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irv
March 27th, 2014, 08:25 PM
There are many articles on the Internet about tablets out selling laptops. I am a laptop user, but I also have a tablet. In fact I am writing this on my tablet right now. (using Android). Between the release of Win8 and tablets running other OS' I believe it has hurt Ubuntu. At least I see it in my daily use of electronics. Also It has been awhile since I have been on the forum. Maybe so of you thought I died or just droped off the grid.
What's your thoughts.

mattlach
March 27th, 2014, 08:40 PM
Not really.

Ubuntu doesn't sell their services to end desktop / laptop users. Large enterprises pay them for support on their implementations, but we don't, so they aren't really hurt if people move away from Ubuntu.

That being said, Ubuntu (and other Linux distribution) users, are more likely than not to be the type of power users who would chafe at the limitations of your typical tablet. They might buy a tablet, but they would never replace their main computer with one. This might be more of a concern for Windows and OSX, but I doubt it for desktop linux.

Furthermore, with 14.04, Ubuntu will officially run on ARM tablets (at least some of them) so this will reduce the migration further.

I - for one - look forward to giving Ubuntu a test drive on my 2013 Nexus 7 tablet once dual booting on the Nexus 7 is stable.

irv
March 27th, 2014, 08:48 PM
Good information. I have a Asus Transformer TF300T I would love to have Ubuntu running on. I don't think I can do this without some help. Maybe 14.04 will run on it I don't know. If it does I have no idea how I would install it.

mattlach
March 27th, 2014, 08:53 PM
Good information. I have a Asus Transformer TF300T I would love to have Ubuntu running on. I don't think I can do this without some help. Maybe 14.04 will run on it I don't know. If it does I have no idea how I would install it.

I'm sure once it is official, there will be plenty of guides!

buzzingrobot
March 27th, 2014, 09:55 PM
Laptop and desktop sales seem to be down, but sales of phones and tablets are way up, and growing. So, the overall market is getting larger. What is happening is that many people have decided their computing needs don't require a desktop or a laptop, but can be met at less cost with a portable device.

Canonical is pointing itself squarely at that market segment.

Old_Grey_Wolf
March 27th, 2014, 11:25 PM
...Maybe so of you thought I died or just droped off the grid.
What's your thoughts.

I have thought about getting my son that uses Ubuntu to post to the Ubuntu Forums and announce my death when it happens. :)

lykwydchykyn
March 28th, 2014, 04:07 AM
I think tablets have done something significant for Ubuntu and all Linux distros; they've opened people up to the idea that many computing tasks can be done on something other than a Windows PC. They've also forced web designers and content developers away from the "everyone uses IE on Windows" mentality that locked so much web content from us in the past.

IMO, people who merely use free software don't really benefit free software; it's those who use and participate in some way who benefit free software. I'm painting with a broad brush, but somehow I think a person who is satisfied with a device as locked-down and consumer-oriented as a tablet was not going to be much of a participant.

sammiev
March 28th, 2014, 04:38 AM
I'm watching all the tablet threads and Ubuntu as I will buy one and switch it over to Ubuntu when the time comes.

monkeybrain20122
March 28th, 2014, 05:40 AM
That means a significant number of laptop and desktop owners do so little with their computers that they can do what they need with a tablet. I always think it is a waste of a good machine for doing things that could be done with much less power. Like, why do you need a real computer if all you ever do is watching youtube, visiting the internet and check email? I know this guy who bought a Mac book pro just for word processing (he doesn't even check email so much as he never reply sto mine. :)), another guy bought a top of the line lenovo laptop with a quadro card just for doing Office and reading PDFs (I am waiting for him to sell it for less than half the price as the machine seems to have excellent Linux support). Well people like the second guy may be less common, but there are many people like the first guy.

I wouldn't get a tablet myself. It is a waste of money. For the price I can get a real laptop with respectable specs, and the tablet is not that portable comparing to the phone (ever seen guys who take pictures with a tablet in a festival? They just look stupid with the flat fat camera. :)) Any way, I have spent enough time on the computer, when I go out I don't need to stare at a screen and a dumb phone that costs $50 is good enough for me. :)

buzzingrobot
March 28th, 2014, 01:52 PM
That means a significant number of laptop and desktop owners do so little with their computers that they can do what they need with a tablet... watching youtube, visiting the internet and check email...

Yep. That fits most people I know.



I wouldn't get a tablet myself.


Got one. Use it when I'm lazy and on the couch. Also take it with me when I travel. Much more convenient than a laptop, and I don't need to pull it out and turn it on at airport security.

The smart phone is gone, though, replaced by a dumb phone, plus more money in my wallet.

grahammechanical
March 28th, 2014, 05:25 PM
Look at it this way. The popularity of smartphones and tablets has created a market that Ubuntu can move into. The popularity of Android based phones has given Ubuntu developers open source code to use in getting Ubuntu to run on smartphones and tablets. Canonical could not have done what Google has done in creating Android. Canonical does not have the amount of money that was needed.

It has been said that if Ubuntu phones and tablets can get just 1% (I am sure that was the figure) of market share then Ubuntu for phones and tablets will be a success. This mobile market is huge.

My present machine was built in 2007. So, in future, do I buy newer hardware and build a new machine, or buy a desktop or laptop and pay for some other OS that I have no need for, or do I buy a Ubuntu super phone that can become a PC when connected to a monitor, keyboard and mouse?

Guess which option I am thinking of doing.

Regards.

QDR06VV9
March 28th, 2014, 06:04 PM
With all due respect grahammechanical view points can vary from person to person for myself a Tower(PC) or an upper-tier Laptop with required hardware is just a must have due to my usage.(Details not inculded)
You know I bought into the fad of tablets and phones and in my case Meh! I was so let down due to my expectations.
Tried them all Ipads, Iphones, Androids most all them.
I Could not sell them fast enough!! The only thing I want out of a phone is to answer calls and texts
I guess others see things I do not? I am however a little curious as to what Ubuntu Phones are like. (Hands On Usage)
Regards

buzzingrobot
March 28th, 2014, 06:25 PM
Phones and tablets aren't fads. They provide alternative approaches to personal computing. If your computing needs can be met by a small portable device, why buy a big un-portable box to do the same things?

Many people have already bought their last desktop or laptop.

mattlach
March 28th, 2014, 08:02 PM
Got one. Use it when I'm lazy and on the couch. Also take it with me when I travel. Much more convenient than a laptop, and I don't need to pull it out and turn it on at airport security.

I actually use my 2013 Nexus 7 primarily for in car naviagtion and as a music player. While I am excited about trying out Ubuntu on it, it would never replace my desktop.

MorningWood
March 31st, 2014, 05:44 AM
I believe tablet sales are hurting desktop PCs and operating systems as a whole.

Xentime
March 31st, 2014, 06:51 AM
Yes, sales are going to be hurt but it won't eliminate the need for desktops/laptops. Most people use their devices for simple tasks such as email, browsing the web, and social networking. Tablets and smartphones fit those users requirements perfectly.

If you are a true power-user, smaller form factors just don't provide the effeciency let alone power. For example, I tend to play many computer games. Ever play any serious games on tablets or smartphones? They don't exist because mobile devices aren't designed with that purpose in mind. Yes, some computer games have been ported over to mobile devices but they have horrendious control schemes.

It really isn't something to be all too worried about. More diversity among hardware will provide higher ease of use to whatever you require.

irv
March 31st, 2014, 09:10 PM
Some might not agree, but windows 8.1 is thinking in both worlds. Those that run windows 8 on a laptop/desktop and go out and buy a tablet/phone look for something that fits what they are already using. So they look at a windows 8 tablet/phone. Now if Ubuntu user only had the same choice I would get a tablet/phone with ubuntu. Right now I have a server, laptop, desktop, tablet, and phone all running whatever. I got a mix of them all not to mention a chromebook and a Nook.

buzzingrobot
March 31st, 2014, 10:17 PM
Some might not agree, but windows 8.1 is thinking in both worlds...

And I do disagree.

The Metro/Modern/bunch-of-blocks interface makes sense for small devices with small screens on which users run one app at a time, essentially managing the thing by finger pokes. It does not make sense on larger screens where we expect to operate in an entirely different manner.

As implemented in Win8, that interface constrains laptop and desktop users to using their hardware as a *phone*. The catch, though, is that if you are constrained to use your hardware as a phone, you are very likely just going to use your phone in the first place.

Microsoft suckered itself into believing that consumers are too stupid to use one interface on desktops and laptops and another on phones and tablets. So, Microsoft went ahead and invented an interface that turns expensive desktop and laptops into giant inconvenient cellphones.

It's worth noting that the company that is actually good at building interfaces that make it lots and lots of money -- Apple -- has maintained OS X and iOS as two different interfaces for two different purposes.

Meanwhile, the less said about the forced marriage of two interfaces in Win8, the better.

irv
April 1st, 2014, 06:36 PM
And I do disagree.

The Metro/Modern/bunch-of-blocks interface makes sense for small devices with small screens on which users run one app at a time, essentially managing the thing by finger pokes. It does not make sense on larger screens where we expect to operate in an entirely different manner.

As implemented in Win8, that interface constrains laptop and desktop users to using their hardware as a *phone*. The catch, though, is that if you are constrained to use your hardware as a phone, you are very likely just going to use your phone in the first place.

Microsoft suckered itself into believing that consumers are too stupid to use one interface on desktops and laptops and another on phones and tablets. So, Microsoft went ahead and invented an interface that turns expensive desktop and laptops into giant inconvenient cellphones.

It's worth noting that the company that is actually good at building interfaces that make it lots and lots of money -- Apple -- has maintained OS X and iOS as two different interfaces for two different purposes.

Meanwhile, the less said about the forced marriage of two interfaces in Win8, the better.
Is this not what Ubuntu is doing by using Unity desktop? I like the idea. I have been using Unity since it came out and it has been getting better and better. I have used windows since it replaced the old MS DOS, and Window 8.1 in my opinion is one of the best MS has come up with. I agree there are many people (and maybe yourself included) that do not like Windows 8 or 8.1 or Ubuntu with Unity desktop, but I am one that thinks they both are moving in the right direction. I never was a windows fan until 8.1, but I still miss Ubuntu with Unity. I am not saying this to offend you, I am just saying there are many things and there are many people who just disagree on all these different things.

buzzingrobot
April 1st, 2014, 07:05 PM
Is this not what Ubuntu is doing by using Unity...

I see no similarity between Unity and either of Win8's interfaces.

I don't think Desktop Unity would work, directly transfered, on phones and tablets any better than OS X would.

Warren Hill
April 2nd, 2014, 12:08 PM
Many people use computers just to check their email, tweet, surf the web etc. As a result computer sales are declining.

The average PC has far too much power for such tasks and tablets are the way to go for such people. This obviously means that there are going to be less computers running Ubuntu or any Linux distribution.

Does this hurt Ubuntu? Not really - Ubuntu is free.

Does it hurt Microsoft? Yes - Microsoft does not have the dominance in the tablet and smart phone market that it has in the PC market so this will hit them financially.

irv
April 3rd, 2014, 09:41 PM
I had another thought. My wife has been using a Chromebook for a couple of years now and she loves it. All she uses it for is Facebook and email and ordering a few things over the Internet. She has her Recipes on it (Evernotes) a Google app. The point being Chrome OS and Android are Linux based and have done a great job in taking some of the market share. I just read an article that said by 2019 Chromebooks will have about 11% of sales. This is because of the price and this is what people are realizing that this is all they need so why pay big bucks for more.
This is where Ubuntu would shine. If someone would come out with a cheap unit like this for under $200 with Ubuntu running on it they would sell like hotcakes.
Just a thought.

kurja
April 3rd, 2014, 10:18 PM
What I'm really curious about, is that when(if?) Ubuntu phones/tablets are available in stores, do we get root access as default or is it going to be a mess like with Android/apple :)

sammykur
April 4th, 2014, 08:06 AM
Hi everyone,am new to linux and thought I might offer my view
I do have a tablet and use it mostly for reading and letting my 5/6yrr olds play games. I used ubuntu in the past as a dual boot just for kicks but decided to rid myself of windows.

I think in the future the use of tablets will benifit linux as for one dont like to touch my monitors,i mean who wants fingerprints all over their monitors? The real key here is the unlying functionality of linux for "power users"( I use that term loosely). Thing like burning your home moives to a dvd/bluray, running automated scripts, even cad just arent done well on a tablet.

Just an fyi I am in my 40's and dont like the windows 8 interface,I find it troublesome as my step daughter has it on a laptop (not a touchscreen) and it just seems more promlematic than its worth.To me its like adding and extra layer on top of your OS. I am sure I am not alone in this thinking esp.w/ older xp users who would just assume to keep using something similar to what they have in XP.

If anything I think the tablets will hurt windows more than linux in the long run because of the functionality linux has ,the somewhat familiar interface along with the I phone becoming such a huge sucess. I think alot of the users of windows will migrate to apple if they can afford their overpriced products.

The ubuntu phone OS may even be a big suprise for everyone, from my reading it seems more carriers will unlock smart phone from their system for a fee,but that comes at a price and loss many of the phone featues. If ubuntu phone is able to get universal compatibility with carriers systems I could see UPhone taking off - and if they were to include features like acessing your computer remotely and maybe even focusing on developing a media center distro w/ cable card compatability where the user could control the media center/DVR from their phone, It could very well be the upset of a lifetime.

I realize there are a lot of what ifs in my thinking and my predjudice towards MS/Apple may cloud my vision at times.

sorry if this got off subject with the phone thing ,but they really are kind of the same thing today or at least to me.

Warren Hill
April 4th, 2014, 09:05 AM
sorry if this got off subject with the phone thing ,but they really are kind of the same thing today or at least to me.

I think that's fair the the difference between a tablet and a smart phone appears to be



A tablet can't make phone calls
A tablet usually has a bigger screen


Apart from that I see no difference either.

sam-c
April 4th, 2014, 10:39 AM
I think not
android and ubuntu are both linux and tablets are thin clients!!

Eddie Wilson
April 4th, 2014, 07:21 PM
I believe tablet sales are hurting desktop PCs and operating systems as a whole.

I would say that tablet sales are hurting desktop sales but not operating systems. Even tablets and smart phones have operating systems. For the work I do I could not use a tablet or smart phone. So there's always going to be a market for desktops and laptops. Also as far as the general public goes, most operating systems are irrelevant as long as they do what they need.

Eddie Wilson
April 4th, 2014, 07:31 PM
What I'm really curious about, is that when(if?) Ubuntu phones/tablets are available in stores, do we get root access as default or is it going to be a mess like with Android/apple :)

It's a good thing I saw that smiley face at the end. Ubuntu phones and tablets will be available in stores, and I see no reason for them not to succeed. As far as security goes, your guess is as good as mine. Can we all say SUDO? :D

RichardET
April 6th, 2014, 02:10 PM
There are many articles on the Internet about tablets out selling laptops. I am a laptop user, but I also have a tablet. In fact I am writing this on my tablet right now. (using Android). Between the release of Win8 and tablets running other OS' I believe it has hurt Ubuntu. At least I see it in my daily use of electronics. Also It has been awhile since I have been on the forum. Maybe so of you thought I died or just droped off the grid.
What's your thoughts.

I don't think GNU/Linux sales could be hurt by any new channel because Linux on any desktop is not now, and has never been a contender, period. By the way, I have a Lenovo B590, 8 GB of RAM, 320 GB HD, 15 inch screen running only Ubuntu 13.10 and I really like it. I have VMware on it and have a 64 bit Windows 7 VM for the applications which require Windows. I live in NJ; how many people in NJ do you think are like me? We have 10 million population, probably less than 50,000 people like me, and that's most likely inflated, and that would be a 0.5% market share on the desktop in NJ. So ask yourself - do you think a new tablet or phone is going to matter much to GNU/Linux market share in NJ? I doubt it!

Also of the 50k users of GNU/Linux, I doubt more than 10k use Ubuntu. Of that 10k, perhaps 2k actually paid any money for it, and I doubt anyone paid more than say $5, ONE TIME only. Thus thats about $10,000 revenue , which is most likely flat. That's equivalent to about 10 new Apple tablets with Apple warranty. At the Short Hills Mall Apple store, sales are always brisk, and on weekends, the store is literally packed with wall to wall people all day Saturday & Sunday. I doubt any will ever consider GNU/Linux and really could care less that Darwin is similar to Linux; people seem to like to sit in their ignorance.

Linux is for intelligent computer enthusiasts; it was never meant to be a serious desktop contender because there is no professional support structure for GNU/Linux on a desktop. If people have trouble with Windows on their Thinkpad, they call Lenovo, always open 24x7. If they have trouble with OS/X on their Apple, they have similar options, I am certain. What happens if my B590 goes down? Whom do I call? No one, I go to the forums, but most people would have trouble doing that. To be fair, probably system packagers like System76 would offer support for their Ubuntu products, unlike Lenovo for this B590.

Lenovo is a great Windows support company and they have helped me many times with my Thinkpad W530 and my Lenovo V470, both of which run Windows 8.1, but for this B590, I am on my own.

I have to say that all-in-all, I really enjoy Ubuntu, and it would be great to see it gain enough market share, such that there would be a potential risk of market share erosion from tablets, but alas, we are not there yet.

Yozuru
April 6th, 2014, 08:12 PM
The hype of the tablet market is huge right now, I say there is a impact but not enough to impact the production.

kurja
April 7th, 2014, 05:09 AM
I think that's fair the the difference between a tablet and a smart phone appears to be



A tablet can't make phone calls
A tablet usually has a bigger screen


Apart from that I see no difference either.

A lot of tablets can also text and make calls, and those that can't can use skype or such. I for one can't really see a difference between phones and tablets other than size.