Is Linux a real alternative for Windows?

[YigalB]

Don't be mad with me. I hate the bad guys from Redmond. I even tried Fedora 2 years ago, and now I use Ubuntu.
My biggest Project is to collect PCs from people who bought new ones, and donate yo youth centers of teen agers in "not so good places". My question was what OS? I was convinced into Ubuntu and I donated 6 Pcs in the last month. It looks like a failure. The kids actually formatted and installed windows. Why?
- messengers: not the SAME behavior: they expected Yahoo to look like Yahoo, and ICQ like ICQ, etc. Certainly not different like GAIM. I use GAIM at home. It;s OK, not more than OK, but good for me. Not for them.
If you ask me - messenegers are number ONE to teens.

Beside that, for me, as the "IT", I am frastrated with hardware connectivity. I try to connect HP scanner, 1 year old, with USB (no SCASI, no parralel port)m and it doesnt work. The forum is also very quiet about that. I am not blaming anyone. I just say that it's not a mode I can work with, and people to use.

I don't want to try Fedora again. Ubuntu has a great messege. But that's not enough.

Hope I didn't sound too pasimistic. I would love to hear a more positive feedback, pr maybe "yes- you can easily connect your scanner" and yes: "yahoo works with Ubuntu just like windows".

Yigal

[meng]

With this new-fangled instant messenger stuff like nudging, and advanced smileys, it's tough for gaim to keep pace with all the changes. Not to mention graphical elements like smileys may well be proprietary! *Sigh* people are superficial creatures, not much can be done to change that.

Hardware compatibility is a real problem sometimes too.

Is Linux a real alternative? Yes, absolutely, I don't believe there is any doubt. Is it similar enough to Windows that no one will blink? No, absolutely not, but L!=W.

[YigalB]

Gaim doesnt have to follow with the smilies thingie. The issue is with video, cam, audio. The interface should look the same. Not a big deal from technical point of view.

As for alternative - how can OS be alternative with poor hardware?

[Dr. C]

... The kids actually formatted and installed windows. ... l

Just curious which version of Windows did the kids install the properly licensed one or the pirated one?

[Tomosaur]

Sounds like you didn't do much research on this. GAIM is not designed to look like the messengers it supports - but there are messengers which are intended to clone their Windows counterparts. aMSN is one - it looks (mostly) like MSN Messenger. It is a little 'ugly' in my point of view - but I only used it for 5 minutes and didn't bother fiddling with it to see if it could be improved. I'm fairly sure there are AIM clones and suchlike too - you just need to find them.

As for hardware - linux is generally far superior to Windows in this respect - its biggest problem is wireless, which is being worked on and improved.

[Dr. C]

And another question to any of the Windows messaging clients the kids like to run work in Wine?

[Frak]

Windows messengers don't work with Wine, only with Crossover, and almost all messengers have a port for *Nix systems, exect MSN, (duh!) but you can download those Pretty little smileys off of get more smileys, and sourceforge, kopete is best for this, no matter what anybody says, K really got this one right!, but I chat with my friends all the time, I'd rather use Gaim on Linux, Mac OSX, and Windows, they are just to lazy to learn this, just plain truth, its that learning curve thing again.

[YigalB]

Perhaps I didn't research much, but I have no idea about yahoo client in Ubuntu. In windows I don't need to research much. Perhaps it should be added to the installation package, same like office is, and we solve the learning curve.

As for hardware - I agree that installation is easier than windows. Ubuntu is great from this point of view. But what shall I do when I have to add a scanner? suddenly one small item change the whole picture.

What bothers me is that Ubunto didn't report that it found a new hardware on the USB bus. The best would have been: "found, installed, go to work" process.

[doobit]

If a messenger is your "killer app" then I think that's pretty weak. However, AMSN does pretty much everything that MSN Messenger does.

[meng]

Good point. My guess is the real #1 reason for teens to use Windows is ... games! (shock, horror)

[Klaidas]

Is Linux a real alternative for Windows?
No, it's not.

Can you play good games without windows? No (no need to tell me about tuxkart :D)
Can you run some special software (AutoCAD, Photohop, AutoRoute) without them? No. (no need to tell me about wine - usually it doesn't work)

The list could go on. Alternative == the one which can substitute the original. As you can see, linux can't.

It might be an alternative to someone who doesn't need those special programs, games, other stuff though. But a global alternative - no.

[meng]

Alternative == the one which can substitute the original.
That's a ridiculous definition. The only thing that emulates Windows in all its glory and shame (viruses, etc.) is Windows. By your definition there can never be an alternative to Windows.

[Hex_Mandos]

Kopete supports nudges and custom smilies. Actually, I find that an upgrade from Windows, since I used Trillian.

As for what OS to use - Ubuntu, of course. If the kids want Windows, they can install it themselves. You can preinstall Kopete for them so that messengers aren't what makes them switch, and maybe some games like Battle for Wesnoth and Tremulous.

Honestly, how could anyone use the ad-ridden crapfests that are msn and aim when they can use Kopete?

[meng]

If I were donating computers, I'd put Linux on them. It's generous enough to be giving away hardware, why should I pay for an OS into the bargain?

[Frak]

I've donated computers to unfortunate children before, but I either put windows or Ubuntu on it, if I put Ubuntu on it, I always put Crossover on it too, (I happily pay the mass licensing), because, as we all know, all teens want to do is have fun on the computer, with the occasional school work, so I make sure of that, nothing against anybody.

EDIT:
Forget there have been a few I've donated with Xandros and Linspire installed, they really loved it, tax write off for me.

[migla]

Try to get a small group of kids interested in the moral, practical and geeky advantages of GNU/Linux and see to it that the computers end up with dual-boot instead.

[Mr Wrath]

I made this statement a while back in a different conversation, but I still feel that it is the main concern with *nix in a general manner of speaking.

Re: In your opinion what is the biggest setback that is preventing Linux to widespread
In my opinion, the thing that is holding Linux back is not 'Linux' itself, but the people in general. People/humans are creatures of habit. They get their first family computer (which is usually Windows) and as they grow up they just continue to depend, and suffer, with Windows because it is "user" friendly, and well, the only thing they grew up with. There are not many people willing to learn something new that wasn't taught in high school or college...but, time changes everything. The only things we as 'Linux' users can continue to do is contribute, spread the word, and teach others.

"Is Linux a real alternative for Windows?"
In my own opinion...Not yet, but it's close. I go through many *nix sites for learning and to see what hardware problems they most recently fixed...Every day I see the *nix community getting one step closer to becoming an equal to that of Windows. As far as the gaming and more specialized programs, i.e. AutoCAD, it is a matter of time. I see many *nix users/contributors working on creating similar programs...but proprietary licensing is the hurdle. With another year or two of time, I believe that the *nix OS can be an equal alternative to that of Windows. This is, of course, only an opinion.

[Mateo]

That's a ridiculous definition. The only thing that emulates Windows in all its glory and shame (viruses, etc.) is Windows. By your definition there can never be an alternative to Windows.

i'm not all that interested in defending windows, but this idea that you have to have a heavy virus scan and firewall to use it is ridiculous. I know a lot of paranoid people invest in them, but most of the virus and spyware problems have been handled. I still have a windows partition and haven't used any virus scanner or firewall for years and never had any problems (did have some problems back in the ME days).

[raul_]

I see it like this: Is windows a real alternative for Linux?

[meng]

i'm not all that interested in defending windows, but this idea that you have to have a heavy virus scan and firewall to use it is ridiculous. I know a lot of paranoid people invest in them, but most of the virus and spyware problems have been handled. I still have a windows partition and haven't used any virus scanner or firewall for years and never had any problems (did have some problems back in the ME days).
Which is fine if you never click on popups, open strange looking email, or install "free" (as in beer) software including desktop searches and browser toolbars. But Mr. and Mrs. (and Miss) Average User seem to run into trouble with this all the time!

[Hex_Mandos]

My memories of using Windows are fresh, as I switched about a month ago. Using windows without a firewall, AV and spyware/adware removal tools is almost suicidal. Actually, you don't need to download anything to get popups with an unpatched Windows XP... as I rediscovered when I made my XP partition.

[raul_]

Which is fine if you never click on popups, open strange looking email, or install "free" (as in beer) software including desktop searches and browser toolbars. But Mr. and Mrs. (and Miss) Average User seem to run into trouble with this all the time!

so, Windows is fine, unless you actually DO something...or if u have nothing whatsoever installed

[Mateo]

My current partition has a lot of stuff installed. Patching is done automatically (assuming you have it turned on). I don't use a firewall or anti-virus ever. And it's not like i don't do stuff when I use it. I used to get viruses all the time, adware all the time. XP has really improved on that issue. I'm not saying it's a complete non-factor, but it's not something you have to heavily worry about.

[raul_]

I used XP too, and i'm not an average/careless user, and i would get spyware often. I have to say though, that wasn't the reason why i switched to ubuntu. But i like the feel of not having 3 or 4 applications running even when i'm doing nothing, all eating my RAM :P

[Mateo]

But i like the feel of not having 3 or 4 applications running even when i'm doing nothing, all eating my RAM :P

Me too. I got tired of sitting on my couch not on the computer, and hearing the processor busily doing a thousand "back processes" and such. or waiting after XP had already loaded for the million different back processes to finish loading, which took as long as from boot to OS loaded.

[Frak]

Windows should have their own brand of RAM, SERIOUSLY!, it has to be rebooted every 4 hours for me, because all of my RAM is used, there are some Open Source apps that can allieviate this, but not by much.

[Maxime81]

I use Linux since my 15 (4-5 years...) so for me the answer is Yes : linux is a real alternative for windows.
But Linux is not a Windows like ! People must be prepared before.

[Johnsie]

My opinion is that Linux is not as good as Windows when it comes to instant messaging, gaming and hardware support. Linux is more secure than Windows in terms of Viruses and spyware but the software for Linux is still very lacking.

There are some nice independent IM programs for Linux but their user base is too small and the chances are that nobody you know will use them. The "clones" that connected to the major networks (msn, yahoo, aol)are nowhere near as good as their Windows counterparts at audio/video and are not fully featured.

When you buy hardware it comes with Windows drivers, and a lot of hardware comes with nice Windows programs that look good and work well (eg. high quality printer/scanner software that comes with good printers and of course the sync software which comes with portable devices). If you need help with the hardware/software most companies outright refuse to support Linux users.

Most high quality, full games that are released are released for Windows only apart from a select few.


Linux does have a lot of good things going for it like freedom, better security and less restrictions but until the quality of software and hardware improves it just simply will not be acceptable to most home users.

[Frak]

My opinion is that Linux is not as good as Windows when it comes to instant messaging, gaming and hardware support. Linux is more secure than Windows in terms of Viruses and spyware but the software for Linux is still very lacking.

There are some nice independent IM programs for Linux but their user base is too small and the chances are that nobody you know will use them. The "clones" that connected to the major networks (msn, yahoo, aol)are nowhere near as good as their Windows counterparts at audio/video and are not fully featured.

When you buy hardware it comes with Windows drivers, and a lot of hardware comes with nice Windows programs that look good and work well (eg. high quality printer/scanner software that comes with good printers and of course the sync software which comes with portable devices). If you need help with the hardware/software most companies outright refuse to support Linux users.

Most high quality, full games that are released are released for Windows only apart from a select few.


Linux does have a lot of good things going for it like freedom, better security and less restrictions but until the quality of software and hardware improves it just simply will not be acceptable to most home users.
Good point, but there is proof available that says that OEM's aren't allowed to make drivers, firmware, allowances, ect. for Linux, because Microsoft threatens to put them out of business by taking the licensing away from them, so some of these programs don't work well, some hardware is impossible to use without changing the firmware, ect.

But we all must remember, LINUX IS NOT WINDOWS! (http://linux.oneandoneis2.org/LNW.htm)

[raul_]

As far as i'm concerned Windows is not as good as Linux in many more things...

[Johnsie]

Yeah, I'm sorry if my post looked like I was dissing Linux... I use Ubuntu and really like it. I guess those three things are my main grievences with Ubuntu. They could all be solved by making Linux work better with Windows software and drivers. That's why projects like Wine/Crossover are so important. We need to accept that good software already exists on Windows and people DO want to use it. They dont want to be restricted from using software because of their choice of operating system. We need to find ways to make it work if thats what they want. Some kind of optional windows driver compatibilty layer would be nice, at least until companies start releasing open drivers. That way everyone can be happy and have the freedom to use the hardware and software that they choose to use. I'm sure some Linux purists wouldnt like that but it could be optional and for the average user it would be great. Freedom is also about the ability to choose but right now we're very restricted in what we can use with our OS.

[raul_]

My answer is your signature

[Frak]

They could all be solved by making Linux work better with Windows software and drivers. That's why projects like Wine/Crossover are so important.

It's very crucial, without Wine, we wouldn't have been able to reverse engineer some closed source drivers and codecs.


We need to accept that good software already exists on Windows and people DO want to use it.

I never said it had bad software, there's some software on Windows, that's way better then what any Linux developer could produce. (nothing against developers)

[raul_]

I never said it had bad software, there's some software on Windows, that's way better then what any Linux developer could produce. (nothing against developers)

Of course they get paid and have a budget to do it...

[Sef]

They could all be solved by making Linux work better with Windows software and drivers.

If Microsoft would opensource their software then it could be easily done. Until then, i wil be a struggle.

[Frak]

Of course they get paid and have a budget to do it...
...and have more developers to work on it...

[Johnsie]

At the end of the day, most good programmers need to feed themselves or their families.... There are ways to make some money from open source like providing support or customised versions of software but it's a lot harder than just selling a license.

[Frak]

At the end of the day, most good programmers need to feed themselves or their families.... There are ways to make some money from open source like providing support or customised versions of software but it's a lot harder than just selling a license.
Exactly, well put!
Red Hat sells their OS for a huge amount of money, but much of that goes for support, because of the fact that its open source, so it has to have a selling point, where...

...Instead of using RHEL, you could just as easily use WhiteBox, its the EXACT same thing...

[raul_]

There are ways to make some money without being corrupt or dishonest, but that doesn't mean that people actually give a damn about ideals and don't go for the easy way to make money

[Frak]

There are ways to make some money without being corrupt or dishonest, but that doesn't mean that people actually give a damn about ideals and don't go for the easy way to make money
Exactly, Ubuntu is free, it makes money off of support, not charging everybody an arm and a leg, and causing vendor lockins, so they can make sure that its sold effectlively.

[macogw]

Your HP scanner should work just fine. Hook it up with HPLIP and CUPS like a printer, then use XSane for the scanning.

I think it's a fine alternative to Windows. It's all I use, and it's the only OS in my mom's house as well (and she's a computer idiot). My sister mentioned GAIM looking different too, but after a week on vacation over the summer with my Ubuntu laptop being her only access to IM'ing, she's fine with it. She asked that I get her a whitebook and put Ubuntu on it when she goes to college because she doesn't want to pay for Windows and all the programs for it when there's so much free stuff in the Linux world, and she doesn't want to deal with viruses. That's why it's what my mom uses. I figured it'd give me a chance to teach my brother (he wants it too) and sister to use Synaptic and everything for a couple years before they switch completely

[Frak]

She asked that I get her a whitebook and put Ubuntu on it when she goes to college because she doesn't want to pay for Windows and all the programs for it when there's so much free stuff in the Linux world, and she doesn't want to deal with viruses.

Why not get a System76 Laptop, a little expensive, but all hardware is guaranteed to work out of the box, or search the community market, help the community a little, instead of a big manufacturer, the community that helped you along.

(I hope that didn't sound like an advertisement)

[ragadanga63]

i'm not all that interested in defending windows, but this idea that you have to have a heavy virus scan and firewall to use it is ridiculous. I know a lot of paranoid people invest in them, but most of the virus and spyware problems have been handled. I still have a windows partition and haven't used any virus scanner or firewall for years and never had any problems (did have some problems back in the ME days).


It's not paranoia. A friend of mine logged on to the net, played online games on an XP box without virus protection/firewall. The next day he had to reformat his hard drive because of viruses and spyware (ads that pop up incessantly, bringing his system to a crawl). Click program of BBC once showed an XP (with SP2 installed but with no antivirus/antispyware) logging in to the net. It had eight attacks in 30 seconds. I myself have been a victim of windows malware even if i have an antivirus. Please don't call other people paranoid just because you did not suffer the way they did.

Linux is slowly replacing Windows all over the world. It is not just the alternative software. It can become mainstream. It is only a matter of time. But let us all help spread the news! So many people haven't even heard of Linux.

As substitute of YM, Gyache is a good one. It supports voice, webcam and file transfer. It also has all the YM Emoticons and more. You can even run multiple instances of Gyache. Installing using its .deb package was a breeze. You can get if from:

http://sourceforge.net/projects/gyachi/

[ragadanga63]

Errr Umm...correction. The link to GYachE or GYachI is http://gyachi.sourceforge.net/index.shtml

[Sweetpea]

- messengers: not the SAME behavior: they expected Yahoo to look like Yahoo, and ICQ like ICQ, etc. Certainly not different like GAIM. I use GAIM at home. It;s OK, not more than OK, but good for me. Not for them.
If you ask me - messenegers are number ONE to teens.


There's a Yahoo messenger for Linux. Still pretty ugly-looking though. I can't understand why they couldn't make it look exactly like their Windows version.

http://messenger.yahoo.com/unix.php

[meng]

There's a Yahoo messenger for Linux. Still pretty ugly-looking though. I can't understand why they couldn't make it look exactly like their Windows version.

http://messenger.yahoo.com/unix.php
Did you notice that was Yahoo Messenger version 1.0.4? Maybe it did look very similar to the Windows version 1.0.4.

[steven8]

There's a Yahoo messenger for Linux. Still pretty ugly-looking though.

That's sad. If I want to talk to my firend, I'll call them even if the phone is ugly. Talking to my friend is what's important.

Linux is a completely viable alternative to windows. What it is NOT, is a drop-in replacement for windows.

Cascade, the dish washer detergent, has these commercials where they say, "Leaves dishes VIRTUALLY spotless!". Not TOTALLY spotless, which is what the advertisers hope you will think when you hear the word virtually. Linux is an ALTERNATIVE to windows, not a DROP-IN REPLACEMENT.

Never was meant to be that.

[styven]

If a messenger is your "killer app" then I think that's pretty weak. However, AMSN does pretty much everything that MSN Messenger does.

I think that killer app may be strong but IM it is way up there in respect to linux adoption.
I think that the people that would happily adopt a Linux solution are the young and the old. The thirty somethings mabye forties that use a computer at work and probably home have grown up with windows and the applications that go with it, are the toughest to crack. Lets not forget that this issue is about applications users want not really the underlying OS.

I fit bathrooms for a living and see quite a few computer users that are of the older generation, not only that, quite a few have relatives abroad and they use IM to do audio/video messenging. Do you think these people have a clue about operating systems.....no they don't.

As i have said on other threads, my daughter does not boot her ubuntu partition because she can't do audio/video IM.

The situation the thread starter come across is exactly why Linux is not ready, if we can't attract young adopters, then what chance do we stand?

My laptop is ubuntu only, i have a webcam, can't use it though, i am prepared to wait till the situation changes, but as it stands i feel my pc use is not as rich as it should be.

I had to boot my wife's xp partition over xmas to use the new webcam i was bought so that she could see and talk to her sister in Miami. To be honest this really p****s me of.

The facts are that if pre-installed Linux computers were available in PC World tomorrow next to macs and pc's and the "end user" went home with, he or she would expect to be able to do at the very least what they could do on there old computer. Or maybe if this was there first computer what they had seen there friends do. And i think they are right to expect this.

Most of the things that make people go "ooh" "thats good " etc is around multimedia, and I am not aware of any distro that has this cracked.

I think that these types of issue are underestimated when it comes to getting people to use Linux.

aMSN is close, but where is audio?, and boy does it look orrible?

To answer the thread title.............NO

Steve

[Sef]

As i have said on other threads, my daughter does not boot her ubuntu partition because she can't do audio/video IM.

Kopete can do audio/video, which supports multiple ims. So can gyachi if you are on yahoo.

[macogw]

I think that killer app may be strong but IM it is way up there in respect to linux adoption.
I think that the people that would happily adopt a Linux solution are the young and the old. The thirty somethings mabye forties that use a computer at work and probably home have grown up with windows and the applications that go with it, are the toughest to crack. Lets not forget that this issue is about applications users want not really the underlying OS.

I fit bathrooms for a living and see quite a few computer users that are of the older generation, not only that, quite a few have relatives abroad and they use IM to do audio/video messenging. Do you think these people have a clue about operating systems.....no they don't.

As i have said on other threads, my daughter does not boot her ubuntu partition because she can't do audio/video IM.

The situation the thread starter come across is exactly why Linux is not ready, if we can't attract young adopters, then what chance do we stand?

My laptop is ubuntu only, i have a webcam, can't use it though, i am prepared to wait till the situation changes, but as it stands i feel my pc use is not as rich as it should be.

I had to boot my wife's xp partition over xmas to use the new webcam i was bought so that she could see and talk to her sister in Miami. To be honest this really p****s me of.

The facts are that if pre-installed Linux computers were available in PC World tomorrow next to macs and pc's and the "end user" went home with, he or she would expect to be able to do at the very least what they could do on there old computer. Or maybe if this was there first computer what they had seen there friends do. And i think they are right to expect this.

Most of the things that make people go "ooh" "thats good " etc is around multimedia, and I am not aware of any distro that has this cracked.

I think that these types of issue are underestimated when it comes to getting people to use Linux.

aMSN is close, but where is audio?, and boy does it look orrible?

To answer the thread title.............NO

Steve

You can't use your webcam? Do you have V4L installed?　That usually supports them. Mine has a driver in the kernel, so it worked OOTB. By the way, she can do video/voice from Ekiga to Microsoft Live Messenger since Live uses SIP, which is a standard protocol. She can't do video to Skype, though. Voice will still work.

[styven]

I was not aware that kopete did voice as well as video, I will give it a try.
The issue around my webcam is really installing a driver. MY old logitech webcam works, but is only for video, my new Logitech pro 5000, does not. This I understand is not really down to Linux, but is still frustrating. If it was an obscure brand i would not mind so much.

[ragadanga63]

There's a Yahoo messenger for Linux. Still pretty ugly-looking though. I can't understand why they couldn't make it look exactly like their Windows version.

http://messenger.yahoo.com/unix.php

I'm aware of YM for linux but installing it has been a hellish experience. Can you teach us how you installed yours? Thanks.

[Mathiasdm]

I was not aware that kopete did voice as well as video, I will give it a try.
The issue around my webcam is really installing a driver. MY old logitech webcam works, but is only for video, my new Logitech pro 5000, does not. This I understand is not really down to Linux, but is still frustrating. If it was an obscure brand i would not mind so much.

http://linux-uvc.berlios.de/ (Right now, the link isn't working, so try Google cache (http://64.233.183.104/search?q=cache:DnNN_6cruG0J:linux-uvc.berlios.de/+linux+Logitech+pro+5000&hl=nl&gl=be&ct=clnk&cd=3&client=firefox-a)

Basically, the people on this website are busy developing drivers for your new webcam.

Once those drivers make it into the Linux kernel, you'll be able to use that webcam!

The development list (https://lists.berlios.de/pipermail/linux-uvc-devel/2006-December/thread.html) seems to contain a thread concerning your webcam.

I hope things will improve :)

[Gargamella]

*Sigh* people are superficial creatures, not much can be done to change that.

It is one of the major linux obstacles,isn't it? ](*,)

[califman831]

You failed to answer the previous posters question, did the kids install a legal version of windows? if not then by not doing anything you are teaching the kids to pirate software.

[K.Mandla]

Don't be mad with me. I hate the bad guys from Redmond. I even tried Fedora 2 years ago, and now I use Ubuntu.
My biggest Project is to collect PCs from people who bought new ones, and donate yo youth centers of teen agers in "not so good places". My question was what OS? I was convinced into Ubuntu and I donated 6 Pcs in the last month. It looks like a failure. The kids actually formatted and installed windows. Why?
- messengers: not the SAME behavior: they expected Yahoo to look like Yahoo, and ICQ like ICQ, etc. Certainly not different like GAIM. I use GAIM at home. It;s OK, not more than OK, but good for me. Not for them.
If you ask me - messenegers are number ONE to teens.
I've had the same problem. I've given away about a half-dozen computers, usually with Linux on them so they were functional at first boot. Unfortunately, all of them are now running pirated versions of Windows, because the owners didn't like or didn't want Linux -- they wanted Windows.

Personally, I don't care. I don't intend to prosletyze by force. But one of those people has come back already and said there was a virus on the machine, to which I shrugged my shoulders and went on with what I was doing.

It didn't make her happy, but I won't do tech support on Windows any more. It's not in my repertoire any longer to support a substandard operating system installed illegally over a perfectly functional, virus-proof, spyware-proof system. :-? If she hadn't installed Windows for her kid, she wouldn't be having that problem.

[Johnsie]

If you want to use yahoo for voice I recommend Gyachi. It's not as good as the real thing but you can supposedly talk with it.

http://gyachi.sourceforge.net/download.shtml

[Smuve]

I think it depends on how you look at it.
Is linux a good alternative to windows = yes.
Is linux an easy replacement for windows = no.

Linux would be a good alternative to windows if you started with a base computer and added peripherals with linux compatibility in mind.

Linux is much more difficult to manage if you are replacing windows and already own lots of additional hardware.

This is approximately the third time I've tried to make the transition from windows to linux. I tried Mandrake a long time ago. Then it was SUSE. Then Ubuntu Hoary?. Every time it keeps getting better and better. Hopefully this time, it will stick.

Unfortunately, the problem isn't with linux, it's with hardware manufacturers that don't support linux. From now on, I'll be voting with my dollars.

[Adamant1988]

Gaim doesnt have to follow with the smilies thingie. The issue is with video, cam, audio. The interface should look the same. Not a big deal from technical point of view.

As for alternative - how can OS be alternative with poor hardware?

actually, truth be told, it supports more hardware than it doesn't support. There are some issues with spotty drivers and such, but can you buy Mac OSX and run it without completely replacing all of your hardware? I bet not. I don't think it's unfair that you have to buy a compatible printer.

[Shay Stephens]

It is a real alternative. I'm a photographer using it full time now, my wife is using, and my parents are now using it too.

But it's not for everyone. Some will want windows, some mac. Being free to change the os is a wonderful thing. But just because the kids changed to windows for particular reasons doesn't mean that ubuntu isn't a viable alternative.

If I really have my sights set on having a cheeseburger, and I am offered a sub sandwich instead, I am going to be disappointed and try to find a way to get a cheeseburger. But that doesn't mean I might not turn around and enjoy that very same sub sandwich tomorrow.

[Quillz]

Yes, I would say that Ubuntu is a very real alternative to Windows, just like Mac OS X. And also like on the Mac, things work differently on Linux, but ultimately accomplish the same goal.

[karellen]

linux is linux, not a windows clone. it's different, it's free, it makes some people learn new things and adapt. the others simply stay with what they have (windows) and there's no problem with that

[Frak]

Replacement - Maybe, not at the moment though
Alternative - Absolutely

[karellen]

I like freedom of choice and software diversity - that's why I dual-boot ubuntu/xp

[jgrabham]

I like freedom of choice and software diversity - that's why I dual-boot ubuntu/xp

Yes but because everyone use MS`s crap, we have no choice. I have XP on my Laptop as I need to use it, but I have Ubuntu on my PC because I love it.

Therefore MS is a chore
Linux is loveable

[Mateo]

Mythtv is currently not an alternative to Media Center (for my needs), so to me the answer is no.

[karellen]

Yes but because everyone use MS`s crap, we have no choice. I have XP on my Laptop as I need to use it, but I have Ubuntu on my PC because I love it.

Therefore MS is a chore
Linux is loveable

it's not about ms crap(the os), it's about "crap" like photoshop or office 2007 or google talk with voice support or being able to watch webcam in yahoo mess and the list goes on. stop mixing things, confusing an os with it's software environment

[Redlance]

linux can be a replacement for some users. but not for others.
Its a great academic OS its also a great Server OS. It can be a good home OS. and for some it can be an AWESOME home OS. Others it wont. Its like saying Dr Pepper is a great Pepsi replacement. Well it can be.. if ya like DR. Pepper. Or if ya hate Pepsi. etc etc.
This really all academical and there is no real answer that applies. Its just personal tastes.
If ya like to game. GO GO GO WINDOWS! But take the bloat and the problems and the security crap from viruses to Validation to drm with it.
when is this thread gonna be merged with the same exact thread that has 600 or so messages in the same vein?