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Mr. Picklesworth
August 29th, 2007, 06:28 AM
I've been thinking that one really good way to ease the transition to Linux would be a way to transform Windows into something like a specific game platform, where very few processes run at any one time and the whole desktop is stripped down, streamlined for the idea. A bit like a game console using Windows' native libraries, sort of, that could be accessed just by restarting the computer.

Is there any such thing, or am I dreaming?

rohan182
August 29th, 2007, 06:34 AM
there was a program a couple of years ago that i found (it was a tweaking XP program) and one of the cool things was it had a function of stopping all the processes not needed and called it "gaming mode".

i cannot remember what the program was called. If i do ill let u know.

Sorry if this doesn't make any sense its been a looonog day at uni.

SupaSonic
August 29th, 2007, 08:04 AM
The program's name is GameXP. I don't think it does exactly the thing Mr. Picklesworth was talking about though.

lisati
August 29th, 2007, 08:17 AM
There was a day when a stripped-down version of Windows was called MS-DOS or something like that, somewhere around version 3.1 or earlier :confused:.... just teasing really!

Might be possible......the first DTP program I ever owned ran under "GEM" and came with a stripped down version of GEM that ran under MS-DOS and which was unloaded when the DTP program was closed.

kerry_s
August 29th, 2007, 08:21 AM
http://www.litepc.com/

http://www.btmon.com/Applications/Windows/XP_Lite_2006_Corporate_Edition.iso.torrent.html

http://thepiratebay.org/tor/3516657/Windows_Xp_Pro_Lite

google is your friend

Tom Mann
August 29th, 2007, 09:26 AM
www.nliteos.com to build a windows cd with components stripped out of it from the start.

PrimoTurbo
August 29th, 2007, 10:45 AM
Imagine this, you have a shortcut for a game on your desktop. A game that only works on Windows and a game that's recent.

You click this shortcut, Linux goes into a type of sleep mode, a very light version of Windows 2000/XP is booted into and the specified game is automatically loaded.

The game is running 100% native with a low resource Windows, once you exit it returns back to Linux.

If this can be done in 10-30 seconds, that would quite awesome. You would bridge the gap between Linux and gaming.

lucazade
August 29th, 2007, 11:13 AM
Check this software I've made:

SparkleXP (http://www.sparklexp.com)

:popcorn:

let me know what do u think !

forrestcupp
August 29th, 2007, 01:54 PM
Imagine this, you have a shortcut for a game on your desktop. A game that only works on Windows and a game that's recent.

You click this shortcut, Linux goes into a type of sleep mode, a very light version of Windows 2000/XP is booted into and the specified game is automatically loaded.

The game is running 100% native with a low resource Windows, once you exit it returns back to Linux.

If this can be done in 10-30 seconds, that would quite awesome. You would bridge the gap between Linux and gaming.

That's kind of what a virtual machine does, only they haven't progressed to the point that you could play a good 3d game yet.

PrimoTurbo
August 29th, 2007, 02:26 PM
That's kind of what a virtual machine does, only they haven't progressed to the point that you could play a good 3d game yet.

Virtual Machine emulates, my concept uses native equipment and drivers. Virtual Machines do very limited 3d and don't support DirectX or OpenGL for the most part.

kerry_s
August 29th, 2007, 02:36 PM
Imagine this, you have a shortcut for a game on your desktop. A game that only works on Windows and a game that's recent.

You click this shortcut, Linux goes into a type of sleep mode, a very light version of Windows 2000/XP is booted into and the specified game is automatically loaded.

The game is running 100% native with a low resource Windows, once you exit it returns back to Linux.

If this can be done in 10-30 seconds, that would quite awesome. You would bridge the gap between Linux and gaming.


you just basically described a duel boot system. what your saying is you want to integrate windows natively into linux, do you really think MS would allow that? not to mention the thought of having a non-free OS as part of your free OS.
doctor jekell & mister hyde come to mind right a bought now.
:lolflag:

Lord Illidan
August 29th, 2007, 02:38 PM
Bah, I'd rather that the game was native, than reinforce the thought that Linux is worthless for gaming - use windows.

PrimoTurbo
August 29th, 2007, 04:18 PM
you just basically described a duel boot system. what your saying is you want to integrate windows natively into linux, do you really think MS would allow that? not to mention the thought of having a non-free OS as part of your free OS.
doctor jekell & mister hyde come to mind right a bought now.
:lolflag:

Dual-boot takes a much longer time, then what I described. It's a far quicker method and it using a light version Windows XP will do wonders.

Who cares if Microsoft allows it. You think Microsoft allows the lite versions of xp, Microsoft doesn't even allow you to use custom themes by hacking your dll files...

reacocard
August 29th, 2007, 04:47 PM
I like the idea, but linux can't just go into sleep mode and let windows take over like that, it just doesn't work (hardwares states, etc get in the way). Really what you want is a minimal windows under a hypervisor that provides full access to the 3d card with 99% native speed. Either that or dual-boot with a minimal windows, but two OSes cannot run fully native side-by-side, one of them has to have its hardware access managed by the other, which is basically all a hypervisor does.

st33med
August 29th, 2007, 06:19 PM
You know, if MS stripped such things and made another Vista edition, it would fit a persons needs.

Like, say, Vista Performance Edition, Vista Power Edition, Vista Gaming Edition.

PrimoTurbo
August 29th, 2007, 06:22 PM
I like the idea, but linux can't just go into sleep mode and let windows take over like that, it just doesn't work (hardwares states, etc get in the way). Really what you want is a minimal windows under a hypervisor that provides full access to the 3d card with 99% native speed. Either that or dual-boot with a minimal windows, but two OSes cannot run fully native side-by-side, one of them has to have its hardware access managed by the other, which is basically all a hypervisor does.

What I mean, is more of a quick session save. Linux doesn't shutdown anything it could save the sessions quickly into a temp file which is restored after.

Of course this is all hypothetical I know little about how it would work, but could be really sweet. Everyone knows that Linux will NEVER be able to play windows native games flawlessly unless they are ported or they are run in windows. Recoding Windows API's is never going to be 100% hence wine is not perfect.

tehkain
August 29th, 2007, 06:31 PM
Wine/C,dual boot, and VM are not solutions for this operating system. They are solutions on a per person basis. Ubuntu does not ship with wine for this reason. We want to make our platform a viable(which it is) choice - if we were to ship with wine and all built in it would just gives them more of a reason to not develop native solutions.

Play warsow and ut3 with me.

Erik Trybom
August 29th, 2007, 06:59 PM
Imagine this, you have a shortcut for a game on your desktop. A game that only works on Windows and a game that's recent.

You click this shortcut, Linux goes into a type of sleep mode, a very light version of Windows 2000/XP is booted into and the specified game is automatically loaded.

The game is running 100% native with a low resource Windows, once you exit it returns back to Linux.

If this can be done in 10-30 seconds, that would quite awesome. You would bridge the gap between Linux and gaming.
I think it's an excellent idea, and (almost) fully possible to do. Loading Windows with a specific game could be a difficult thing (I think), but a "switch OS" button should be possible. When pressed, Ubuntu could hibernate-and-reboot into Windows. Perhaps you could even have another one in Windows that hibernates the Windows session and reboots into Ubuntu.

On a fast machine, the switch shouldn't take more than half a minute. Damn. I want it.

reacocard
August 29th, 2007, 07:41 PM
What I mean, is more of a quick session save. Linux doesn't shutdown anything it could save the sessions quickly into a temp file which is restored after.

Of course this is all hypothetical I know little about how it would work, but could be really sweet. Everyone knows that Linux will NEVER be able to play windows native games flawlessly unless they are ported or they are run in windows. Recoding Windows API's is never going to be 100% hence wine is not perfect.

I know what you meant, but it works out the same. If ANYTHING is going to touch the hardware, linux needs to shut itself down properly. Even hibernating isn't enough, trust me. I've lost data that way. Hence the idea of a hypervisor with 99% performance and 3d access, since it solves the problem nicely. You could have linux enter a sleep state underneath, but the linux kernel has to manage the hardware for windows via the hypervisor.

Depressed Man
August 29th, 2007, 07:59 PM
The way I would see this being implemented in a working fashion (nowadays). Is that Linux can save whatever your running (like suspend or hibernation) but for a shutdown. Kinda like KDE (though it was never reliable with the sessions for me). So next time you boot up Linux everything will be back to what you were doing (Firefox, Thunderbird, Pidgin, etc..)

Now this is a dualboot. So Linux will shutdown, and Windows can be selected to boot up. Of course Windows is stripped down so only gaming works so it boots quickly (I've seen insane boot speeds with alot of stuff stripped out).

Play your game, done. Shutdown Windows (also insanely fast) then when you boot Linux your session is restored.

It's not as fast as the original idea but this is how I imagine it would only work with our current hardware, OS, and laws.

PrimoTurbo
August 29th, 2007, 11:56 PM
The way I would see this being implemented in a working fashion (nowadays). Is that Linux can save whatever your running (like suspend or hibernation) but for a shutdown. Kinda like KDE (though it was never reliable with the sessions for me). So next time you boot up Linux everything will be back to what you were doing (Firefox, Thunderbird, Pidgin, etc..)

Now this is a dualboot. So Linux will shutdown, and Windows can be selected to boot up. Of course Windows is stripped down so only gaming works so it boots quickly (I've seen insane boot speeds with alot of stuff stripped out).

Play your game, done. Shutdown Windows (also insanely fast) then when you boot Linux your session is restored.

It's not as fast as the original idea but this is how I imagine it would only work with our current hardware, OS, and laws.

I agree this would work out pretty well also, very similar to my idea.

You don't even need to say have a shortcut of a windows game on your computer. A quick-switch to Windows would also work fine I think, and reverse.

Depressed Man
August 30th, 2007, 02:09 AM
Another area of slowdown you couldn't control would be the POSTing however. We can try to make Linux faster, we can strip down Windows. But at the end since we're still shutting down and booting up another OS we're going have to keep going through POST.

reacocard
August 30th, 2007, 03:00 AM
Another area of slowdown you couldn't control would be the POSTing however. We can try to make Linux faster, we can strip down Windows. But at the end since we're still shutting down and booting up another OS we're going have to keep going through POST.

which again is avoided by a hypervisor approach. If we could make a hypervisor for this that got even 95% native performance it would be very nice.

Depressed Man
August 30th, 2007, 03:12 AM
Interesting, I didn't know what a hypervisor was so I had to look it up on Wikipedia. Though I guess the problem would be creating one that efficient.

abhiroopb
August 30th, 2007, 03:13 AM
Quick question guys (been posting here about my specific problem: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=537703).

So basically what I have been wanting to do is EXACTLY what the main poster wanted to do. With that intenion I downloaded a stripped down version called GameBoost XP. I don't really mind having to dual boot as I only see myself playing games once in a while.

In any case my problem is that no matter what I did (as you can read in my thread), including reformatting my entire drive to Fat32 and ntfs and leaving it unformatted, I can't get the GameBoost cd to find my HD (it keeps saying windows cannot find a HD and needs to exit). I tried it with my normal XP Pro cd and I had the same problem.

What I think the issue is is that HP comes with ATA hard drives and these aren't recognised. Could someone please provide insight on how I can put the required drivers for the HP laptop (dv5242ea) onto a disk with GameBoost. I don't need anything to work in Windows (especially NOT my internet), but I need it to install!

I have heard of nliteos that allows you to build your own iso, but I don't really know what to do about my hard drive.

reacocard
August 30th, 2007, 03:23 AM
Interesting, I didn't know what a hypervisor was so I had to look it up on Wikipedia. Though I guess the problem would be creating one that efficient.

Exactly, but if we're putting a custom XP on there anyway, we could make drivers for XP desinged to work well in the hypervisor and disable everything not needed. basically, the less the XP kernel tries to do, the better performance it gets since less has to be emulated rather than run natively. The one big problem is the 3d, since you have to support accelerated DirectX somehow.

aktiwers
August 30th, 2007, 04:39 AM
This worked pretty good for me in the past.
http://www.voodoofiles.com/3435

mech7
August 30th, 2007, 07:56 AM
I have read that vista will stop services which aren't needed if you play a game.

abhiroopb
August 30th, 2007, 08:51 AM
Is SP2 or any of the hotfixes or patches that MS wants you to download required to play any games? This is providing I never want to access the internet.

rolnics
August 30th, 2007, 09:55 AM
Is SP2 or any of the hotfixes or patches that MS wants you to download required to play any games?

Wouldn't that depend on how new the game is that you want to play?


But this is an interesting subject, it would be great to be able to run a game and start playing in 30secs that's as fast as my machine loads things now! I'm not like you guys having brand new machines!!

The only thing is though, if and when this happened, by that time we'd all be moaning it took to long to load!!! lol