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View Full Version : Charging for a linux distro!!! I DONT THINK SO. . .



~~Tito~~
July 18th, 2007, 02:04 PM
http://www.linspire.com/

Those con artists!!! Correct me please.

FuturePilot
July 18th, 2007, 02:18 PM
LinSpire has been around for a while. It's perfectly legal under the GPL to sell Linux. The free version of it though is FreeSpire.

slimdog360
July 18th, 2007, 02:20 PM
jumped the gun a litlle there ay.

John.Michael.Kane
July 18th, 2007, 02:20 PM
They are not con artists, As it's perfectly legal for them or any other person to sell a distro according to the GPL, However. What you have to keep in mind is that most are not selling just the disto per se they are selling you support access.

Kymac
July 18th, 2007, 02:20 PM
Am I the only person who believe a few companies charging for their linux distros is a good thing?

M$LOL
July 18th, 2007, 02:52 PM
No. I think it's a good thing too, as long as I don't have to use them. xD

ThinkBuntu
July 18th, 2007, 02:59 PM
Starve, open source developers!

Sheesh.

tgalati4
July 18th, 2007, 03:11 PM
I have Linspire 5 that I got at a trade show. It's actually a pretty decent OS. It's got a nice book to help Window's users find stuff. Freespire 1.0 (Linspire 6.0) is also decent and the developers have decided to use Ubuntu as it's base distro. Freespire 2.0 is out now as well for testing. Give it a spin. Try before you buy.

Some people aren't convinced that Linux is real unless it comes in a shrink-wrapped box and it costs $70. If they charged less, then that would give the impression that it's crapware. If they charged more, then that would create resistance to installing on old hardware. So, I would say it is priced fairly.

A more useful thread would be if the original poster had bought Linspire and gave it a fair comparison to Ubuntu.

jrusso2
July 18th, 2007, 03:23 PM
Back in the day before we had broadband a lot of Linux users would buy the boxed Linux versions, or get the cheap bytes cd's cause it would take days to download.

I think its fine for Linspire to charge no one forces you to buy it there are plenty of free linux around that is as good or better.

That is my main complaint if your charging for a disto to me it better be significantly better then the free one and I don't think Linspire is.

However the new Linspire thats based on Ubuntu we will have to see.

mike102282
July 18th, 2007, 03:28 PM
Am I the only person who believe a few companies charging for their linux distros is a good thing?


Nope I am with you.

ThinkBuntu
July 18th, 2007, 03:32 PM
Also, if my local computer store had a wide variety of up-to-date, professionally-packaged distros on a shelf, I would surely shell out $50 for one that I felt good about. If the store had a rack of CD cases with a nice-looking insert and a custom CD label, I'd certainly pay $10-30 for one too.

There's something nice about browsing in person, and I would never order, for example, openSuSE sight unseen.

adamklempner
July 18th, 2007, 03:33 PM
http://www.linspire.com/

Those con artists!!! Correct me please.

Redhat, Suse, and Xandros charge too (among others). I think it is a good thing. Without an influx of money from some source Linux would not be anywhere near where it is today. Ubuntu has Mark Shuttleworth whose fortune has been funding the Ubuntu project. Linspire has Micheal Robertson whose fortune funded Linspire. Both Shuttleworth and Robertson are business guys who intend to make money from these projects in the end. They just have different strategies...

w4ett
July 18th, 2007, 03:38 PM
Don't forget Mandrake. They charge you to be part of the 'community'. Lot's of folks do pay for support. That's one of the reasons to use Ubuntu!

amadeus266
July 18th, 2007, 04:14 PM
They charge for their versions because they are considered Commercial Distro's and they include some proprietary software and drivers with their distribution. Distro's like Ubuntu don't include any of that stuff so they can give it away for free (although some things are available in the repo's). That's my understanding at least.

mike102282
July 18th, 2007, 04:19 PM
They charge for their versions because they are considered Commercial Distro's and they include some proprietary software and drivers with their distribution. Distro's like Ubuntu don't include any of that stuff so they can give it away for free (although some things are available in the repo's). That's my understanding at least.

That is exactly right when you pay for Linspire you are paying for the codecs and support.

ScottMac
July 18th, 2007, 04:26 PM
I dont know anything really about how the GPL works... apparently it is legal to charge for a distribution even though it is based on a free distro (eg linspire and ubuntu). isnt that a bit strange? hypothetically could i take any piece of software under the GPL, modify it as much or as little as i like and then sell it??

ThinkBuntu
July 18th, 2007, 04:31 PM
I dont know anything really about how the GPL works... apparently it is legal to charge for a distribution even though it is based on a free distro (eg linspire and ubuntu). isnt that a bit strange? hypothetically could i take any piece of software under the GPL, modify it as much or as little as i like and then sell it??
Yes, as long as you make the source code available.

GeneralZod
July 18th, 2007, 04:34 PM
I dont know anything really about how the GPL works... apparently it is legal to charge for a distribution even though it is based on a free distro (eg linspire and ubuntu). isnt that a bit strange? hypothetically could i take any piece of software under the GPL, modify it as much or as little as i like and then sell it??

Yes:

http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/selling.html

AlexenderReez
July 18th, 2007, 04:49 PM
http://www.linspire.com/

Those con artists!!! Correct me please.

linux is free as free speech not free as free beer ....

Hex_Mandos
July 18th, 2007, 05:20 PM
I dont know anything really about how the GPL works... apparently it is legal to charge for a distribution even though it is based on a free distro (eg linspire and ubuntu). isnt that a bit strange? hypothetically could i take any piece of software under the GPL, modify it as much or as little as i like and then sell it??

For software to be truly free, you need to have the freedom to sell it, don't you think? Anyway, try reading the GPL's preamble. It's a nice read, and it explains a lot of the philosophy of the free software movement.

tcoffeep
July 18th, 2007, 05:22 PM
Hasn't this been a debate thats been going on forever?

ScottMac
July 18th, 2007, 05:55 PM
ive not been using free software for very long but recently i have become very passionate about freedom in general. Being used to how proprietary software works makes the idea of free sofware a bit tough to figure out.

A bit off topic but since this is the ubuntu forum ill also tell you that its Nelson Mandela's 89th birthday today!!

scott

igknighted
July 18th, 2007, 06:01 PM
I dont know anything really about how the GPL works... apparently it is legal to charge for a distribution even though it is based on a free distro (eg linspire and ubuntu). isnt that a bit strange? hypothetically could i take any piece of software under the GPL, modify it as much or as little as i like and then sell it??

Actually, I don't think you even need to change it at all. You could order 100 Ubuntu CDs via shippit and sell them on ebay if you like. Linspire actually used to sell OO.o and Firefox boxed sets for a very minimal price (just covering costs of production, with any profits going to the dev teams I believe) in stores like Best Buy and CompUSA. I think they even came with a little users manual as well. They have since stopped due to people being very upset, but honestly, is that such a bad thing? Lots of people would buy a boxed set before they would download something free, so it just means more exposure. Plus, as the GPL says, there is nothing wrong with making money on free software.

ThinkBuntu
July 18th, 2007, 06:01 PM
Hasn't this been a debate thats been going on forever?
And it's still interesting.

igknighted
July 18th, 2007, 06:03 PM
ive not been using free software for very long but recently i have become very passionate about freedom in general. Being used to how proprietary software works makes the idea of free sofware a bit tough to figure out.

A bit off topic but since this is the ubuntu forum ill also tell you that its Nelson Mandela's 89th birthday today!!

scott

The problem is that in English the words for free as in rights and free as in costs nothing are spelled the same, even though they have different meanings. In other languages I think this distinction is more clear. Gotta love English...

ThinkBuntu
July 18th, 2007, 06:11 PM
The problem is that in English the words for free as in rights and free as in costs nothing are spelled the same, even though they have different meanings. In other languages I think this distinction is more clear. Gotta love English...
Like how open has a few meanings, while in Spanish "abierto" means open spatially and "libre" means open, as in a football player being "open." It's all about context, and I think that all languages have an emphasis on context to differentiate meanings. But Free Software is so new that the context is still unknown by the vast majority non-geeks, and the two contexts are used equally with this subject. I call it a linguistic fringe case :^)

igknighted
July 18th, 2007, 06:33 PM
Like how open has a few meanings, while in Spanish "abierto" means open spatially and "libre" means open, as in a football player being "open." It's all about context, and I think that all languages have an emphasis on context to differentiate meanings. But Free Software is so new that the context is still unknown by the vast majority non-geeks, and the two contexts are used equally with this subject. I call it a linguistic fringe case :^)

Well, I think the concept of "free as in speech" should have had its own word in English, we like to talk about it enough. I guess the "free as in beer" concept is the one we should struggle with, America is a country where everything has a pricetag (which is the main determinant of value often).

aysiu
July 18th, 2007, 06:35 PM
For more info on this issue, read:
Is it legal/okay to sell Ubuntu/Linux CDs you got for free? (http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=158892)

ThinkBuntu
July 18th, 2007, 06:39 PM
For more info on this issue, read:
Is it legal/okay to sell Ubuntu/Linux CDs you got for free? (http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=158892)
You're like the MS Word Paperclip that swoops in with resources. Except yours are always relevant.

smartboyathome
July 18th, 2007, 06:43 PM
I think it is ok for some distros to sell their products. It is one of the ways they fund the project. without it, the projects could go down in flames.

Hex_Mandos
July 18th, 2007, 07:24 PM
Selling Ubuntu is of questionable legality. First, the Ubuntu trademark policy states that you can't use the Ubuntu trademark commercially without an agreement from Canonical. So you can sell Ubuntu but only if you take out all names and logos. Second, the ShipIt CDs are freely distributed for non commercial use only: otherwise, you'd be forced to pay an import tax on them (at least for those of us who don't live in the EU).

So, selling ShipIt CDs is probably very illegal (as it's a trademark infringement, a violation of your agreement with Canonical not to sell the CDs, and most likely also a form of smuggling depending on your country's laws), and selling Ubuntu CDs burned at home without authorization is arguably also trademark infringement. However, it's not impossible to get permission from Canonical to sell Ubuntu, if there's a good reason for it. For instance, I got permission from Canonical to create a short run of remastered LiveCDs with PDF tutorials and sell them to recover the costs, for instance. I'll probably end up losing some money, but it'll be fun.

EDIT: BTW, IANAL, but I'm working towards a law degree.

stepan2
July 18th, 2007, 07:39 PM
i dont agree with linspire because they **** me off but i do agree with commercial distros.

DM was on fire!
July 18th, 2007, 07:39 PM
I ran Linspire. All you have to pay for is the CNR (Click-n-Run), and if you don't want to pay for it, you run Freespire.
Compared to Ubuntu, it's a crap operating system. XD It might've gotten better with Five-O (my computer wouldn't agree with it, so I had to use 4.5), but I don't know.

There are lots of distros that you have to pay for. It's not just them.


Linspire actually used to sell OO.o and Firefox boxed sets for a very minimal price (just covering costs of production, with any profits going to the dev teams I believe) in stores like Best Buy and CompUSA.

I saw them at our local CompUSA.

ScottMac
July 18th, 2007, 07:42 PM
Is there a way then to make money off free software? ive read a few articles about making money off the support side of things, which i suppose makes sense. i think this is canonical's long term strategy?

How would one make a living off FOSS? i wouldn't mind knowing how many people are employed programming FOSS cause surely it cant all only be from guys coding in their spare time?

eentonig
July 18th, 2007, 08:04 PM
You're like the MS Word Paperclip that swoops in with resources. Except yours are always relevant.

Now that's an awfull comparison.

But it's true. He always jumps in a thread with a good reference.

stepan2
July 18th, 2007, 08:05 PM
there is since red hat and suse are raking in a lot of money. i think you can get money of support. I am not sure since it is a very hard business model

igknighted
July 18th, 2007, 08:41 PM
Is there a way then to make money off free software? ive read a few articles about making money off the support side of things, which i suppose makes sense. i think this is canonical's long term strategy?

How would one make a living off FOSS? i wouldn't mind knowing how many people are employed programming FOSS cause surely it cant all only be from guys coding in their spare time?

Lots of companies (google, IBM, Novell and many many more) allow developers time to work on OSS programs while on company time. I think the theory is the company will benefit from having these free apps to use, plus they are in the good graces of the community and it keeps their developers happy. I think it was Novell that gave the Suse team a month off to work on their own projects (paid time that is). It certainly helps them because then there are better apps to put into their distribution.

Overall, it certainly makes sense. After all, business is where the money is. Large companies will almost always buy support, so why not cut to the chase and sell them what they need?

Then there are small companies (like the one I work for) that cannot afford support after they buy software usually. We end up with outdated software that we cannot run properly because we didn't buy updates or support. By using open source software we could actually keep our servers up to date and supported (I am working on that... ).

So there are markets. I recently read that up to 27% of MS Exchange users are considering switching to OSS alternatives (Zimbra, Scalix, OpenExchange, etc.) due to unhappiness with MS Exchange. Novell's OSS division posted the strongest numbers for the company last year. Hopefully Canonical can get into the enterprise game, time will tell. I think the very best way would be for Ubuntu to get together with Zimbra (the best supported exchange-type server on Ubuntu) and offer a complete package to business. Get it all in one place (software, support, etc.) and then they would have something to offer that others don't.

~~Tito~~
July 18th, 2007, 08:49 PM
That is so true.

A side note: My uncle's gf works at a dry cleaners ad the computers went down for some reason and the computer guy had to upgrade to the xp version and it was better(they where with ms exchange).

Quillz
July 18th, 2007, 08:55 PM
http://www.linspire.com/

Those con artists!!! Correct me please.
Read up on the GPL, please. You know, no one is forcing you to buy Linspire.

~~Tito~~
July 18th, 2007, 09:01 PM
I know, but I thought Linux was supposed to be free software wise. They should have said you can buy support after you install linspire or you can chose a computer with out support which most people would buy it then (I wouldn't because I don't have a credit card because I'm 14. . .), but really Linspire or freesprie really aren't that great.

ThinkBuntu
July 18th, 2007, 09:03 PM
I know, but I thought Linux was supposed to be free software wise. They should have said you can buy support after you install linspire or you can chose a computer with out support which most people would buy it then (I wouldn't because I don't have a credit card because I'm 14. . .), but really Linspire or freesprie really aren't that great.
If they release the source, you could certainly build the system on your own. I don't see any reason you couldn't build Linspire's source code into a free Linspire and re-brand it, like Whitebox and CentOS do with Redhat Linux. That is, unless there are parts of their source that you can't see, but I don't know how that's affected by the GPL.

Peyton
July 18th, 2007, 09:38 PM
Someone brought up the selling of OpenOffice.org, etc., in stores at a small price. Honestly, I don't think that's such a bad idea at all. When most people want to obtain software, they don't just open up Adept.

~~Tito~~
July 18th, 2007, 11:26 PM
Yea, but thats the problem. They need to know that it is free and you can get it in Add/Remove. I don't want to kid my self and start a war.

lisati
July 18th, 2007, 11:35 PM
Back in the day before we had broadband a lot of Linux users would buy the boxed Linux versions, or get the cheap bytes cd's cause it would take days to download.


Ditto on the disadvantages of not having broadband. Depending on the plan you're on, some ISPs give you a monthly gigabyte allowance, and once you go past it they slow down your connection speed to "dial-up" speed.

One of my local stores advertises on its website a couple of different flavours of Ubuntu and Fedora. What we're paying for is the convenience of not having to wait for a download or for delivery of a "free" CD.

~~Tito~~
July 18th, 2007, 11:58 PM
That sounds reasonable not having to wait 10 weeks. I ordered mine that way. I waited until it came in the mail. Man I wish I had a blank cd then. How much is it?

Hex_Mandos
July 19th, 2007, 12:08 AM
Someone brought up the selling of OpenOffice.org, etc., in stores at a small price. Honestly, I don't think that's such a bad idea at all. When most people want to obtain software, they don't just open up Adept.

Most people who have Adept, Synaptic or any package manager installed do open them up whenever they want new software...

Extreme Coder
July 19th, 2007, 12:41 AM
Anyone has the freedom to sell open source software.
But IMO, Linspire has nothing to make it a s hot seller ;)

stepan2
July 19th, 2007, 01:28 AM
agree with you all the way extreme coder. their company gives me a bad vibe ever sicne i saw what they did. Damn those hypocrytes.

Peyton
July 19th, 2007, 01:35 AM
Most people who have Adept, Synaptic or any package manager installed do open them up whenever they want new software...

Right, but I'm talking about the people who don't even know what package management is.

~~Tito~~
July 19th, 2007, 01:39 AM
Yea, but they NEED TO LEARN, HAHAHAHAHAHA MUUHHUUUHAHAHAHAHA!!!
Lol they seriously do if they are dumb enough to buy something that is supposed to be free. . .
Not saying the 2 guys who did buy it just saying the type of person who is ignorant to learn computers and just buy everything.

Wiebelhaus
July 19th, 2007, 01:50 AM
Linspire is great , their charging for it is justified , Hell I'd pay for Ubuntu , that's how much I truly love this OS , But thankfully Ubuntu is supported by the UN so we don't have to pay for this top notch & improving rapidly product , GNU/Linux Is not just about "Free" but about "Freedom".

Hex_Mandos
July 19th, 2007, 03:02 AM
Right, but I'm talking about the people who don't even know what package management is.

People who don't know what package management is don't use Linux, so they can't even consider using a package manager. They'd probably download their software from the project's website (like millions of people do with Firefox.

Peyton
July 19th, 2007, 03:10 AM
No, no, I'm talking about exposure. Putting a product in an actual store gives it a lot of exposure.

stepan2
July 19th, 2007, 03:12 AM
Linspire is great , their charging for it is justified , Hell I'd pay for Ubuntu , that's how much I truly love this OS , But thankfully Ubuntu is supported by the UN so we don't have to pay for this top notch & improving rapidly product , GNU/Linux Is not just about "Free" but about "Freedom".

Why is linspire great? What does it have that linux mint doesn't except hypocrite employees and people that bend the truth(Linspire vs. Ubuntu page , pend of truth example.) I will buy any other OS then linspire.

andrewpmk
July 19th, 2007, 03:29 AM
It's perfectly legal and allowed by the GPL, but I refuse to pay for a Linux distribution when I can download a better one (Ubuntu) for $0.00.

stepan2
July 19th, 2007, 04:06 AM
you can not say better as certain dsitributions fit certain users. For example , ubuntu is not the number one choice for hard-core linux users

adamklempner
July 19th, 2007, 04:19 AM
Yea, but they NEED TO LEARN, HAHAHAHAHAHA MUUHHUUUHAHAHAHAHA!!!
Lol they seriously do if they are dumb enough to buy something that is supposed to be free. . .
Not saying the 2 guys who did buy it just saying the type of person who is ignorant to learn computers and just buy everything.

I paid Linspire (then Lindows) $100 to fight a Microsoft lawsuit in Sweden 3 or 4 years ago. They lost... For that $100, I got Linspire, CNR, and support... all new versions, for life. Not a bad deal if you ask me. And when you buy Linspire, you also get real support. I'm not sure how it is now, but in the past I called them up when I was having hardware compatibility problems. They helped me compile and install something over the phone, and in 10 minutes time everything worked. I think that was the second day I ever used Linux. It was a real slick operation they had going, and the OS easily replaced XP for me.

And for a little bit of perspective, this was before the Ubuntu project was even started publicly...

Now that these gratis distro's like Ubuntu have reached the ease of use of Linspire, the value of Linspire as an OS is somewhat diminished. Linspire, Inc. knows this, hence all of the development in their CNR process, MS compatibility, patent coverage, etc... But for some people, particularly those less computer savvy than most people here and OEM computer manufacturers, Linspire and its support package still is worth the price tag...

MetalOverlord
July 19th, 2007, 04:23 AM
Starve, open source developers!

Sheesh.

Amen. Free software is nice. But my God, people have to make a living too. I don't have a problem with paying a reasonable price for linux. I actually think it would be a good thing. Don't get me wrong. The work volunteers have done with linux is incredible. But I think it would be great if those that wish to could do it full time and make a living at it.

adamklempner
July 19th, 2007, 04:52 AM
Why is linspire great? What does it have that linux mint doesn't except hypocrite employees and people that bend the truth(Linspire vs. Ubuntu page , pend of truth example.) I will buy any other OS then linspire.

Not gonna say all of Linspire was great, but their file sharing thingy certainly was. It was a real simple gui application that made Linux-to-Linux or Linux-to-windows file sharing super easy. Kubuntu's "remote places" tool isn't nearly as nice: my two Kubuntu computer can't even see each other by default (even after enabling NFS). PCLOS and OpenSuse also sucked at this when I tried them. Linspire had me sharing files and printers between 2 Linspire computers and one XP one with just a few clicks on each. No configuring of NFS or Samba, no editing of .conf files, and I don't even think I need to read any help files to get this working either.

That is the one thing I miss most about Linspire. For the most part, the rest of the experience is better for me now in Kubuntu.

EdThaSlayer
July 19th, 2007, 05:20 AM
At least they can make a business out of opensource. I don't know about you guys, but capitalism isn't that bad.Especially if it supports our socialists ideals.

deanlinkous
July 19th, 2007, 05:49 AM
Not gonna say all of Linspire was great, but their file sharing thingy certainly was. It was a real simple gui application that made Linux-to-Linux or Linux-to-windows file sharing super easy. Kubuntu's "remote places" tool isn't nearly as nice: my two Kubuntu computer can't even see each other by default (even after enabling NFS). PCLOS and OpenSuse also sucked at this when I tried them. Linspire had me sharing files and printers between 2 Linspire computers and one XP one with just a few clicks on each. No configuring of NFS or Samba, no editing of .conf files, and I don't even think I need to read any help files to get this working either.

That is the one thing I miss most about Linspire. For the most part, the rest of the experience is better for me now in Kubuntu.
right click a folder and choose share????
apt-get install pyneighborhood???

deanlinkous
July 19th, 2007, 05:57 AM
They charge for Linspire and you are only allowed to install it on one computer. How funny is that?

You also are required to provide info to microsoft if they require it!

Software that is distributed via CNR is not covered under the patent/no-sue agreement. So they have your name and information and you aren't protected....hmmm.....does that bother anyone else??

I have tried Linspire in the past for grins and giggles but I will not even be trying them anymore. Scary IMWO!

siimo
July 19th, 2007, 08:01 AM
Amen brother! I use linux cause it is free. If windows vista was free i'd use it. :guitar:

beefcurry
July 19th, 2007, 09:20 AM
Cut them some slack, they were already done over pretty badly for partnering with M$ :)

http://boycottnovell.com/2007/07/17/linspire-betrayed-by-ms/

lisati
July 19th, 2007, 09:25 AM
That sounds reasonable not having to wait 10 weeks. I ordered mine that way. I waited until it came in the mail. Man I wish I had a blank cd then. How much is it?

http://www.dse.co.nz/cgi-bin/dse.storefront/469f1f9100f4717e273fc0a87f33070c/Product/View/XC4146
(This is a New Zealand site...there's also a www.dse.com.au)

misfitpierce
July 19th, 2007, 09:28 AM
One thing you got to realize is most of these companies are not selling the distro itself. They are selling the support that comes with it like phone line support etc.

~~Tito~~
July 19th, 2007, 10:48 AM
Like I said they should make the os free but the support not like 3 dollars a call or something and make the support number a hint when you click help or report this problem to the support section. Thats how they can make money off support for those who aren't educated about forums.

prizrak
July 19th, 2007, 01:45 PM
Like I said they should make the os free but the support not like 3 dollars a call or something and make the support number a hint when you click help or report this problem to the support section. Thats how they can make money off support for those who aren't educated about forums.

You might also be interested to know that Linspire actually includes non-free codecs by default, part of the price is for the codecs. What is wrong with paying developers for their work? They do do quite a bit of work on the distro and I think it's reasonable to pay them for it. I bought my first ever Linux distro, and I was prepared to pay for SLED (before MS deal) but was unable to download the trial version to make sure it would work with my hardware.

The point of free software is freedom not price. Remember the more companies can make money of open source the more of them will start contributing.

clay_in_nj
July 19th, 2007, 02:10 PM
Bigger players than Linspire "selling" Linux:

http://shop.novell.com/store/novell/DisplayCategoryProductListPage/categoryID.9621900

tcoffeep
July 19th, 2007, 02:15 PM
Has anybody complaining about the fact that one has to pay for certain distros actually read the General Public License? Click here for more info (http://www.gnu.org/copyleft/gpl.html)

awakatanka
July 19th, 2007, 03:31 PM
They charge for Linspire and you are only allowed to install it on one computer. How funny is that?

You also are required to provide info to microsoft if they require it!

Software that is distributed via CNR is not covered under the patent/no-sue agreement. So they have your name and information and you aren't protected....hmmm.....does that bother anyone else??

I have tried Linspire in the past for grins and giggles but I will not even be trying them anymore. Scary IMWO!
Can you also proof this kind of things with links from there site. Because you not realy a person to believe if its about linspire because of yure posting history about linspire. If you want to spread fud proof it with links from there site with that kind of info then i believe you.

aysiu
July 19th, 2007, 04:13 PM
From [url=http://www.linspire.com/lindows_products_OSEULA.php]the Linspire EULA[url]:
THIS END USER LICENSE AGREEMENT ("AGREEMENT") IS ENTERED INTO BY AND BETWEEN LINSPIRE, INC., A DELAWARE CORPORATION ("LICENSOR") AND YOU -- AN INDIVIDUAL END-USER (ā€œYOUā€¯) -- AGREEING TO A LICENSE FOR PERSONAL USE ON ONE COMPUTER.

Frak
July 19th, 2007, 04:19 PM
Perfectly legal to sell a Linux distro, such as Xandros. Open Source is free to sell. Look at Comparesoft (http://www.comparesoft.com).

init1
July 19th, 2007, 04:23 PM
http://www.linspire.com/

Those con artists!!! Correct me please.
GNU's Philosophy (http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/selling.html)

init1
July 19th, 2007, 04:26 PM
They charge for their versions because they are considered Commercial Distro's and they include some proprietary software and drivers with their distribution. Distro's like Ubuntu don't include any of that stuff so they can give it away for free (although some things are available in the repo's). That's my understanding at least.
You can get the linspire source for free, but you have to pay for the compiled version.

awakatanka
July 19th, 2007, 04:39 PM
From [url=http://www.linspire.com/lindows_products_OSEULA.php]the Linspire EULA[url]:

Thxs Aysiu,
but my understanding of this part is that its only there for the closed source part where the license from that prg/driver/codec say's you may only use it on 1 pc . The GNU part you can have more copies on pc's.

Hex_Mandos
July 19th, 2007, 04:55 PM
Yes, but you have to copy the free packages while leaving out the proprietary bits. Not worth the effort, IMO, I'd rather install Ubuntu.

dasunst3r
July 19th, 2007, 05:04 PM
It is perfectly legal that companies charge for their distribution of Linux. As a matter of fact, they are not quite selling the software, but rather a peace-of-mind that there will be someone to call when you have a problem. You are free to not use their distribution and use this one; and you are more than welcome to donate some $$$ to the open-source projects that have really helped you. :)

deanlinkous
July 19th, 2007, 07:35 PM
By necessity, the covenant is conditioned upon the Customer providing Microsoft, upon its request, with sufficient information to verify which copies of Client Offerings are Covered Products subject to the covenant.


“Client Offerings” means any software products of Linspire that include the Linux operating system, including Linspire Five-0 and successor offerings. However, Client Offerings do not include (i) any portions of products that comprise or include Foundry Products, Clone Products, GPLv3 Software or Other Excluded Products, (ii) Freespire and any other software offerings that include the Linux operating system for which Linspire receives no Revenue, (iii) any products running on a server, or (iv) any Linspire CNR applications distributed separately from the Linux operating system.

Quotes from....
http://www.microsoft.com/interop/collab/linspire/customer_covenant.mspx

thegnome87
July 21st, 2007, 12:06 PM
Like I said they should make the os free but the support not like 3 dollars a call or something and make the support number a hint when you click help or report this problem to the support section. Thats how they can make money off support for those who aren't educated about forums.

Why should they make the OS free? Whether or not I like Linspire, they have the right to decide what their business model provided it's legal. Like other people said, you're paying for the licensing of codecs and some ease of use they added in, not the kernel.

As for support, I had a legal copy of Linspire on my computer, and while the support wasn't 5 star or anything (what tech support ever is lol), I wasn't charged for a single incident of e-mail support from their employees.

As for being educated, I'm glad you're using Linux at such a young age, but you still have alot to learn about Linux and Linux business models kid. ;)

~~Tito~~
July 21st, 2007, 12:16 PM
Oh, ):P. I think you misunderstood me. I was trying to say to give the os free with no support then sell the support for like 5 bucks and it would be free for ever as long as you verify you account, say like account name and password and some other security stuff I cant think of in the front of my head (get it:p). I know, I know I don't know all about business and stuff ,but I base a lot of my answers on common since and some tid bits of info I know. Also I know a lot more than you'd expect :), but I found this site because I wanted to know more:---).

tcoffeep
July 21st, 2007, 05:48 PM
If you read in earlier posts, it's mentioned that some of the ones you pay for come with licensed material (or something). I'm guessing that would be Flash and Java, and whatnot. I understand what you mean, though.
But in the GPL, it's stated you can sell your product. Remeber, free as in freedom, not free as in beer. :)

XDevHald
July 21st, 2007, 06:19 PM
Linspire is good, but not good enough for a charge IMO.

~~Tito~~
July 21st, 2007, 09:05 PM
Exactly thats why I started this thread, but if its legal I'm fine with it but I'm not going to get it.
Any more thoughts to squeeze in before this goes into the bowels of the forums?

ice60
July 21st, 2007, 10:22 PM
GNU encourages people to sell free software for as much as you possibly can -

Actually we encourage people who redistribute free software to charge as much as they wish or can.
http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/selling.html

i burned a whole load of knoppix isos once on to blank cds and planned to sell them for £100 or so at a car boot sale i had to go to once, but i didn't get around to it in the end :( it's a good thing though lol

~~Tito~~
July 21st, 2007, 10:53 PM
100 euros like 75 dollars?

w4ett
July 21st, 2007, 10:56 PM
100 pounds as in $210 dollars as in 220 Euros at current exchange rate

bvanaerde
July 21st, 2007, 10:58 PM
He was talking about pounds:

Live rates at 2007.07.21 21:56:33 UTC
£100 = €148.661 = $205.620

edit: w4ett was a little bit faster :p

ice60
July 21st, 2007, 11:05 PM
i can't believe GNU encourages people to do that :confused: i don't really agree with it and i admit i did spend a lot of time thinking how i'd get away if someone noticed you can get it for free off the internet lol

~~Tito~~
July 21st, 2007, 11:06 PM
WOW I WANT TO DO THAT AND MAKE GOOD MONEY, lol. :)

~~Tito~~
July 21st, 2007, 11:17 PM
i can't believe GNU encourages people to do that :confused: i don't really agree with it and i admit i did spend a lot of time thinking how i'd get away if someone noticed you can get it for free off the internet lol

Later this month I'm going to do a test to see if people can do research and find out I'm selling it for 150 dollars and if anyone finds out it can be free then ill give them a refund and if not the other people where just lazy.

ice60
July 21st, 2007, 11:19 PM
WOW I WANT TO DO THAT AND MAKE GOOD MONEY, lol. :)

just make sure you don't burn the cds then change your mind ;) i've still got loads of knoppix cds here. you can buy them from me at a reduced rate if you like - £50 :lolflag:

zarathustra
July 22nd, 2007, 12:19 AM
Ironically it seems all the distros most worth paying for are free. If the price were reasonable I'd pay money for Ubuntu.

Extreme Coder
July 22nd, 2007, 12:20 AM
IMO, if you're against the idea that FOSS software should be sold, then you don't get the idea of FOSS.
Linux users aren't cheapskates ;)

AlexenderReez
July 22nd, 2007, 12:51 AM
for me if direcx10 already released..and we be able to play high graphic game just like when using windows..then at that time it is worth to charge ,even more than vista:lolflag::lolflag:

Andrewie
July 22nd, 2007, 04:08 AM
everybody sit back and think for a second.

Computer programmers see nothing wrong with paying for software, and non-computer programmers want things for free...

~~Tito~~
July 22nd, 2007, 08:47 AM
Hmm, good point.:guitar:

thegnome87
July 22nd, 2007, 12:39 PM
I have Firefo---err BrowserFox CDs...available for a limited time offer of $110 dollars! If you order now you also get a free lint ball and a used slipper.

I remember once getting a calculator on ebay mailed in a Kraft macaaroni and cheese box...hmmm

Case in point, I understand Titos confusion about selling GPL software but with Linspire I don't think they have much of a choice in charging since they have to pay for the proprietary stuff they include. Not sure if the Lindows deal gave them some for free but oh well.

In terms of selling Linux and GPL software. Think of it this way. You can get the flour and some ingredients for free, but the distro companies can sell you the baked cake. With frosting. ;)

tcoffeep
July 22nd, 2007, 10:26 PM
I have Firefo---err BrowserFox CDs...available for a limited time offer of $110 dollars! If you order now you also get a free lint ball and a used slipper.

I'll give you $90 if you give me one for free ;)
but only if you give me two used slippers, and 3 lint balls :)

bread eyes
July 22nd, 2007, 10:28 PM
I Think So

blackspyder
July 22nd, 2007, 10:34 PM
Until 6 or 7 years ago d/l'ing a distro such as Fedora7 (I think it weighed in at 2 gb) would have taken weeks if not months around here but now its not bad. I remember Staples selling RedHat a long time ago. Its not wrong to sell a distro. the Dev's gotta eat dont they??

lukjad
September 7th, 2008, 07:01 PM
What is the problem with Linspire?!??!?!!?!?!?!?
The IDIOTS take a good, free OS and make it better. They add propriatary softare and ease of use. And then THEY CHARGE MONEY FOR IT!!!! Those IDIOTS!!!! They should starve and steal the M$ controlled stuff! They should rename it RobinHoodSpire and steal the software!!! Yeah, that's it!

cardinals_fan
September 7th, 2008, 07:43 PM
This thread was a failure from the first post on, reviving it didn't improve anything...

lukjad
September 7th, 2008, 07:48 PM
Sorry. I didn't look at the date. I was just following one link after another and landed here.

qazwsx
September 7th, 2008, 08:04 PM
BTW
http://www.xandros.com/news/press_releases/xandros_acquires_linspire.html

david_lynch
September 8th, 2008, 01:27 AM
http://www.linspire.com/

Those con artists!!! Correct me please.
I don't believe in trying to starve linux developers. I buy boxed linux distros and pay for 3rd party linux applications all the time. It's good for business.
Or did you think only microsoft should get paid for their crap?:lolflag:

bp1509
September 8th, 2008, 01:31 AM
They are not con artists, As it's perfectly legal for them or any other person to sell a distro according to the GPL, However. What you have to keep in mind is that most are not selling just the disto per se they are selling you support access.

agreed. Anyways Linspire will be discontinued since the Xandros purchase anyways. That aside, Redhat, Novell, and plenty of others charge for supported versions of their OS, normally making the "community" versions the less stable testing grounds for their enterprise releases.

LaRoza
September 8th, 2008, 01:39 AM
Necromancing of a thread about a dead distro.