Why is it the whole community is so, pardon me, ugly?

[Ali.]

Well, I'm completely in love with this community tbh after the gracious behaviour of some lads, but initially I was scared off. The designs around the Linux community are hideous at best and it really puts one off imo.
One may argue that it's not about that and Linux as a whole isn't some fancy Apple plaything and fair enough, but that argument is only suitable for people on very, very high horses, mind my opinion only obviously.
So why is it? Why can't people be bothered designing good looking sites? Open source is fb and I'm quite sure most people would be surprised to see how easy using Linux really is and the massive amount of support you can recieve from a, what appears to me, friendly community.

I know I'm new and all - well, d'oh, I'd be rather thick not to know that - and this topic can seem a bit rude, but I'm extremely curious. I apologize if my curiousity came across rudely.

[Polygon]

take a look around the microsoft site sometime, it is quite possibly one of the most confusing sites ive ever been too

the best one i think is apple's web site, but ubuntu's own website is really cool looking now

a lot of webpages for certain packages and programs and such are very to the point. They either dont have the ability or the time to spend making a website look pretty, when they could be working on the program instead, which is what everyone uses, not the project's website

[Nekiruhs]

Personally, the Ubuntu.com website is one of the best designed sites I've been to. This forum looks nice too.

[ThinkBuntu]

Debian has a good site. So does Zenwalk, Arch, Sabayon, and most other distros. Poorly designed sites that come to mind are openSuSE (why is it based on a Wiki? silly.) and Mint.

[PartisanEntity]

Personally, the Ubuntu.com website is one of the best designed sites I've been to. This forum looks nice too.

I have to agree there, the Ubuntu site and the screen shots posted there were what gave me the push to try Ubuntu.

[Ali.]

I wasn't really thinking of the "official sites" such as Ubuntu's own site, but more the community sites offering software and guidance. In the FM (Football Manager) community design is rather important and I quite like that personally.

[Tomosaur]

"Ugly" is subjective, so we can basically sit here all day and debate it. I don't like the Apple look and feel, but I like the Ubuntu look and feel. It's all just opinion.

[Betta]

There are a lot of things in the linux world that don't seem ugly to me, but rather they just seem so...big. I feel like I have 10x the screen realestate on Windows. I'm adjusting to Ubuntu, but I can't seem to find anyway to make everything not feel like it's been blown up.

Btw, Ubuntu has really done a nice job with some difficult colors. I'd never think of using orange and brown as my sites colors, but hey, they pulled it off.

-Betta

[johnny4north]

the only thing i would change is the lime green notice bar. i suggest an Alaska sky blue or darker Hawaii mango color. ;)

[adamklempner]

I certainly wouldn't say the "whole community" is ugly by any means. In terms of distro's, I'll agree that Ubuntu is rather ugly (just my opinion). I personally think KDE looks better than gnome in general anyway. Check out Suse's KDE or even Kubuntu, they look a lot nicer out of the box than WinXP (throw on beryl and you got Vista beat). If you like the Mac thing, check out DreamLinux. I think some of their art work in the distro is better than Apples own.

Now if you are talking about program web sites, well, that is a different story. The large open source programs with lots of developers often have very nice websites. In contrast, the small "one man" programs tend to lack art work on the website. Developers of these programs usually make a living doing something else and have limited time available. I'd personally rather them spend their limited time making a nice program than make a nice website for a half-assed program. And I think that is what ends up happening.

[P_Badger]

I've seen some very nice looking sites pertaining to Linux, and I've seen some very ugly looking ones, too.

I've seen *many* hideous looking sites pertaining to microsoft and windows apps, and I've seen some very nice looking ones.

Mac sites are nice looking, but the "theme" has gotten rather tired and old.


I'm afraid to say you're being rather picky, but beauty is in the eye of the beholder, I guess.

[nine01a]

Imo, I'd say that any person who uses these forums would help anybody else out but it's just that it can be-- well, is-- frustrating to have to answer questions that would've taken a few minutes to research but then again, most users do attempt that research.

If everybody just selflessly answered posts to the best of their ability and left out any criticism except where obviously needed (like being to lazy to look for something), the community would seem much more not-"ugly."

And like myself, many others probably see past this and think of this site as very useful.

Actually, after reading my post, I don't think I had any solid points but I'll leave it just because I thought I did, initially. :o

[justin whitaker]

I prefer to think of it as aesthetically challenged.

Very useful, but not beautiful. I never look at an Ubuntu site and go, "Damn, that's some great design right there!"

As for the tenor of the participants here....nicest folks in the world. Ready to help you with whatever you need, so long as you do some research first.

[23meg]

There are a lot of things in the linux world that don't seem ugly to me, but rather they just seem so...big. I feel like I have 10x the screen realestate on Windows. I'm adjusting to Ubuntu, but I can't seem to find anyway to make everything not feel like it's been blown up.

http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=2699427&postcount=31

[Turboaaa2001]

First I want to make sure your talking about web design and not the attitudes of the members.

If thats so then I agree with your observation. That's why I send people to sites that are the easiest to use that I know about. I tell them the best places for help because there asre allot of sites that are poorly thrown together by people who know everything about Linux and can solve anyproblem but are "user friendly" challenged.

A good example is the flip-side of this. That being I know a web designer who has all the degrees but actually hates the internet, mostly web-pages. Of course she is my wife's crazy friend that I married into....:roll:

[Ali.]

"Ugly" is subjective, so we can basically sit here all day and debate it. I don't like the Apple look and feel, but I like the Ubuntu look and feel. It's all just opinion.


I'm afraid to say you're being rather picky, but beauty is in the eye of the beholder, I guess.

True. Functionality and design are my two main criterias for everything I use and buy. If it wasn't due to my lack of cash - and knowledge - I would have thrown this piece of garbage, called Windows, out ages ago.


If you like the Mac thing, check out DreamLinux. I think some of their art work in the distro is better than Apples own.

I'll look into that. Sounds worth a look, thanks :)



Now if you are talking about program web sites, well, that is a different story. The large open source programs with lots of developers often have very nice websites. In contrast, the small "one man" programs tend to lack art work on the website. Developers of these programs usually make a living doing something else and have limited time available. I'd personally rather them spend their limited time making a nice program than make a nice website for a half-assed program. And I think that is what ends up happening.

Valid, valid point.


Imo, I'd say that any person who uses these forums would help anybody else out but it's just that it can be-- well, is-- frustrating to have to answer questions that would've taken a few minutes to research but then again, most users do attempt that research.

If everybody just selflessly answered posts to the best of their ability and left out any criticism except where obviously needed (like being to lazy to look for something), the community would seem much more not-"ugly."

And like myself, many others probably see past this and think of this site as very useful.

Actually, after reading my post, I don't think I had any solid points but I'll leave it just because I thought I did, initially. :o


First I want to make sure your talking about web design and not the attitudes of the members.

If thats so then I agree with your observation. That's why I send people to sites that are the easiest to use that I know about. I tell them the best places for help because there asre allot of sites that are poorly thrown together by people who know everything about Linux and can solve anyproblem but are "user friendly" challenged.

It was web designs. I even praised the community at both the start and end of my intial post in order to avoid confusion, but I failed.. kind of like my Windows does all the time :(

And your observation is exactly my picture of the community as well. The content-wise best sites are the ugliest, or so it seems after a brief look around some of the sites, while the less thorough ones look way better.


I prefer to think of it as aesthetically challenged.

Very useful, but not beautiful. I never look at an Ubuntu site and go, "Damn, that's some great design right there!"

A double package would be fb though :D

[saulgoode]

It seems to me that the comparison being made is that of particular "websites" to actual "forums". I don't find the forums of open source communities to be any less aesthetic than those of such commercial endeavors as Adobe (http://www.adobeforums.com/cgi-bin/webx/.3bbf2764/), Apple (http://discussions.apple.com/category.jspa?categoryID=160), even Football Manager (http://community.sigames.com/eve/forums).

[Ali.]

It seems to me that the comparison being made is that of particular "websites" to actual "forums". I don't find the forums of open source communities to be any less aesthetic than those of such commercial endeavors as Adobe (http://www.adobeforums.com/cgi-bin/webx/.3bbf2764/), Apple (http://discussions.apple.com/category.jspa?categoryID=160), even Football Manager (http://community.sigames.com/eve/forums).

Sigames is the official site. This (http://www.sortitoutsi.net/) is a fan site for example and this (http://www.sortitoutsi.net/forums/index.php) is its forum. Mind, doesn't look as good as it did before the server crash (which meant everything was basically lost), but it's still heads and shoulders above what I've seen on the different Ubuntu boards imo.

[Tundro Walker]

Debian has a good site. So does Zenwalk, Arch, Sabayon, and most other distros. Poorly designed sites that come to mind are openSuSE (why is it based on a Wiki? silly.) and Mint.

LOL! I actually kinda like the Wiki-Style sites! When Feisty Fawn came out and I was messing with Compiz, I went to the Compiz site and started adding stuff I figured out into their Wiki-FAQ. I think it's good to let users help write some content. Only issue is, a lot of Wiki sites don't "look" really flashy and cool. But, are you there for the style or for the substance. I'd much rather take a hit on style if it means more substance.

[drivel]

Personally, the Ubuntu.com website is one of the best designed sites I've been to. This forum looks nice too.

Yeah,nicer than SuSE's and RH's