GNOME-flavoured Ubuntu Spin Coming

[irv]

GNOME-flavoured Ubuntu Spin Coming (http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2012/08/gnome-flavoured-ubuntu-spin-coming-october-18th?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+d0od+%28OMG%21+Ubuntu%21%29&utm_content=FaceBook)
I don't like it.
First, it cut to much out of Ubuntu.
Second, I really really like Unity, so why would I switch.

OK, what's your take on this?

[vasa1]

http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1999827&highlight=gnobuntu

[deadflowr]

I personally think it's a good thing.
You have an xfce distro, and lxde distro, a kde distro, why not a pure gnome distro.
A lot of people(a lot meaning more than 2) would like to have a pure gnome Ubuntu flavor. At this point in time, the only way someone can run a system as such is through a painstaking process of adding the gnome-shell,classic and then cautiously removing all of the unity features.
I too like Unity and have no real plans to install GNObuntu. But that said, I think it fits in with the other distros just nicely.

[BigSilly]

I think it's a great idea. Brilliant that the Ubuntu community can cover all bases so well.

Would I use it? Possibly so. I'm currently very spoilt for Linux desktops and finding it hard to settle on one, but there's always room on my PC for a Gnome 3 Ubuntu spin. :)

[vexorian]

GNOME-flavoured Ubuntu Spin Coming (http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2012/08/gnome-flavoured-ubuntu-spin-coming-october-18th?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+d0od+%28OMG%21+Ubuntu%21%29&utm_content=FaceBook)
I don't like it.
First, it cut to much out of Ubuntu.
Second, I really really like Unity, so why would I switch.

OK, what's your take on this?
No one is making you switch.

I'll be happily using my unity + gnome-panel install but other people who prefer constantly moving their mouse cursor to the top left corner now have an alternative they can use.

But Abiword instead of libreOffice and epiphany instead of firefox make it sound not very serious.

[vasa1]

...
But Abiword instead of libreOffice and epiphany instead of firefox make it sound not very serious.
Keeping LibreOffice out may make the .iso fit on a CD (for those who don't prefer DVDs or USBs) ;)

[drawkcab]

I have an htpc with the community spin w/Gnome Shell. It's great because you can scale Gnome to your television so easily.

Gnome shell with a taskbar or its equivalent (you can install various extensions) is still better than unity in my opinion. Given the direction of the two projects, however, I doubt that will be the case a year from now.

FWIW, Luninux, Pear, Pinguy, etc. all offer customized Gnome shell experiences over ubuntu.

[Lucradia]

Epiphany is a really horrid browser to use honestly. Same with the vanilla KDE Browser and Midori for XFCE (usually, unless you can get it to use gecko instead of Webkit.)

[BigSilly]

Epiphany is a really horrid browser to use honestly. Same with the vanilla KDE Browser and Midori for XFCE (usually, unless you can get it to use gecko instead of Webkit.)

Oh I disagree. Rekonq was pretty decent last time I used it in Kubuntu.

[Rainstride]

GNOME-flavoured Ubuntu Spin Coming (http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2012/08/gnome-flavoured-ubuntu-spin-coming-october-18th?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+d0od+%28OMG%21+Ubuntu%21%29&utm_content=FaceBook)
I don't like it.
First, it cut to much out of Ubuntu.
Second, I really really like Unity, so why would I switch.

OK, what's your take on this?

You do know that all of the official ubuntu spins like kubuntu, lubuntu, xubuntu, and so on all share the same exact repos right? witch means if someone files a bug for one spin, all of the spins can benifit from it. unity shares a lot of backend stuff from vanilla gnome, so if someone files a bug report about something in the vanilla spin, theres a pretty good chance my unity desktop will benifit from that. And there is always going to be a lot of people who want a vanilla gnome spin no matter what anyone says, and will go to what ever disto has it. So if ubuntu has it, chances are they will come here, witch means more bugs getting filed and eventually fixed. Witch means better quality repos for everyone. Sounds win, win to me. They get their vanilla gnome, and we get better quality software in the repos.

[Primefalcon]

GNOME-flavoured Ubuntu Spin Coming (http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2012/08/gnome-flavoured-ubuntu-spin-coming-october-18th?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+d0od+%28OMG%21+Ubuntu%21%29&utm_content=FaceBook)
I don't like it.
First, it cut to much out of Ubuntu.
Second, I really really like Unity, so why would I switch.

OK, what's your take on this?
I don't really care about Gnome Shell myself I like Unity..... if I was going to switch it'd be to XFCE or LXDE or maybe even KDE... but definitely not gnome3

As it is, I am very much hoping Canonical either fork nautilus or adopt something like dolphin instead... the gnome team seem to be messing everything up!

[qamelian]

Personally, I'm glad to see this happen. Frankly, the only time I use Unity is on test boxes. On my work machine, I can't get rid of it fast enough. Unity may have improved in some areas with each release, but I still find it much less usable than Gnome-shell.

Use what works best for you. For me, that's Gnome-shell. :)

[KiwiNZ]

I have been trying a Gnome spin for an associate.it's Gnome spin Fedora 17, frankly it is terrible, I doubt that a Gnome spin Ubuntu will be any improvement.

[evilsoup]

Some people will like it, others won't use it; it can't hurt, so why not?

On a more serious topic, what colour will the [gnomebuntu] forum thread tag be?

[Lucradia]

I don't really care about Gnome Shell myself I like Unity..... if I was going to switch it'd be to XFCE or LXDE or maybe even KDE... but definitely not gnome3

As it is, I am very much hoping Canonical either fork nautilus or adopt something like dolphin instead... the gnome team seem to be messing everything up!

I used Unity for about 2.5 weeks, and I still didn't like it after, nor GNOME3. I will forever be with LXDE / XFCE as such =/


On a more serious topic, what colour will the [gnomebuntu] forum thread tag be?

It probably won't have a tag on UF for about 3 months at least.

[KiwiNZ]

Some people will like it, others won't use it; it can't hurt, so why not?

On a more serious topic, what colour will the [gnomebuntu] forum thread tag be?

White

[Jakin]

If its Gnome 3 (and im sure it is) thats a no go for me... not because i don't like the layout; I really think Gnome 3 has something against my current video card (ati)- it is PAINFULLY slow and stutters..
Though Unity 3D seems so lightweight its ridiculous.

[lykwydchykyn]

Seeing as there have been respins of Ubuntu with every other desktop environment and window manager in the repositories, not having a Gnome respin would be a considerably glaring omission, would it not?

And, hrm, what happened to all the people who were screaming for "Gnobuntu" when 11.04 came out? :confused:

[forrestcupp]

GNOME-flavoured Ubuntu Spin Coming (http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2012/08/gnome-flavoured-ubuntu-spin-coming-october-18th?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+d0od+%28OMG%21+Ubuntu%21%29&utm_content=FaceBook)
I don't like it.
First, it cut to much out of Ubuntu.
Second, I really really like Unity, so why would I switch.

OK, what's your take on this?

That's the whole point, right there. You don't like it, and you like Unity, so you wouldn't want to switch. There are a lot more preferences out there that people have than just yours. Personally, I like Gnome Shell way more than Unity. I think it's great to have that choice.

That said, I probably won't use it either. I've recently found out that I like the latest KDE better than them all. It's come a long way since 4.0 when I last tried it.

[Jakin]

That said, I probably won't use it either. I've recently found out that I like the latest KDE better than them all. It's come a long way since 4.0 when I last tried it.

KDE sure gets my vote :)

I still want to have Gnome 3 as a session though, incase i want to mess with it sometime. I like to have all the DE, just to say i have used them.
Hell- i'd have Looking Glass on 12.04 if i could- just to mess with it.

[Primefalcon]

Am I the only one that see's all these.... official spins and kinda silly?

Xubuntu, Kubuntu, Edubuntu, Lubuntu, Gubuntu and whatever else....

All of these desktops can easily be gotten via the repo's anyhow, why not just kill them off, and during install ask the user if they want a different desktop.... since we're beyond a CD now anyhow....

[KiwiNZ]

Am I the only one that see's all these.... official spins and kinda silly?

Xubuntu, Kubuntu, Edubuntu, Lubuntu, Gubuntu and whatever else....

All of these desktops can easily be gotten via the repo's anyhow, why not just kill them off, and during install ask the user if they want a different desktop.... since we're beyond a CD now anyhow....

No I have been saying it for years, fragmentation is more our enemy than OSX or Windows.

[Primefalcon]

No I have been saying it for years, fragmentation is more our enemy than OSX or Windows.
I don't think fragmentation is a problem, choice is good, but when we're beyond a cd, having all these seperate names... when the only difference is say Unity or XFCE.... well... since the underlying OS is the same anyhow just stick them all on the download image and at boot

have the top ones listed such as

which desktop environment would you like installed (at least for the major DE's anyhow).

Unity (recommended)
Gnome Shell
KDE
LXDE
XFCE

And then just let the package manager sort it out

[Jakin]

Am I the only one that see's all these.... official spins and kinda silly?

Xubuntu, Kubuntu, Edubuntu, Lubuntu, Gubuntu and whatever else....

All of these desktops can easily be gotten via the repo's anyhow, why not just kill them off, and during install ask the user if they want a different desktop.... since we're beyond a CD now anyhow....

There's something that can be said for those who don't have access to the internet- who either wont use their setup for internet, or just cannot get networking to work- then what are they gonna do for GUI? :/

As you say we are past the CD limit, and how many of us really dont have a DVD drive? So perhaps a group could bundle all the DE into the same DVD, and you could choose at install which DE(s) you want. (Obviously after the fact, due to different release dates of each DE)

EDIT: Or maybe you were sayin' that all along, and i just now thought about what you said from another angle.

[KiwiNZ]

The key to Linux growth is the Corporate Desktop (we have the server segment already) the following is very important for this to happen... identity, reliability, trust and continuity of support.

Fragmentation does not engender this, I know I come from the Corporate sector and have experienced both sides of the bargaining table.

Alas we are seeing the same fragmentation with Android. There is such a thing as spoilt by too much choice.

[Mikeb85]

The key to Linux growth is the Corporate Desktop (we have the server segment already) the following is very important for this to happen... identity, reliability, trust and continuity of support.

Fragmentation does not engender this, I know I come from the Corporate sector and have experienced both sides of the bargaining table.

Alas we are seeing the same fragmentation with Android. There is such a thing as spoilt by too much choice.

For awhile Red Hat and SUSE were the obvious corporate choices (and thus .rpm files were quite ubiquitous), but with SUSE being acquired several times and Ubuntu becoming so popular, that balance has shifted...

But yes, fragmentation is bad. It's unfortunate the Linux world can't settle on a single type of packaging, and other things (sound, display manager, etc...)

[KiwiNZ]

For awhile Red Hat and SUSE were the obvious corporate choices (and thus .rpm files were quite ubiquitous), but with SUSE being acquired several times and Ubuntu becoming so popular, that balance has shifted...

But yes, fragmentation is bad. It's unfortunate the Linux world can't settle on a single type of packaging, and other things (sound, display manager, etc...)

Classic Divide and conquer, except we are doing the dividing, MSFT and Apple are doing the conquering.

[forrestcupp]

No I have been saying it for years, fragmentation is more our enemy than OSX or Windows.I think package managers and different file hierarchies do a lot more for fragmentation than desktop environments do. If we could have a standard file hierarchy and package manager, we would have a lot less problems. There is more to it than that, like dependency issues. But I don't think having choices of desktop environments is the main thing that causes fragmentation.



As you say we are past the CD limit, and how many of us really dont have a DVD drive?
How many people actually use optical media for installing Linux anymore, anyway? It seems like it's shifting a lot more to USB memory sticks. You can reuse them a lot easier, and they're smaller.

[Jakin]

How many people actually use optical media for installing Linux anymore, anyway? It seems like it's shifting a lot more to USB memory sticks. You can reuse them a lot easier, and they're smaller.

I admit it, i waste optical media all the time :oops: The idea is that i can give to someone to keep and tryout. I also often get the dvd iso, for the other languages included.

[vexorian]

No I have been saying it for years, fragmentation is more our enemy than OSX or Windows.

The whole point of this is freedom and having multiple options.

I for one would rather have options than success. Success is such a foul objective for open source anyway. We do not need another successful OS that only brings one choice, we already have OS/X and windows for that.

[KiwiNZ]

Why?

The whole point is freedom and multiple options.

I for one would rather have options than success. Success is such a foul objective for open source anyway.


Success brings success, which in turn brings investment and the growth will attract more Software suppliers and developers, the result a richer experience for all.

But of course failure is way more desirable

[vexorian]

Explain to me why we need software suppliers and developers that would be better fit for the windows world anyway.

I misused the world success. What you speak of is not success. Is the promise of numerical success out of imitating dows and OS/X. And a not-so certain promise at that based on suppositions and other dubious things.

The truth of the matter is:
- DEs are interchangeable in this OS.
- There are developers who would rather develop for unity instead of GNOME.
- There are developers who would rather develop for GNOME instead of unity.
- There are people who would rather use GNOME instead of unity.
- There are people who would rather use Unity instead of GNOME.

Imposing a single option to battle this mythical "enemy" of fragmentation would forcibly give us 50% of losers. 50% users that do not like the choice presented. 50% developers that do not like to develop anymore.

Allowing choice, allows all of these guys in . Users can use unity if they want, they can use GNOME if they want, they can use KDE if they want etc. And contrary to nay-sayers it has been working GREAT. We have a vibrant developer community of people working in DEs and Applications that THEY like. And we got users who have such fun tweaking their systems and taking all the juice from them. So, I didn't use the word success correctly. To me, this is success. If we instead had something like windows. That was popular and mainstream but didn't allow this many choice. That would be failure. Because windows already exists. Where's the need for another one?

[vasa1]

I don't think fragmentation is a problem, choice is good, ...
At least one Mozilla dev is on record expressing frustration with fragmentation.

[KiwiNZ]

Fragmentation ; The act or process of breaking into fragments.

Of course its a myth. It's a myth that there is 100's of Linux Distributions. Its a myth that there is multiple packaging systems. Its a myth that there is multiple file systems.

Why don't Enterprises flock to Linux? Simple which one would they choose? should they spend ten years testing them all when they can go to their suppliers and get Windows or OSX.

Why don't Game suppliers flock to Linux? Simple which one would they choose? or should they spend huge sums developing for them all to have each trade at a loss.

Why don't consumers flock to Linux? Simple which one would they choose? Windows or OSX is in the High Street Appliance store.

But of course the +/-1% after twenty years is a myth, fragmentation is a myth, success is therefore a myth.

[mamamia88]

I personally think it's a great thing to have the choice even if you don't use it. It's nice to have the 4 major DEs all in the same distro.

[vasa1]

...
Allowing choice, allows all of these guys in . Users can use unity if they want, they can use GNOME if they want, they can use KDE if they want etc. ...
Yes they can but there's a cost. Gardens are being walled off by "integration" and "recognized" apps.

[Mikeb85]

Fragmentation ; The act or process of breaking into fragments.

Of course its a myth. It's a myth that there is 100's of Linux Distributions. Its a myth that there is multiple packaging systems. Its a myth that there is multiple file systems.

Why don't Enterprises flock to Linux? Simple which one would they choose? should they spend ten years testing them all when they can go to their suppliers and get Windows or OSX.

Why don't Game suppliers flock to Linux? Simple which one would they choose? or should they spend huge sums developing for them all to have each trade at a loss.

Why don't consumers flock to Linux? Simple which one would they choose? Windows or OSX is in the High Street Appliance store.

But of course the +/-1% after twenty years is a myth, fragmentation is a myth, success is therefore a myth.

While there is fragmentation, it's not quite that bad. SUSE, Red Hat and Ubuntu make up 90+% of Linux users...

Another issue is development tools. MS and Apple make developers lives easy. While Linux has powerful development tools and support for a ton of language and frameworks, it's not the easiest to develop desktop apps for. MS and Apple have consistent and unified frameworks, Linux doesn't.

Dependencies are annoying too, especially since the .debs and .rpms all have different names...

[lykwydchykyn]

All of these desktops can easily be gotten via the repo's anyhow, why not just kill them off, and during install ask the user if they want a different desktop.... since we're beyond a CD now anyhow....

You're taking for granted the fact that these packages would be in the repo, and as well supported, if there weren't the respins. These respin projects often act as a rally point for people interested in packaging and polishing the software for Ubuntu.

[CarpKing]

I might check it out. It's a hassle to boot up into a different environment just to install Gnome-shell, and I'm always wondering if any of my esoteric problems involve Gnome components fighting with Unity.

[Primefalcon]

I might check it out. It's a hassle to boot up into a different environment just to install Gnome-shell, and I'm always wondering if any of my esoteric problems involve Gnome components fighting with Unity.
It doesn't, I have both installed

[mamamia88]

You're taking for granted the fact that these packages would be in the repo, and as well supported, if there weren't the respins. These respin projects often act as a rally point for people interested in packaging and polishing the software for Ubuntu.

also they all probably wouldn't all fit on a single disc and what if you didn't have internet? also what if i don't like unity or kde? would i be forced to install kubuntu or ubuntu just to install gnome-shell and have a bunch of kde crap i might not want on my system? Personally i prefer the spins.

[Linuxratty]

I have been trying a Gnome spin for an associate.it's Gnome spin Fedora 17, frankly it is terrible, I doubt that a Gnome spin Ubuntu will be any improvement.

This is what I suspect the outcome of this experiment will be...Could be wrong,time will tell as they say.

[Primefalcon]

also they all probably wouldn't all fit on a single disc and what if you didn't have internet? also what if i don't like unity or kde? would i be forced to install kubuntu or ubuntu just to install gnome-shell and have a bunch of kde crap i might not want on my system? Personally i prefer the spins.
it'd only install what desktop you choose.... why would it install kde if you choose xfce?

[forrestcupp]

I admit it, i waste optical media all the time :oops: The idea is that i can give to someone to keep and tryout. I also often get the dvd iso, for the other languages included.That's a worthy use of a blank DVD. ;)


The whole point of this is freedom and having multiple options.

I for one would rather have options than success. Success is such a foul objective for open source anyway. We do not need another successful OS that only brings one choice, we already have OS/X and windows for that.If you change the word success to "mainstream use", I think you have a good point. We don't need Linux to be turned into another commercial OS that is controlled by people who care more about their agenda than what people actually want. That's why Windows 8 is so atrocious for the desktop.


Fragmentation ; The act or process of breaking into fragments.

Of course its a myth. It's a myth that there is 100's of Linux Distributions. Its a myth that there is multiple packaging systems. Its a myth that there is multiple file systems.

Why don't Enterprises flock to Linux? Simple which one would they choose? should they spend ten years testing them all when they can go to their suppliers and get Windows or OSX.

Why don't Game suppliers flock to Linux? Simple which one would they choose? or should they spend huge sums developing for them all to have each trade at a loss.

Why don't consumers flock to Linux? Simple which one would they choose? Windows or OSX is in the High Street Appliance store.

But of course the +/-1% after twenty years is a myth, fragmentation is a myth, success is therefore a myth.You're an admin of a Linux forum, yet you never have anything positive to say about Linux. :confused:

[vexorian]

I did intend to mean success in the sense of "mainstream use".


You're an admin of a Linux forum, yet you never have anything positive to say about Linux. I wouldn't dig on that topic.

[mamamia88]

it'd only install what desktop you choose.... why would it install kde if you choose xfce?

As of right now there is no gnome-shell spin in 12.04. If i wanted gnome shell i would have to install one of the other buntus and apt-get install gnome-shell. If you wanted to have the option on the installer you would either have to make sure everyone has internet access out of the box or include it on the cd. It's best to have it on the cd if possible. The DE probably takes up the vast majority of the space on any installer cd. You get what i'm saying? Sure we could provide a dvd with all of it but i don't know about you but i would rather download a 700mb iso than a 4gb iso especially on my 3mb connection.

[KiwiNZ]

That's a worthy use of a blank DVD. ;)

If you change the word success to "mainstream use", I think you have a good point. We don't need Linux to be turned into another commercial OS that is controlled by people who care more about their agenda than what people actually want. That's why Windows 8 is so atrocious for the desktop.

You're an admin of a Linux forum, yet you never have anything positive to say about Linux. :confused:

I am extremely passionate about Linux and in particular Ubuntu, do really think I would have given 8 years of my life to these Forums and been a user and supplier of Linux products since the 90's.

What I don't believe in is the elitist garbage that prevails the Linux community, I actually want see Linux develop and be available all and to be a commercial success.

[forrestcupp]

I am extremely passionate about Linux and in particular Ubuntu, do really think I would have given 8 years of my life to these Forums and been a user and supplier of Linux products since the 90's.

What I don't believe in is the elitist garbage that prevails the Linux community, I actually want see Linux develop and be available all and to be a commercial success.

It's good to hear you say this to reassure us that you still care. :)

I don't like the elitist garbage, either. But it actually seems to be much less here than with other distros.

[irv]

I didn't want to start a new thread and seeing we have been talking about GNOME here, I thought I would post about
Linus Torvalds comment: “GNOME Are In Total Denial” (http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2012/09/linus-torvalds-gnome-are-in-total-denial?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+d0od+%28OMG%21+Ubuntu%21%29&utm_content=FaceBook)
The comment was based on this: GNOME Founder Says Desktop Linux is Dead (http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2012/08/gnome-founder-says-desktop-linux-is-dead)

[vexorian]

That article is really not about GS. but rather about Icaza's BS comments lately.


In fact, Linux pretty much did what I envisioned back in 1991 when I first released it. Pretty much all subsequent development was driven by outside ideas of what other people needed or wanted to do. Not by some internal vision of where things “should” go.

That’s exactly the reverse of the gnome “we know better” mentality, and “We will force Corba/.NET down your throat whether you like it or not, and if you complain, you’re against progress, and cannot handle the change”.

Some gnome people seem to be in total denial about what their problem really is. They’ll wildly blame everybody except themselves. This is like my most favorite Linus' rant ever.

I am going to go buy I <3 Linus Torvalds t-shirts somewhere.

[LeoMcSnarf]

When Unity first came out I downgraded back to 10.04 Lucid... eventually I skipped the first Unity release and tried the second release to feature Unity, which was pretty good. I have to admit it was less buggy, just really different... so I downgraded again and stayed with 10.04 until 12.04 Precise came out. So now Unity is what you'll get with Ubuntu, unless you want a re-spin, which is of course the beauty of GNU/Linux if the first place, everyone gets what they want, and they should. "You can't please everyone all of the time" as the saying goes and it's true. If a great distribution (Ubuntu) makes a spin for most every desktop environment out there everyone should be happy... except people don't seem to like someone else being happy with something they themselves don't like best.... weird, I know.
When Unity first came out I didn't like the fact that Gnome made a great desktop environment, which Ubuntu used as their base, but then glazed over with their own environment... but that is what they did... however as I began using Unity, since 10.04 is older now and I had to move on, it grew on me, a lot. I have to say I really love it now. Would I like a gnome-panel based release? I said a year ago that I did... but I haven't... I still think that their should be a pure Gnome Ubuntu release... even if I wouldn't use it. Every thing for everyone. Some people won't be happy over it but that's okay.

[Eddie Wilson]

I installed gnome-shell as a session and that's how I play around with Gnome 3. I still prefer Unity but it's nice to play around with.