Karma for Microsoft?

[adam.tropics]

Microsoft sued by Alcatel over video patent abuses

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/6172214.stm

http://www.macworld.co.uk/business/news/index.cfm?newsid=16534

[steven8]

While it seems ironic, if we don't believe that Microsoft can go after Linux for IP infringement (it's basically silly) then this shouldn't go through either.

[DoctorMO]

Patent trolls are even worse than Microsoft, going after the market leader with patents is a bad move, even if they screwed you over.

You just have to learn to not deal with the devil.

[adam.tropics]

Forgive my ignorance if I am missing something, but how do you not deal with the market leader in a field that directly relates to your business, sooner or later you have to collide. Also, whilst I think the world has gone mad with relation to patents, Intellectual property etc, you can't let people/companies walk all over you just because they are a market leader, it's just not right.

[steven8]

I NEVER think you should let someone walk over you. EVER. But this is the subject of IP. We have all talked of how this is not right gainst Linux, so we need to stick by that.

[MaximB]

I don't get one thing
how can you sue a "closed source" company ?
I mean, you can't know which code they used to get it done
so how can you know that they stole from you ?

[steven8]

Well, it's just like the ridiculous. Ballmer claims. It's not about code, it's about a company supposedly mimicking something you did first. Intellectual Property. We did the 'click a button to do something' first, then you copied that idea.

I have not been defending Microsoft in any way. I am all for Microsoft getting tastes of their own foul medicine, but IP is IP. I don't think you can sue for that.

[justin whitaker]

I don't get one thing
how can you sue a "closed source" company ?
I mean, you can't know which code they used to get it done
so how can you know that they stole from you ?

You can go after companies that "look" like they do something similar to what you do, and claim prior art. That's how people have won against Microsoft before.

Alcatel has a stronger case, I would think, since they can say that without their drivers, their hardware works, and obviously, the hardware works in XP and Vista. Q.E.D.

[steven8]

without their drivers, their hardware works, and obviously, the hardware works in XP and Vista. Q.E.D.


Hmm. That raises a small question to me. My modem is a Toshiba, and the Toshiba site clearly states they have no Linux support for this device, yet the rndis_host driver allows it to work in Linux. Would tht allow Toshiba to sue the creator(s) of the rndis_host driver?

[DoctorMO]

Now you begining to see the sillyness of it.

If there were a task that could only be done one way then it wouldn't be patentable. (it's obviousness in this case is huge)

Prior Art is how you defend against fraudulent patents not how you win them.

Microsoft could use a patent troll 3rd party to attack Linux without cross patent suites.

If we knew what these 'reasonable' and lawful patents were we could work around them; because there must be more than one way to do something.

My personal stance is that patents shouldn't only be valid for 5 years after granting and then when the company owns more than 30% of a given market _all_ patents should be void because when the company controls both the market and the methods and artifacts it effects extortion on the customers and death to any reasonable competitors.

[MaximB]

Steven8 :
"Hmm. That raises a small question to me. My modem is a Toshiba, and the Toshiba site clearly states they have no Linux support for this device, yet the rndis_host driver allows it to work in Linux. Would tht allow Toshiba to sue the creator(s) of the rndis_host driver?"

no it won't
first - their interest is that there modems will work with Linux
second - think about wine and cedega , M$ never sued the developers for that.

[adam.tropics]

first - their interest is that there modems will work with Linux
second - think about wine and cedega , M$ never sued the developers for that.


...yet!

[MaximB]

they (the developers) wouldn't risk that.
sedega is a business after all.

[adam.tropics]

I don't know, but can't help but wonder how much further along we might be, if only we'd all stop wasting time and money suing each other!

[MaximB]

and think about all the gamestation emulators
like PS emulator, GBA emulator , sega , geniuses , xbox ....they are all legal. (the roms aren't if you don't own the game).

[cantormath]

You can go after companies that "look" like they do something similar to what you do, and claim prior art. That's how people have won against Microsoft before.

Alcatel has a stronger case, I would think, since they can say that without their drivers, their hardware works, and obviously, the hardware works in XP and Vista. Q.E.D.

We, The Linux Community, really really need to figure out a way to give him the middle finger and **** him off something terrible.
:evil:

[cantormath]

K,

I made the post

WHAT DO YOU THINK WOULD REALLY **** Steve Ballmer OFF? (http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=1796344#post1796344)

[localzuk]

Why are Alcatel, a market leader in a variety of fields (such as voip), patent trolls?

[DoctorMO]

Fair play, then why arn't Microsoft counter sueing? is it because their businesses are in different arienas?

[cantormath]

Fair play, then why arn't Microsoft counter sueing? is it because their businesses are in different arienas?

I think microsoft will sue in due time

[steven8]

Steven8 :
"Hmm. That raises a small question to me. My modem is a Toshiba, and the Toshiba site clearly states they have no Linux support for this device, yet the rndis_host driver allows it to work in Linux. Would tht allow Toshiba to sue the creator(s) of the rndis_host driver?"

no it won't
first - their interest is that there modems will work with Linux
second - think about wine and cedega , M$ never sued the developers for that.

Well, that makes sense. There has also been discussion about wine and cedega. They are doing nothing legally wrong providing a windows api framework in which to run programs, are they? People develop windows programs in free compilers, or Borland or whatnot, and access the windows api without paying MS one red cent. I do see, now that I read this, where it may be considered wrong. Would it be a 'breach' because they are physically lifting the api from windows and using it elsewhere?

I'm kind of doing a lot of just writing what I'm musing right now.

[blastus]

The whole thing about software patents is a circus. The overwhelming majority of software patents are anything but innovative. I wouldn't be surprised if less than 5% of them are truly genius. At least Microsoft is on the receiving end of some of the BS it dishes out.

I think I'm going to patent the double-click now. :)

[adam.tropics]

I think I'm going to patent the double-click now. :)

You can't since Apple already have the single click!!!