Puppy Linux Talk:

[RAV TUX]

downloading both puppy versions now, always a great Linux distro to add to your OS library.

Puppy version 2.12 is released! There are two iso files, puppy-2.12-seamonkey-zdrv.iso (83.1MB) and puppy-2.12-seamonkey.iso (68.0MB). The former has the zdrv_212.sfs file in it, which is a massive collection of kernel drivers and firmware, whereas the latter has a cutdown selection of drivers on a par with previous Puppies (but the zdrv_212.sfs file can be downloaded separately and Puppy will have automatic access to all of the extra drivers).

Download (http://puppylinux.org/user/downloads.php?cat_id=1) | Torrent (http://puppylinux.org/user/puppybt/) | Release Notes (18-Nov-06 entry) (http://puppylinux.org/user/readarticle.php?article_id=12)

"A few extra minor points to append to the release notes ..." http://puppylinux.org/user/themes/Prometheus/images/bullet.gif Posted by puppian (http://puppylinux.org/user/profile.php?lookup=4) on November 19 2006 11:56 Read More (http://puppylinux.org/user/news.php?readmore=36) · 0 Comments (http://puppylinux.org/user/news.php?readmore=36) · 7 Reads http://puppylinux.org/user/themes/Prometheus/images/printer.gif (http://puppylinux.org/user/print.php?type=N&item_id=36)
Downloads: 1. Puppy Linux Main Release Puppy Linux 2.12, puppy-2.12-seamonkey-zdrv.iso [NEW] puppy-2.12-seamonkey-zdrv.iso, 83.1M.
The greatest news for 2.12 is the support for a huge range of kernel modules, using a new "fetch on demand" system. There are also exciting new mini-applications developed by Puppy-enthusiasts.
puppy-2.12-seamonkey-zdrv.iso has the zdrv_212.sfs file in it, which is a massive collection of kernel drivers and firmware.

Make sure you have read the release notes (http://puppylinux.org/user/readarticle.php?article_id=12) (18-Nov-06) before downloading.

md5sum: 6de7e4ac9f66ddaaed56924ff2a85ca1 puppy-2.12-seamonkey-zdrv.iso
More information (http://puppylinux.org/user/readarticle.php?article_id=4)

License: O/S: Version: 2.12 Added: 19.11.06 Downloads: 9437 Download (http://puppylinux.org/user/downloads.php?cat_id=1&download_id=56) (83.1 MB)

Puppy Linux 2.12, puppy-2.12-seamonkey.iso [NEW] Puppy Linux Main Release, puppy-2.12-seamonkey.iso
The greatest news for 2.12 is the support for a huge range of kernel modules, using a new "fetch on demand" system. There are also exciting new mini-applications developed by Puppy-enthusiasts.
puppy-2.12-seamonkey.iso has a cutdown selection of drivers on a par with previous Puppies (zdrv_212.sfs file can be downloaded separately and Puppy will have automatic access to all of the extra drivers).

Make sure you have read the release notes (http://puppylinux.org/user/readarticle.php?article_id=12) (18-Nov-06) before downloading.

md5sum: f263e81d0f707438b0b0ba6de0f3bd4c puppy-2.12-seamonkey.iso
More information (http://puppylinux.org/user/readarticle.php?article_id=4)

License: O/S: Version: 2.12 Added: 19.11.06 Downloads: 34947 Download (http://puppylinux.org/user/downloads.php?cat_id=1&download_id=55) (68 MB)

[BigDave708]

That's amazing, RAV TUX.

[rattlerviper]

How is Puppy's open source spirit? Do they support freedom to use Puppy in any way you like, or do they try to regulate projects re mastering the distro?

[Peepsalot]

I don't even really consider Puppy open source by spirit...Read the FAQ section on the puppy homepage and you'll know why...I highly recomend anyone needing a light small distro give Damn small Linux a try...atleast they have a true open source spirit behind DSL.;)
Well, I just read it and I don't see what you are talking about. Why don't you just say what you mean.

Are you referring to this?

A Linux distribution is a Unix-like operating system comprising of the Linux kernel, the GNU operating system (or most of it), other assorted free software/open-source software, and possibly proprietary software.
This is giving a definition of a distro, and saying that some include proprietary software. Now I don't know if Puppy linux does or doesn't include proprietary software, but this statement does not necessarily show that it does.

[seshomaru samma]

The Puppy is amazing
I've been running Xubuntu on several old boxes and it was just too slow, I've switched to IceWM which made it faster but nobody could use it but me, they had to call me everytime they wanted anything done in it. Then I found Puppy, install in seconds (Xubuntu took over an hour),it runs as fast as the devil and it is very user friendly.
I do not understand qhat constitutes proprietary software ,but Puppy can play MP3

[RAV TUX]

The Puppy is amazing
I've been running Xubuntu on several old boxes and it was just too slow, I've switched to IceWM which made it faster but nobody could use it but me, they had to call me everytime they wanted anything done in it. Then I found Puppy, install in seconds (Xubuntu took over an hour),it runs as fast as the devil and it is very user friendly.
I do not understand qhat constitutes proprietary software ,but Puppy can play MP3

The Puppy is simply amazing!....nice that you can use deb + pup files.

[rattlerviper]

I thought I did just say it...From what I have read Puppy does not want you to remaster puppy without permision! this is not what I would consider in the open source spirit...


Well, I just read it and I don't see what you are talking about. Why don't you just say what you mean.

Are you referring to this?

This is giving a definition of a distro, and saying that some include proprietary software. Now I don't know if Puppy linux does or doesn't include proprietary software, but this statement does not necessarily show that it does.

[RAV TUX]

I thought I did just say it...From what I have read Puppy does not want you to remaster puppy without permision! this is not what I would consider in the open source spirit...

If this was true why do they list and encourage derivatives on their site?


1. Puppy Linux Main Release (http://www.puppylinux.org/user/downloads.php?cat_id=1) (7)GET THIS FIRST! Current version 2.12

2. Specialised Puppy by Enthusiasts (http://www.puppylinux.org/user/downloads.php?cat_id=3) (6)QEMU-Puppy, Windows 98 Puppy, etc

3. Puplets (Puppy derivatives) (http://www.puppylinux.org/user/downloads.php?cat_id=2) (5)Different versions of Puppy created by enthusiasts


Downloads: 3. Puplets (Puppy derivatives)Different versions of Puppy created by enthusiasts

Empty Crust Empty Crust is a barebones version of Puppy 1.0.7. Basically, Mozilla, the sound libs, pdf junk, and many other things were torn out. Basic utilities, gftp, pupget, and an enhanced Dillo were left. It is roughly 45 megabytes. The name is because it's like being suppied with an empty crust and being allowed to build your own custom pizza upon it (the reason for the pizza reference is due to its creator's "slight" insanity. More information (http://www.murga.org/%7Epuppy/viewtopic.php?t=5929)

md5 checksum:
f8c11d897d4fe6f7fe2cf6186f5c10d4 emptycrust107.iso
(file by Pizzasgood)

License: O/S: Version: Added: 19.03.06 Downloads: 1064 Download (http://www.puppylinux.org/user/downloads.php?cat_id=2&download_id=44) (45 MB)
http://www.puppylinux.org/user/themes/Prometheus/images/blank.gif


Grafpup Grafpup's goal is to be as useful to graphic designers and other imaging professionals as possible while still remaining extremely small and fast. How small? Grafpup is a live cd of only 75mb with current versions of Gimp, Cinepaint, Inkscape, and Scribus...
Latest version 1.0.2. More information (http://grafpup.com.nyud.net:8080/)

md5 checksum:
10209da59125db89e576c780dd832b58 Grafpup_standard-1.0.2.iso
(file by NathanF)

License: O/S: Version: 1.0.2 Added: 13.02.06 Downloads: 1130 Download (http://www.puppylinux.org/user/downloads.php?cat_id=2&download_id=6) (73.7 MB)
http://www.puppylinux.org/user/themes/Prometheus/images/blank.gif


Murga's 50M Mean Puppy It now takes up EXACTLY a mini-cd.

New features :
New compression and a couple of other system tweaks.
Mozilla now comes with a new theme and menu system that makes it look good.
Re-Arranged the desktop, changed some icons, resized others.
New RXVT theme for the desktop.
I have included the SP1 fixes...
More information (http://www.murga.org/%7Epuppy/viewtopic.php?p=19982#19982)

md5 checksum:
3E97354579865EBDAF6BBCCD7E514F15 puppy-1.0.5-mozilla-128Mb-Murga.iso
(file by John Murga)

License: O/S: Version: Added: 25.11.05 Downloads: 1224 Download (http://www.puppylinux.org/user/downloads.php?cat_id=2&download_id=7) (51.7 MB)
http://www.puppylinux.org/user/themes/Prometheus/images/blank.gif


PizzaPup +Uses pup015 to keep cool with other pups
+Rox 2.3
+Nicer GTK theme
+IceWM
+Firefox 1.0.7
+Dillo
... and more!
More information (http://www.murga.org/%7Epuppy/viewtopic.php?t=3145)

md5 checksum:
1cabfba446700c99ce36a692fc6f7bd0 pizzapup105.iso
(file by Pizzasgood)

License: O/S: Version: Added: 25.11.05 Downloads: 1062 Download (http://www.puppylinux.org/user/downloads.php?cat_id=2&download_id=15) (72 MB)
http://www.puppylinux.org/user/themes/Prometheus/images/blank.gif


SimplePup Designed to be clean and simple, SimplePup 0.3.1 does the basics of what most home desktop users need.... with the configurability of the XFCE window manager, pupget, and dotpups. Pupgets and Dotpups that you add yourself can be added to the XFCE menu via the menu editor.

Highlights:
-stripped down (based on Empty Crust 1.0.7)
-XFCE window manager
-Firefox 1.5.0.1 (with flash and gxine plugins)
-Thunderbird 1.5
-Abiword 2.4.1
-Perl 5.8 (use ndiswrapper right away for wireless cards)
-Graveman 0.3.8 (and upgraded burniso2cd)
-Gxine 0.4.6 (with added codecs)
-Mtpaint 2.10
-GQview 2.0.1
-some cleaned up graphics and stuff...
-... and of course, it still has all those other terrific Puppy qualities (stability, excellent hardware compatibility, helpful forum support, pupget management, etc.)
More information (http://www.murga.org/%7Epuppy/viewtopic.php?t=6949)

md5 checksum:
1f1edade135007706002b4b425c9f95a SimplePup-0.3.1.iso
(file by timcriger)
License: O/S: Version: Added: 23.03.06 Downloads: 2786 Download (http://www.puppylinux.org/user/downloads.php?cat_id=2&download_id=46) (81 MB)

[rattlerviper]

My guess is those are the approved ones...I'll try to get ahold of the link again and post it here.

[RAV TUX]

here are more:


Downloads: 2. Specialised Puppy by Enthusiasts

108 game CD 2 Here's a game ISO that has a modified xorgwizard that will set up 3D/DRI video acceleration and load all the libs. You can run it ram only boot if you want. Tested with some ATI cards, Radeon 7500 & 9250 (r100 & r200).

Version 2 now includes Tempestuous mach64 updates and the proprietary Nvidia (geforce & quadro) driver. The ISO creates a pup777 file instead of a pup001. The Reaction quake mod is removed and usr_devx, glxgears, and the pup777 zip file for NTFS are added. So now it's a 270MB download. If you select the Nvidia option from the xorgwizard it mounts usr_devx from the CD and runs the Nvidia installer / compiler.

Games included:
Quick 3, Armagetronad, D2X, Supertux, Tuxmath, bzflag, ppracer and DukeNukem

More information (http://www.murga.org/%7Epuppy/viewtopic.php?t=7892) | Previous version (http://www.murga.org/%7Epuppy/viewtopic.php?t=7134)
(file by kirk)
License: O/S: Version: Added: 21.05.06 Downloads: 1819 Download (http://www.puppylinux.org/user/downloads.php?cat_id=3&download_id=47) (270 MB)
http://www.puppylinux.org/user/themes/Prometheus/images/blank.gif
Puppy 109 Community Edition Puppy 109 Community Edition (P109CE) is released. This is a release of Puppy that follows on from version 1.0.8 and is created by a team of Puppy enthusiasts. It has many enhancements and features.

More information (http://puppylinux.org/wikka/Puppy109)
(Project Leader Nathan - Creator of Grafpup; XDG menus Rarsa; Styling Lior, Lobster, Tim Criger, Klh; Forum Host Teddog; Coding Barry, MU, PizzasGood, Dan, Kwiller)

License: O/S: Version: Added: 18.05.06 Downloads: 750 Download (http://www.puppylinux.org/user/downloads.php?cat_id=3&download_id=50) (65 MB)
http://www.puppylinux.org/user/themes/Prometheus/images/blank.gif
Puppy Installer for Windows XP This program installs Puppy Linux on your Windows drive (C:\). It will just download/copy files, but does not alter your partitions. This version can be used for future versions of Puppy, too. It has a small entry, where you can enter the release to install.

The Bootloader "Grub" is copied to C:\boot
Then grubinstall is run, and you get a new entry in your Windows XP Bootmenu.
This version of Grub does not alter your Partitions or bootsector!

Download the file and run Puppy-XP-installer-setup.exe.
Then you have an Icon on your Desktop to start it.

More information (http://www.murga.org/%7Epuppy/viewtopic.php?t=5117)
(file by MU)

License: O/S: Version: Puppy 1.0.7 Added: 25.02.06 Downloads: 2905 Download (http://www.puppylinux.org/user/downloads.php?cat_id=3&download_id=5) (2.2 MB)
http://www.puppylinux.org/user/themes/Prometheus/images/blank.gif
Puppy Virtual Machines Run Puppy Linux as a Virtual Machine using VMWARE's free player.

To use:
1) Install the VM Player (be patient and accept all the defaults unless you know what you are doing). Get VMPlayer here (http://www.vmware.com/products/player/)
2) Start the player, when it asks for a file point it to where you extracted the 62.9MB Puppy 1.0.7 VM. When asked about the virtual machine's configuration file, choose "Create", which is the default. It will complain that your G drive is not a CD Drive (if indeed it isn't), just click OK
3) Now Puppy 1.0.7 should start the boot process using Grub with no timeout set. Click once in the VM player windows (or press Ctrl+G) to start using Puppy. Press Ctrl+Alt to return to the other OS.

VM Configuration: 128 MB RAM, 500 MB Hard Drive, NAT for networking
Puppy Configuration: Using Xvesa, 800 x 600 x 16

More information (http://www.murga.org/%7Epuppy/viewtopic.php?t=5222)
(file by mayakovski)

License: O/S: Version: Puppy 1.0.7 Added: 07.03.06 Downloads: 2095 Download (http://www.puppylinux.org/user/downloads.php?cat_id=3&download_id=40) (62.9 MB)
http://www.puppylinux.org/user/themes/Prometheus/images/blank.gif
QEMU-Puppy QEMU-Puppy 1.0.9-1 released. It's based on, Puppy Linux 1.0.9 CE. No functional changes in Erik's patches or files.

QEMU-Puppy is an OS and a set of applications meant for a USB flash drive. This OS can be booted natively or on top of another, already installed, OS (currently Windows and Linux). Just borrow a PC, boot your own environment, and return the PC unaffected.

You can check the integrity of qemu-puppy.tar.gz with qemu-puppy-1.0.9-1.md5sum.txt (http://prdownloads.sourceforge.net/qemupuppy/qemu-puppy-1.0.9-1.md5sum.txt?download):
md5sum -c qemu-puppy-1.0.9-1.md5sum.txt

Torrent (http://linuxtracker.org/download.php?id=2068&name=qemu-puppy-1.0.9-1.tar.gz.torrent) | More information (http://www.erikveen.dds.nl/qemupuppy/index.html)
(file by Erik Veenstra)

License: O/S: Version: Puppy 1.0.9CE Added: 24.05.06 Downloads: 4608 Download (http://www.puppylinux.org/user/downloads.php?cat_id=3&download_id=2) (74 MB)
http://www.puppylinux.org/user/themes/Prometheus/images/blank.gif
Windows 98 Puppy Puppy Linux for Win98 ... works well with Windows 98.
No need for a floppy disk or CD-ROM drive.
Based on Puppy Linux 1.0.7 standard release.

More information:
Wiki (http://puppylinux.org/wikka/PupWin98) | Forum (http://www.murga.org/%7Epuppy/viewtopic.php?t=1425) | Homepage (http://www.freeveda.org/linux/puppy/)
(file by JaDy)

License: O/S: Version: Puppy 1.0.7 Added: 25.02.06 Downloads: 1500 Download (http://www.puppylinux.org/user/downloads.php?cat_id=3&download_id=4) (59 MB)

[RAV TUX]

Is this what you are looking for?

http://www.puppyos.com/faq.htm

Scroll down and begin reading at:


Q: Where do I get the source code for Puppy?


also read the answer to this question:


Q: May I release my own distro based on Puppy?

and this one:
Q: What are the legal details?

_______________________________________


also see this statement:


How to name your Puppy distro
Monday, August 28, 2006, 02:18 PM
It's fine (and fun) to create your own "flavour" of Puppy. With regard to naming, however, there does need to be some thought. If you have created what I call a "flavour" of Puppy, perhaps by using the remaster-CD script or Unleashed, it's okay to use "Puppy" in the name, for example "MeanPuppy".

However, if you want to go that extra step and maintain your creation as a separate distro., then there is a requirement for product differentiation. I have been in discussion with Ladislav (from Distrowatch) and John Murga and we have agreed on a basic requirement. It is thought that people may become confused seeing multiple distros listed on distrowatch with the name "Puppy".

Nathan has created "Grafpup", Hacao has created "Hacao Linux", and as John would like to list his 50M Puppy on distrowatch he has agreed to name it "MeanPup".
We agree that the string "Pup" is adequate product differentiation.

An exception to this will be the "Puppy Community Edition", which is managed by the not-yet-in-existence Puppy Foundation, and is not to be thought of as a separate distro to "Puppy" but as a flavour. That is, it is puppy re-dressed by the inner development committee of the Puppy community. Perhaps ultimately the "CE" edition will replace my own.

[ 34 comments ] (http://www.puppyos.net/news/comments.php?y=06&m=08&entry=entry060828-141848) ( 700 views )http://www.puppyos.net/news/index.php?entry=entry060828-141848

[RAV TUX]

If you really need help with Puppy refer to this online book:

click the image to go to the book's site:
http://img237.imageshack.us/img237/8250/puppyfordummiesdt2.png (http://tmxxine.com/Wikka/wikka.php?wakka=PuppyLinux)

[rattlerviper]

Thanks Rav Tux that indeed was the page I was looking for.

Makes me question their open source philosophy by attempting to control re masters and derivative work. If I understand the quoted text one must ask for permission prior to working on a project. And that permission would be denied if you intended to create a a new distro from it that was intended to supplant the original puppy project. In other words if you fork the distro and come out with one that is highly competive to the point that it makes Puppy second class to it then I assume they would get upset?

I won't argue that puppy is not a good distro as it is excellent, just not the right one for me, and I also have worries about the quoted text attempting to water down the GPL. It would be interesting to know if someone failed to comply would there actually be any legal recourse(not if they would do anything, but could they?). I don't really know the answer to that question, but the statements made concern me.

PS: I had to edit out the quote because it plainly says no part of the webpage may be reproduced elsewhere...So I guess everyone will just have to follow your link and find it themselves ;)

[RAV TUX]

PS: I had to edit out the quote because it plainly says no part of the webpage may be reproduced elsewhere...So I guess everyone will just have to follow your link and find it themselves ;)

I had to do the same thing;)

[rattlerviper]

I had to do the same thing;)Not real open source of their developer if you ask me...Oh well. It is a nice distro though LOL.

[RAV TUX]

Not real open source of their developer if you ask me...Oh well. It is a nice distro though LOL.
I think most people can read and form their own opinions on this subject matter.

[RAV TUX]

Firefox in the new Puppy.

[rowanparker]

Are they allowed to do that if they under GPL?

[rattlerviper]

Are they allowed to do that if they under GPL?That was my question too(but you know that since you pointed this issue out to me a week or so ago;) )

[RAV TUX]

The only thing they are asking is to protect thier trademark not much unlike Ubuntu or any other Linux distro....I think you guys are reading too much in to it.

I think their policy is great and should be a model for ALL Linux distros to follow, the fact that the developer is willing to personal review each derivative so you don't screw things up for yourself, is simply awesome, above and beyond what any other Linux distro developer is willing to do.

I commend him for his EXTRA effort in maintaining an awesome Linux,...OS

In fact I would say they are more in line with GPL then anyone else out there, if you understand it for what it really is.

As far as frequent edits to the page being made and the dev requesting you link to the site instead of qoute again is an EXTRA simply awesome step to maintain integrity. A Linux model that ALL should follow!

[RAV TUX]

Don't fear the Puppy it won't bite in fact you may fall in love with this puppy.

I do have to say after testing the new version that now as always they have the most awesome package management system (pup-get), next to Emerge that is.;)

[rowanparker]

So it's like what Mozilla does with FireFox apart from they released it under a seperate license?

[steven8]

I am going to have to get the new puppy!! Thanks, RAV TUX!

[RAV TUX]

So it's like what Mozilla does with FireFox apart from they released it under a seperate license?

It's like what Ubuntu does with Ubuntu.

[RAV TUX]

I am going to have to get the new puppy!! Thanks, RAV TUX!

Good Welcome!;)

[rowanparker]

It's like what Ubuntu does with Ubuntu.
How?

[RAV TUX]

How?
Protecting the Trademark.

[rowanparker]

But you can use the Ubuntu name in spin-offs can't you?

[cantormath]

Is it deb based, yum, rpm etc......?

[wilberfan]

What a cute little feller! This may be just the distro for my friends archaic box that's grunting along under XP! 8)

[RAV TUX]

Is it deb based, yum, rpm etc......?

it is an independent distro built by the dev.

but uses Pup-Get and Deb

unless a new development has been added or changed?

[RAV TUX]

What a cute little feller! This may be just the distro for my friends archaic box that's grunting along under XP! 8)

yes, this is an awesome distro for this purpose.

[ragadanga63]

Thanks to this Thread. I now have a replacement for all the clunky Windows 95 running on the old boxes in the school where i'm working. Bye bye Bill!!!

[justin whitaker]

unless a new development has been added or changed?

It's now source based.

They switched to the T2 plaform with 2.10.

http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=10421

http://www.t2-project.org/

[Flint and Tinder]

Tried this distro myself and can vouch for it.

Maybe doesn't support newer hardware/laptops though, I ran it off a live CD on my Macbook, it didn't like the trackpad or a USB mouse, I had problems with the keyboard typing twice e.g. uubbuunnttuu and though it is meant to be loaded in to RAM it ran really slowly.

That said I ran it on a much older system and it worked like a charm with mouse and keyboard support out the box and properly fast when running it.

If your looking for a small OS for an old desktop, this is a good choice.

[presbp]

I am not getting much help at all with puppy linux on their forums. here is my problem..

First off I formatted my 64MB USB thumbdrive as FAT. My PC will not boot puppy from the CD so I have to go use an older Dell PC to run the boot CD. When I boot the latest version of barebones puppy CD it works correctly in the Dell and then I put the USB flash drive in and go to the Puppy Universal Installer. I chose to install to the USB flash drive and just told it to install as default but then a screen popped up saying it will be installed as a super floppy in which there are no partitions and some other stuff. I said ok and then told it to install. I then took it to my new computer and plugged it into the USB port. I booted the computer up and went to the BIOS and chose the USB CBM Flash or something similar to that to boot before the floppy in the removable media category. The PC exited the BIOS and then completely skipped the USB and went straight to the harddrive. Syslinux was put on the USB device when puppy was installed via the puppy universal installer.

I was told that I should format the USB thumbdrive as FAT32 instead of FAT and that I should do something about partitioning it using gparted from a PC that has already booted puppy. Do I have to partition it as the first partition for barebones puppy and leave the remaining 12mb for file storage and then install puppy? Is there some editing I have to do to some core files of puppy or something to make it boot properly? Please help.

[mips]

Maybe this would be a better location:
http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=302974

or

http://ubuntuforums.org/forumdisplay.php?f=147

[Artemis3]

Enter bios and enable usb legacy or usb dos support, enable "boot other devices" if available.

http://assistance.orange.fr/Image/107_aext_17_e_chipset.gif
http://www.quepublishing.com/content/images/art_upgrade01_04_01/elementLinks/LegacyFig01_300.jpg
http://common.packardbell.com/itemnr/instr_bios_atlas_s_dc/bios_atlas_sdc_advanced.gif

If available, try usb fdd:
http://www.techpowerup.com/articles/34/images/boothdd.jpg

Or usb hdd:
http://www.msi-korea.co.kr/images/page/faq/2004/0322/3th/usb%20boot.jpg
http://www.netzwelt.de/images/articles/usbxp_biosreihenfolge_kl_1145625269.jpg

[RAV TUX]

moving to the other os forum