Political Activism

[stimpack]

Is there somewhere a list of Hardware maunfacturers who produce native linux drivers?. I would like to buy soley from them for political reasons.

I would also like to boycott companies that use windows servers, but I guess thats harder to find out unless you completly sell your soul and brag about it like RadioShack. Ok maybe more contentious, so if you dont agree at least help with the first question.

[weasel fierce]

I believe Nvidia cards have native linux drivers ?

[xequence]

Good idea =D Though I think most companies use windows servers... Unfortunatly for us and them.

[slux]

Taking it to another level, you could also consider supporting the ones that actually offer free (/open source) drivers. :)

After all, binary-only ones like Nvidia's are legally questionable not to mention often only a temporary measure (when done for a specific kernel version of a specific distribution, left unsupported) and they are a problem for kernel developers.

[Brunellus]

Taking it to another level, you could also consider supporting the ones that actually offer free (/open source) drivers. :)

After all, binary-only ones like Nvidia's are legally questionable not to mention often only a temporary measure (when done for a specific kernel version of a specific distribution, left unsupported) and they are a problem for kernel developers.
I'll take temporary hack now over perfect solution later.

When I *need* hardware, I need it now. So Nvidia it is.

[slux]

I'll take temporary hack now over perfect solution later.

When I *need* hardware, I need it now. So Nvidia it is.

With that attitude slowly every device driver will become a temporary hack and Linux will end up no better than Windows (regarding both stability and philosophy).

I'd like to know that I'll always be able to use that hardware and I'd like to be able to use it with even more exotic operating systems than GNU/Linux.

Now, I admit to using Nvidia as well on the boxes that permit it (x86) but I've thought about going DRI many times. For a binary-only driver they do make a fairly good effort.

It still worries me: I see the GNU/Linux desktop becoming dependant on closed drivers for 802.11g, 3D acceleration, flash, java and so on. Looks like the control is slowly moving over to these corporations and one day it may not be possible to make a completely free distribution that is usable. Ubuntu is an example of one today, but how many of you go and add the restricted packages to gain mp3 and all the other things I've mentioned?

[isTHEr3mOr3]

Open source hardware:

http://lists.duskglow.com/mailman/listinfo/open-graphics

I will buy one for sure if it's available.

[blastus]

It still worries me: I see the GNU/Linux desktop becoming dependant on closed drivers for 802.11g, 3D acceleration, flash, java and so on. Looks like the control is slowly moving over to these corporations and one day it may not be possible to make a completely free distribution that is usable. Ubuntu is an example of one today, but how many of you go and add the restricted packages to gain mp3 and all the other things I've mentioned?

It would be nice if everything could be open sourced but I don't see that happening. It's not a big issue to get drivers for Linux IF they are provided by the hardware vendor. The point is, is that even if everything could be open sourced, what about the hardware that the software runs on? Where do you draw the line? At some point we have to accept that we will always have to be, to a certain extent, under the control of and dependent on corporate business to run GNU/Linux.

The good news is that the market will determine who will survive and we form a part of that market! We have buying power and we can choose who we want to do business with and who we dont. What we can do is only buy hardware/software from corporations that are known to be Linux-friendly. When it comes to hardware support, of course we will only buy hardware that is well-supported under Linux. In doing so we help support the cause of GNU/Linux. For example, I'm sure that NVIDIA knows that if they all of a sudden became anti-Linux or discontinued their drivers for Linux that we would no longer buy their graphics cards. As a matter of fact, I'm thinking about writing NVIDIA and thanking them for providing a driver for Linux.

That being said, there is one corporation that we know for sure is against Linux and against open source. That corporation is of course, Microsoft. Even if you don't support Linux you should not be supporting Microsoft or any of their partners or associates--buy a Macintosh if you don't want Linux. As long as Microsoft is in a position of absolute economic power, they will continue to manipulate and control consumers and the market through unethical and illegal business practices. This is a corporation that will fight to the end to destroy Linux, open source, open standards, open formats and freedom of choice to NOT USE MS-WINDOWS if you own a PC. We should not and cannot rely on the U.S. government or EU or any other government to keep Microsoft under control. The U.S. government has already proven that it cannot control Microsoft. On the contrary, Microsoft has more than enough economic power and $resources$ to influence world governments and buy their way out of anything.

[Kvark]

Good idea =D Though I think most companies use windows servers... Unfortunatly for us and them.
Most medium and big companies probably don't have the same system on all servers so maybe they have a few Windows servers in some closet. But GNU/Linux is the most popular OS for servers so I'd guess most companies run it on most of their servers.

On the hardware drivers front, things will get better as GNU/Linux grows on the desktop side so hardware manufactorers realize a portion of their potential customers needs Linux-drivers. Let's just hope they leave the Windows traditions on the Windows platform and follow GNU/Linux traditions when making drivers for the GNU/Linux platform.

[slux]

It would be nice if everything could be open sourced but I don't see that happening. It's not a big issue to get drivers for Linux IF they are provided by the hardware vendor.

Everything has been free. Even now most of it is still free with just a few troubling developments.

Part of what makes Linux great is that the kernel team has a strict quality control for what is let into the main kernel and they are constantly reworking parts they are not satisfied with. Letting companies hide their code from them and make drivers on their own will without a doubt degrade the quality of the Linux kernel and make debugging problems impossible. Not only that,it is possibly not legal and quite clearly against the spirit of the GPL.

And getting drivers is a big issue when you're on an arch such as PPC that the companies won't support (no Nvidia/ATI acceleration for Macs). It's also an issue when you wish to use a version of the kernel that the vendors aren't supporting.



The point is, is that even if everything could be open sourced, what about the hardware that the software runs on? Where do you draw the line? At some point we have to accept that we will always have to be, to a certain extent, under the control of and dependent on corporate business to run GNU/Linux.

It's a non-issue. Hardware cannot be modified at all after being manufactured whereas making software non-free is an intentional and artificial barrier to modification. Linux also got along fine without corporate control. In fact most of what is has managed to achieve has been largely *because* it has resisted corporate control.

Software doesn't need to be proprietary for corporations to be able to make money off it anyway as many companies utilizing and even selling GNU/Linux today prove.

[Brunellus]

Everything has been free. Even now most of it is still free with just a few troubling developments.

Part of what makes Linux great is that the kernel team has a strict quality control for what is let into the main kernel and they are constantly reworking parts they are not satisfied with. Letting companies hide their code from them and make drivers on their own will without a doubt degrade the quality of the Linux kernel and make debugging problems impossible. Not only that,it is possibly not legal and quite clearly against the spirit of the GPL.

And getting drivers is a big issue when you're on an arch such as PPC that the companies won't support (no Nvidia/ATI acceleration for Macs). It's also an issue when you wish to use a version of the kernel that the vendors aren't supporting.



It's a non-issue. Hardware cannot be modified at all after being manufactured whereas making software non-free is an intentional and artificial barrier to modification. Linux also got along fine without corporate control. In fact most of what is has managed to achieve has been largely *because* it has resisted corporate control.

Software doesn't need to be proprietary for corporations to be able to make money off it anyway as many companies utilizing and even selling GNU/Linux today prove.
I admire your dedication to The Movement, but, frankly, I want my system to work, work well,and work with a minimum of fuss.

From what I understand, there are open drivers under development for ATI, and work on those is progressing, slowly. If and when those drivers come to a point where they're mature enough for me to use, then I'll change to ATI hardware, because, yes, a free and open driver would be preferable. But I am neither comfortable with desktop aceticism nor running lots of unstable cvs software...especially when it's something crucial, like a video driver.