Gaming more important than the linux community lets on ?

[NoTiG]

http://www.extremetech.com/article2/0,1697,1841219,00.asp


Windows Gaming: A First-Class Citizen

As Microsoft set out to build its next-generation operating system, it first set about collecting data. What exactly do people spend all their time doing on their Windows PCs? The numbers are pretty surprising. 35.5% of the time spent on a Windows PC is browsing the net, but the No. 2 activity—by a wide margin—is playing games. 18% of a Windows user's time (and this is all Windows users here, even grandma) is spent playing games. Granted, this includes casual games, not just multi-million dollar AAA blockbusters that cost $50 at the store. The third and fourth highest- activities by minutes of time spent were using the shell and doing email, at just over 9% each.

There have been many reports in the news lately about the "decline of PC games." Microsoft thinks that is due almost entirely to lazy reporting and bad numbers. Worldwide, retail sales of Windows games have been flat, at about $2.3 billion a year. The press looks at these numbers and compares it with console sales of over $6 billion (and rising each year) and says that Windows games are being marginalized. To begin with, why lump all the consoles together against a single platform, the PC? Shouldn't we compare the PC individually to the Xbox, PlayStation 2, and Nintendo Gamecube? More importantly is that worldwide online sales have increased to $2 billion a year, and those numbers are never included in the typical NPD industry tracking reports.

That $2 billion figure includes online sales of games, digitally distributed games, online game subscription fees, and sales of online digital objects, extras, and add-ons. This is projected to grow to about $7 billion over the next 4 years. So if you total up all the actual money being spent on Windows games, not just retail sales, it's a very healthy and steadily growing marketplace. Still, that's not enough for Microsoft. The company is working on initiatives with retailers to drastically improve the "brand" of PC games, turning the Windows PC into a platform with the same retail recognition, consistent packaging, and shelf space as the Xbox or PS2. Trials will roll out at some major retailers later this year, with a major marketing push to increasing and improving the PC game retail presence next year.

The long and short of it is this: Microsoft intends to use both marketing and technology improvements in Vista to turn Windows into a "platform" in the minds of retailers and consumers—a platform equal in every way to the Xbox 360 or PlayStation 3. And it's not just marketing. In Windows Vista, gaming will be a first-class citizen, no longer stuffed five levels deep in the Start menu. It will share top-tier status with Documents, Music, and Photos.

The more developers are using directx 10 rather than opengl , well it bodes badly for linux and opengl. I just read an article on "improvements in opengl es 2 (http://www.tomshardware.com/hardnews/20050801_152819.html) , but will any of those improvements be passed on to regular opengl 2.0 ? it seems to me theres alot of companies on board opengl es because it benefits THEM and their devices, but opengl doesnt have this same benefit so it may be that it develops at a slower pace?

[NoTiG]

One other factor that might be worth mentioning is that since the consoles are typically sold at a loss... that might detract from the profit of console games as as well.

[paul cooke]

PC games are dead... the only two shops in our city that still carry proper ranges of PC games are Game, and PC World... the rest have cleared space for just two platforms... PS2 and XBOX... the other platforms have all been dropped and only exist in the pre-owned racks... no new games for PC or Gamecube... even Game is shrinking their PC shelfspace...

[oddabe19]

pc games aren't dead.

There are still people like me who can't stand console games. I can't get into them. But PC games are a huge part of my life (in part with Cedega of course).

IMHO for me, nothing can replace the mouse and keyboard combo, i can just do so much more with more accuracy.

[Curlydave]

PC games are dead.

You're kidding, right?

[Omnios]

There are people who's sole consideration on buy a computer and harware is based on gamming in mind and the terminology of gaming computer. Looking at all the deveopments, hyperthreading, dual core the increase standards that ram and video im magabites leads me to think that we are going to see some amazing games in the future with huge game maps, and worlds which may make games more relevent as more people will want to play them. Also possibly amazing graphics though I tend to like playablitlity more. Is it important to Linux, some what but Linux will still be there even without total game support. One thing it will affect is the Linux market share.

There are many poeple who wan't to try Linux but gaming is holding them back. The fact that a person has a couple hundred dollars of games lying around might hold them back. I found my solution, dual booting and that was one of the options that finaly got me to comit to try Linux.

[NoTiG]

Well... its kind of a weird comparison.. because basically consoles ARE computers. The reason why people choose console isnt because its better in any way except that the hardware is underpriced, whereas computer hardware is overpriced. computer harware is probably bloated about 800% while console is negative 25% . of COURSE ppl will prefer consoles for financial reasons but... A computer itself is a better gaming machine than a console. its modular, it can multi task and you can even play two different games at once.. and it has more variety for controllers.. keyboard /mouse joystic etc....

this is becoming less of an issue as they become more of the same but... games DO drive hardware sales. which means in theory that if PC games are waning, then hardware prices will come down because there is less demand. With lower prices, it will naturally balance itself as a gaming platform because of this. Pc gaming will never die.

[pmj]

It doesn't matter how great OpenGL is/will be if no games are made for Linux. And I don't see that happening any time soon.

It's a huge problem. If Windows wasn't the *only* real alternative for gamers, I know several people that would switch to Linux. And the only reason I'm about to switch is because I no longer have a computer that is fast enough for modern games.

[poofyhairguy]

And the only reason I'm about to switch is because I no longer have a computer that is fast enough for modern games.

Most people do. Gamers will be the last to come to Linux (not counting dual booting) and their is no way around the problem.

If Linux is ever going to get real big it will do it in the Corporate setting. Corporate desktops not Home user desktops. Ubuntu is better for the first one out of the box than the second.

Corporate masters do not wish for their employees to play games on the clock. Lack of games is a pluss then. Also the most popular games are card and puzzle games and Linux has a lot of those (good ones).

The group that plays new PC games on a high end rig machine are a small (but vocal) minority of computer users. If they come over last, it doesn't hurt that much.

[ubuntu_demon]

I think we should encourage users a bit to play games with Ubuntu and show that is is possible. That is one of the reasons why I started the European Ubuntu Clan :

http://www.katanoon.nl/ubu-e/index.html
http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=44995

[N'Jal]

Here's a crazy idea i had, say a games company makes a really good game, but releases it only for Linux, who would go over to linux to play it? Simple, well it's a simple concept, everyone who buys the game, and how would we do that? Create a bootable DVD that run's a free version of linux designed to mainly play the game, and include in the box a flash drive where the games are saved to. If they loose the flash drive oh well, you just have to buy a new one, but this makes editing of game config files easier (and lots of people do this anyway) since it's all stared on a flash drive not hidden in
C:\Program Files\Some Game\Saves\mygame.sav

[Dragonfly_X]

I think we should encourage users a bit to play games with Ubuntu and show that is is possible. That is one of the reasons why I started the European Ubuntu Clan :

http://www.katanoon.nl/ubu-e/index.html
http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=44995

Excellent! How can I join the clan? :-P

[nocturn]

Games are a huge part of the home computing market and the lack of them on Linux does turn many people off.

But to be fair, Linux itself cannot help this. We cannot force game makers to port to Linux. There is this chicken and egg problem regarding games. Most companies do not port to Linux because it isn't a huge market now and many people do not want to switch for the lack of games.

The best solution for gamers is either cedega or a console or dual booting (still better since a crashed windows does not affect E-mail/browsing/...).

[npaladin2000]

There's more problem than getting companies to port to Linux. THe main thing would be that it's HARDER to develop a game for LINUX! There's NO unified API. Microsoft has DirectX....Direct3D, DirectSound, DirectPlay, DirectInput, etc. Linux, on the other hand has OpenGL, SDL, Esound OR ARtS, several different controller interface methods...need I go on?

Microsoft has a unified toolkit for game developers to use to put together games. Linux has a hodgepodge of stuff, and no matter how good the individual pieces are, it's still a hodgepodge and therefore harder to work with. It's a place where Linux's flexibility and variety works against it, frankly..that's just how it is. And no one's working to correct it, really.

Show developers that it's not hard to develop/port games to Linux and more of them will do it. Cedega's just emulating DirectX, and that ain't gonna cut it. We need some srt of thingy that can be part of any Linux...Maybe call it Lin-X? How about Direct-L? Whatever it is, it's gotta start by merging Esound and ARTS.

I have to still keep crappy Windows around so I can play games. It really sucks, you know? On Linux, I'm stuck with emulators (which I'm addicted to anyway) and LBreakout2 and SuperTux, which I'm nuts for. But I still wish i could play Jagged Alliance 2...or Supreme Ruler 2020...or Medieval: Total War.

Speaking of...anyone kjnow if Loki's Alpha Centauri works in Ubuntu and won't break anything? I know the Loki stuff is real old, and I'm worried about trying to install it...

[Knome_fan]

Whatever it is, it's gotta start by merging Esound and ARTS.

Ehm, as sdl can use both arts and esound, this isn't really a problem. (Well, having arts and esd sure is a problem in itself, but not the kind of problem for game developers you try to make it.)

[ubuntu_demon]

Excellent! How can I join the clan? :-P
Well we start by playing tc:e because
1) it's free
2) I like it so I don't mind to do a bit of organising

In the future we will also be playing other free games that run native in Ubuntu when requested by enough members.

If you don't want to play tc:e and you can get a couple of other guys together (as long as everyone meets the joining restrictions) that want to play that game then you can join our clan and use our irc channel and website. You will have to deliver a teamleader who wants to organise fun wars or matches. I'm gonna write some information about this on our website soon.

See http://www.katanoon.nl/ubu-e/contact.html for joining information

[nocturn]

There's more problem than getting companies to port to Linux. THe main thing would be that it's HARDER to develop a game for LINUX! There's NO unified API. Microsoft has DirectX....Direct3D, DirectSound, DirectPlay, DirectInput, etc. Linux, on the other hand has OpenGL, SDL, Esound OR ARtS, several different controller interface methods...need I go on?

The API is not really an issue, at least it's not for people who make Linux-only games...
The problem is in the unified Windows API, it exists only on Windows. So you write a game for Windows using DirectX and want to port. This involves rewriting all the directX calls to something else.

Maybe even an open API like OpenGL/SDL was used on Windows too, the cost of porting would be worth it.

[Hamman]

IMO, someone should create an OpenSource game engine. Par that with a nice SDK and you would have lot's of mods in no time!
Concerning that study, by games most people probably meant Solitaire and the like, not the latest FPS game.

[nickless]

There is also www.linux-gamers.net as a nice Linux-Clan :)
I also would love to see more games on Linux. The problem with a opensource game engine is, that this is a lot of work for no money :D
And I believe that the engine isn't the problem, because of the quake3 engine, will it is not open source, but we're not only talking about those little opensource games...

[npaladin2000]

The problem with a opensource game engine is, that this is a lot of work for no money :D

Honestly, I think that can be gotten around. Sure one can have a game engine, and make it open source. But then you write a development toolkit and charge for it. And, of course, charge for support also. If the licensing is done right it's theoretically possible, though purists will complain if the development kit isn't GPL. But if you want commercial-quality games, you're gonna have ot pay for them anyway, which means they AIN'T gonna be open source or GPL in most cases.

Someone said earlier about SDL supporting ARTS and ESOUND...well, that's true, but not at the same time. That's why people stick with one desktop...if you usually use KDE, but load GNOME and start an SDL game from GNOME, you get no sound, since ESOUND is running instead of ARTS. I mean come on, how hard is it for people to agree on ONE soft mixer??

Other than that one problem, SDL could almost fit the bill to be the "DirextX" for Linux (Short a "DirectPlay" network component though). Question is, do any commerical game developers develop for SDL for Windows?

[BWF89]

I like console games better than PC games anyway. You don't have to worry about checking the system requirements a few years after you get your computer because it becomes out of date by then.

Linux has enough games to play with. The NES emulators and basic card and puzzle games that come with KDE and Gnome is enough to keep most people busy.

[Kyral]

The way I see it....

PC is for FPS and the like (Can't beat a mouse and the AWSD bind!)

Console is for everything else :D (God I love Skies of Arcadia Legends....)

But honestly, I use my GBASP over everything else. POWER TO THE PORTABLE!

[BWF89]

PC is for FPS and the like (Can't beat a mouse and the AWSD bind!)
I must be the only person who still plays PC games with the up, down, left, & right buttons.

[Omnios]

Most people do. Gamers will be the last to come to Linux (not counting dual booting) and their is no way around the problem.

If Linux is ever going to get real big it will do it in the Corporate setting. Corporate desktops not Home user desktops. Ubuntu is better for the first one out of the box than the second.

Corporate masters do not wish for their employees to play games on the clock. Lack of games is a pluss then. Also the most popular games are card and puzzle games and Linux has a lot of those (good ones).

The group that plays new PC games on a high end rig machine are a small (but vocal) minority of computer users. If they come over last, it doesn't hurt that much.

Im kinda agree with you on this, They are all different chunks of a big overall market share. The corperate setting is a definate achieveable target where gamming is in the hands of the game developers and corperate is in the hands of Linux developers. I read one short comming pertaining to Linux not having a native flash developer app though. Im starting to think that developing Ubuntu Linux for the workforce is a more important than I originaly though.

As for parlor games that is achievable and is a huge target the numbers for parlor game users is huge.