Ubuntu vs. Fedora MY SAY! LiveCD

[Frak]

I'm going to do what has needed to be done for a long time. Pit the LiveCD installations together.
5 subjects
1. Ease of Install
2. Artwork/Design
3. Hardware Detection/Installation
4. Intuitiveness
5. Support

All of these will be scored on a scale of 1/10.

Hardware was
HP Vectra VL420
512MB of RAM
40 GB Harddrive with XP on first drive.
P4 1.8GHz
nVidia GeForce FX 5500
HP Deskjet D1420

Lets start with
1. Ease of Install

Fedora

I found Fedora incredibly easy to install. It was very fast and didn't take up much resources. I though didn't like the configuration on bootup, personal thing.
But It didn't find XP on the first drive and add it to the boot menu, and I had to migrate files via CD or manual install of NTFS-3G. Not to mention add Windows to the boot menu manually.

Rating: 6/10

Ubuntu

Ubuntu is incredibly easy to install. Simple box with simple questions. But what I like most about it, is the ability to migrate files from your Windows installation. All my music is put in the ~/Music folder, pictures in the ~/Pictures folder, documents in the ~/Documents folder, Wallpaper already applied, uses my user icon for IM, etc. It automatically added XP to the boot menu, and most of its mount methods are controlled via simple checkboxes, fstab in fedora.

Rating: 10/10

2. Artwork/Design

Fedora

I like the artwork in Fedora, its soft to the eye, its got great icons, very simple. The fonts are perfect, not too big yet not too small. Its a nice shade of blue, and has great artwork.

Rating: 8/10

Ubuntu

I don't think I speak for everybody when I say, brown and orange is a good scheme color. Its kinda hard edged, and it over emphasizes on the colors orange and brown.

Rating: 5/10

3. Hardware Detection/Installation

Fedora

Fedora correctly detected all of my hardware, even my printer, and auto-installed it. Yet there was no way to install the NVidia proprietary driver from the YUM repositories without enabling the extras, which was supposedly merged with the base install repo's. There is a package manager called Pirut that is supposed to be the package manager of Fedora, but IMO, wel...
Those arguing that Gnome has been dumbed down too far, well look at Pirut, you will be in arguing heaven. The driver from NVidia's site screws up X, so it shouldn't be used.

Rating: 5/10

Ubuntu

Ubuntu correctly detected all my hardware, even my printer, and auto-installed it. Of course the NVidia driver wasn't installed, yet about 4 or 5 clicks away (System->Administration->Restricted Driver Manager->Enable), and is auto-updated.

Rating: 10/10

4. Intuitiveness

Fedora

Fedora was kinda intuitive for the most part. Graphical RPM installation, graphical package manager. Yet, if you wanted to mount a device, command line. Actually install a package, command line.
I don't care about you purists that say "The best way is by the CLI", but this is over reliant.

Rating: 6/10

Ubuntu

Click here, Click there, all set!
Ubuntu is very intuitive, its easy to find your way around. Trying to listen to a song only requires going through a wizard. Thanks to Automatix (don't argue with me over this) many things are easy to install, with descriptions about the item. Finally, Synaptic is actually more intuitive than Pirut.
Thanks to the devs for attempting all this great stuff :)

Rating: 9/10

5. Support

Fedora

I found their community forum to be very small. Wiki help is almost non-existent due to way outdated pages. And I found most of their community showing much elitism towards Fedora, and bias against Ubuntu calling people morons for using it. Most of all, the admins are so lax, that you could call people morons, say "Google it", and/or just say "RFM" to somebody. Sorry, no support today, Johnny... :(

Rating: 3/10

Ubuntu

Ubuntu has great support through, Canonical, these forums, and they even have a handy question mark (?) on the top bar for ready help. As we all know, these are great, get it, get it done, get it done now forums. Of course we have to hand it to the Admins for keeping these forums in line, as I have seen no other forum enforce the rules as much as here.

Rating: 11/10

Total

Fedora
6/10

Ubuntu
9/10

I am an Ubuntu fan boy, so don't accuse me of it, I admit it.:guitar:
OK, let the comments commence:popcorn:

[tbroderick]

Congratulations. :-s

[Frak]

Thank you, I took 2 hours to make that, but 90 minutes of that was wasted playing Paintball2 and eating a sandwich.

[Tux Aubrey]

I agree with you 100% about Pirut. No info at all, not even size of packages and progress bars.

And everything in Fedora seems, well, hidden. I had really been looking forward to installing it for a good test drive but I just didn't find anything interesting enough on the LiveCD to tempt me to put in the effort. Although hardware detection for me was outstanding and I did like the artwork and font rendering - best looking live desktop by miles (I have a 24 inch WS monitor running 1920x1600 and a lot of LiveCDs, including Ubuntu, bork at that).

I did do an install on VirtualBox but had great trouble getting the Vbox extensions to work - despite using a known workaround for Xorg (mind you, Gutsy was far worse! But it is alpha so was forgiven. For now.).

I'd be interested to know what the attraction of Fedora is for others who do use it. SELinux? I genuinely wanted to be impressed by Fedora 7, but could not find a good enough reason. Still one of the better high-end distros for beginners, IMO.

[DC@DR]

You should post this to Fedora forums too, and let's see what they say about it :p

[Frak]

Sure, I already have an account, 18 questions, all unanswered.

[misfitpierce]

I'd really only use Fedora on my PS3 or something but with ubuntu I see no other reason for another OS as ubuntu has mastered it :)

[Frak]

Sorry for double posting, but
http://forums.fedoraforum.org/showthread.php?p=837457#post837457

[Kingsley]

I admit that Fedora is beautiful and well-setup but it HATES me.

I had problems with FC6 on my desktop in the past but decided I would put that behind me and give Fedora 7 a try on my HP laptop. I got through the whole setup process and tested suspend. It actually works on Fedora but doesn't on Ubuntu. Maybe it was because I didn't install nvidia-glx on Fedora yet.

My real gripe this time was that wireless on my Intel 3945 card couldn't get detected by Fedora. I tried a number of fixes that I found on their forums but nope. Apparently it's because of the 2.6.22 kernel. So back to Ubuntu I went.

[ashvala]

Well Well...
Fedora is RPM & Ubuntu is DPKG...
DPKG is better than RPM

[Frak]

Originally Posted by bob of FedoraForum.org

As to the Admins being lax, I'm feeling a bit less lax today and since you've violated the Guidelines (Read #1....oh, gee, you can't now....) you're history! As is this crap.

I was banned from the forums:lolflag:

[flatwombat]

Gee, yes I do. I'm the Admin at FedoraForum.org ("Bob") who 'banned' you. C'mon now, sunshine, you posted that one knowing it was a bit of a troll and were looking for the ban as well as me closing the thread.... because you decided that we were lax on other such threads. :) So, as my morning chuckle, I hit you with a massive "One Day" ban.

Seriously though, Fedora's not Ubuntu and Ubuntu's not Fedora. They're distros aimed in different directions and at different users. As you might have seen, I enjoy many different distros myself and admire the great work that's gone into each of them. Frankly, it's amazing how far linux has come in just the last 2-3 years. It's poised to take on MS as a serious desktop contender now that Dell and some others are installing it on their machines. That's great! However, we can't pick each other apart. If you love something about a distro, and find another one lacks it, by all means use what pleases you and works with your hardware. If you have a suggestion, then contact the developers and make your ideas known.

As to your particular circumstances at FedoraForum.org, I'm done with the chuckle and have reinstated your original account to active status. You are welcome to return, if you want, and to contribute. However, I do ask you to please adhere to the Guidelines and to also contribute in a positive fashion. There are many things to be learned by using different distros and sometimes the tweaks and differences are what make it fun. If not, well then I wish you nothing but happiness and luck in whatever you do.

Bob.

[KiwiNZ]

Frak Do NOT make this an us and them thing.

Fedora is a respected Distro and the Fedora Forum is an good Forum. We do not want Forum bashing here .

[needtolookatascreenshot]

http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=519877

[Frak]

Frak Do NOT make this an us and them thing.

Fedora is a respected Distro and the Fedora Forum is an good Forum. We do not want Forum bashing here .
Then, KiwiNZ, I hope you will be courteous enough to respect this as my views and as how I percieve using Ubuntu and Fedora. If you feel this is Fedora bashing, then please take it down. I am in no way inclined to cause civil dissagreement between two Linux distro's.
@flatwombat
I posted that on the forums from here, so everybody could see the way I percieve Fedora and Ubuntu. Nobody is forced to read it, and in no way was I trying to put anybody down.

Frak

[needtolookatascreenshot]

http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=519877

[RAV TUX]

Gee, yes I do. I'm the Admin at FedoraForum.org ("Bob") who 'banned' you. C'mon now, sunshine, you posted that one knowing it was a bit of a troll and were looking for the ban as well as me closing the thread.... because you decided that we were lax on other such threads. :) So, as my morning chuckle, I hit you with a massive "One Day" ban.

Seriously though, Fedora's not Ubuntu and Ubuntu's not Fedora. They're distros aimed in different directions and at different users. As you might have seen, I enjoy many different distros myself and admire the great work that's gone into each of them. Frankly, it's amazing how far linux has come in just the last 2-3 years. It's poised to take on MS as a serious desktop contender now that Dell and some others are installing it on their machines. That's great! However, we can't pick each other apart. If you love something about a distro, and find another one lacks it, by all means use what pleases you and works with your hardware. If you have a suggestion, then contact the developers and make your ideas known.

As to your particular circumstances at FedoraForum.org, I'm done with the chuckle and have reinstated your original account to active status. You are welcome to return, if you want, and to contribute. However, I do ask you to please adhere to the Guidelines and to also contribute in a positive fashion. There are many things to be learned by using different distros and sometimes the tweaks and differences are what make it fun. If not, well then I wish you nothing but happiness and luck in whatever you do.

Bob.

Bob,

Welcome to Ubuntuforums.org; I am just a user here, but I want to welcome you. I am impressed with your post I hope to stop by your forums soon.

Thanks for the post, I hope to see you around more. ;)

Jozef

[Frak]

One, just one thread apart from your little fedora bashing started by you on the forum and you got a very nice answer.
Not one further question.

Why do you feel the need to bash fedoraforum?
OK, with the 18 questions thing, I was being Fecicious.

[rfruth]

Ash said it, RPM vs APT, it's APT in my book (tried openSUSE not too long ago, installed okay but after a few days of wrestling with its rpms I reinstalled Ubuntu) maybe if I stuck with it ...

[KiwiNZ]

OK, with the 18 questions thing, I was being Fecicious.

*ahem*

What did I say.

Keep with the review or the box of locks will be taken out of the store room

[Lord Illidan]

For my part..I found Fedora a nice distro. As a matter of fact, I started Linux with FC 1.

However, in comparison with Ubuntu, well, pirut really does suck...that's about the thing I really hate. Synaptic is much, much better, even better than smart.

[Frak]

For my part..I found Fedora a nice distro. As a matter of fact, I started Linux with FC 1.

However, in comparison with Ubuntu, well, pirut really does suck...that's about the thing I really hate. Synaptic is much, much better, even better than smart.
I agree, I've heard alot of people say they liked pirut for its simplicity and disliked Synaptic for its bloat. Yet I found that Synaptic has alot more options and configuration than pirut. Which I find much better to deal with. It doesn't feel like I'm installing things blindly.

[needtolookatascreenshot]

http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=519877

[needtolookatascreenshot]

http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=519877

[flatwombat]

Rav, thanks for your kind words. I've been happily using Ubuntu and several of the variants for a year or more now. I'm a bit ashamed to see that that was my first post in nearly a year, but then I never had questions with Ubuntu and being an Admin or Mod at a few other Forums has kept me a bit busy. Got to admit to being a bit of a distro junky and currently booting 7 on this machine, plus the Live CD ones such as Puppy and DSL.

I'll try to put in more of an appearance since many of my old friends are members here (and some a bit more). And, in return, let me invite all of you to FedoraForum.org and to try the distro. It's FOSS, so you have to do a bit of searching for 'those codecs' (hint: Livna's a good repository!) and the How-To's to get it set up exactly as you prefer, but the Forum has all the hints. Oh yeah, I'll try really hard not to bite your head off before my morning coffee. ;)

[Lord Illidan]

Use yumex or smart then, or, OMG!!!!! synaptic.

So, why aren't they default?

[needtolookatascreenshot]

http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=519877

[Atreus12]

I agree about the artwork, fedora is a clear winner there.

As far as package management Ubuntu is the clear winner

But I disagree with you about fedora forums. I have asked questions there and found the members helpful and knowledgeable. They are probably less tolerant of ignorant noobs though, you need to be careful how you ask you questions.

My final thought: Some people like Fedora, others Ubuntu. The point is that we are all on the same side (GNU / Linux), trying to instigate rivalry isn't going to help anyone.

-Andrew

Edit: I personally like Fedora's commitment to GNU software. I wish Ubuntu would be a little less focused around proprietary addons.

[Lord Illidan]

Why should they?
Obviously the Fedora devs hold the opinion that the current default options are sufficient and I tend to agree with them.

As to why synaptic isn't default (pure speculation on my part):
1. It requires apt, which isn't the default way of installing packages on Fedora.
2. It isn't a good option as a default as it is way to complicated.

Ok, smart, then....

Complicated?? I found that using yum from the command line was way more userfriendly than pirut! At least I could see whether an app was downloading or not..and it was faster!

[Frak]

Can we please just keep this on course, no more questions about instigating rivalry, I just wanted to see what each side had to say. Just one didn't like what I had to say.
But yes, I think Apt is better than YUM, and I think Ubuntu's artwork needs some,... help...
Again, just me, thats my opinion.

[Lord Illidan]

Can we please just keep this on course, no more questions about instigating rivalry, I just wanted to see what each side had to say. Just one didn't like what I had to say.
But yes, I think Apt is better than YUM, and I think Ubuntu's artwork needs some,... help...
Again, just me, thats my opinion.

With regard to artwork, yes FC7 looks great..A few icons do hark back to the old GNOME days, like the Show Desktop button, but otherwise, very nice icons. As to Ubuntu, I also happen to like the Human/Tangerine icons...

Installation..Fedora was more "complicated" than Ubuntu...but I managed it easily...Had to hand-edit Ubuntu grub, but that's no problem for an experienced user.

I am also wondering if there are any repos closer to Malta...it took a huge amount of time to upgrade.

[original_jamingrit]

Can we please just keep this on course, no more questions about instigating rivalry, I just wanted to see what each side had to say. Just one didn't like what I had to say.
But yes, I think Apt is better than YUM, and I think Ubuntu's artwork needs some,... help...
Again, just me, thats my opinion.

As one of the guys on the Fedora forum pointed out, artwork shouldn't be an issue, because everyone will configure their backgrounds and themes to what they want it to look like anyways.

I'd just like to say that comparing linux distros is okay, but a little healthy competition always has a way of going bad. Plus, there are just distros that just can't be compared, like Ubuntu and Slackware. They are different distros because their maintainers have particular set of goals in mind with them, Fedora aims at being non-proprietary, Ubuntu aims to be easy to use, Slackware aims to be the most Unix-like (Keep It Simple, Stupid). People may find your review a little unfair.

[Lord Illidan]

As one of the guys on the Fedora forum pointed out, artwork shouldn't be an issue, because everyone will configure their backgrounds and themes to what they want it to look like anyways.

True..but first impressions mean a lot..This is for Ubuntu's background, mind. It's horrible in my opinion. Fedora's backgrounds are excellent.

[Frak]

True..but first impressions mean a lot..This is for Ubuntu's background, mind. It's horrible in my opinion. Fedora's backgrounds are excellent.
I agree, it has some major detail work, not to mention the effort for it. Nice job IMHO.

[igknighted]

Ok, smart, then....

Complicated?? I found that using yum from the command line was way more userfriendly than pirut! At least I could see whether an app was downloading or not..and it was faster!

SMART is still beta. You really can't include a beta package manager, that's a kinda important piece :). Also, smart is not a YUM front-end. YUM is the primary reason I pick Fedora, I would not want them to drop that. Sure the GUI package tools suck, but they are really young. There is Pirut, Yumex and a couple others IIRC. I think Pirut is the package manager tool of the future, and it will become more feature filled as it matures. Besides, who uses graphical package tools? Yum search <package> and yum install <package> are so much easier and faster.

[JN4OldSchool]

Hi guys. I am a Fedora user who has used Fedora as his primary distro since FC4. I frequent Fedoraforum, am probably considered a regular. I just wanted to extend my hand to you Ubuntu guys. I am impressed by what went on here. I came here following RAV TUX's gracious post in our forum. Bob, or Flatwombat, is a highly respected Administrater in our forum, probably the hardest working and friendliest person we have. He wont admit that but he certainly has my admiration and undying gratitude. I just wanted to thank you folks for not turning this thread into a flamefest. We have had our share the last month or so and I suppose you have also. Linux is great! Most anyone who has used it more than a year will tell you that under the hood it is mostly the same and it really matters not which distro you use or prefer. I have two installs of 7.4 Ubuntu CE and I love it. I used 1 install of Edgy before that. I also run debian etch on my backup server and as a dual boot/back door on my big rig. It is OK to compare distros, I do it. I like Fedora much better than anything else. This is me. Doesnt mean I cant respect other distros for their strong points. But these "distro wars" are stupid. You had someone trying to tell you we are elitist in our forum, putting down Ubuntu, saying it was a kiddie distro...Some do, same as I saw a few of the same type of comments about Fedora in this thread. So what? The people over at Fedoraforum that matter not only support Ubuntu but we also actually recommend it to many people. You have many users over there, as I am sure there are probably a good many Fedora users here. And once again, I am just so impressed by how this was handled that I had to register just to thank you guys. Thank you.

[purdy hate machine]

I was banned from the forums:lolflag:


Nice going! You demonstrate the superiority of the Ubuntu forums by giving everyone else the impression that it is populated by immature little fan boys, a little naive I think. :roll:

[Frak]

Nice going! You demonstrate the superiority of the Ubuntu forums by giving everyone else the impression that it is populated by immature little fan boys, a little naive I think. :roll:
Stay on subject.

[stmiller]

A LOT of serious Linux users use Fedora. Just click on any recent month's threads archive view of Fedora-List:

https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-list/

And you can see much of the discussion has a different focus from ubuntuforums. There are generally not newbie posts of 'how do I hook up my printer?' but rather posts asking about iptables, etc.

I noticed you commented how the fedora forums are lacking users. Well, all fedora users use the above mailing list primarily, and not that forum.

Ubuntu has its strengths, as you have outlined in your initial post. But to say that one is better than the other, or this one wins here, etc. - those are sort of ridiculous statements, as Fedora and Ubuntu are different by nature.

[rstewartmailacct]

Hi all,

I been using both of these distributions since they started, I'm kind of an old fart. Can I say that here? :lolflag:

Anyway, they are both great in their own arena and both lacking in good easy to use wireless support. Fedora comes better suited out of the box to compile and customize and Ubuntu is more plug and play for a quick setup and the older I get I like the quick setup.

I have and old laptop that only has 256 mb of ram and 800mghz pentium III that I couldn't get Ubuntu to install on because of lack of memory so I grabbed the Fedora 7 liveCd and guess what, it went right on. So each has a place. I also couldn't get wireless to work on Ubuntu for wl-107g and f5d7050 adapters while the rt2500pci worked on Fedora out of the box and the serialmonkey belkin driver compiled and worked.

Ubuntu package management is definately better with great selection and I really like the auto search codec feature added in Feisty. :guitar:

I'm ramblin now so I'll just say I hope both versions keep rockin' forward and adding functionality, especially related to wifi. Oh yea, and I personally like the Ubuntu art and Fedora art!

Thanks!

[igknighted]

I really like the auto search codec feature added in Feisty.

Fedora 8 will have a similar feature. I think codec buddy will be very very similar to whatever Ubuntu calls its codec finding app.

[Frak]

I think I will use Fedora 8 when it comes out. I don't hate Fedora, either its not ready for me, or I'm not ready for it yet.

[flatwombat]

Good that you'll give it a further try, but why wait? With drives so cheap and grub so easy to configure, it's easy to boot up a distro and play with it until you break it, then dump and reload. I've learned more in linux from my catastrophic errors than on all the perfect installs and updates.

[racoq]

hi flatwombat

Welcome to our warm and friendly forum community.

I'm going to make a challenge to you, and don't get me wrong :), its a friendly and healthy one,

But since Frak said on his threads some point he didn't like in Fedora, i and many people here could be interested in listening your opinion, as an main Fedora User, where do you think (since you are not an Ubuntu fan boy), ubuntu can improve, what are its flaws in your point, in order to make it even more appealing to the end user, and especially the windows one?

[igknighted]

hi flatwombat

Welcome to our warm and friendly forum community.

I'm going to make a challenge to you, and don't get me wrong :), its a friendly and healthy one,

But since Frak said on his threads some point he didn't like in Fedora, i and many people here could be interested in listening your opinion, as an main Fedora User, where do you think (since you are not an Ubuntu fan boy), ubuntu can improve, what are its flaws in your point, in order to make it even more appealing to the end user, and especially the windows one?

Having spent a good deal of time on both (but primarily a Fedora user these days), I think Ubuntu needs:

1) A major art upgrade. After all, you never get a second chance to make a first impression.

2) Split up between Enterprise (LTS) and personal desktop. Ubuntu wont have the biggest piece of linux software in years (KDE4) until a year after its release because Gutsy +1 is LTS. Keep a standard 6 mo. release cycle and then every couple years also release an Enterprise edition... maybe even based on Debian stable instead of Unstable.

3) Build that windows based installer. That will be godsend for converting Windows users. In the same vein, the settings importer on the installer should get settings from linux installs as well.

4) Profit. Ubuntu needs to start making money, they cannot keep shipping CDs and payings devs without it. I think a Zimbra-Ubuntu enterprise server would be a good start.

Hope that helps.

[flatwombat]

Wow; that's a tall order! I haven't used Windows in years, although my bride of 41 years still is a 'fanboy' and probably just keeps me around to help with the AV updates and defragging.

So, let's give it a try. Windows users have probably never used CLI and should not be exposed to it right off the bat. They like easy menus and icons that are appealing and easy to understand and find. My pick for 'easiest' to adjust to would be SAM Linux. It's an Xfce4 version of PCLinuxOS with a top docker that enlarges the icons as you mouse over them, making selections a snap. SAM also places the most used icons right up there at the start; Web Browser, Email, Chat, Synaptic, Word Processor.

Now, why I say it's 'easiest' is from personal experience. I recently set up a 71 year old woman who had never really experienced computers with a SAM desktop and gave her a half-hour instruction and told her to call me when she had questions or problems. No calls, no problems and she uses it every day. I see her several times a week, and she's always talking about her surfing and chatting, so I know it's working.

Sam, Ubuntu and so many other distros really could do with a "default background" boost. Of course we can all install our own wallpapers easily, but a pretty face (perhaps like Sabayon or Berry) is hard to pass up. It's not just colors, but an attractive boot screen and desktop .jpg will make the distro seem more interesting to someone on a first visit.

So, really it's all about graphics and ease of menus to draw in Windows users. Sled10 is a good menu, for instance, that's easy for anyone to understand. Once a new user actually works with linux, they soon find the advantages of having everything they need in one repository instead of using Google to search for the packages and then to see if new updates exist. Nothing in Windows can match beryl/compiz, etc., if that's your thing. Heck, just boot Elive's Live CD and watch the faces! If it's gaming...well, dual boot!

As to the 'flaws', that's not for me to say; so much is personal opinion. There are good reasons to use 'su' and good reasons to use 'sudo'; same with .rpm and .deb . With so much great things happening in Ubuntu during the last couple of years and so much more on the horizon, there is great talent in the team that can provide much more input than me. I'll leave it to them.

[Frak]

4) Profit. Ubuntu needs to start making money, they cannot keep shipping CDs and payings devs without it. I think a Zimbra-Ubuntu enterprise server would be a good start.

I 100% agree. Profit would increase development, making it easier to use. Which would help everybody in the long run.

[Minki]

True..but first impressions mean a lot..This is for Ubuntu's background, mind. It's horrible in my opinion. Fedora's backgrounds are excellent.

I agree, it has some major detail work, not to mention the effort for it. Nice job IMHO.

Yeh, I agree as well. I've got Ubuntu on my desktop at home and while it's a good OS, I confess I'm a little disappointed at it having used Fedora beforehand. Fedora is very easy to use and is very visually pleasing. I like both OS's but if I had to chose between one or the other, I'd definitely chose Fedora (though, I am pleased with Ubuntu putting aside the difficulties I had when I first installed it).

[gnomeuser]

I think the second post in reply to this on the Fedora Forums had some interesting to the point comments about why this is a flawed comparision.

That being said I am a Fedora user (and partly a developer), we have a different focus than Ubuntu. I personally like both platforms but Ubuntu is insanely hard to use on my mdraid+lvm setup and I don't feel like wiping 500gb of data for an OS.

I think the fact that both installed and fared well in tests speaks highly of Linux as a whole, I remember 9 years ago when I started with Linux things where much different. The problems keeping us from the desktop were not "pretty button to violate US law or not", it was "doing this might cause hardware malfunction" and "it boots" was a considerable success story.

I have a feeling that while Linux on the desktop might be at least half a decade away, we are now a considerable strength to be reconned with. We have all the modern technology supported and much of it is prototyped using Linux. Today Linux is on embedded devices, cellphones, servers, appliances and millions of desktops.

World domination will happen in good time, on our terms because our model is better.

[sailor]

I know this is a bit late but...WAY TO GO, Bob!!! :p