Is ubuntu going to slowly fade out?

[user1397]

i was just pondering on this subject, because it seems to me that Mark Shuttleworth just spends and spends money on ubuntu, but isn't gaining much from it. He gives away free cd's (bless him) and he gave like $10 million to the ubuntu foundation. he must spend a lot of $ on maintaining servers, offices, and the official ubuntu website, plus he has to pay all of the coders at canonical, and does all of this out of benevolence. he does not charge anything for any ubuntu version, even the server one.

unless i see some proof of shuttleworth getting something out of this huge investment, i'm thinking Shuttleworth might turn his eyes elsewhere, or abandon the project altogether.

any thoughts?

[maniacmusician]

no, he won't, not for a good long while. and if he ever does, the good community will step up to the task and take over.

Canonical does provide fee-based support for Ubuntu users, and they make at least some money off of that. I'm sure they have other sources of income that just aren't wildly advertised. I can't see ubuntu fading out anytime soon, it's just too visible to the general public. it's in a spotlight (as much as a linux distro can be), so I have no such fears.

[user1397]

no, he won't, not for a good long while. and if he ever does, the good community will step up to the task and take over.

Canonical does provide fee-based support for Ubuntu users, and they make at least some money off of that. I'm sure they have other sources of income that just aren't wildly advertised. I can't see ubuntu fading out anytime soon, it's just too visible to the general public. it's in a spotlight (as much as a linux distro can be), so I have no such fears.yes i forgot to mention it, but i did know that they sell support for ubuntu users, desktop or server. apart from that tho, Mark's pockets seem like they're going to be empty in a few years. are there any actual pieces of evidence that shuttleworth is selling support for ubuntu? has any company completely switched to ubuntu?

[maniacmusician]

Actually, I think Canonical also develops another version of linux that they sell commercially. I forget what it's called...but I think it has a lot of Ubuntu-derived code and then some. They probably sell that and make some money.

edit: impi linux http://www.impilinux.co.za/

canonical doesn't officially sell it I guess, but Shuttleworth made an investment in it, and on top of it being already great, it has access to everything Ubuntu which will make it phenomenal. I'm assuming Shuttleworth is hoping to get a large return on his investment.

[enopepsoo]

I checked the canonical website and did not see any commercial linux. This doesn't mean that it does not exist though. If only life were so easy. :razz:

I thought there was a commercial version of Ubuntu that comes with 5 year support...

[Bezmotivnik]

My suspicion is that the Next Big Distro will come from some outfit like Google or another deep-pockets, anti-Microsoft business entity with huge amounts of money to squander on the project.

Ubuntu will be eclipsed by some other distribution eventually. It's just the way Linux works.

The only serious question is whether the marketplace will even notice. :confused:

[maniacmusician]

for those who didn't catch the link, see my edit above. the distro is called ImpiLinux

@Bezmotivnik: I sort of agree. Even google has implicitly said that it doesn't plan on releasing Goobuntu (yes it apparently does exist lol) to the public, I have a suspicion that they'd like to work on it in private and show it to the world eventually.

But they desperately want to outdo microsoft...this would be a great victor for them. So I don't think they'll release until they have it perfected. For instance, they'll probably want full-on hardware support, and amazing graphics (along the lines of xgl/aiglx), stuff that will beat Vista out of the box, no ifs ands or buts about it. If anyone can do it, if anyone has the resources for it, it's google.

[Bezmotivnik]

But they desperately want to outdo microsoft...this would be a great victor for them. So I don't think they'll release until they have it perfected...If anyone can do it, if anyone has the resources for it, it's google.
I don't think anyone other than Google has both the money and the willingness to support a general-purpose OS for the broad public.

I think that if cooler heads prevail, Google will back away from this as not even they have the resources to defeat the vast technical and developmental problems that prevent desktop Linux from being a genuinely competitive and popular OS. As I've said here many times, that would in itself take multiple billions of dollars and years of development, plus the entire third-party hardware and software industries have to get on board and support it for it to really fly. I simply don't see that happening, particularly the second part.

But someone at Google may see it differently.

[xhaan]

Shuttleworth founded HBD Venture Capital, which invests in Impi Linux, among other companies.

I doubt Shuttleworth is hurting for money with a venture capital agency.

[maniacmusician]

that's true, which is why I said that if it happens, it will happen after a long time. Google won't want to release something that is imperfect or inferior to Microsoft's products. I think that if they do go about it, they'll spend a few years working on it behind the scenes. People at google have incredible amounts of talent and enthusiasm...if anyone can reverse engineer hardware all day and night, it's them. They have the resources and the money to spend on it. Their revenue goes up every year just from the products they supply now (that list grows quickly), so they can afford to invest in something big like an OS. Ubuntu has done so much of the work for them. They could probably concentrate solely on hardware and borrow the rest from ubuntu, and they would have a chance of being successful.

[Bezmotivnik]

I doubt Shuttleworth is hurting for money with a venture capital agency.
I read an article the other day that placed his personal net worth in excess of $1B. True? I dunno. I'm not worried about Ubuntu bankrupting him with those free CDs. :rolleyes:

[xhaan]

that's true, which is why I said that if it happens, it will happen after a long time. Google won't want to release something that is imperfect or inferior to Microsoft's products. I think that if they do go about it, they'll spend a few years working on it behind the scenes. People at google have incredible amounts of talent and enthusiasm...if anyone can reverse engineer hardware all day and night, it's them. They have the resources and the money to spend on it. Their revenue goes up every year just from the products they supply now (that list grows quickly), so they can afford to invest in something big like an OS. Ubuntu has done so much of the work for them. They could probably concentrate solely on hardware and borrow the rest from ubuntu, and they would have a chance of being successful.

Now all they need to do is make a good search engine. :p

[Bezmotivnik]

Now all they need to do is make a good search engine. :p
The reason Google's search engine is junk from the user's standpoint is because it's profitable for Google for it to be that way. End of story. It could be made hugely more serviceable by the trivial inclusion of simple methods to optionally filter retail sites from user searches, for example, but this would cut into Google's revenues.

I don't like Google, nor trust them, and I absolutely don't think they're ever going to set up their products to serve my interests before their own. I don't see them putting billions of dollars into an open-source OS that can be stripped of the sophisticated data mining spyware that would inevitably be among its central functions.

[xhaan]

The reason Google's search engine is junk from the user's standpoint is because it's profitable for Google for it to be that way. End of story. It could be made hugely more serviceable by the trivial inclusion of simple methods to optionally filter retail sites from user searches, for example, but this would cut into Google's revenues.

I don't like Google, nor trust them, and I absolutely don't think they're ever going to set up their products to serve my interests before their own. I don't see them putting billions of dollars into an open-source OS that can be stripped of the sophisticated data mining spyware that would inevitably be among its central functions.

It's not that I mind the retail sites so much, it's the fact that the engine doesn't seem to take my queries seriously.

For example, "S.A.M." will fetch Sam, it messes with things I put in quotes and changes the tense of verbs, among other things.

[maniacmusician]

their search has been a little less satisfactory these days, but that's because they're a large target for scammers, and all the wrong type of people. As the biggest search engine around, they have to combat the largest amount of junk.

I personally love google. I think they come out with excellent products, some of which I use on a daily basis. Of course they like to be commercial and make money, it's not like there's anything wrong with that. I don't really see how their products primarily serve their interests.

They have such a large list of products...the tons of different specific search sites, Picasa, Earth, Page Creator, Notebook, Analytics, Trends, Spreadsheets, Suggest, etc etc. Most of these products are free and enhance my browsing experience. [shrug] i'm perfectly satisfied with them. As for trust, they didn't cave in to the U.S. gov'ts request for information on users, and although this can be construed as a publicity stunt in some ways, it was still acting mainly on behalf of the user. They do some questionable things, but for the most part, i find them to be an honest, efficient company

[3rdalbum]

I read somewhere that Canonical had customised a version of Ubuntu for one particular business... I can't remember which one. Jane Silber also said something about a big deal with a bank.

[Dr. C]

And what is Ubuntu worth today?

Novell paid about $210 million for SUSE Linux back in 2003

http://www.informationweek.com/story/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=16000174

[drucer]

Ubuntu is not going to fade away. Ubuntu will be around for as long as you and I live. That foundation has enough funds to ensure that no matter what happens to Mark or anybody else.

[aysiu]

Google and Sun are Ubuntu clients.

Shuttleworth spent $20 million on a "for fun" trip to space.

He has enough to last. Don't worry.

[weatherman]

rather than producing their own os I think it would make more sense for a big company to buy some smaller linux developing company, (for example google buying canonical) as it happened with novell/suse.I don't see ubuntu fading away anytime soon, unless it looses the great community it has.

[drucer]

Ubuntu is not for sale - never. Not now or in the future. There is never going to be commercial Enterprise version of Ubuntu like Redhat or Suse.

Mark has said Ubuntu has enough funds to be around for as long as we live. Watch his DebConf speech - link below. That will make it clear.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1165754797197197496

[missmoondog]

slightly off topic here, but sure am glad to see i'm not the only non google fanboy around. googles buying spree WILL end and so will there popularity eventually. they ARE NOT the greatest search engine around either, whether you want to believe that or not. it's amazing how many people will blindly follow others just because they say it the coolest. i don't think people have the ability to think on their own anymore, for the most part.

now, back on topic:
very doubtful if ubuntu is going anywhere soon after having all that money invested in it.

[katiad]

they ARE NOT the greatest search engine around either, whether you want to believe that or not. it's amazing how many people will blindly follow others just because they say it the coolest. i don't think people have the ability to think on their own anymore, for the most part.


Also slightly off topic, but I couldn't help but say that it's amazing how many people who object to any particular popular thing (google, windows, various movies, whatever) love to say that "it's amazing how many people will blindly follow others" - as if people who like popular things ONLY like them because they're popular. I like Google because it works - for me. I have yet to meet a search engine that matches its efficiency - for me. I disagree that it "isn't the great search engine around" - I could just as easily say "they are, whether you believe it or not". But it's all my opinion - just as your opinion is yours.

I use Google religiously because I've never found anything else that suits my needs better, not because someone else said: "Oh, this is cool, use it." I use Ubuntu because it suits my needs better - not because it's in the top 5 list at distrowatch, and because I've read dozens of reviews speaking its wonders.

It's fine if you're not a fanboy, and you don't like something. But insisting that your opinion on a particular thing is the correct one for everyone "whether you believe it or not", and that anyone who disagrees is just blindly following the herd and can't think on their own is insulting and silly.

On topic - I doubt Ubuntu will fade away anytime soon - seems to have a great community backing it, a lot of support, and Shuttleworth doesn't seem to be in any danger of running out of money due to free cds. :) I'm sure they've got more long-term financial planning in place to support it!

[croak77]

There is never going to be commercial Enterprise version of Ubuntu like Redhat or Suse.


He is the majority share holder, 65%, of Impi Linux. Which seems similer to Redhat or Suse.

[SlugO]

He is the majority share holder, 65%, of Impi Linux. Which seems similer to Redhat or Suse.I don't think it's an enterprise version of Ubuntu. More like a different distro that might build on Ubuntu code.

[croak77]

It based on Dapper and it says, "ImpiLinux is fully compatible with Ubuntu, meaning that any one of the 14000 software packages available in the Ubuntu "Universe" repository can be loaded onto any ImpiLinux distribution at any time"

"Impi Linux offers four primary product streams:
- The free to use evaluation edition, ImpiLinux 6.01(Duty Free);
- Enterprise desktop and desktop server products (Business Class);
- Custom-built distributions tailor-made to a customer's specific requirements (Premier Class);
- Ubuntu (Economy Class), also free to use."

Sounds like enterprise Ubuntu to me. Only catch is it's designed and marketed for South Africa not the world.

[DoctorMO]

Wouldn't you want to keep your money making dealings on a low key incase it hurt the community that brings the strenth behind your distro?

[TheMono]

I don't have a problem with it at all, good on him for producing Ubuntu when he could just as easily have ONLY done an enterprise version.

And from what I can tell, their Business Class version is simply Ubuntu + propietary stuff, ie, graphics drivers, DVD decoding (legit), MP3 etc, all legit, plus support for MS Office. It's basically just Ubuntu plus all these other things, so it is a legal way of doing what a lot of people already do with Ubuntu, and preferable for companys who just want their Ubuntu to work out of the box without extra codec installs etc.

I for one hope it sells well and makes him a bit of money - I know if I ran a business I'd want to kick some money his way.

[user1397]

Google and Sun are Ubuntu clients.

Shuttleworth spent $20 million on a "for fun" trip to space.

He has enough to last. Don't worry.damn so google and sun use ubuntu as their primary OS? or just a secondary OS? and they pay Canonical for server support?

[sanderella]

If it is really important to anyone to know how much Mark Shuttleworth (God bless him) is worth, why don't you just go ahead and ask him? That's what emails are for. :D

[croak77]

damn so google and sun use ubuntu as their primary OS? or just a secondary OS? and they pay Canonical for server support?

Don't thinnk google has said what they use Ubuntu for. Just that they use it internally. Canonical and Sun have partnered so that Ubuntu will run on Niagra.

[moore.bryan]

from what i read, google uses ubuntu internally, but has some developers using other linux systems.
-sidebar-
if google isn't the best, what is? (honestly, just asking... i always want to make my life and net searching more efficient)
;-)
-end sidebar-

[maniacmusician]

there's no one best search engine. Different search engines are good for different things. I saw an article on it a few months back :/ wish I could find it. But google is good for certain types of queries and other search engines are good for different types of queries. I don't really remember any specifics. I just use google because they serve my need.

btw, I wasn't trying to be a google fanboy...I don't even use google search all that much. I think their desktop products, more than anything, are really good. They also do a service to smaller companies by buying them up and providing them with funding, if they like the projects that the small company is working on.

For instance they've bought services like Writely and Blogger and help made them a lot better, helped them get into the spotlight. They have products of their own like Google Notebook, which make browsing so much easier. If I want to remember something for later, all I have to do is highlight, right click, and say "Note this". and it's good for organizing information. But that's just my personal opinion I guess.

On the topic of Ubuntu, if it ever does fade out, it probably won't be in our lifetime. And even if it is, that would mean it died out due to competition from other distros. And as lamentable as that is, it also means there will be lots of other great distros out there.

for now though, i'm an ubuntu guy.