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kostkon
September 1st, 2006, 06:35 PM
Which team beat the so-called Dream Team, the so-called best of the world and went to the finals at the World Basketball Championships 2006 (Mundobasket 2006).

Of course, the best European team, the European Champion Greece. Now you can see that the europeans can play better basketball than the americans can do. Who's your daddy now, who's your daddy?! :tongue: :tongue:

Here is the European Dream Team
http://www.geocities.com/kostas291/greece.jpg

Take this USA!! (Hellas==Greece)
http://www.geocities.com/kostas291/take_this.jpg

Brunellus
September 1st, 2006, 06:48 PM
many congratulations to the Greek squad. The U.S. team still needs to learn how to play defense, evidently.

USA basketball is in a serious rebuilding phase, and will remain so for a while, I think. They'll need to decide on their "reliable" team, and then work on making them play more effectively as a team. One-on-one trashtalking contests won't do it.

kostkon
September 1st, 2006, 07:28 PM
Yeah, I agree. Now the final on Sunday for the world champion title!! Greece VS Spain.

Onyros
September 1st, 2006, 09:17 PM
many congratulations to the Greek squad. The U.S. team still needs to learn how to play defense, evidently.

USA basketball is in a serious rebuilding phase, and will remain so for a while, I think. They'll need to decide on their "reliable" team, and then work on making them play more effectively as a team. One-on-one trashtalking contests won't do it.Civility in person, I'm glad to see you accepting and acknowledging the US defeat in such a way (even after the mindless taunting). You guys probably needed some of the Chuck Daly attitude, in terms of defense. Trying to outscore the opponent in every game didn't work for the Suns, internally, so that should have served as a lesson. I actually thought coach K would emphasize defense, but much to my surprise that didn't happen.

These days I'm actually much happier because Chris Mullin finally had the guts to kick Mike Montgomery's **** back to Furd and bring back Nellie to coach my Warriors :D

RUN BJM*, we're good to go :P

(*Baron, Jason, Mike)

teet
September 1st, 2006, 11:32 PM
I've only gotten to see the US play once or twice (most of the games come on at 5:30 AM here in the US).

The US team has a lot of talent, there's no denying that. I mean, Lebron James, Dwayne Wade, and Carmelo Anthony all on the same team...that's craziness. I remember a few times last season when Lebron would just go running into the lane like a freight-train, bounce off a few defenders and still have enough power to dunk it in another defender's face. He can literally be unstoppable at times. Same thing for Wade. He took over games in the fourth quarter of the NBA finals this year...he honestly reminded me of MJ a few times.

But, when I watched the US team play this summer it was almost as if there was too much talent on the floor. No one guy seemed to want to take over and dominate the game. I've heard people talk about sending the current NBA champions to the world games instead of a "dream team" and honestly that might work better.

Also, I often wonder how well the TRUE top 12 NBA players would fair in the world games. Remember, this team had no Kobe, Garnett, AI, T-Mac, Duncan, or Shaq.

Anyways, congrats to the Greece team. Maybe I'll be able to catch the rerun sometime.

-teet

jimrz
September 2nd, 2006, 02:33 AM
many congratulations to the Greek squad. The U.S. team still needs to learn how to play defense, evidently.

USA basketball is in a serious rebuilding phase, and will remain so for a while, I think. They'll need to decide on their "reliable" team, and then work on making them play more effectively as a team. One-on-one trashtalking contests won't do it.

+1 ... I have been saying for several years that the current version of NBA Showtime (a form of entertainment (?)loosely based on the game of basketball) is ruining US basketball...most laughed at this 4-5 years ago, but no more.

Jimrz - NYC born and raised, learned to love / play the game on the asphalt, former Division I point guard who hates where this utter obsession with flash and complete disdain for fundamentals has taken my game.

my $0.02 ... rant over

songo
September 2nd, 2006, 02:42 AM
Also, I often wonder how well the TRUE top 12 NBA players would fair in the world games. Remember, this team had no Kobe, Garnett, AI, T-Mac, Duncan, or Shaq.
True! but this guys are spoiled. even if they played for their national team they wouldn't play as they do for their billion $ NBA's paying teams. on the other hand the other players still play with their heart. who went to the final? greece and spain. and argentina did well too...

Brunellus
September 2nd, 2006, 03:46 AM
It's not about talent anymore.

In 1992, the original Dream Team unleashed basketball pwnage on a world that had no credible top-level basketball stars. International programs were not training to the same level.

Things started to change. I remember when Vlade Divacs and Tony Cucoc were unusual in the NBA because they were non-American. Now, there are many non-Americans in the league, playing with teams which are competitive at the highest professional level. They go back to their home countries and raise the game there--both by inspiring younger players and actually making their teammates better in the international game.

1) PLAYER DEVELOPMENT AND TRAINING. It may seem strange that the country with, arguably, the largest pool of talented basketball players in the world should struggle with player development. But the fact is that while the US has historically been able to turn out players with tremendous natural talent, there is a difference between a merely talented player and a capable player. Talented players use their physical gifts to overpower individual opponents--go to any playground in the country, and you'll see guys using great physical skill to beat their opponents one-on-one.

If your guys are big enough, fast enough, and quick enough, they can bully and intimidate the other side. They can drive the pace of the game, leave their opponents flat-footed, and go right to the rim.

But if the other side decides it's not going to be scared, and decides instead to play basketball, what happens? Physical gifts are NOT enough to get you through a determined, organized, and disciplined defense. Nor is it possible to power your way through or physically intimidate an opponent in a game whose rules are enforced much more strictly than the NBA's current non-enforcement. The individual superstars fail to coordinate, get frustrated, and foul. Suddenly, there are no superstars, and the only team standing is the team that is disciplined.

In an earlier age, the NCAA (college/university-level "amateur") game provided that discipline, bridging the gap between the physical talents of its players and their need to develop and mature. But after 1992, the trend was to recruit younger and younger players. First players left the college game a year early, then two years early. Then, a number of players simply bypassed college altogether and went straight to the NBA. What had once been an intensive four-year development league began to suffer. The best individual players were leaving, or not coming to the NCAA at all. The overall level of play deteriorated.

Worst of all, the young players went straight into an NBA that was right in the middle of a major generational change. Guys who had been in the league for 10 years or more were retiring and taking their grasp of the fundamentals with them. Kids with great streetball but poor fundamentals and defense were taking their places. Nobody was left to teach or mold these young players. So we were left with a generation of physically tremendous players who were also poorly-trained in fundamental basketball, as well as indisciplined and emotionally-unstable into the bargain.

There *must* be some way of improving young-player development. Baseball has its minor league farm system. Basketball would do very well to follow that example.

2) RULES AND OFFICIATING. The NBA is most definitely not FIBA: it is rougher, more focused on pure offense and physical confrontation--and that's just the rulebook. In the actual officiating, there has been a tremendous drop in quality. Players who themselves are not fundamentally sound are getting away with murder on the court--it's hard to see a "crossover" move these days that wouldn't have been ruled a carry before; the previously-illegal three- and four-step layupshave made their mark; pivots are executed sloppily. Yet the officials make no move to punish players for their sloppy play in the name of keeping the game quick and exciting. The result is that when these same 'superstars' get out into FIBA competition, they are bewildered at 'bad' officiating that is really merely punishing their poor control.

3) NATIONAL TEAM SELECTION. Much has been made about the "best" US players not being on the national team. There's a lot to that. But the presence of Kobe/Shaq/whoever does not change the fundamental weaknesses of the US game as a whole. It's hard to play disciplined, precise team basketball when you're only a team for six weeks. The competitive nations select their teams, keep them together, and have them train together frequently. It shows in the ease with which they are able to execute set plays and organize their defenses. USA Basketball, in my opinion, is wasting its time going after the "best" players. Instead, it should be going after the "most reliable" players--the ones who are willing to go out, train and compete together, as a team, for the USA. If that means going back to pre-1992 practice and recruiting only NCAA "amateurs," I'm all for it.

Sorry to have ranted at length, but this is something I've really been thinking about for years.

jacksaff
September 2nd, 2006, 07:32 AM
The next US representative basketball team should be labelled the Dream-On Team. Would do wonders for their attitude methinks.