Fedora Core 5 Goals

[poofyhairguy]

I was just looking at the Fedora Core 5 goals, and there is some neat stuff in there. I know that it seems to early to talk about life after Breezy (as its feature set is already laid out) but some of this I would like to see in Ubuntu in the future. Next Spring, maybe we can have some stuff like this:

http://www.fedoraproject.org/wiki/FC5Future



CD image generating tool

A tool to create CD images from a list of wanted packages would be very nice. The tool would need to generate directory images with all the desired packages, plus their dependencies.



Would be good for dial up people.



Free Java related enhancements

The proposal is to integrate gcjwebplugin (Java applets will work out of the box) , Azureus (Bittorrent client) and RSSOwl (RSS feed aggregator), GCC 4.1 (for better Java funtionality)

I'm a big fan of open java.



Sound-Server

From the whishlist: Better sound server replacement - no arts, or esd, something else. Alan Cox had some ideas about synchronization that he considered essential for a new sound server. Have to dig in the archives to find what he thought of these choices specifically.

(actually I think Breezy has that last one in mind too)



GUI Package manager and Updater

GUI package manager (replacing system-config-packages) that avoids the synaptic like long list of packages with a better task oriented system

Our update manager will probably morph into that one day.

Some neat stuff. Out of everything, I hope Ubuntu gets the free java and the sound hammered out first. From every indication, the Java will come when its ready:

http://daniel-robitaille.blogspot.com/

[benplaut]

fedora is really awesome... even though it's not DEB based...

if it was, it would be first on Distrowatch...

[Xian]

fedora is really awesome... even though it's not DEB based...

if it was, it would be first on Distrowatch...
Heh. And the RH sales team would have alot of explaining to do. :)

[Lovechild]

Fedora works for me, by far my favorite distribution.. I'm running Development right now and it's so far not all the different from FC4 but that'll change draticly in the months to come.

[poofyhairguy]

Fedora works for me, by far my favorite distribution.. I'm running Development right now and it's so far not all the different from FC4 but that'll change draticly in the months to come.

Does that mean you are like running the Fedora Breezy?

[jdong]

Does that mean you are like running the Fedora Breezy?
Yep. Rawhide, as they call it :)

I'm excited to see this unfold :)

FC4 is a very exciting release too... A bit too on-the-bleeding-edge for my tastes as a primary OS, but nevertheless fun to play with.

[mrtaber]

I guess I'm a geek, too--I find this exciting. I also find the future of Ubuntu exciting. I've partitioned my life to enable me to use both RHEL, Fedora Core 4, Ubuntu, Windows XP, and Mac OS X...the best of all worlds :) (Oh, and MVS, of course). Work: RHEL and CentOS, FC4 on a VM, XP, MVS, and Mac OS X. At home, Ubuntu, XP on a VM, and Mac OS X.

Any news on when Ubuntu might be implementing something like ExecShield and SELinux? These are very big selling points in the Enterprise (we're paranoid about our security :))

Mark

[Lovechild]

Yep. Rawhide, as they call it :)

I'm excited to see this unfold :)

FC4 is a very exciting release too... A bit too on-the-bleeding-edge for my tastes as a primary OS, but nevertheless fun to play with.


Rawhide is the term RedHat use for their development tree for the RedHat Linux products, the Fedora term is Development - but generally everyone just calls it all rawhide - old habits die hard.

[jdong]

Rawhide is the term RedHat use for their development tree for the RedHat Linux products, the Fedora term is Development - but generally everyone just calls it all rawhide - old habits die hard.
Yeah, devs call it "rawhide", the RPM system has yet to move away from the dist=rawhide, bugzilla calls it rawhide, etc etc etc. I think that name is here to stay :)

[Quest-Master]

CD image generating tool

A tool to create CD images from a list of wanted packages would be very nice. The tool would need to generate directory images with all the desired packages, plus their dependencies.

I really like this. :)

[Optimal Aurora]

Hay you all, I like FC4 too... but redhat and the fedora forum needs to work on manners and the OS alot, because I had to start experimenting to solve some of my problems and now though I got a perfectly fast OS with most of the rpm bells and whisles that you can get... (Wow, I like apt-get and synaptic debian packages...)

I would expect that with the fedora foundation started the fedora will get more bleeding edge...

[billiejoex]

I prefer Ubuntu.

[poofyhairguy]

I prefer Ubuntu.

Me too. But I think Fedora is the closest distro to Ubuntu, so it would be good to steal a few ideas from them.

[billiejoex]

Sure! It would be a great thing.
But by now I can't use any distros that doesn't include apt.
Can you imagine something better than apt? :-)

[jdong]

Sure! It would be a great thing.
But by now I can't use any distros that doesn't include apt.
Can you imagine something better than apt? :-)

Actually, in a number of ways, yum exceeding apt :)

[TravisNewman]

Actually, in a number of ways, yum exceeding apt :)
really? ech. never have I had a good experience with yum

[desdinova]

I have to admit my last RH experience was with 7.2 ;-) Though my Uni uses Fedora for some of the unix work......

[poofyhairguy]

But by now I can't use any distros that doesn't include apt.



Fedora has apt-get and synaptic out there. That was how I was able to find out that Ubuntu had twice the pacakges.

[Xian]

really? ech. never have I had a good experience with yum
Agree. Still _very_ slow in FC4. But has much potential.

[poofyhairguy]

Agree. Still _very_ slow in FC4. But has much potential.

A package managing program only has as much potential as the repo it fetchs from in my opinion....

[Xian]

A package managing program only has as much potential as the repo it fetchs from in my opinion....
As I installed FC4 on day1 I only had the default fedora-extras enabled.
I would assume the other "regulars" are now set-up.

The process to get from update > installed in yum is lengthy.
Run the same command structure in apt and the time difference is notable.

[jdong]

Agree. Still _very_ slow in FC4. But has much potential.

It's not that bad. Considering that yum performs an "apt-get update" equivalent for every operation, it's not that bad at all. Especially in FC4 where sqllite is used, it's very acceptable.


As far as the number of packages available, that's not really yum's fault... The devs simply can't support that many packages given their release cycle. It's much more fair to compare Ubuntu's 'main' with Fedora+Extras.

As far as general availability of prepackaged software... Fedora/RedHat wins. Far more 3rd parties give RPMs of their software than any other format.

[Xian]

It's not that bad. Considering that yum performs an "apt-get update" equivalent for every operation, it's not that bad at all. Especially in FC4 where sqllite is used, it's very acceptable.
Oh, it's not "bad" by any means. If I'd never tried or gotten familiar with Apt then I would be none the wiser. Apt is just a faster and more responsive tool at this point. Of course, anything is possible and in a year who knows...


As far as general availability of prepackaged software... Fedora/RedHat wins. Far more 3rd parties give RPMs of their software than any other format.
Are you talking in terms of available titles? I'm not sure about this as Debian-based Apt seems to include many more, especially when you add in all of Apt's unoffical repos. Not that it is any big deal. When I used Fedora I enjoyed it immensely and found basically any application that I ever needed. How ever many titles they do have it certainly far exceeded anything that I required. It's a great distribution.

[jdong]

It's kind of a funny topic: the speed of APT. Since APT is written in C and Yum in Python, sure, APT has a speed advantage there, LOL.

However, Yum has been so optimized and tweaked that the difference is basically unnoticeable, especially in FC4 with the sqlite database backend.

However, the RPM system is much faster than dpkg... there's no doubt about that. Install a single package. RPM will do it in less than half the time than dpkg... ("Reading Database......" sound familiar? ;) )

So in the end, the speed basically balances out.

[Lovechild]

It's not like you access yum or apt-get on a daily basis (unless you like me are running the development branches and update daily). I don't see the marginal speed difference as a big selling point, however the fact that yum downloads rpm headers for each file rather than a large repo file is a big thing for me since that sometimes takes forever.