price will play a huge role in this--after all, MS-DOS dominated not because it was the best platform out there (in hindsight, that might have been the Amiga)--but because it was good enough and CHEAP ENOUGH.

I'll say it again, USD 1,000 for an indifferently-specified laptop isn't what's going to do it. At USD 800, plus support, as you say, then you're really talking.

Too bad all this action seems to be taking place in the EU.

drizek
September 19th, 2005, 05:26 PM
i just checked and the inspiron 110l with winduz is 872 euro and 759 euro with linux. as far as i can tell, it is they cheapest laptop they offer, which is most liekly what most students are going for. it also includes openoffice, which will be a plus to people once they add 183 euro for the basic MS office package or 365 euro for the one comparable to OOo as far as included apps.

so basically if a student wants a laptop for basic web surfing and MS word compatibility, its a choice between 759 euro for the linux lappy and 1055 for the windows one. If they want powerpoint as well, then its still 759 for linux and a whopping 1237 euro for the MS one.

its a pretty easy choice if you ask me. if dell is as competitive in france in comparison to other brands as it is in the US, and i was living there, i would definetly buy it(with a ram and cpu upgrade of course).

N8MAN1068
September 19th, 2005, 05:38 PM
i just checked and the inspiron 110l with winduz is 872 euro and 759 euro with linux. as far as i can tell, it is they cheapest laptop they offer, which is most liekly what most students are going for.

Not bad. Far cheaper than my $1800 laptop!

Should be ok as long as they dont have to install any course-specific programs. I'd imagine that if they did, they'd have a computer lab on campus to use.

aysiu
September 21st, 2005, 06:34 AM
Any French speakers out there? This page (http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:wkfdNa-7oSMJ:www1.euro.dell.com/content/topics/topic.aspx/emea/topics/offers/merchandising/fr/fr/pam1%3Fc%3Dfr%26cs%3Dfrdhs1%26l%3Dfr%26s%3Ddhs+sit e:dell.com+mandriva+france&hl=en&lr=lang_en) just looks like gobbledygook to me.

drizek
September 21st, 2005, 06:55 AM
Any French speakers out there? This page (http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:wkfdNa-7oSMJ:www1.euro.dell.com/content/topics/topic.aspx/emea/topics/offers/merchandising/fr/fr/pam1%3Fc%3Dfr%26cs%3Dfrdhs1%26l%3Dfr%26s%3Ddhs+sit e:dell.com+mandriva+france&hl=en&lr=lang_en) just looks like gobbledygook to me.

i can actually understand some of it. i took french a while ago, but its been like 4 years now...

basically the description is

"a mobile solution at an exceptional price with Linux Installed!"

its pretty decent in terms of specs. the default is a celeron, but you can upgrade to pentium m. its only 1.4ghz and 1mb l2 cache(as opposed to 2mb on the high-end chips) but it should be more than powerfull enough for students. it should get very good batterylife too.

256mb ram is enough to run linux with KDE and OOo. its got a fast 5400rpm hard drive(as opposed to 4200rpm, and you certainly cant expect a 7200rpm one on a budget system). its got a fast multiformat dvd burner which is pretty amazing to me. It also uses the intel media accelerator integrated video card which is significantly faster than the integrated gfx in older systems.

its got integrated wifi and finally the Open Office productivity suite.

Now that i look at that page, i am starting to think more and more that this system will do well. it is a 140 euroe cheaper than the 2200 next to it yet it has better battery life and better specs. if im not mistaken, i think they have free shipping on it too. Dell should really clarify that OOo is compatible with word, excel and powerpoint, because this might turn people off. They should also mention that the Student edition of office included with the 2200 does not include powerpoint.

And if you were wondering about why the price is so high, the dvd burner is certainly going to bump it up, and so does the 3 year standard warranty. And in europe, 17% VAT(tax) is included in the price.

ygarl
September 21st, 2005, 10:16 AM
Excellent.
Wonder if they will do one in the UK?

MetalMusicAddict
September 21st, 2005, 10:33 AM
Now that i look at that page, i am starting to think more and more that this system will do well. it is a 140 euroe cheaper than the 2200 next to it yet it has better battery life and better specs.
Im on a 2200 now. Too bad it that price in France I got mine strait from Dell for $608US out-the-door.

Had issues under Hoary but Breezy is great. Ndiswrapper for WiFi though.

Master Shake
September 21st, 2005, 02:18 PM
I had read a year or two back that Dell wanted to sell computers without an OS installd, for people who may want something other than Windon'ts installed. Well, part of the M$ contract for OEMs was that every machine that the OEM sells MUST come with an OS.

So Dell started selling computers with blank hard drives, and threw a FreeDOS floppy in the box to get around that requirement.

newbie2
September 21st, 2005, 03:30 PM
http://www.powernotebooks.com/articles/index.php?action=fullnews&id=17
:razz: :razz:

Master Shake
September 21st, 2005, 03:44 PM
Ahh: Dells with FreeDOS (http://www1.us.dell.com/content/learnmore/learnmore.aspx?c=us&cs=19&l=en&s=dhs&~id=os_freedos_dimen&~line=desktops&~mode=popup&~series=dimen)