Why do you think schools do not convert to Linux?

[thenetduck]

I am very big when it comes to education and think that expensive licenses help prevent teachers from being paid more, more classes being offered and over all more money for the school to use and operate with. This is of course not only for US schools, (Although I don't know how other schools systems work).
I can think of a couple of reasons, but I can say that the free cost of linux should out weigh them.

Industry Standard. When it comes to designing pictures in a design class or building websites in Flash, Linux does a tough time competing. I don't like the fact that there are very few programs out there to edit flash (effectively) but the fact is, Unless you have Macromedias studio, its pretty dang tough, specifically for students trying to learn. Also, Photo Shop is much more advanced than GIMP (I am not bashing, I use gimp for image editing) but industry standards are such. Photoshop has much more features and more brushes etc.
The point that I'm making is that when it comes to media stuff for schools, I think if just a few flaws were overcome, there would be not stopping schools from using Ubuntu. We all use what we learn on unless we become "Advanced" and what to go beyond.

So any other reason you think schools wouldn't convert to Ubuntu? Just makes sense to me.

The Net Duck


Or at least have most of their computers running Ubuntu.

[maniacmusician]

Interesting that you bring this up; my region of schools is actually considering using Linux right now. They're considering a thin-client setup. Just today, the IT head honchos got together at my school, and someone demo'd a Linux thin-client setup to them. They used k12ltsp (http://www.k12ltsp.org/) to get that set up. Then, they took four or five laptops, wired them to a private network connected to the server, and performed a netboot on them (boot from LAN). It was fast, flashy, and worked really nicely. As far as I could tell, they were pretty damn impressed; it came with all the basic tools necessary for computing in school.

I will agree with you on the points that Linux is suffering in multimedia design right now. Picture design is lacking. We have the GIMP, but it may not be enough for an advanced design classroom. We certainly don't have CAD or any good video editors. No flash editors. We do have Maya and Blender; those are pretty big assets.

Overall, I think the general sentiment should be; For general purpose computing needs, go with Linux. For specific multimedia-oriented teaching, go with Macs. I despise Apple, but Macs certainly seem to be one of the best platforms for multimedia editing right now.

[FoolsGold]

Ah, but some schools ARE converting to Linux - mainly in places like India for starters.

As for why the rest don't convert, or at least consider it, I can summarize the answer in one word: politics.

[Albi]

Those screenshots look ancient!

Anyways, I think the reason is that most institutions already have a Win2k license -and windows 200 works just fine for them-, thus using linux would just be throwing the money away.

Also, linux is only good when no specialized programs are needed, such as at a library or something, it would be too much hassle to set up solutions if things like Flash are needed, although good alternatives exist for some programs.

Third point is that many institutions are bound by the regulations set by upper management. Most people really don't have a say, and it's hard to convince the institution to convert to linux unless you have a compelling reason, or there are problems in the current set-up.

Fourth point is that the tech support people are probably trained only in windows. They would have to invest in them being able to solve linux-related problems.

Conclusion: If it ain't broke, there's no point in trying to fix it.

[aysiu]

I think it's mainly ignorance and fear of change.

[Frak]

I am the system admin of my HS and I have forced Ubuntu, Red Hat, SuSe, and PC-BSD onto most of the computers there.
But, it has been difficult to get everything running the way it has been, and (unfortunately) we still run Windows on some computers, its just unavoidable at the moment.
And Codeweavers and Win4Lin have gotten a huge chunk out of our pockets, again, some things that are just unavoidable, such as gradequick, they have a Linux port, but its VERY outdated and can't upload reports to EdLine (Student Progress Report Service) unlike the Windows version.
Just stuck in a bind on some things.

[Anthem]

I think they're full of terrible people who hate freedom. Obviously they're all corrupt shills for evil proprietary companies.

Or, a more likely scenario is that schools get MS software for cheap-to-free, and using it means there are plenty of people around who can fix stuff when it breaks (it can be pretty hard to find Linux expertise sometimes).

Actually, most likely response is "because then they'd have to install from scratch." I'm betting most schools just use whatever came on the machine.

[ricardisimo]

In California, there is a major grant that is received from Microsoft (I think it's called the Microsoft Fund, or something just as terribly inventive). It's for purchasing hardware, software and IT sundries for the schools and para-educational facilities and services.

Now, take a WILD guess what software (and related hardware) can be purchased with the monies derived from this fund.

[DarkOx]

I think part of it might be simply exposing students to what they'll be seeing out in the work world and at home. If I was a teacher, I'd rather teach students on the software they'll actually be dealing with on a day-to-day basis, and likely this is Windows. Whether or not this should be so is beside the point -- I suspect most people will be required to use Windows more than Linux or Mac in their jobs, and schools should reflect that reality.

[aysiu]

The rate at which technology changes, I don't know if that line of reasoning makes sense. Do you know what word processor I was using in high school? T3. Most people probably haven't even heard of that. When I was in high school "no one" (at least no one I knew) used the internet or email. Even in college, I don't think I used Excel or Word. I had a Mac SE II, and that's what I typed my paper on, and that's what I used for dial-up.

Was there any program or operating system that prepared me for now using Windows XP and Microsoft Office at work? Not directly. But I do just fine with that operating system and those programs now.

Teach the kids Linux. Who knows? By the time they grow up, they may be using it anyway, and if not... they'll learn to adapt, and that's more important than learning any one program. Proper education is about principles and concepts, not memorization. Memorization and ritual should just be means to an end (conceptual understanding and adaptability)--not ends unto themselves.

[FoolsGold]

In California, there is a major grant that is received from Microsoft
"Grant"? Hardy har har.

Government departments give out grants.

Corporations give out bribes. :D

[Motoxrdude]

Proper education is about principles and concepts, not memorization. Memorization and ritual should just be means to an end (conceptual understanding and adaptability)--not ends unto themselves.

Mind if i quote that?

[aysiu]

Mind if i quote that?
Go for it.

[matthekc]

if even half the computers in the schools were dual boot students could at least experience linux. as i occasionally say there are still a lot of people who have no idea what linux is about.

[kragen]

My mum's the ICT coordinator at a primary school, it's a little different from secondary schools, but they use a lot of windows based educational software.

Windows based software aside though, I think the biggest reason is that the people in charge of the IT departments aren't familiar with linux. Even if they were, its quite a big step to go from "linux might be cheaper", to being sure that all the software required will run, and all the hardware is compatible.


I think part of it might be simply exposing students to what they'll be seeing out in the work world and at home. If I was a teacher, I'd rather teach students on the software they'll actually be dealing with on a day-to-day basis, and likely this is Windows. Whether or not this should be so is beside the point -- I suspect most people will be required to use Windows more than Linux or Mac in their jobs, and schools should reflect that reality.

I don't think this really can be considered that much of a big deal. A lot of educational institutions use unix / linux - particularly universities, and the differences between linux and windows don't really matter compared to learning the fundamentals of word processing, spreadsheets, databases etc...


I think it's mainly ignorance and fear of change.

I suppose very bluntly - yes :) it's not really that straightforward though - Microsoft has put a lot of effort into promoting and supporting its products, wheras information and support for linux is far less accessible. If someone is responsible for the IT at a school (or anywhere for that matter), then they're not going to try and change to linux unless they are well informed and are sure it's a good thing to do - to try and change when they're not really sure what they are doing would just be irresponsible :)

In the UK, the last I heard the government was making a push to get open source software more widely used in the civil service and in education, so hopefully they will start providing the advice and support that's needed.

[Hallvor]

In Norway, many schools are running Skolelinux (school linux) - an Norwegian distro made for schools. It is quite common because it is much cheaper than paying licenses to MS, and because you can run it on hardware with low specs. Corporations often donate their obsolete hardware to schools.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skolelinux

"Skolelinux is an educational Linux distribution based on Debian (hence also named: Debian-Edu).

Skolelinux is a free software project founded in Norway. Its name is derived from Norwegian "Skole" (School). Skolelinux offers four different installation profiles on one Compact Disk that will easily install a pre-configured educational network including main server, workstations and thin client server. In short, its major aimings are:

Create a Linux distribution tailored for schools -- based on their needs and resources.
Simplify maintenance of computer facilities.
Provide a thin client-solution, which eases maintenance, reduces costs and allows use of old hardware.
Cut costs by using open source software and re-using old hardware.
Localize the IT infrastructure by translating the software pages to all officially-supported languages in Norway, that is Nynorsk and Bokmål as well as Sami.
Identify and facilitate suitable programs for use in the schools.
Enable teachers to provide high quality IT-teaching to their students."

[Spr0k3t]

In my area, they refuse to even look at anything that isn't Microsoft. I'm guessing it's the MSDNAA bribe. The local college won't use anything but frontpage for ftp like access, and another college refuses to use a domain for fear of allowing viruses to spread faster (really dumb IT security people if you ask me). Our local community college has even set a restriction which forces OpenOffice software to close immediately after launch, when you inquire about it, they tell you not to use it and classify the software as "spyware" wtf!

[ricardisimo]

"Grant"? Hardy har har.

Government departments give out grants.

Corporations give out bribes. :D

I wish it were that good! At least with bribes money actually changes hands. In this case MS is pulling money out of one pocket and putting it in the other. Sad.

[jfinkels]

I wish it were that good! At least with bribes money actually changes hands. In this case MS is pulling money out of one pocket and putting it in the other. Sad.

Don't worry, AH-nold is on the case!

[ricardisimo]

No, dude... the T-200s and beyond run Vista.

[Fascination]

All the schools in Jersey (the channel islands) use Windows but the biggest reason for doing so is because the company who monitors the school servers for them is a Microsoft Gold Partner which of course does wonders in influencing the schools choice of OS. ;)
The irony of it all however is that the server used to monitor those schools is in fact a CentOS box. :P

[thenetduck]

Sometimes I think Linux being free is both the Best and Worst thing. Good because its free and gives everyone an opertunity to learn,but bad because of greedy people that just don't care about education as much as makeing a little extra doh..

[drbob07]

My school uses lots of proprietary apps that probably wouldn't run well under Linux... Theres a photoshop course. A web design course which uses Photoshop for making graphics, and the Macromedia Suite (Dreamweaver, Flash, Etc.), not to mention Mavis Beacon Teaches Typing, a Word + Data class which uses Microsoft Office. (We have about 30 books all relating to Microsoft Office, not OpenOffice)... it's a private school, so the budget is tight enough as it is... hiring a staff that actually knows what Linux is, and finding time to get all these Apps running or find alternatives that are actually worth-while wouldn't be easy. Plus these closed source apps have documentation used for the educational purposes. There aren't many course-books for open-source apps...

So mainly, they've already invested hundreds of dollars, and can't afford to hire Linux-techies / get new books and materials, thats the reason schools aren't changing >_<

[Nils Olav]

Guys, as nice as the bribe explanation may seem it just doesn't make sense. As others are saying, I think it's just infeasible to use linux in some situations.

[ricardisimo]

Guys, as nice as the bribe explanation may seem it just doesn't make sense. As others are saying, I think it's just infeasible to use linux in some situations.

Like I said before, it's not a bribe. What it is, at its core, is a manipulated market, just like all markets nowadays. The technical name for them is "free markets". If this doesn't make any sense to you, just remind yourself that the world has been turned upside-down. Microsoft, whether to their credit or detriment, has mastered the art of the "free market".

[orient2000]

A lot of school IT are non educated mor... that is why.