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View Full Version : why is the X360 lack the cool features of the PS3 and Wii?



billdotson
February 28th, 2007, 10:33 PM
Well while the Xbox360 has online gaming and the online marketplace it seems to be lacking a bunch of features that the Wii and PS3 have.

The Wii has a channel for chatting, a channel for checking the weather, and even has the Opera web browser on it. Kudos Nintendo, there just might be some people that don't even need a computer now (assuming all they do is surf the internet)!

The PS3 while it is expensive has many nice technological features over the Xbox360. The PS3 from what I heard actually officially supports Linux operating systems so if I want to load Ubuntu or another Linux OS on it all I have to do is go to the harddrive and choose between the playstation OS and my Linux OS.

The Playstation in terms of it's processor and other hardware specific. With the PS3's processor and other hardware specifcations along with the ability to run a Linux OS is an incredibly valuable feature.

With a Linux OS on the PS3 you pretty much have a computer. And with all of the media ports on the back you can do almost as much as you could with a computer.
The ability to also switch in and out and laptop harddrive with the PS3 is an incredibly valuable feature.

With the Xbox you can play DVDs and that is a good thing, and you can use it to stream music which is also good, but where is the X360 web browser? Where is the support for portable devices? Why won't Microsoft allow you to run Windows on there if you want to (MS wouldn't dare let Linux or OS X work on there) ?

I used to think the PS3 was really expensive and the price was not justifiable but with it's Blu-Ray player (Blu-Ray movies are actually beating HD-DVD 10-1 in sales so Blu-Ray could be the next thing), support for a Linux operating system, it's ability to switch laptop HDDs in there, and it's media ports it looks to actually be an incredible investment.

I also played the Wii the other day and it was really fun, and hearing that they now have te Opera browser on there is pretty cool.

Don't get me wrong I have an Xbox360 but the Xbox360 seems to behind in innovation and cool features as of right now.

rsambuca
February 28th, 2007, 10:44 PM
I think MS intended the 360 to be used more as an extender for streaming content to the TV from the PC, didn't they?

billdotson
February 28th, 2007, 10:46 PM
I wouldn't doubt it but without a web browser it seems like it can't do much of anything.

and I know MS wouldn't do it but the ability to have a Linux distro on it would make it extremely useful, pretty much a PC.. although not as versatile as the PS3 with it's laptop HDD capability and all of it's media ports

and honestly just being able to stream music from a Windows PC isn't that great of a feature. If I want to listen to music why can't I simply just be at my computer? The ability to have and OS on a console is a much better feature than a content streamer or a place to download movies and tv shows. The prices on that downloadable content isn't even worth it really.. just record it with a DVD recorder and cut out the commercials or get TV card and do the same.

izanbardprince
March 1st, 2007, 12:39 AM
The PS3 only kinda sorta has Linux support, the hypervisor locks out full access to the video card, and Linux is limited to 192 megs of system RAM.

So, have fun with that.

Anyway, I think the XBOX 360 is a steal compared to the PS3, the PS3 costs way more and actually doesn't include any "WOW!" features.

SishGupta
March 1st, 2007, 01:46 AM
IMHO console web browsing is terrible because it is very limited.

For the ps3 i don't think that you can even use all the cores if you use linux. I might be very wrong on this.

It seems to me that you think that the 360 is the weakest of all of them, but I'd say it is one of the strongest (though i personally want the wii)

What the ps3 doesn't have is an affordable price point and standardized online gaming.
These are huge! We are going to see in the near future that the online component of the ps3 is going to not be successful at all. Sony was incredible in ignoring the demand from gamers, which was for a great online service. Sony has left online support up to each game developer, which IMHO is a recipe for disaster.

Online gaming can definitely make or break a game or console.

Streaming content is cool too. Why would you want that? Because not everyone wants to listen to music and watch vids on a computer. It definitely isn't as good. Steaming media provides a way for users to easily watch media on their tv's and stereo systems.

billdotson
March 1st, 2007, 02:43 AM
wow if the PS3 limits Linux to only 192MB of RAM, no videocard usage, and not all the cores then they are missing out on a good selling point "You can have an OS on a system-- go that has a really old computer oh cool I will get the PS3 and have a gaming console and a computer in one" the wii is cool but honestly the x360 is right next to my PC so streaming seems worthless to me.

Kujen
March 1st, 2007, 03:47 AM
The real question is... why should I care? I bought my 360 to play games (as should wii and ps3 owners.) and I think it does a fine job of doing that.

billdotson
March 1st, 2007, 04:06 AM
well I mean all these other consoles have good features why can't the X360 have the same features? The Wii and the PS3 play games also, they just don't have as many quality games for them. I would like for the X360 to have an internet browser because then if one of my friends came over and was on the PC he could be on the internet. I personally am not too impressed by any of the X360 games that have come out. They need to get some more good games out there soon or they will lose my support totally.

I mean if the X360 is going to have other features like streaming content and a marketplace where they can get more money out of you why not have an Xbox Live internet browser? it wouldn't be that hrd to do just a update you would download one day and then you could use the internet through Xbox Live, so to use the internet you would have to have Xbox Live.. wouldn't that get some more people to get Xbox Live.. I would probably pay for it because of right now I don't buy Xbox Live as there are no games that are interesting to me to play online.

igknighted
March 1st, 2007, 05:57 AM
Didnt the X360 come out like a year before those other two? Might that be part of the reason it is technologically behind?

rsambuca
March 1st, 2007, 06:20 AM
Didnt the X360 come out like a year before those other two? Might that be part of the reason it is technologically behind?

In theory it is kinda behind, but for all intents it isn't. The PS3 has multiple cores which may be used, but to utilize all of the cores isn't really practical for developers, as this would mean that it would be too difficult to port the game to other systems and PC's. There may be the odd Killer PS3 platform game, but for the most part, the programmers will not write code to utilize all of the cores independently. Just not cost effective in the short term. Now, if the PS3 eventually starts selling like hotcakes... Big if.

billdotson
March 1st, 2007, 02:56 PM
if all the consoles just had the ability to play games the only issue would be which system had the best games. But now consoles are mainly for playing games but they are becoming more and more like computers.

The PS3 does have a variety of media ports, and the ability to use a laptop HDD, and even while they only allow Linux 192MB of RAM and no access to the video card and only to some of the cores at least the PS3 allows Linux. Microsoft has hardcoded stuff into their hardware to not allow anything but the Xbox360 OS to run on there.

izanbardprince
March 1st, 2007, 07:59 PM
Didnt the X360 come out like a year before those other two? Might that be part of the reason it is technologically behind?


The XBOX 360 has a much more powerful video card than the PS3, and the cores on the XBOX 360 are each as powerful as the other, the SPE's on the PS3's Cell are not very good for generalized computing (AI, physics, stuff like that).

Sony wanted the Cell to be more like a GPU, and anticipated that if they made the SPE's act more like pixel shaders, they might even be able to get away without having a separate GPU, that didn't pan out.

Anyway, the Cell has more theoretical processing power, but it's harder to utilize, and the GPU is not as advanced as the 360's, it should be a tie between the systems.

ruz322
March 1st, 2007, 08:59 PM
The real question is... why should I care? I bought my 360 to play games (as should wii and ps3 owners.) and I think it does a fine job of doing that.

well put man well put

Kateikyoushi
March 2nd, 2007, 05:40 AM
X360 was rushed to be the first nextgen to get the edge, I expect the same with this generation as well when PS3 is going to pull away, not that this is a bad move, also I think they did not want to implement some things what the PS offers that might be one reason why Xbox ever came to existence.

purplearcanist
March 2nd, 2007, 06:09 AM
All the Xbox 360 has in terms of cool features are the good Xbox-exclusive games, such as Halo 3 and Oblivion. Microsoft is relying on this and an early release of the Xbox 360 to get an edge in the market.

cowlip
March 2nd, 2007, 07:29 AM
The xbox 360 hypervisor has just been cracked (well, was just released anyways) so we may see some interesting stuff on there soon :)

igknighted
March 2nd, 2007, 07:50 AM
I've got to say, I have never liked console games because those controllers were just so awkward to use, starting w/ N64. I have a PS2, but I don't have 4 thumbs to use all the controls... whats the deal? However, despite my deep seated hatred for game consoles, I love the wii. I don't care how it stacks up to the others in terms of processing power or other features, the whole idea of it seems incredibly clever to me. That, and the controls are so natural and a lot more fun. If I had the money I would stand outside at 4am to get one, and that saying a lot.

eddiejcruze
March 2nd, 2007, 08:45 AM
nice article

igknighted
March 2nd, 2007, 10:19 AM
nice article

QFE

eddiejcruze
March 2nd, 2007, 03:26 PM
nice article

izanbardprince
March 2nd, 2007, 05:02 PM
PS3 sales have been slow because the machine has lots of unresolved problems and because Sony is running out of people that will pay such a price for a video game machine.

The biggest thing that hurts the PS3 as far as me buying one goes is the scaler chip sucks and I have a TV that only supports 1080i mode, so since it can't switch to 720P or 1080P and that PS3 can't upscale or downscale like the 360 can, it would just fall back to 480P, and I'm not buying a brand new $1,000 TV set so I can work around the PS3's broken HD support.

rsambuca
March 2nd, 2007, 06:12 PM
PS3 sales have been slow because the machine has lots of unresolved problems and because Sony is running out of people that will pay such a price for a video game machine.

This is based on... pure speculation? More people believe it is due to supply problems still - you just can't find them easily.

izanbardprince
March 2nd, 2007, 06:25 PM
This is based on... pure speculation? More people believe it is due to supply problems still - you just can't find them easily.

If I wanted one, all I'd have to do is go to Walmart, 1 mile from here, they have a full display case, with about 6 of the 20 gig machines and 6 of the 60 gig ones.

I've also seen them at the Kmart and Target here, and at the Fort Wayne, IN WalMart at Apple Glen, and the Marion Walmart, also the online stores are in good supply.

The reasons I don't want one:

The scaler chip just sucks and I'm not buying a new TV just because of that.

The Cell and RSX aren't as good as Sony had hoped for.

The games out so far are pretty much just ports of everything that has been on the 360, the only real exclusive being Resistance, but thats one of the games that won't scale to 1080i properly.

Linux runs, but it's very slow, because it can't use video acceleration and can only access 192 megs of RAM, also it can only run two threads in SMP mode, meaning that even my Socket 754 Sempron could beat two of the SPE's.

The system is even bigger than the original XBOX, and the form factor doesn't help it either.

The wireless controllers have to be plugged in to "sync" and if you run out of juice, you have to plug them in to charge, vs the 360's wireless controller, where you can charge the battery pack while you pop another one in.

No rumble feature in the controller.

Blu-Ray drive added as a poison pill to prop up Blu Ray movie sales, add $200 to the cost of each system, even if you don't want Blu Ray movies, and Blu Ray movies won't scale properly to my TV set either.

Compared to the XBOX 360 which costs a couple hundred less, and just works after you plug it in.

It's not that I really like Microsoft (I went to lengths to avoid buying this system with a copy of Windows), but Sony just sucks so much worse.

rsambuca
March 2nd, 2007, 06:30 PM
Well, not up here in Canada, and in most centres. I do agree with a lot of your points, but I don't think that is what is stopping most people from buying. Dollars and Availability.

billdotson
March 2nd, 2007, 11:25 PM
wait the X360's hypervisor was cracked?? How in the world did they do that?! It looked impenatrable!

Also, since Microsoft went to such lengths to keep their X360 "hack-proof" wouldn't it be considered illegal to use something on it by using a bug or glitch in the hypervisor? or would it just ruin your warranty? (my warranty for that thing is already gone so yeah.. you only get a year warranty for a game console.. what?! how stupid!)

izanbardprince
March 2nd, 2007, 11:31 PM
wait the X360's hypervisor was cracked?? How in the world did they do that?! It looked impenatrable!

Also, since Microsoft went to such lengths to keep their X360 "hack-proof" wouldn't it be considered illegal to use something on it by using a bug or glitch in the hypervisor? or would it just ruin your warranty? (my warranty for that thing is already gone so yeah.. you only get a year warranty for a game console.. what?! how stupid!)

It also got patched soon after it was found, so the new firmware, thats required to sign onto Live is on pretty much all consoles.

billdotson
March 3rd, 2007, 09:53 PM
well that stinks. NO!!! Why doesn't Microsoft just elt people use the hardware the way they want to, why, why, why!?

cowlip
March 3rd, 2007, 10:04 PM
the thing is now that they can look for other vulnerabilities in the old kernels that could possibly be in the current kernel. They couldn't do that before..

rsambuca
March 4th, 2007, 04:21 AM
well that stinks. NO!!! Why doesn't Microsoft just elt people use the hardware the way they want to, why, why, why!?

Because the majority of people modding and hacking the XBox do it so they can use pirated/copied games. I would try to stop it too. MS is making money on each unit now, but when it was first released (and moreso with the original XBOX) they lost money on the console sale which they recoup over the life of the machine through game sales. Without the game sales, MS won't make money in the division.

Anthem
March 4th, 2007, 06:25 AM
why is the X360 lack the cool features of the PS3 and Wii?
Why the is grammar so bad in this post? Hopefally is because speaker isn't English as first language, otherwise may be time to spend more homework in order to be understood on online forums.

izanbardprince
March 4th, 2007, 07:28 AM
Because the majority of people modding and hacking the XBox do it so they can use pirated/copied games. I would try to stop it too. MS is making money on each unit now, but when it was first released (and moreso with the original XBOX) they lost money on the console sale which they recoup over the life of the machine through game sales. Without the game sales, MS won't make money in the division.

Correct, Microsoft doesn't care about a few people running Linux on their XBOX, cause they COULD have sued the people behind the original XBOX Linux under the DMCA, but once the code verification layer is cracked, all you need to do is copy a commercial video game disc onto a DVD-R and give it to friends/sell it.

Sony's PS3 Linux has allowed users to dump raw HD video from a Blu Ray disc, and I'm sure Microsoft is laughing at that.

rsambuca
March 4th, 2007, 07:33 AM
Why the is grammar so bad in this post? Hopefally is because speaker isn't English as first language, otherwise may be time to spend more homework in order to be understood on online forums.

These personal bashing attacks really aren't necessary.

eddiejcruze
March 5th, 2007, 05:59 AM
nice article

cowlip
March 5th, 2007, 06:02 AM
Here's the video of the Xbox 360 running unsigned code: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4AGAohJuovY

MS may have a right to limit user's activity, but just like the first Xbox, it really is just a detriment to users. Homebrew will open things up for sure.

eddiejcruze
March 5th, 2007, 06:11 AM
nice article

billdotson
March 5th, 2007, 06:22 AM
by the way the only issue with my grammar from the topic title "why is the X360 lack the cool features of the PS3 and Wii?" is that I put "is" in place of "does". Simple grammatical mistake. But yes, the ability to copy commercial games is an issue, but I wonder if there is a better way to allow the console to do things other than play games (like run Linux or something else) without compromising the safety issues that keep games from being copied.
Too bad people don't mod their Xbox's to use it for cool stuff, not to cheat in online games and copy games illegally to their harddrive. If people didn't do stupid stuff like that I could be running Ubuntu on my Xbox360 right now from my external USB HDD while I am waiting for my PSU and motherboard replacement.

Although I still ask why MS won't include a X360 internet browser in one of their updates, one where you can use in "console mode" where if you want to type something you bring up that virtual keyboard or you can use it in normal mode where you can hook up a USB mouse and a USB keyboard and search normally. Does MS have any such suggestion boxes or suggestion forums where I could ask them for such a thing?

cowlip
March 5th, 2007, 06:30 AM
People DO use it for cool stuff like you mentioned. It's called Xbox Media Center ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/XBMC ), LinksBoks, emuLauncher, etc. Much better than the Xbox 360 crap (other than Live) that MS has put on; there's not even a web browser yet!

MS automatically bans people who play online with a hacked BIOS so it's not easy to circumvent and cheat on Live, unless you use a tunnelling service such as XLink Kai (although thye have rules about cheating too, you still have the freedom to do that if hte people you play with agree). Of course if you disable your mod on Live, you are fine.

BTW what is wrong with running a game you own (I know you said illegally, but still..) from your hard drive? That just means your kids/pets/wife/husband don't get to scratch em up and make them unreadable ;)

eddiejcruze
March 5th, 2007, 09:53 PM
nice article

Muis24
March 5th, 2007, 10:44 PM
I just wonder, will the Wii be able to run some modded Linux kernel as well, like the Nintendo DS and the GameCube? Would be nice, since you then (maybe) can watch DVD's and play CD's with it. ;) Its a real shame that it's not possible at this moment. :S

cowlip
March 5th, 2007, 11:36 PM
The Wii can run Gamecube homebrew (eg., Gamecube Linux) due to its emulation of Gamecube. However, you can't do much more than you could with the Gamecube stuff.

I think people are still looking for ways to break out of that emulation.

WalmartSniperLX
March 6th, 2007, 01:34 AM
I remember in time of the X360 launch, Microsoft claimed that the 360 was to be a simple game console and living room media player, not a computer. The idea of keeping it simple (to gaming) was a concept started since the first xbox. Also I heard Puppy Linux was the first linux os to be installed on the PS3 to work with all cores. They did a kernel patch that took 2 nights.

Anyways it doesn't really bother me if linux can or can't be installed on the 360 because the system wasn't designed to be a pc, more rather a gamer. And, may I add that it does its job VERY well. I love the 360 for that.

billdotson
March 6th, 2007, 02:44 AM
yeah while the X360 is a very capable gaming platform it has alot of useful hardware that could be used as a PC for most purposes.

izanbardprince
March 6th, 2007, 04:02 AM
yeah while the X360 is a very capable gaming platform it has alot of useful hardware that could be used as a PC for most purposes.

Microsoft sells Windows as a PC operating system, if the 360 could act as a PC, even just for trivial tasks like web browsing and all that, then their home computer business would collapse.

rsambuca
March 6th, 2007, 04:18 AM
Microsoft sells Windows as a PC operating system, if the 360 could act as a PC, even just for trivial tasks like web browsing and all that, then their home computer business would collapse.I think that is a gross exaggeration! In any even, most people's TV's are not high enough resolution for day-to-day PC use anyways.

hidabroot
March 6th, 2007, 04:20 AM
good luck

unbargained
March 6th, 2007, 04:30 AM
xbox 360 is mainstream and therefore must go by the rules of being mainstream. since p3 and wii are of a lower acceptance, they're provided more opportunity to mess around.

izanbardprince
March 6th, 2007, 06:40 AM
I think that is a gross exaggeration! In any even, most people's TV's are not high enough resolution for day-to-day PC use anyways.

Well, I just have a cheapie 1080i CRT set, and I would think that resolution would be acceptable.

Edit: The thought also occurs that they have an adapter out that lets you hook up your 360 to a computer monitor.

rsambuca
March 6th, 2007, 06:57 AM
Well, I just have a cheapie 1080i CRT set, and I would think that resolution would be acceptable.

Edit: The thought also occurs that they have an adapter out that lets you hook up your 360 to a computer monitor.
Yeah, I'm lucky enough to have a 1080p TV, but according to the stats, the majority of houses are still using standard def tvs.

izanbardprince
March 6th, 2007, 07:00 AM
Yeah, I'm lucky enough to have a 1080p TV, but according to the stats, the majority of houses are still using standard def tvs.

I would think thats more because people get tricked into buying them, I've noticed there are a lot of low res TV's being marketed as "digital" or "Enhanced Definition" that are still 480p, either that or because they aren't forced to buy a new set yet.

AR_Kozz
May 3rd, 2007, 06:03 AM
I couldn't get my ps3 until after I paid my taxes this year, then I didn't quite have the money and waited... then the laser on my v7 ps2 finally gave up on dvd's and I was left with the choice of spending $60 on a new laser...

But shazzam! I found my 60gb ps3 in a cd-exchange for $450, bought it today. Used, but it ain't all that used. Only 2 weeks of stuff on the hard drive.

I haven't even played a ps3 game yet, and I'm astounded by what sony built. It doesn't really need linux installed for most computer functions, most importantly the web browser, which xb360 hasn't got. There's no streaming audio, but you can import audio anyway... and if you install linux you can stream your audio and video too (eventually).

being locked out of the graphics controller is a downer for linux but I've heard tell (yes only rumors) that Sony has asked Yellow Dog to fix it and if you think about it, Sony would want Yellow Dog to succeed, wouldn't they? I bet they will find a way, or else sony will modify the hardware in future versions so it can be done, maybe with YDL pre-installed even...

Add to that the ps3 is a blu-ray player which alone makes it a bargain as the cheapest blu-ray player available by over $400.

As for online gaming being deficient that is nonsense. When ps2 developers didn't create servers, they generally made dedicated pc servers for players to run on their own. Gamers don't need a centralized system to tell them where to play (and how much to PAY...)
especially not linux gamers.

And of course the ps3 can run 2 Tflops compared to xb360's 1. Maybe some developers won't use it all, but you can rest assured SCEA will. You'll see SOCOM, Final Fantasy, all the games playstation fanatics have been loyal to for years. They'll buy the ps3's.