Jeos: Canonical's virtualization-specific Ubuntu Linux

[benton]

Check this out!

http://news.com.com/8301-13580_3-9776585-39.html

It's available already, according to the article.

Cheers,

-Benton

[newbie2]

Jeos (pronounced juice) is an acronym, meaning Just Enough Operating System, but maybe the wizards at Canonical aren’t up on their Google, because there’s already a Java project with that name.
http://blogs.zdnet.com/open-source/?p=1411
:rolleyes:

[gonzalov]

It says it is available on the news release. Where is it available? Google produces only news links, ubuntuforum search leads to this thread, search on ubuntu's or canonical's site gets nothing. I do NEED this product!! Looks great!!

[newbie2]

It says it is available on the news release. Where is it available? Google produces only news links, ubuntuforum search leads to this thread, search on ubuntu's or canonical's site gets nothing. I do NEED this product!! Looks great!!
all i can find is this :
http://open-vm-tools.wiki.sourceforge.net/Packaging

[jsmidt]

Where can I get Jeos?

[SighKick]

I am right in the middle of a project now trying to install a minimal Debian Etch Host OS.

Would be great to find a link to where this 'JUICE' can be downloaded!


:popcorn: <<< waiting for the show

[rbalfour]

Just read this over at theregister.com -> Main Story (http://www.theregister.com/2007/09/13/ubuntu_jeos_vmware/)

One thing that urks me.


Canonical is still in the midst of deciding whether not to make JeOS wildly available, since it's mostly meant as an ISV thang.


Whether or not to make is available? It better be available! There is no deciding about it. Either in the beta areas or "hey look! see where Ubuntu is going now" area. Some at the top better go look at the Ubuntu motto AGAIN.

[Tux Aubrey]

Whether or not to make is available? It better be available! There is no deciding about it. Either in the beta areas or "hey look! see where Ubuntu is going now" area. Some at the top better go look at the Ubuntu motto AGAIN.

I had never interpreted the Canonical commitment to say that everything they do would be free. Ubuntu desktop. server, Kubuntu, Xubuntu and Edubuntu seem to be a very full suite of free products. Its totally up to them whether anything else is released for no cost. I understand that Launchpad isn't free. I'd far rather see Canonical successful than commited to serving my needs for nothing and then whithering away. They are going to need a herd of cash cows sooner or later.

And what do you think "wildly available" would be if it did happen? Maybe it means released into the wild but you have to track it down and kill it if you want it.

[RAV TUX]

I had never interpreted the Canonical commitment to say that everything they do would be free. Ubuntu desktop. server, Kubuntu, Xubuntu and Edubuntu seem to be a very full suite of free products. Its totally up to them whether anything else is released for no cost. I understand that Launchpad isn't free. I'd far rather see Canonical successful than commited to serving my needs for nothing and then whithering away. They are going to need a herd of cash cows sooner or later.

And what do you think "wildly available" would be if it did happen? Maybe it means released into the wild but you have to track it down and kill it if you want it.

I agree with Aubrey on this one. You don't see them giving away free Ubuntu T-Shirts and free Ubuntu mugs either.

[bodhi.zazen]

Threads merged.

[Anthem]

"Wildly" available?

I'd be interested to see what that looks like.

[23meg]

Like Windows, perhaps.

[leftfield technology]

We are currently testing a Ubuntu-powered VMWare server, running mixed Ubuntu and XP Clients. We plan to push the Ubuntu clients though as we are already getting imporved performance (and it's cheaper for the client!)

JeOS could be just what we need. Whilst we're are due to apply for canonical membership, I'd like to see JeOS go fully open - Not only could it also be useful in the embedded market, but being fully available to the open source community can only be good for the product itself.

[IronWolve]

Post a link already! :)

[frankabel]

So... is free or not? where I can download it?

Salute
Frank Abel

[EmmEff]

It is not yet available... seems to be some rumour that it might be available only to ISVs and such, but no confirmation of that yet.

[bschopman]

Man, I am excited about this distribution of Ubuntu. I can't understand there is so little information about it... why isn't everybody as enthousiastic???

I wonder how it'll work performance wise... I've heard & seen windows run pretty efficiently emulated using vmware on ubuntu. Could it even be fast enough for serious gaming?

[polaris20]

Why have a release article about it, and then not actually allow people to download it, or say how to buy it?

To have this fanfare about it, and then say that they're still thinking about how they're going to release it is stupid on Canonical's part.

That said, when it becomes available I cannot wait to try it out.

[EmmEff]

I imagine the showing of JeOS at VMWorld was nothing more than a "technology preview". Or perhaps Ubuntu isn't sure how to market it or whether they're going to charge for it or not.

ISVs and virtual appliance builders aside, is there really that much general interest in a VMware optimized version of Ubuntu?

[Cyphase]

There's a new package in the repositories called linux-virtual, with accompanying linux-backports, linux-headers, linux-image, linux-restricted and linux-ubuntu packages. It says it's a kernel for virtualized hardware.

[n3tfury]

awesome news.

[frankabel]

Where I can find that?

[smokeslikeapoet]

http://packages.ubuntu.com/gutsy/metapackages/linux-virtual

If I were a betting man. Ubuntu Jeos would be available with Hardy Heron which is also the next LTS version. I believe one of the goals for this Hardy is a completely free system including a free jdk/jre implementation. Of course I have absolutely no evidence to support this but given the suitabilty of this release in a lightweight virtual appliance, with free (freedom) software and long-term support, I would put my money on April '08.

https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HardyReleaseSchedule

[EmmEff]

I wouldn't take that bet :)

This article (http://searchenterpriselinux.techtarget.com/originalContent/0,289142,sid39_gci1272918,00.html) says that JeOS will be available on Oct 18. Who it's available to is the question... there is certainly some indication it will not be a public release.

[smokeslikeapoet]

Gerry Carr, the marketing manager for Canonical, told SearchEnterpriseLinux.com in an email that it would not make a lot of sense to make JeOS available beyond ISVs and OEMs just yet. "To avoid confusion and frustration, we will likely make [JeOS] available only through VADK [the VMware development kit] and restricted through our site so that the right people are getting it," Carr said. "We don't want people to think, 'Oooh, a lighter server version,' as it will not work in that way." Carr said Canonical will make a final decision on just how restricted it will keep JeOS closer to its release on Oct. 18.

Yeah, seems to me like keeping this from being released into the wild is a pipe dream. Why they would even try is beyond me. GPL anyone?

[EmmEff]

I think it's more an issue of Canonical not wanting additional support load or perhaps dilution of the Server Edition market. I doubt this limited release is being done with ill intent.

[ariek]

Has anybody seen when and where JEOS will be available? Gutsy is already released, but the JEOS iso is not available in the standard download location yes.
I'm really looking forward to this slim, VMware server dedicated version.

Arie

[smokeslikeapoet]

Why not just install Ubuntu Server on a VM yourself. Jeos is application oriented. For instance: If I want just a XMPP Jabber server, it would only install the dependencies necessary for that server. I wouln't get any extra stuff like dns, mail or http, no desktop would be installed or any other stuff.

From the command line if I wanted the Thunar file manager on a default Ubuntu Desktop installation I could either:

apt-get install thunar

Or I could

apt-get install xubuntu-desktop

The second would install xfce4 and a bunch of other unnecessary programs. In much the same way, with Jeos I could define a "bind" appliance to have a self contained DNS server and get a operational DNS server without any extra services running or applications installed.

[locutus42]

Has anybody seen when and where JEOS will be available? Gutsy is already released, but the JEOS iso is not available in the standard download location yes.
I'm really looking forward to this slim, VMware server dedicated version.

Arie

looking for the same answer myself. I'm getting the 7.10 server just to see if it somehow on that as an install option or hidden.

I know a Windows shop that recently had the dev manager ask about SCM and I want to drop off a little pre-configured Trac virtual machine as a demo. Also, want to keep the VM small but easily update-able and Ubuntu apt-get gives that.

So I'll ask too, Where's JeOS?

[EmmEff]

Why not just install Ubuntu Server on a VM yourself.

Ever done it?

The base includes ALSA (sound) stuff as well as Bluetooth support, for example. Neither of which are required for a JeOS-based appliance.

Installing Avahi, for example, also includes dependencies to X11 libraries, which drags in a bunch of other stuff that shouldn't be on a lean VM-based server.

There is much room for improvement in what constitutes a base system in Ubuntu.

[EmmEff]

So I'll ask too, Where's JeOS?

Today is/was supposed to be the release date, but I've yet to see anything that's not 7.10.

[EmmEff]

I didn't see anybody mention that there's a JeOS entry in Launchpad now...

https://code.launchpad.net/ubuntu-jeos/

Having looked at the script, there's reference to some packages (linux-virtual) and a virtual kernel that do not appear to be included in Gutsy.

FWIW, their procedure is virtually identical to what I originally did to create VMs almost a year ago with 6.06LTS (minus the virtual kernel and "special" package(s)).

Looking forward to seeing the rest of this show itself... anything to make my VMs better!

[locutus42]

Ever done it?

The base includes ALSA (sound) stuff as well as Bluetooth support, for example. Neither of which are required for a JeOS-based appliance.

Installing Avahi, for example, also includes dependencies to X11 libraries, which drags in a bunch of other stuff that shouldn't be on a lean VM-based server.

There is much room for improvement in what constitutes a base system in Ubuntu.

FYI, looking for a trimmed Ubuntu server OS I installed Gutsy 7.10 DNS server install. Seeing as I don't want the bind stuff, here's some things which don't seem generally too useful but were installed:
note: result from using "sudo dpkg -l"

alsa-base alsa-utils bind9 bind9-doc bind9-host libasound2 libbind9-30 libdns32 libisc32 libisccc30 libisccfg30 libiw29 liblwres30 libusb-0.1-4 linux-sound-base ntfs-3g libntfs-3g12 pcmciautils popularity-contest ppp pppconfig pppoeconf reiserfsprogs wireless-tools wpasupplicant

Add "sudo apt-get remove" to the head of that list and save some space. Apt listed 22MB saved/removed and it lookes like there's a 7MB initrd backup in /boot which can go also.

[EmmEff]

What is your installation size down to after removing those?

I used to build virtual appliances on Gentoo. My first appliance (incl. Lighttpd, PHP, Dropbear for SSH, and Busybox for most everything else) was around 10MB compressed. Now with Ubuntu, my appliances are 130MB to 200MB (depending on which apps are installed).

I build a Tomcat appliance and for some reason I gcj is an installation dependency for Tomcat 5.5 despite trying to make it Sun JDK 6 only. Far too much bloat!

[locutus42]

What is your installation size down to after removing those?


UPDATE: Two Gutsy server installations( one using same DNS option and one with no selected option ) resulted in "zip -r9" sizes of 216MB and 210MB for the two options and after "apt-get remove" on the above listed packages.

[IronWolve]

Any update yet? Still havnt seen the JEOS released other than the script to build it. (Does it even work?)

[EmmEff]

The script contains references to packages that aren't available, so no, it doesn't work :)

[nealmcb]

The script contains references to packages that aren't available, so no, it doesn't work :)

On 2007-11-01 some updates to the ubuntu-jeos trunk were made, and it works for me:
https://code.launchpad.net/ubuntu-jeos

I uploaded my own "nealmcb" branch with qemu support:

https://code.launchpad.net/~nealmcb/ubuntu-jeos/nealmcb

EmmEff, can you post a link or some more info on your gentoo appliance? What VM do you run it on?

[EmmEff]

On 2007-11-01 some updates to the ubuntu-jeos trunk were made, and it works for me:
https://code.launchpad.net/ubuntu-jeos

I uploaded my own "nealmcb" branch with qemu support:

https://code.launchpad.net/~nealmcb/ubuntu-jeos/nealmcb


I will have to give that a try. Thanks for the headsup.



EmmEff, can you post a link or some more info on your gentoo appliance? I assume that doesn't include a kernel? What VM do you run it on?

My startup company (http://virtualappliances.net) has been building virtual appliances for almost 3 years now. We first started out doing work on Gentoo and uClibc but turned out there were too many limitations (for example, not enough applications would build with the libc subset).

Currently we offer LAMP, LAPP, Cacti, and Tomcat appliances based on Ubuntu 7.04 Server Edition.

Of course it includes a kernel :) It wouldn't boot without it... all of our stuff has been primarily developed for VMware desktop and ESX products, although we've done work with qemu, VirtualBox, XenSource OSS, XenServer, Virtual Iron, Moka5, and Microsoft Virtual PC/Virtual Server.

We're keen on making Ubuntu-based appliances that have a footprint similar to that of our custom Gentoo-based appliances, and still retain all the benefits of Ubuntu.

[nealmcb]

I edited out my kernel question after a bit more thought :-) I was thinking your stuff might run in one of those "container" or "jail" like systems that use the kernel of the host os.

The idea of using busybox to replace lots of stuff is interesting. Has anyone put together an ubuntu derivitave that relies on busybox?

This is a command line I've used with that "nealmcb" version of ubuntu-jeos (after installing
apt-catcher which caches apts and dramatically speeds up the apt-get stuff that debootstrap does). It uses ts (from the moreutils package) to timestamp each line of output:

sudo ubuntu-jeos-builder -t /dev/shm --addpkg openssh-server --mirror http://localhost:3142/archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu --vm qemu 2>&1 | ts %H:%M:%S > jb.out

cd ubuntu-jeos-gutsy-i386
./launchjeos -redir tcp:2222::22 -monitor stdio

ssh ubuntu@localhost -p 2222

[EmmEff]

The idea of using busybox to replace lots of stuff is interesting. Has anyone put together an ubuntu derivitave that relies on busybox?

I was hoping that this is something that may have been an option for the Ubuntu JeOS project, but so far, that has not been the case.

We originally focused on Gentoo because it was possible to build a 3 or 4 package base installation (libc, kernel, busybox, and some support utils) without dragging in excessive dependencies. I'd like to be able to build a Ubuntu dist from standard packages that does not drag in Bluetooth, ALSA, and whatever else is currently a dependency.

I am going to experiment with your script modifications and hopefully contribute many of my own.

Thanks for the tip about apt-catcher... this might be useful for our current build script which spends significant time interacting with the APT repository.

[sbassi]

Hello,

Just to share a link I found (after thoroughly googling)
http://ftp.heanet.ie/disk1/ubuntu-cdimage/jeos/releases/
The direc link to the iso (151Mb) is here:

JeOS ISO (http://preview.tinyurl.com/23vht7)

I used tinyurl because I have a problem in my editor and very long lines.
(I put the preview link in tinyURL for you to see where you are going to jump).

Didn't find any torrent :-(

There should be a JeOS specific forum. If there is no forum here, I created one in GoogleGroups: http://groups.google.com/group/jeos
I am also involved in virtual appliances.

[sbassi]

Sorry, here is the good link:

http://preview.tinyurl.com/2o5dve

http://preview.tinyurl.com/2o5dve

[EmmEff]

Did anybody get it to work? Installs fine, but hangs on boot...

[nealmcb]

What hangs, the iso or the VM? When/where does it hang? On what sort of machine?

[EmmEff]

I created an empty 32-bit VM in VMware Server x86_64 (running on Ubuntu 7.10 on a Core Duo 1.83Ghz something or other), booted from the ISO, and installed "JeOS".

After rebooting the new JeOS VM, it displays the regular "Booting..." (forget the exact text; it's at the office, I'm currently at home) and then stops dead.

[jschwartz73]

I hang as soon as the Ubuntu progress bar appears

[nealmcb]

Can you mount the disk image and look for useful information in /var/log?

When I do an install under qemu,

qemu jeos-gutsy-iso.img -cdrom ubuntu-7.10-jeos-i386.iso -boot d

I have cdrom problems and have to use the tips for the alternate installer at https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux-source-2.6.22/+bug/120316

Then it installs. When I quit qemu and reboot without the cdrom

kvm jeos-gutsy-iso.img

It takes a while and then I get to an initramfs screen that I don't understand.....

If I loop-mount the image file

sudo mount -r -o loop,offset=32256 jeos-gutsy-iso.img /mnt

I see lots of info in /var/log about the install, but no hints about why I end up in intramfs.....

The ubuntu-jeos debootstrap installs are SO much faster and easier and work great..... Not much reason at all for an iso image as I see it. I think Ubuntu should ship a vm image that can be converted to the users vm tool of choice and which includes tips on the appropriate dpkg-reconfigure options etc. to select languages, keyboards etc.

[EmmEff]

Ok, I wrote a script to generate a JeOS VM and got to the initramfs prompt like yourself... problem is missing "mptscsih" kernel module. The modules for JeOS appear to only include buslogic, so I adjusted the SCSI driver in the VMX file.

For some reason, it's now probing sd[a-z] despite the fact that the VM only has a single disk. It's been a while since I've used Buslogic SCSI in a VM, so perhaps this is something that can be disabled through a boot flag.

Edit: apparently I should've looked at the ubuntu-jeos-builder script a little more closely :) They're using IDE based disks. I'll be back after updating my script...

[EmmEff]

After some tweaks for making VMware Server happy with the IDE disk geometry, it boots!

The installed footprint is still >150MB :(

This cannot be the JeOS that was demo'd at VMworld because ESX doesn't support SCSI disks and I know at least one ISV demo'd their appliance running on JeOS. That is, unless they demo'd on something other than ESX.

[EmmEff]

And ALSA is still in there...

[nealmcb]

I've now packaged the nealmcb branch in my personal package archive:

https://edge.launchpad.net/~nealmcb/+archive

Despite what it says there (launchpad bug?), you need to specify "gutsy" in the sources.list file:

deb http://ppa.launchpad.net/nealmcb/ubuntu gutsy main
deb-src http://ppa.launchpad.net/nealmcb/ubuntu gutsy main

and you can then sudo apt-get update; sudo apt-get install ubuntu-jeos-builder and follow my directions above for the rest. And you can then pull in upgrades as usual (like removing alsa!) as they are uploaded. [Which is to say that this is very much an alpha package - expect behavior to change. And it isn't even my package - thanks go to soren, complaints to me!]

[nealmcb]

The official gutsy jeos iso is at http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/jeos/releases/7.10/release/

It is the same as the one previously reported here.

It isn't at http://releases.ubuntu.com/7.10/ because that only has a selection of the most popular downloads.

[EmmEff]

I'm planning on creating a branch on LaunchPad as well, Neal.

I am curious if anybody has done anything interesting with Ubuntu JeOS yet?

[nealmcb]

Good news, Emm :-) The trunk has now been upgraded with my patches and a bit more.

We're also trying to figure out how this ought to relate to virt-install, libvirt, virt-manager et al.

[dendrobates]

Neal,
Are you going to merge your changes back into Soren's main branch?

BTW, we plan to have a cli based on libvirt in Hardy, but you know that, since you were at UDS. :)

[dendrobates]

Good news, Emm :-) The trunk has now been upgraded with my patches and a bit more.

We're also trying to figure out how this ought to relate to virt-install, libvirt, virt-manager et al.

Oops, I didn't notice your last post. I was going to ask what changes you made, but I'm sure soren will let me know.

[Tahi_Kiwi]

Does anyone know the whereabouts of documentation for JEOS?

I installed it as a guess VM, but I'm not sure if the installation is working. It didn't even prompt me for my username and password. It gave a barebones terminal, no X that I can see.

[EmmEff]

I think you're misunderstanding what JeOS is all about... it's not a desktop operating system (hence X not being there). It is for server-based, purpose built "appliances" in virtual machines.

If you're looking for a desktop operating system with X, you can install the regular Ubuntu Desktop version.

[Tahi_Kiwi]

Thanks, EmmEff

I am sure that I did misunderstand what JEOS was about.

I had thought that I could make my own virtual appliance--that is, a desktop virtual appliance that contained only the applications that I wanted.

I have tried to use Add/Remove programs as well as Synaptic Package Manager to remove some of the standard 7.10 desktop apps, such as Evolution, but the process became hairy. I had to make decisions on packages that I had no knowledge of besides the obvious.

[JBAlaska]

Here's the torrent;

http://www.tuxdistro.com/torrents-details.php?id=686

[EmmEff]

I had thought that I could make my own virtual appliance--that is, a desktop virtual appliance that contained only the applications that I wanted.

You can do that now with "regular" Ubuntu... it's the desktop dependencies that I do not want to see in my server-based virtual appliance.


I have tried to use Add/Remove programs as well as Synaptic Package Manager to remove some of the standard 7.10 desktop apps, such as Evolution, but the process became hairy. I had to make decisions on packages that I had no knowledge of besides the obvious.

This is something perhaps Ubuntu could do better with, but I don't think desktop virtualization within the scope of the JeOS project.

[IronWolve]

Grabbed the juice, and it didnt boot due to initrd.img issue.... Have to check the md5 later, maybe something is corrupt.

[garilerma]

Hello,
I am installing JeOS in a new machine. I want to have couple of VMware virtual appliances working in top of it.
Is there any manual that explains how to do so?
thanks in advance,
Gari

[ts84]

Our company might want to distribute a virtual machine, and JeOS is a good
candidate. Because we'd be distributing GPL'd software, we need to distribute the source. Is
there an easy way to find and download the source packages for JeOS or another Debian/Ubuntu-based
virtual machine?

I imagine this could be done from the host or from inside the guest. The end result we would like is a directory full of source packages. I don't know enough about apt to know where to start. Any pointers would help.

I realize that the GPL is widely ignored when distributing virtual machine binaries (as it also is with Knoppix-like
distributions), but we'd need to follow the letter of the law for this usage.

- ts