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endlesslove
March 16th, 2005, 06:32 AM
Is Ubuntu competing with debian? Are there some differences between Debian and Ubuntu (philosophically and technically)?

If there is none, why do people have to make and maintain another debian-distro like Ubuntu? Why not just help the debian maintainers improve the debian distro? Why don't people just give donations to debian maintainers so that they may also freely distribute CDs without cost like what Ubuntu do instead of stablishing another distro name and community? What If debian users switched to use Ubuntu and they stopped giving support and donations to debian and then the debian distro died, would this be treated as a success to ubuntu?

Please don't get me wrong. I'm just asking this out of my curiousity.

Thanks for the response.

TravisNewman
March 16th, 2005, 06:38 AM
Who said they're competing?

Debian developers are employed by Canonical to do work on Ubuntu. From what I've heard, working for Canonical also inspires them to do even more work on Debian as well. Ubuntu kicks back any improvements to the community, therefore Debian, and everyone else can improve their distro by Ubuntu's contributions.,

Also, the goals of the two distros are completely different.
Stable Debian is still at kernel 2.2
Stable Ubuntu is at 2.6
Ubuntu strives to be more up to date, yet still being stable.

The term "competing" is a term that is thrown around way too much in Open Source. Most of the time, Open Source project goals are to create a good, stable product to achieve a certain goal. KDE and Gnome are NOT competitors. Gentoo and Debian are not competitors. Firefox and Epiphany are not competitors. The developers wanted something that did things differently, so they made it. That's it.

telmo
March 16th, 2005, 06:41 AM
Hey Thumb there's no need to panic! LOL

TravisNewman
March 16th, 2005, 06:46 AM
Hey Thumb there's no need to panic! LOL
*LOL* Who's panicking?
Gotta love name jokes. Just like the 1st grade playground ;)
KIDDING!

Slapdash
March 16th, 2005, 08:01 AM
:shock: :-D

az
March 16th, 2005, 01:00 PM
www.lugradio.org

Scroll down the past episode guide. They do interviews with Jeff Waugh and Mark Shuttleworth in two previous shows. You really get the idea behind Ubuntu.

They swear a lot on lugradio.

endlesslove
March 21st, 2005, 01:27 AM
www.lugradio.org

Scroll down the past episode guide. They do interviews with Jeff Waugh and Mark Shuttleworth in two previous shows. You really get the idea behind Ubuntu.

They swear a lot on lugradio.
hi azz,
I already listened to this episode of lugradio as you advised. But I did not understand the conversation completely becasue english is not my native tounge and British English is very hard for me to comprehend. Could you please tell me what I supposed to understand about my question above about Ubuntu. I'm neither a user of Debian nor Ubuntu. I'm using Fedora. But my brother uses Debian. What I only know about Ubuntu is that it's shipping is free and it's based on debian.

Thank you very much in advance.

TravisNewman
March 21st, 2005, 01:32 AM
You can get most of the information you need about this from the website
http://www.ubuntulinux.org

poofyhairguy
March 21st, 2005, 08:27 AM
Whoa. You have lots of questions. glad I'm back from vacation.


Is Ubuntu competing with debian? Are there some differences between Debian and Ubuntu (philosophically and technically)?

No. They don't compete- they aim for different audiences. Debian release are for protects that need old and stable (server), while Ubuntu is fresh but less tested (desktops).


If there is none, why do people have to make and maintain another debian-distro like Ubuntu? Why not just help the debian maintainers improve the debian distro?

Well there are differences, yet Ubuntu still helps improve Debian. All the work is offered to the Debian maintainers. They might not accept it all, but its is offered. The fact that they might not accept it is why Ubuntu is separate. Ubuntu can make changes and decisions (such as making releases on schedule and including things like Xorg) that Debian might not accept. Otherwise the Ubuntu devs. might do a lot of work to only have it sit in an unstable branch or not be used at all....its about control. Ubuntu can make its own decisions.


Why don't people just give donations to debian maintainers so that they may also freely distribute CDs without cost like what Ubuntu do instead of stabilizing another distro name and community?

This highlights a problem in plain Debian. Just little things like that-sending CDs- would be a big deal. I mean, what would you put on Debian CDs? It has 10000+ packages, its needs many CDs to get it all (expensive to ship). If you decided to leave some out, the devs might get offended and quit Debian. Therefore the shipping of Debian cds won't happen because of the community nature of debian. With Ubuntu the decisions are made by only a few entities and the goals do not change. Its not mob ruled. So more gets done in the decision making department....

Plus...it costs a lot more to pay good developers to polish Ubuntu than its does to ship a few CDs. And all that work is given to Debian...


What If debian users switched to use Ubuntu and they stopped giving support and donations to debian and then the debian distro died, would this be treated as a success to ubuntu?

Can't happen. Ubuntu's work is offered back to Debian. The worst that would happen is that Debian would never release and be just used as a base for Ubuntu because of lack of interest. But Debian won't or can't be killed by Ubuntu. It can just direct it (but not enough to not be separated).


Please don't get me wrong. I'm just asking this out of my curiousity.

Thanks for the response.

No problem. I like good questions....

az
March 21st, 2005, 04:01 PM
"Is Ubuntu competing with debian? Are there some differences between Debian and Ubuntu (philosophically and technically)?"

Debian is a general-purpose distro. Ubuntu is a streamlined distribution that focuses on the desktop.
Debian has two sides, really. The stable version has a long release cycle which makes for very stable software, but it is dated. This is ideal for servers where you rarely need the cutting edge. The unstable versino of debian have the very latest software avaiable to the free-sortware world. It is always new, and not bug free.
Ubuntu takes this fresh and unstable software and patches it to make it stable. They put a lot of work into it. You get stable cutting-edge software.


"If there is none, why do people have to make and maintain another debian-distro like Ubuntu? Why not just help the debian maintainers improve the debian distro? Why don't people just give donations to debian maintainers so that they may also freely distribute CDs without cost like what Ubuntu do instead of stablishing another distro name and community?"

Ubuntu gives all the work they do to make the distribution stable back to debian. All the patches go back into debian.



"What If debian users switched to use Ubuntu and they stopped giving support and donations to debian and then the debian distro died, would this be treated as a success to ubuntu?"

No. Not at all. Ubuntu needs debian.

node
March 21st, 2005, 04:05 PM
That's the beauty of freedom :)

endlesslove
March 22nd, 2005, 07:59 AM
Thanks a lot guys for the replies. All my questions are clear to me now. I now understand that ubuntu isn't a debian killer. I'm now waiting for the CDs I ordered to arrive and will soon be an Ubuntu user like you guys. Thanks again.

poofyhairguy
March 23rd, 2005, 06:31 AM
Thanks a lot guys for the replies. All my questions are clear to me now. I now understand that ubuntu isn't a debian killer. I'm now waiting for the CDs I ordered to arrive and will soon be an Ubuntu user like you guys. Thanks again.

No problem. Debian seemed to be losing steam. Longer and longer it languished between releases.

Ubuntu and Mepis and Knoppix and such are the new steam. To blow the RPM distros away from the home desktop.