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View Full Version : Microsoft to "protect" LG. What the hell is going on here?



BigSilly
June 11th, 2007, 10:53 PM
And where will it end? What are they playing at? Microsoft to "protect" LG Electronics. (http://www.pcworld.com/article/id,132662-pg,1/article.html) Personally, I cannot for the life of me see what could possibly be legal about this. How can they be allowed to pursue these avenues?

Al Fairclough
June 11th, 2007, 11:51 PM
I just knew there was a reason that I didn't like LG. As for M$, their day will come, with another monopoly suit.

juxtaposed
June 11th, 2007, 11:52 PM
They say "lifes good" too many times in their commercials.

Ozor Mox
June 12th, 2007, 12:43 AM
"The approach that Microsoft is taking is to work with industry partners to ensure that when customers want to use open source software they can do so with the knowledge and security that the software brings with it all the licensing rights that are required,"

How can they say this? That's an outright threat to companies using open source software that it is not fully licensed and therefore not entirely legal unless they make a deal with Microsoft. Are they essentially saying to companies that they can use Microsoft software or they can not use it, but either way they must pay them? There is no interoperability deal going on here, this is purely about patents. I hope I'm missing the point here because it is very concerning if I'm not.

starcraft.man
June 12th, 2007, 01:02 AM
LOL! It's not surprising. I've been reading up on these deals and I never thought I'd say this but Microsoft has played this game Perfect! I'll just list the facts and you can see how its going, at least how I've read it.

It really boils down simply so I'll just summarize:

1) MS made a starting deal with Novell who for whatever means couldn't refuse the offer.

2) MS went public with the patent infringement and spread Fear Uncertainty and Doubt about the Linux name to the average person, shareholder and CEO.

3) They pointed to Novell for legitimacy (inferred or literally) and told everyone to pay up or else.... reminiscent of the Mob.

4) Smaller companies with no funds to fight and larger ones who's shareholders pressured the management to cave in and pay did so. With all these companies caving in, the integrity of the community of Linux is falling in and dividing itself up and taking radical sides ignoring the threat.

Thats about it, they didn't sue a single company and they got all that done. They pulled it off so well its sad that it didn't take any effort. The only hope it seems is for the rest of the remaining ones to get together under the GPLv3 I guess or whatever other means they choose and take this to MS and get it settled.

I feel so sad that MS played this community so easily...

smoker
June 12th, 2007, 01:52 AM
Thats about it, they didn't sue a single company and they got all that done. They pulled it off so well its sad that it didn't take any effort. The only hope it seems is for the rest of the remaining ones to get together under the GPLv3 I guess or whatever other means they choose and take this to MS and get it settled.

I feel so sad that MS played this community so easily...

i'm hoping it is only a matter of time before someone with clout stands up to ms and calls their bluff, and the sooner the better:D

kamaboko
June 12th, 2007, 01:58 AM
If you're suggesting that LG buckled under to MS b/c LG is small...uh...they're not.

LG is US$81 billion business group operating around the world with 130,000 employees. LG would not have done this if they ALSO didn't find it advantageous in some way.

steven8
June 12th, 2007, 02:01 AM
It makes me glad that my LG Electronic CD-RW drive is sitting there. . .dead. The only CD drive I've ever had die on me. I'll never buy another.

Extreme Coder
June 12th, 2007, 02:03 AM
4) Smaller companies with no funds to fight and larger ones who's shareholders pressured the management to cave in and pay did so. With all these companies caving in, the integrity of the community of Linux is falling in and dividing itself up and taking radical sides ignoring the threat.

Not that I'm calling you a liar or anything, but would you list the smaller companies you're talking about? and your sources too?

Because what I know is that MS has spread FUD that AFAIK didn't affect the community. I could be wrong though.

jiminycricket
June 12th, 2007, 02:15 AM
Not that I'm calling you a liar or anything, but would you list the smaller companies you're talking about? and your sources too?


Anonymous companies using Linux. They don't want a backlash like the one EV1 got from customers from licensing the other scam of the decade, SCOSource.

MS themselves said this in the CNN Fortune article, other developers have said this..

FuturePilot
June 12th, 2007, 02:25 AM
MS is trying to sneak its way into every Linux OS and device so that it can destroy Linux.:o

Hide!.......:-$

JT673
June 12th, 2007, 04:48 AM
Hmms...Let's hope you didn't use that new voice recognition feature in Vista! (http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1123221217782777472)

FuturePilot
June 12th, 2007, 04:54 AM
I'd like to think even the CEO of Microsoft would know how to spell his name. I guess the spellcheck in Word didn't catch it!!
I think you mean the spell check in IE:p

I told you, they're coming! Now they're infiltrating our forums!
Hide!...........:-#

FuturePilot
June 12th, 2007, 04:58 AM
http://www.linux.com/howtos/Speech-Recognition-HOWTO/software.shtml
Said who?

argie
June 12th, 2007, 11:00 AM
It makes me glad that my LG Electronic CD-RW drive is sitting there. . .dead. The only CD drive I've ever had die on me. I'll never buy another.
That's funny. The only CD drive to stop working that I had was an LG too, but it was a CD-R drive and it doesn't read anything any more.

steven8
June 12th, 2007, 11:05 AM
That's funny. The only CD drive to stop working that I had was an LG too, but it was a CD-R drive and it doesn't read anything any more.

That is exactly what happened with mine!! How long did you have yours? Mine was 3 years old.

mips
June 12th, 2007, 11:20 AM
Below are my thoughts on the issue:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protection_racket
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racketeering

BigSilly
June 12th, 2007, 11:39 AM
That's exactly it right there, mips.

use a name
June 12th, 2007, 12:26 PM
As part of the deal, Microsoft will have access to LG patents that cover computer architecture utilized in game consoles and other products and will license other LG patents that are owned by system integrator MicroConnect Group, which is based in Manchester, England.
In the mean time, MS tries to blow up the current software patent system. link (http://www.pcworld.com/article/id,131984-c,opensource/article.html) So, before the rediculous claims they make go void, the try to exchange them for patents that will make it through their proposed new system.

Tomosaur
June 12th, 2007, 04:17 PM
Anonymous companies using Linux. They don't want a backlash like the one EV1 got from customers from licensing the other scam of the decade, SCOSource.

MS themselves said this in the CNN Fortune article, other developers have said this..

So your source for all these 'anonymous companies' is the company who has the most to gain from propogating this myth? When GPLv3 roles out - the MS/(insert company name here) deals will become more or less invalid, and all that will have happened is that Linux companies have gained money while MS has lost money, which is not exactly a bad thing.

jgrabham
June 12th, 2007, 04:21 PM
I think MS are trying to get rid of the GPL, by bribing/threatening/blackmailing linux companies, users etc. Good luck Ballmer, you're going to need it!

Enverex
June 12th, 2007, 04:34 PM
Not really, seems they're doing well enough without anyone wishing them good luck. I used to mildly hate MS, now I think they need to die, and quickly.

jgrabham
June 12th, 2007, 04:36 PM
Yeah, but you can't buy off non profit organisations. :] Bill Gates - "Whats a non profit organization - Is that something where I cant get money - nah, no such thing"

Ozor Mox
June 12th, 2007, 04:41 PM
Yeah, the good news is that free/open source software cannot be killed, as it will always exist in some form or another, no matter how much power Microsoft finds itself having over various companies. I just hope that this doesn't damage the adoption of Linux too heavily.

Tom Mann
June 12th, 2007, 05:27 PM
I think there's only one way to get Microsoft once and for all. It's going to be people power. Like the hundreds upon hundreds of people who filed a class action against Microsoft over the x-box fiasco (they were accused of modding their x-boxes after a bad update by MS and told they had to pay to have it fixed!), Linux users are going to have to file a class action to prove their patents or shut the hell up.

I would do it now, but I don't have a clue where to start...

Sp4cedOut
June 12th, 2007, 05:37 PM
I find it surprising that people are so quick to criticize Microsoft yet also give passes to Novell and LG. "They had no choice but to make a deal"....of course they did. They just thought they'd be better off with Microsoft.

Al Fairclough
June 12th, 2007, 05:49 PM
I think a good start is for people to vote with their dollars. Boycott any company in collusion with M$, such as LG, Novell and Xandros. I think that when M$ starts coming after my OS (Linux), they make it personal and personally, I refuse to purchase any product that has anything to do with M$.

kamaboko
June 12th, 2007, 06:14 PM
I refuse to purchase any product that has anything to do with M$.

Well, I guess that leaves you pretty much living in outer space. Given that MS has 87% of the global computing market, barely a product that you consume hasn't been touched by MS in some way. For instance, a friend of mine produced a custom app based on .Net that helps shipping companies bring their products down the Williamette river. That would include grain, cars, raw materials, assorted foods, etc. Do you drive a car? Odds are MS is involved with the planning, development, shipment, etc., of that car. For example, look at Toyta.

TOKYO — July 17, 2006
Toyota Motor Experiences the Power of CATIA V5 on Microsoft Windows XP 64-Bit Edition
Leading carmaker streamlines product development and more efficiently delivers innovative new products with Dassault Systèmes’ solution on the Microsoft platform.


Let me know how many products and services you intend to boycott.

Al Fairclough
June 12th, 2007, 06:17 PM
OK...almost anything. ;)

NJC
June 12th, 2007, 06:35 PM
From original poster's link:

In addition, LG will be making ongoing payments to Microsoft to cover Microsoft patents as they relate to Linux-based embedded devices that LG produces.




The deal with LG comes after Microsoft said last month it would seek royalties for patents that it says are being infringed upon by open-source technologies such as Linux. The company, however, said it would prefer to sign patent and cross-licensing deals with open-source distributors rather than seek payments via litigation.

Here's my opinion. MS is rightly trying to change their business model as they realize their dependance on Office Suite and their OS'es is not a sustainable plan.

I understand MS has been patenting a feverish amount of Iintellectual Property (IP) lately. It seems, in part, that this is part of their strategy - namely, to "to sign patent and cross-licensing deals with open-source distributors rather than seek payments via litigation." But that hardly is a large revenue-generating biz decision.:confused:

I don't think MS has world domination in the cards ... but I smell something fishy. Could these cross-licensing deals set legal precedent? IE If enough of these deals are signed then it is a legal acknoledgement that open source code is infringing on their code. I'll concede I don't know enough about it but would like to hear some legal opinions.

EdThaSlayer
June 12th, 2007, 08:30 PM
It looks like some more FUD. It also seems to be getting our attention too well. :)

adzik
June 12th, 2007, 09:26 PM
There are some elements of these deals that MS has been signing that I can completely understand have strictly business / profit potential purposes, and the rest is ... well, pretty obvious.
You stand up to a big dog and he'll take notice.
You take a step towards him, he'll start getting in the stance of guarding his turf.
Make a move and he'll attack.
With Bill Gates on the way out, (of MS) true advancements are left in Ballmer's hands. :twisted:
Now that Xandros has become Microsoft's next pet, I can only suspect other small GNU/Linux vendors may start considering doing the same. Kind of a cascade effect.
Get enough companies in bed, I mean... on board that rely on Linux in some area of there product / service offering and you have 2 powerful scenarios:

1 - The admission of patent infringement by succumbing to MS in sheer numbers

2 - Enough business agreements / "covenants" that when the license becomes intolerable to these agreements (GPLv3?) it now becomes damaging to "many" businesses' profits and livelihood. That might just be acceptable as interference in business on a large scale, and maybe a judge will like MS' stand on it

At the end of the day, I doubt seriously either of these will happen as MS has it's hands full with Google, since Google is holding the nails to their coffin (and appears to be out buying the hammer as we speak)
The GNU and Linux phenomenon is an internet beast, that was born here, raised here, and is shaping a lot of what it will become. MS simply can't contend anymore, so I suppose strapping people down with licensing is the best they can muster for a little more time.

Just some opinions... they're worth what you paid for them. ;)