Flash 9 is comming :)

[ELD]

Well thanks to my personalized google homepage i found a nice article on Flash9 which comes out soon for windows and mac, they are releasing it for linux but didn't say when.

http://news.com.com/2100-1012_3-6088705.html?part=rss&tag=6088705&subj=news

Good news :)

[FISHERMAN]

How is this good news?
We'll have to wait till 2007 before we get FlashPlayer9, while Win&Mac-users can download it today?

I wouldn't be so bad if the webmasters only used flash for their stupid animations/ads, but a lot of them use it for necessary web site elements(like navigation bars](*,) ).

[ELD]

I mean it as it is comming which is good to know

I see it as good news since we are getting it.

[roderikk]

Let us hope that SVG will be integrated really soon. I really see that open standard becoming a rival to anything you can do with flash (and more), or am I completely off here?

[rai4shu2]

Only for Windows at the moment...

[asimon]

Does this mean cooler advertisements?

[ELD]

Edit

haha i know what you said :P
Flash 7 is available, nothing higher as of yet :P

[FISHERMAN]

Edit
Edit

[rai4shu2]

haha i know what you said :P
Flash 7 is available, nothing higher as of yet :P

:p I blame Adobe. Their site sucks.

[GoA]

This is a one reason why people won't change into linux. If big software companies doesn't offer porograms/drivers to linux, why to change a working operating system to less usable?

I noticed that I'm again currently using XP. it just is a little bit better in multimedia than Dapper. And looks better with Vista theme and media player 11.

[bruce89]

Gnash (http://www.gnu.org/software/gnash/) will solve it for us, free rubbishy adverts for all!

[asimon]

This is a one reason why people won't change into linux. If big software companies doesn't offer porograms/drivers to linux, why to change a working operating system to less usable?
Some regard missing Flash ads good and non-free licenses and vendor-lockin as bad. These people have plenty of reasons to change.

[GoA]

That's true, but I, and many others, think that those people are "special cases". ;)

I also block flash ads, but any other flash thingies I want to use and keep.

[Rhapsody]

Dammit. Windows and Mac are on Flash 9 now while the Linux version is still at Flash 7? Maybe Gnash will make them wake up soon...

[hizaguchi]

The lack of an up-to-date Flash player is a blessing in disguise. As the Gnu/Linux userbase grows, and we continue to lack Flash, web designers will be forced to use a more open format or risk alienating a portion of their potential viewers. This will ensure that Flash-based sites don't become more common than they already are, and so will keep the average web surfer from looking at a nice, non-Flash site the way they already look at a nice, basic HTML site. That will be bad for Macromedia, but great for internet equality. I hope Flash 9 takes its sweet time.

[forrestcupp]

Dammit. Windows and Mac are on Flash 9 now while the Linux version is still at Flash 7? Maybe Gnash will make them wake up soon...

Gnash isn't going to hurt Flash. Gnash only supports up to version 7.


The lack of an up-to-date Flash player is a blessing in disguise. As the Gnu/Linux userbase grows, and we continue to lack Flash, web designers will be forced to use a more open format or risk alienating a portion of their potential viewers. This will ensure that Flash-based sites don't become more common than they already are, and so will keep the average web surfer from looking at a nice, non-Flash site the way they already look at a nice, basic HTML site. That will be bad for Macromedia, but great for internet equality. I hope Flash 9 takes its sweet time.

As much as I love Linux, the user base isn't anywhere near enough to be powerful for anything to be "bad" for Macromedia.

A lot of you guys seem to think the only purpose for Flash is for advertisements, but my 2 year old boy's favorite website is Playhouse Disney. Everything on it uses Flash. It has a lot of educational games and such. Since they just switched their site to a newer version, now I can't access it, which means no Mickey Mouse or Jo Jo for my 2 year old boy until Flash 9 comes out. You can explain to me all you want about the philosophy of Free Software, but try explaining that to a 2 year old who just wants to play Jo Jo.

[Rhapsody]

Gnash isn't going to hurt Flash. Gnash only supports up to version 7.
Macromedia Flash for Linux only goes up to version 7. It's terrible too. Sound lags a lot, and I've found other bugs that weren't present under Flash for Windows. As it stands, Gnash can really stand to hurt Flash unless version 9 arrives soon.

[ELD]

I will have to keep an eye on Gnash...

[hizaguchi]

A lot of you guys seem to think the only purpose for Flash is for advertisements, but my 2 year old boy's favorite website is Playhouse Disney. Everything on it uses Flash. It has a lot of educational games and such. Since they just switched their site to a newer version, now I can't access it, which means no Mickey Mouse or Jo Jo for my 2 year old boy until Flash 9 comes out. You can explain to me all you want about the philosophy of Free Software, but try explaining that to a 2 year old who just wants to play Jo Jo.
Oh, I fully understand that it does more than advertisements. That is the problem. It is being used with increasing frequency, yet can only be implemented by those who can afford the editor liscense.

I also understand how difficult that is for your son. But this actually highlights another problem. The fact that Flash is a proprietary format puts the control of who can and cannot view its content into the hands of a corporation. Imagine that the content were much more important than a game, though. What if your bank or university class registration websites used Flash exclusively? Then what if Macromedia decided (as they have with version 8 ) that you cannot use their technology?

I don't mean to seem insensitive (though I'm sure I will), but if a proprietary technology, like Flash, someday becomes as popular as html on the internet, that will be a much larger problem than your son playing Jo Jo.

[ELD]

Oh, I fully understand that it does more than advertisements. That is the problem. It is being used with increasing frequency, yet can only be implemented by those who can afford the editor liscense.

I also understand how difficult that is for your son. But this actually highlights another problem. The fact that Flash is a proprietary format puts the control of who can and cannot view its content into the hands of a corporation. Imagine that the content were much more important than a game, though. What if your bank or university class registration websites used Flash exclusively? Then what if Macromedia decided (as they have with version 8) that you cannot use their technology?

I don't mean to seem insensitive (though I'm sure I will), but if a proprietary technology, like Flash, someday becomes as popular as html on the internet, that will be a much larger problem than your son playing Jo Jo.

Very wise words indeed, flash could become a bigger problem.
I for one never used it and never plan to for anything i create or manage.

[warp99]

A lot of you guys seem to think the only purpose for Flash is for advertisements, but my 2 year old boy's favorite website is Playhouse Disney. Everything on it uses Flash. It has a lot of educational games and such. Since they just switched their site to a newer version, now I can't access it, which means no Mickey Mouse or Jo Jo for my 2 year old boy until Flash 9 comes out. You can explain to me all you want about the philosophy of Free Software, but try explaining that to a 2 year old who just wants to play Jo Jo.

Don't go to the Disney site and visit others instead. Disney's site is too commercialized anyway. My 5 and 3 year old keep asking me to purchase games and sign up for Disney spam. :(

Not allowing Flash 7 to work with Disney is great. It allows me to blame Disney so I don't come off as the "Bad Guy" plus it saves me money by not having to buy any of the overpriced merchandising that Disney pushes. ;)

For your 2 year old you should go to pbskids.org instead and support public television. I think the shows are much better, they're educational, and there is a LOT less merchandising. You can't beat that. :D

[wmcbrine]

The worst thing about this is that Adobe publishes the specs for Flash, for free (gratis), but under a license that says you can only use them to write code that generates Flash -- not that displays it. This, despite the fact that they themselves give away the viewer for free (gratis), and make their money on the generation tools. It seems irrational; and it hinders the development of Free (libre) alternatives, like Gnash.

SVG has great potential, BTW. Check out the samples here:

http://www.croczilla.com/svg/samples/

The problem is, it's handled very inconsistently between browsers right now, even among those that claim to support it.

[ELD]

Everything starts somewhere, CSS is only just being better adopted by Internet Explorer, we might see SVG used better in a year or two....mabye...

[forrestcupp]

The fact that Flash is a proprietary format puts the control of who can and cannot view its content into the hands of a corporation.

Sometimes this is a fact of life. If I want to drive a new Ford Mustang car, the control of whether or not I can own and drive one is in the hands of the Ford Motor Company. They make them, they decide the price, and if I want one, I have to pay for it. Not everyone is going to generously donate all their research and developement for the better good of the community. By the way, I'm not against Free Software, it's just a fact that there will always be people trying to make a living off of proprietary stuff.


For your 2 year old you should go to pbskids.org instead and support public television. I think the shows are much better, they're educational, and there is a LOT less merchandising. You can't beat that.

My boy loves to watch the shows on PBS. We don't even have the Disney channel anymore, so if he watches kids shows, it's either PBS or a DVD. Unfortunately, if you go to pbskids.org, it doesn't work anymore. They must have jumped on the Flash upgrade bandwagon.

[hizaguchi]

Everything starts somewhere, CSS is only just being better adopted by Internet Explorer, we might see SVG used better in a year or two....mabye...
Hopefully so. And that much more likely if the non-free alternative (Flash) is unavailable. Necessity is the mother of invention, and all that crap.

[warp99]

My boy loves to watch the shows on PBS. We don't even have the Disney channel anymore, so if he watches kids shows, it's either PBS or a DVD. Unfortunately, if you go to pbskids.org, it doesn't work anymore. They must have jumped on the Flash upgrade bandwagon.

Pbskids.org works fine with Flash 7 plus they finally got rid of Windows Media. Now it's Quicktime and Real Player. They have some shockwave files but only on the Zoom site, which is for older kids.

BTW because it's public television they have to serve the best interest of the public. You can write or email and try to get more of the content to be Linux friendly. You would most likely have a better chance with PBS then with a nameless faceless corporation.

I had a problem with one of the pages not detecting my flash install in Firefox. I sent them an email and about a week later it was fixed. :cool:

Edit: According to netcraft PBS runs on Apache/Linux/Unix since 11/02 on all servers.

[hizaguchi]

Sometimes this is a fact of life. If I want to drive a new Ford Mustang car, the control of whether or not I can own and drive one is in the hands of the Ford Motor Company. They make them, they decide the price, and if I want one, I have to pay for it. Not everyone is going to generously donate all their research and developement for the better good of the community. By the way, I'm not against Free Software, it's just a fact that there will always be people trying to make a living off of proprietary stuff.
There is a very important key flaw in this analogy. Ford's selling of Mustangs does not inhibit the ability of competitors to also sell cars. Nor does it prevent motorcycles, public transportation, bicycles, and walking from being viable alternatives.

If someone wants to buy a Mustang, that's fine with me. But if, suddenly, Mustangs became so popular that they comprised a HUGE percentage of the traffic on the road, then they started using a special proprietary gas tank, all gas stations would have to switch their nozzles to match the Mustangs or be forced out of business. Then, with incompatible fuel stations, how could any other car company ever hope to compete? If you couldn't afford a Mustang, how would you travel further than a short distance?

If someone wants to buy proprietary software, that's fine with me. But if, suddenly, proprietery software became so popular that it comprised a HUGE percentage of the traffic on the internet, and it were made to require a special editor and viewer for anyone to use it, how would those who cannot afford the editor be affected? If you couldn't have the viewer, how would you get important information that was in this new format?

If this isn't clarifying the danger of proprietary formats, you should read this: http://www.catb.org/~esr/halloween/halloween1.html

[forrestcupp]

If someone wants to buy proprietary software, that's fine with me. But if, suddenly, proprietery software became so popular that it comprised a HUGE percentage of the traffic on the internet, and it were made to require a special editor and viewer for anyone to use it, how would those who cannot afford the editor be affected? If you couldn't have the viewer, how would you get important information that was in this new format?

That is true, but that doesn't really apply to Flash. Their viewer software is available for free to anyone. You only have to pay for developing software. Sure, they aren't in as much of a hurry to get out linux ports (which is the only thing that really disturbs me), but nevertheless they do offer it.

Nothing is stopping anyone else to make a competing opensource product. If they want to get it to be popular, they would have to do the same things that Macromedia did to get Flash popular.


Pbskids.org works fine with Flash 7 plus they finally got rid of Windows Media. Now it's Quicktime and Real Player. They have some shockwave files but only on the Zoom site, which is for older kids.

Thank you. I went back to the website, and this time it worked. The first time it asked me to download the plugin, which I already had. My boy really loves the pbskids.org website. I think it's at least as good as playhouse disney.

[MethodOne]

While I'm waiting patiently for Flash 9, I'll use Firefox in Wine for those sites that require Flash 8.

[ELD]

Just a question, how well does firefox with flash8 work in wine?

[FISHERMAN]

Just a question, how well does firefox with flash8 work in wine?

It works well(even with Flash9) but running Ff under Wine for flash is a bit ridiculus.

[3rdalbum]

^ I don't think it's ridiculous. If it's something you've gotta do, it's something you've gotta do :-)

Standalone Flash presentations (the ones where you double-click them in Windows and an embedded Flash player opens and runs the movie) also work fine, even in the standard repository WINE.

[bruce89]

^ I don't think it's ridiculous. If it's something you've gotta do, it's something you've gotta do :-)

What about us on something other than i386?