Is Microsoft getting worried by the increased use of Open Source/Linux software?

[beercz]

I have just read this article on the BBC news web site:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/6571139.stm

As well as pirated software selling cheap in some countries I wonder if the take up of Open Source software, particularly Ubuntu is prompting Microsoft to act. I think it is personally, although I have no hard facts to back it up, just a 'gut feeling'.

Comments anyone?

[derjames]

also look at this:

http://news.com.com/Microsoft+aims+to+reach+next+billion+PC+users/2100-1003_3-6177431.html?tag=nefd.top

[beercz]

It is interesting to note that neither article mentions alternatives to MS - i.e. open source software.

I just wonder what Microsoft's real motives are, and why they are doing this.

[mtn]

With the release today of Feisty Fawn (the most important OS to be released this year) the BBC decide to regurgitate what must have been an official MS press release. With virtually no analysis and not one mention of the fact that MS is under threat from Linux throughout the developing world, the BBC push out a MS feel good story!

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/6571139.stm

[beercz]

http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=413471

[mtn]

thanks. probably needs merged!

[aysiu]

thanks. probably needs merged!
Merged.

[jdhore]

i honestly think that if M$ is not worried about the use of open-source software, they should be. i mean. for most people, there used to not be an alternative...back in the Windows 9x days, there were really no competing OS's and in most of the IE3/4/5/6 days, there weren't any really good competing alternatives...now everyone and their dog is using Firefox and there are a lot of people making the move to Mac and Linux so Microsoft SHOULD be working hard on making a good or at least a better OS to try to pull all these people back in, but i think they just failed miserably with Vista and that's going to incite a lot more people to move to Mac or Linux when they realize how much Vista sucks.

[mtn]

so for the cost of producing and shipping the install media, MS gets the countries' governments to pay for the conditioning and training of lots of students (future customers) to use MS software. they are running scared and I feel a Gettysburg coming on - yeehaww!

[ixus_123]

I'd say the are scared but not very.

MS is clever in that it not only is pretty much the first OS most people will use but that it also offers a wide range of easily accessible course for people to qualify as support techs.

It's business sales that will generate revenue & probably transend to people using those operating systems at home - first to work from home & then as personal PCs. Business are only going to use what's supported and presently in most places the demand for techs is greater than the supply. Microsoft Qualified people are plenty whether they come with experience or are just starting their careers. So, as a business, why use Linux for your servers, mail, desktops if you are going to struggle to find support staff.

I think for MS to really be scared & Linux to ever get a hold on teh office / home market it needs to offer easy access to techs starting out. Lay the foundations before you build the house

[hardyn]

MS has nothing to worry about... they generate WAY more revenue from their non-OS software products. Ms-Office is workplace standard, for both windows and Mac, and for a few users linux as well... so they take a ding in OS sales, they have lots of other products.

[Hex_Mandos]

i honestly think that if M$ is not worried about the use of open-source software, they should be. i mean. for most people, there used to not be an alternative...back in the Windows 9x days, there were really no competing OS's and in most of the IE3/4/5/6 days, there weren't any really good competing alternatives...now everyone and their dog is using Firefox and there are a lot of people making the move to Mac and Linux so Microsoft SHOULD be working hard on making a good or at least a better OS to try to pull all these people back in, but i think they just failed miserably with Vista and that's going to incite a lot more people to move to Mac or Linux when they realize how much Vista sucks.

There were alternatives, even back then. My favorite tech magazine ran a comparison between Win 95 and OS/2 Warp when both were released (that quality standard has been apparently dropped). IE 3 wasn't as good as Netscape, which I used until 4.7 (more out of a desire to not use MS products than because of good features, as IE5 and above were better than Netscape 4.7). Finally, not everybody is using Firefox now. Firefox is just 10-15% of the market: a significant enough minority to be considered by most companies and webdesigners, but not a majority by any means. For 8 or 9 people out of 10, the Internet is "the blue e", just what Microsoft planned in the mid 90s. Not that they aren't taking blows, but we're not even close to winning.

[mtn]

MS has nothing to worry about... they generate WAY more revenue from their non-OS software products. Ms-Office is workplace standard, for both windows and Mac, and for a few users linux as well... so they take a ding in OS sales, they have lots of other products.

i think you are wrong for two reasons. first i think you are wrong because if MS didn't worry about the OS market I don't think they would have applied tens of thousands of developers and billions of dollars of resources to creating Vista. as well as that Open Office is challenging there office dominance and Linux servers are out doing MS (as far as I know).

i think also, software trends could change fast (that is, they have the potential to, unlike the automobile market for example) and this could wipe out MS far more quickly that one might expect.

only my subjective thoughts, but i do believe that you are fundamentally wrong in your assertions.

Cheers

[FoolsGold]

I think Microsoft are concerned. Scared, no. Worried, a little. Concerned, definately.

The fact they have to lobby to stop open file formats being used by Governments is a sign that they see open source as a threat. They know that being a virtual monopoly and maintaining that monopoly, means plugging all the opposition in whatever way they can. Even if the opposition isn't a danger at that very moment, MS do have enough experience to detect when something could become a threat later.

Eliminate the threats while they're small so they don't become difficult when they're big, you know?

[jiminycricket]

Their Office depends on the OS though....and so they get money x 2.

[mtn]

i agree. i am (trying to get back to my point) really disappointed with the BBC. surly running an article about how linux works of a live cd would be in the public interest (their official modes operandi) giving the public access to information about an OS that was free, easy to try and "more secure". Darwinian diversity most have its merits!

[mtn]

Their Office depends on the OS though....and so they get money x 2.

yes, but OO does not...so threat!

[edmondt]

I doubt they are worried, market share for linux desktop is like 2 to 3%, MAC is like 9 to 10%, All retail desktop and laptops have Vista installed, end users don't offer a choice by major manufacture to remove Vista for a discount.

Feisty is getting there tho, maybe in 5 years linux desktop will become more mainstream...

The last resort for MS Windows would be to offer their base OS for free.

[dasunst3r]

*sniff, sniff* Windows XP Starter Edition = very limited. Starter Edition was a total waste of development labor time, if you ask me. We, the community, are still able to provide a better alternative... one that doesn't discriminate how much money you have, one that treats you with dignity and respect.

[IYY]

They are not worried by Linux in particular, but by the competition in general. See, Microsoft is a company that needs its monopoly to remain powerful and profitable. Right now, we are seeing:

- Apple stealing their creative users, many students and professors, some coders, and other demographics. Microsoft tried to compete by releasing the Zune and a flashier Vista, but their success is very limited. iTunes has taken away most of the WMP users already, it seems.
- Linux desktops are stealing their technical users, and the less wealthy users who can't afford Windows.
- Google has already became the leader in the online field, and it doesn't look like it's going anywhere (not for lack of trying by MS: they've tried cloning every single Google product, but failed.)
- Firefox and Opera are becoming more and more popular, despite Microsoft fixing IE and copying many features like tabbed browsing.
- Open Office, despite being somewhat inferior, also grows in popularity. People seem to start respecting standards more and more, balancing the scales.
- Their own old products are competing with them. Why buy Vista when you already have XP licenses? Why buy Office 2007 when you have 2003, or even 2000?

So you see, it's not just Linux. Microsoft is losing its empire, and its old strategies no longer seem to work. Their current tactic seems to be this: change the interface so drastically, force the upgrade upon people while we still have a monopoly, hope that the users get used to our new interface, and that the competition won't have time to catch up.

If this fails, they are doomed.

[NikoC]

I'm currently reading Thomas Friedman's 'The world is flat' where he describes several processes that flattened the world... one of them was open source software... thousands and millions of people that are able to work on open source code and share ideas... that 's a very powerful 'machine' in motion. Even more what do a lot of companies do to compete with each other? Lower the price... that's quite difficult when the product is FREE :P

[sloggerkhan]

I think this is a very threatening move for non MS OSes. We really need to get support of world governments for having a standard that it is not US corporate controlled so that there is incentive for citizens to not take MS up on their offer.

The way I see it, if this plan of MS succeeds, we'll be crippled. If it fails, Windows is dead.

[mdsmedia]

I think this is a very threatening move for non MS OSes. We really need to get support of world governments for having a standard that it is not US corporate controlled so that there is incentive for citizens to not take MS up on their offer.

The way I see it, if this plan of MS succeeds, we'll be crippled. If it fails, Windows is dead.Yes, it's threatening, but it's not going to make a dent in current Linux/Open Source users. MS is trying to open up NEW markets, which potentially would have been OSS dominated. This may simply be a proactive move on MS' part, to grab the market before OSS does.

The chink in the plan, that I can see, is that MS wants the governments of these poor countries to supply computers for the students, in order to qualify to BUY this MS package. If the countries are poor, can the governments afford to buy the computers. If the governments are rich, but the country is poor, will the government fork out dollars to supply the computers, in order to pay $3 for the package.

This is not a freebie. And Linux is still better than Windows. AND they're offering a cutdown version of an OS that's out of production soon.

[Bwosc]

Well since nobody mentioned this but Microsoft got already scared of Linux years ago (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halloween_documents).

[Steve H]

I just found this on the beeb site as well, and was just about to post it when I found this thread.

I reckon this is just M$ way of getting themselves on the new wave of "computers for everyone". They would be out done by Linux distros if they kept there prices high, so they look to be trying to "undercut" the prices. The big tell for me was this quote:

"This is not a philanthropic effort, this is a business," Orlando Ayala of Microsoft told the Reuter's news agency.

Who said altruism was dead?!!?!

Someone should point out that $3 is still more expensive than FREE!!

[alanandhispc]

Someone should point out that $3 is still more expensive than FREE!!

especially where FREEDOM is concerned.

[BoyOfDestiny]

You bet they're worried!

Microsoft's $3 anti-Linux weapon
http://www.linux-watch.com/news/NS6409071283.html

"In Beijing, Bill Gates announced this week that Microsoft's 'Unlimited Potential' initiative will now include offering a software package, the Student Innovation Suite, to governments and students in emerging countries across the world at a price of just $3."

I agree 100% with this article.

I hope MS fails here, and that Linux and Free Software keeps taking off.

Kids in Jiri, Nepal love XO (OLPC)
http://olpcnepal.blogspot.com/2007/04/kids-in-jiri-love-xo.html

Anyway, I'm not that worried about everyone going for this $3 dollar deal... Since it's the Windows Starter edition they are bundling (limited to 800x600 and 3 applications at once... Pathetic.)

[daygoj]

is any body steal here?, well if u just happen 2 iono read, could u tell me how to set azereus as my default torrent opener besides i dont wont stuff to open with that stupid bittorent thing????????????????????????????????????????????? ?????????????

[eentonig]

Actually, this is just an extension on what M$ has made so big in the past. They make sure that everybody from within the whomb only gets accustomed with windows.

They know people don't like change. So they tend to stick with the things they know. So, if you can make them know Windows as their first working environment on the PC, they will always try to keep using Windows.

And yes, they'll loose Millions off dollars on pirated versions being donwloaded by home users. So what? As long as the business keeps buying those licenses, they're winning.

[Steve H]

I think you're right when you say most people stick with what they know (and what they are used to). Better the devil you know, as they say (or was it Kylie?!). I think that is what keeps A LOT of M$ market share, as people think that ******* is computing, full stop. Laziness and Ignorance will help M$ market share to stay pretty healthy. Change may be slow but it always comes in the end.

I know a lot of people who didn't even know there were OTHER OS's, they presumed that PC's were built for *******, or had it "burned in to it" somehow (someone actually said that to me!)

[eentonig]

I can see the big success M$ has when I talk to my brother. He was a teacher in a community school and this year he changed postion to become the IT support guy for a group off schools.

He is not the biggest light in computers and software, but he's interested. He likes the flashy Vista and XP stuff, but he's also price aware and interested in Ubuntu. Heck, he's the one who got me to know about Ubuntu (and now I'm the one who helps him when he doesn't know what to do with it :mrgreen:)

Since they have to work with limited budgets and crappy HW, he's looking for an easy and cheap solution to manage and get the work done. So, on a regular basis, he is trying to push Edubuntu or other Open source projects into his working environment. But he just keeps bouncing against the walls. He's problems?

- The supervisor for the IT personal is old(er) and only knows about MS. So he gets the typical "Linux isn't ready. I tried it (fifteen years ago?)"
- If he manages to convince this guy, he has to fight the financial department to get budget approved. Even if his solution is cheaper, they don't know it. So it can't be good.
- And then he has to start convincing the teachers that (ie) Ubuntu and all the installed software can serve their educational needs just as good. But, hey... "We don't know this! Give us our familiar windows interface."

Can you blame the kids for only knowing about M$...

[proalan]

Just some brief points...

dell offering preinstalled linux distros upset them

M$l Gates opposed to one laptop per child program in third world countries (obviously using preinstalled free OS)

M$ aggressive genuine strategy is alienating their own genuine users customer base.

My university (Leicester uk) did the initial beta testing for windows 2000 in 1999, after taking over our computer science department for a year, we found so many security issues with w2k that we rolled out debian instead saving absurd licensing fees.

[Steve H]

I'm just reading through the "Halloween Documents (http://www.catb.org/~esr/halloween/)" and it makes for some very interesting reading.

After someone in the thread pointed me to the documents I thought I'd better take a look. it does now seem that although the "average joe" hasn't yet beaten down the doors for Linux, in general, there seems to be a strong enough undercurrent for M$ to worry. Now that cheaper computing is arriving in the developing countries of the world, it would seem they want a major slice of the action before they get shut out by OSS or FSF alternatives.

So coupled with more and more developers, debuggers and high end users converting (or at least dabbling) to Linux distros it would seem there may be some sleepless night's ahead for Ole' Bill and his brethren.

Is it any coincidence that this it is a re-hash article (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/6571139.stm)on or around the time that Ubuntu release Feisty?

Plus Vista has not been the all conquering behemoth that they had first hoped....

[Cheese Sandwich]

I can see the big success M$ has when I talk to my brother. He was a teacher in a community school and this year he changed postion to become the IT support guy for a group off schools.

He is not the biggest light in computers and software, but he's interested. He likes the flashy Vista and XP stuff, but he's also price aware and interested in Ubuntu. Heck, he's the one who got me to know about Ubuntu (and now I'm the one who helps him when he doesn't know what to do with it :mrgreen:)

Since they have to work with limited budgets and crappy HW, he's looking for an easy and cheap solution to manage and get the work done. So, on a regular basis, he is trying to push Edubuntu or other Open source projects into his working environment. But he just keeps bouncing against the walls. He's problems?

- The supervisor for the IT personal is old(er) and only knows about MS. So he gets the typical "Linux isn't ready. I tried it (fifteen years ago?)"
- If he manages to convince this guy, he has to fight the financial department to get budget approved. Even if his solution is cheaper, they don't know it. So it can't be good.
- And then he has to start convincing the teachers that (ie) Ubuntu and all the installed software can serve their educational needs just as good. But, hey... "We don't know this! Give us our familiar windows interface."

Can you blame the kids for only knowing about M$...


There's an old saying: "Nobody ever got fired for going with IBM". ;)

The saying is obviously dated, but you get the drift.