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AlexJTanner
October 17th, 2007, 10:37 PM
Hello, I am new to FullCircle, I just discovered it today and I LOVE it. I was wondering if there are any plans for publishing it as an actual magazine. You could charge a very low price for the cost of printing and shipping. I have dealt with large shipping before (my family has an online book business and we ship 20+ books a day) but I don't know where you could get access to a printer for the glossy look.

onlineapps
October 17th, 2007, 11:05 PM
You could probably use a site like http://www.magazinepublisher.com/ (disclaimer: I just found it through Google so I have no idea of the quality). Also, Tony Mobily over at Free Software Magazine has had some experience with this.

I would definitely subscribe to a print version. I'll bet a lot of other Ubuntu fans would too.

Also, if you decide not to, could I (or someone else) distribute it unofficially (as long as we only charged for shipping and printing costs)?

AlexJTanner
October 17th, 2007, 11:43 PM
What would a printer possible of printing it like a magazine cost?

If it isn't very expensive I could buy one and use the subscriptions to make up the cost. So the cost would be printing, shipping, and cost of supplies. It still would be around $4 per issue, witch I think would be very reasonable.

catfacts
October 17th, 2007, 11:49 PM
A. Tree killing
B. Other than A good idea, I print it anyways and I know most people do, If I could save ink and pay shipping that would pry equal out.

AlexJTanner
October 17th, 2007, 11:52 PM
I printed it out and it's cool but it still would be cool to have a nice glossy version.

onlineapps
October 18th, 2007, 01:38 AM
You could probably also just get it printed at a Staples or some printing company.

hardyn
October 18th, 2007, 01:54 AM
A. Tree killing.


i agree, we all have computers, lets keep it electronic and hug a tree :)
i mean if you want to print it fine... but lets keep unused magazines out of the landfill.

AlexJTanner
October 18th, 2007, 02:00 AM
What is the licensing for Full Circle?

Does it allow for someone to provide a suscription service with a cost?

Those who want to hug trees can read the online version but those that want a hard copy pretty copy can suscribe to it.

EdThaSlayer
October 18th, 2007, 07:11 AM
Distributing via hard copies would be a bit more tedious for the guys who write the mag as they can't get everything done the day before and then publish the mag on the net. I'm not sure how the full circle mag works though, so, if you guys really want a hard copy go for it.

onlineapps
October 18th, 2007, 12:01 PM
"What is the licensing for Full Circle?"

CC-BY-SA

"Does it allow for someone to provide a suscription service with a cost?"

You'd have to check with Ronnie, but I'm pretty sure you could if you didn't make anything off of it. IDK though.

"Distributing via hard copies would be a bit more tedious for the guys who write the mag as they can't get everything done the day before and then publish the mag on the net. I'm not sure how the full circle mag works though, so, if you guys really want a hard copy go for it."

It could go to press the day after it goes online.

ronniet
October 18th, 2007, 09:31 PM
I personally would LOVE to be able to hold a printed, glossy, edition of Full Circle but financially and logistically it would prove to be a nightmare. It's something we have discussed briefly...

We have over 30,000 downloads a month, even if 10,000 of those people subscribed to a printed edition (and I doubt they would, everyone says 'count me in' until it comes to the crunch!), but who wants to sit and mail out 10,000 copies? And where will the 10,000 copies be delivered to? Not my house, I can tell you that! :D

Also the readers are worldwide, do you want to wait maybe three weeks for your printed copy to arrive? Probably not.

How would it be financed? Advertisements? Fair enough but what if that months advertisements/donations fail to cover the costs for 10,000 copies?

And remember folks; we're volunteers, we can't donate our entire working week to the magazine. Unless someone wants to employ us to work on full circle full time...? :)

catfacts
October 19th, 2007, 09:18 PM
Unless someone wants to employ us to work on full circle full time...? :smile: I need a job! And I must say I print out the cover on photopaper cuz it looks awesome, the rest it printed from a laserjet 4mv!

onlineapps
October 19th, 2007, 09:20 PM
I wonder if Staples would handle all of it. Like we had them print it and then mass ship it. We'd probably get some sort of discount. And we'd charge a fee to cover the costs of making + shipping.

Here's their site (I'll do a little research on it):

http://www.staples.com/sbd/cre/programs/copyandprint/?storeId=10001

onlineapps
October 20th, 2007, 02:54 PM
OK, so I submitted a request for a free quote to Staples, http://www.dynodan.com/ and http://www.magazinepublisher.com/

I'll tell you the price when they get back to me.

onlineapps
October 23rd, 2007, 07:51 PM
I got back a quote from Magazine Publishers:

Here is your quote in signature Pricing -
Printing from Digital page layouts
Quantity:5,000
Page Count: 32 Pages
Trim Size: Newsstand 8 3/8 " X 10 7/8"

Printing Specs: 5K Additional 1k's

1 (16) Page 4/4 60 lb #5Gloss Book Enamel $1,870 $85
1 (16) Page 4/4 60 lb #5Gloss Book Enamel $1,870 $85
Saddle Stitch $250 $25

5K TOTAL $3,890
ADDITIONAL 1,000's =$195


OPTIONS:

Production: Customer to supply Digital Format/

Distribution: Boxed & Pallet Ship to location. - (Estimate $250)
OR
Labeling: Ink Jet or Cheshire $25 set Up $20 per K
Mailing to database: Bulk rate earned (Estimate .22 each USA)


Thank you for working with our Magazine Specialty company.

Let me know how we can further service your title!


Tom



Profiles Marketing Group
http://magazinepublisher.com
P.O. Box 30806
Knoxville, TN 37930-0806
1-865-690-0522

Staples also said they could do it:

I appreciate your inquiry concerning this issue, Andrew.

I'm sure Staples could print it all. You may want to contact your local store for more information
since they handle the copy and print center. Prices may vary in each area. You will have to sign up
at www.staples.com/copyandprint or call your local store for the copying prices. I do apologize.

Please do not hesitate to contact us if you require further assistance.

Thank you for your patience concerning this matter.

Matt
Customer Service Representative

catfacts
October 24th, 2007, 12:04 AM
Well staples was awfually vague. "We won't tell you a price but we will do it and send you a check :)" Hmm this is interisting but I'm not sure if we are ready for this quite yet. But it looks promising.

ronniet
October 24th, 2007, 12:51 AM
yeah, pretty much what i'd seen before, it'd cost about $1 per issue printed.

We get over 30,000 downloads per issue just now. How many printed copies would that be per month? 5,000? 10,000? 50,000?

Everyone likes a freebie so a lot of sign ups would be people just wanting a free magazine and not caring about Ubuntu. In turn that could mean dissapointment for others if we can only afford 5,000 copies but get 10,000 sign ups for the printed edition.

Either way: that's a lot of money we'd need to raise each and every month.

It also brings the problem of liability. Who's going to be liable for the money? Who's account will the money go in to? Who's going to be the accountant/treasurer for these thousands of dollars per month? Who'd be in charge of the advertising side of things?

If I thought I could raise $5,000 per month i'd rather spend it on paying me and some others to work full time on the magazine, THEN think about going to print as we'd have a set of full time 'employees' working on it.

But i'm still open to what you guys think.....

ncappel1
October 24th, 2007, 03:49 PM
I think it would be really cool, and maybe the prospect of having a large reader base, 30,000 downloads or X,000 printed copies may be enough to entice some organizations to pay for some small advertising space which would help pay for a certain amount of the money. Is this a direction we want to go?

I think that it is a petty big step. My intention is NOT to put anyone down, but I don't think we are ready for that kind of commitment yet (better off just as friends? :)). If we do decide to do it, we would certainly need a guide who is familiar with the ropes of the trade! I know some people on our team already have some experience, maybe they could recommend a name for us to learn a bit more from?

my two cents worth

catfacts
October 25th, 2007, 01:15 AM
If I thought I could raise $5,000 per month i'd rather spend it on paying me and some others to work full time on the magazine
I'm all for getting paid :), Who wants to donate :P

onlineapps
October 25th, 2007, 02:28 PM
One suggestion would be to receive the money and THEN send out the magazines.

The other thing is to ask Canonical to sponsor us. I could do that, if you wanted.

Also, Dynodan wrote back. They're $0.63 per issue:

I am pleased to present this quote to you, according to my interpretation of your specifications as outlined below:
(This quote is good for 60 days)

DESCRIPTION 40 Pages Plus Cover Monthly Magazine
SIZE 8.375 x 10.875
STOCK Cover: 80# Gloss Cover
Text: 50# Gloss Text
INK Cover: 4 c/p over 4 c/p w/bleed - Front/back covers to varnish.
Text: Black over black
ART Customer to supply print ready high rez pdf files.
PROOF Electronic proof
BINDERY Fold, saddle-stitch, trim & carton
DELIVERY FOB: Mahwah, NJ 07430
(Shipping & freight is included)

QUANTITY 10,000
YOUR COST $6,930.00
COST PER PIECE 0.693

Plus Applicable Taxes
TERMS: 50% deposit, balance is due prior to shipping after first run.
COMMENTS:

catfacts
October 28th, 2007, 09:08 PM
lets wait to see if we could get say x number of people who would sign up ahead of time and send in the money for say 1 year worth.

ronniet
October 29th, 2007, 01:56 AM
lets wait to see if we could get say x number of people who would sign up ahead of time and send in the money for say 1 year worth.

It's not about READERS paying money, that defeats the purpose of it being a FREE *buntu magazine, it'd be up to us to get a large enough group of advertisers who would pay enough, in total, to cover the cost of printing and shipping. If readers wanted to donate and/or click on advertising on the site (adsense etc) then fair enough.

But again, remember: lets say, for talking sake, that we only made $10,000 per month, that'd mean only 10,000 copies printed. If we end up with a list of 20,000 people wanting a printed copy, how do we decide who gets left out? We could end up with a lot of disgruntled people.

One other thing to consider might be making it more of a newspaper format since i'm quite sure that would be much cheaper...

saxonjf
October 29th, 2007, 07:08 AM
Excellent points, Ronniet... and the newspaper type idea might be an excellent one. I print in greyscale, anyway, and I don't feel like I am missing out.

For a periodical that uses just that newpaper type format, check out this publication

Sword of the Lord Magazine free download (http://swordofthelord.com/freedownload.htm)

onlineapps
October 29th, 2007, 01:46 PM
Greyscale could be interesting.

Though, if it was $1 per issue, I think a lot of users wouldn't mind paying $1...

Also, if we had advertisers it could be first come first serve.

Lastly, we could always try to get Canonical to cover the costs.

bstempi
October 30th, 2007, 03:47 PM
I would think that there would be a really good market for this magazine, and thus a lot of willing advertisers. Dell comes to mind, since they sell Ubuntu desktops and laptops. I imagine many other hardware vendors (System76) and hosting companies would be interested in this.

I'm no business guru, but I would think that if you played your cards right, you could not only produce a print version, but also make a profitable full-time job out of it.

Making the magazine free by supporting it with advertisements is something that Network World has done for quite some time. I think it's a viable option.

catfacts
October 31st, 2007, 01:17 AM
They aren't really paying for the magazine but the medium and shipping. If someone really wants it FREE they can download it and print it but that still costs them electric, ink, internet and time. So really they are paying for it in a different form.

mattr01
November 4th, 2007, 06:41 AM
A. Tree killing
B. Other than A good idea, I print it anyways and I know most people do, If I could save ink and pay shipping that would pry equal out.

I must be the only person that actually doesn't print Full Circle out at home...

mattr01
November 4th, 2007, 06:44 AM
And remember folks; we're volunteers, we can't donate our entire working week to the magazine. Unless someone wants to employ us to work on full circle full time...? :)

You know, i'd like a job too working for full circle, but
1) I live in Australia, i'd have to work at home.
2) Can't do full time. Am a student and podcaster.

Maybe you could ask Canonical, they'll [cough] help [cough] ;)

ncappel1
November 4th, 2007, 03:45 PM
I must be the only person that actually doesn't print Full Circle out at home...

I don't print it out either, in fact, it would be interesting to see how many people do print it out. is there any way to find out?

cosmostrator
November 5th, 2007, 08:39 AM
Just a thought but you could offer it on a service like cafepress.com or lulu.com Both offer printing books on demand and take pdf format. That way there is no up front cost to the full circle team. Of course the mags would be a little pricey, but it may be worth it to some people.
-Cosmostrator

catfacts
November 7th, 2007, 02:17 AM
I don't print it out either, in fact, it would be interesting to see how many people do print it out. is there any way to find out?
Yes http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=605182