Ubuntu needs a hero (a new mail application)

[CaptSaltyJack]

Let's face it, Thunderbird and Evolution aren't so hot. I've logged extensive time with both, and they're bloated, tired, ugly applications. I'm surprised no one has thrown their hat into the ring to create a new mail application with a fresh interface.

Something like Postbox (http://www.postbox-inc.com/) or Sparrow (http://sparrowmailapp.com/) would be awesome. Why must Linux apps always look so thrown together? Ubuntu has done a lot to step up things in the design/UI/UX department, but many of these very basic applications still suck.

Thoughts?

[haqking]

Let's face it, Thunderbird and Evolution aren't so hot. I've logged extensive time with both, and they're bloated, tired, ugly applications. I'm surprised no one has thrown their hat into the ring to create a new mail application with a fresh interface.

Something like Postbox (http://www.postbox-inc.com/) or Sparrow (http://sparrowmailapp.com/) would be awesome. Why must Linux apps always look so thrown together? Ubuntu has done a lot to step up things in the design/UI/UX department, but many of these very basic applications still suck.

Thoughts?

My thoughts are that I have used email for 20 + years. I have used every version of outlook , most versions of evolution and currently using Thunderbird.

There has been nothing that i havent been able to do with thunderbird.

I access over 10 different types of account with it and there is nothing else i need from it that it doesnt do already.

As for looks that will always be subjective, seeing as it looks exactly the same as the rest of my apps and interface in general then I am certainly happy as it is the way i configured it to look.

as for bloated ? if you mean resource intensive, well never had any issues, though im currently running it on a i7 with 32GB Ram so that might help.

I am not using Ubuntu, but that is irrelevant.

Peace

[Greenborn]

Let's face it, Thunderbird and Evolution aren't so hot. I've logged extensive time with both, and they're bloated, tired, ugly applications. I'm surprised no one has thrown their hat into the ring to create a new mail application with a fresh interface.

Something like Postbox (http://www.postbox-inc.com/) or Sparrow (http://sparrowmailapp.com/) would be awesome. Why must Linux apps always look so thrown together? Ubuntu has done a lot to step up things in the design/UI/UX department, but many of these very basic applications still suck.

Thoughts?

Compared to Microsoft Outlook (bloated) and Apple Mail (very buggy), Thunderbird, in my opinion, is a better choice and it's free. I never did like Evolution and I have never tried Postbox or Sparrow. But your idea is sound- I'm always up to try something new as long as it's free ;).

[CaptSaltyJack]

Keep in mind, this discussion is purely about UX and design. I know Thundebird can technically do what an email client is supposed to do, but we should expect more than that.

[stevedude]

I agree that looks are subjective, but I've also been one that prefers usability and substance over looks. I'm familiar with Postbox and other than dropbox links, there is nothing that Thunderbird can't do that Postbox can. Postbox is based on Thunderbird, but its not free.

I'm not familiar with Sparrow, but it looks like Gwibber turned email client.

Thunderbird can be customized to look like your system theme or use some of the Thunderbird themes for a look that is appealing. With all of the extensions that Thunderbird has, I personally find it hard to leave it for something else because you can extend Thunderbird to do all that Postbox does.

As a part-time Mac user, all of Mac programs look the same as the system controls their look, so again, the looks part is subjective to what the user finds appealing. I can agree that innovation should always strive to improve the current norm, but then you get people complaining about innovation - Just look at the Unity backlash ;)

Personally, if Evolution ever cleans up their act with HTML rendering, I would switch to that client in a heartbeat.

[andrew.46]

Perhaps try something completely different:

https://help.ubuntu.com/community/MuttAndGmail

This setup has been working solidly for me for a long time and is very, very extendable....

[VMC]

Have you looked into claws-mail (http://www.claws-mail.org/). that's all I use for Linux. Postbox for Windows.

[FakeOutdoorsman]

Perhaps try something completely different:

https://help.ubuntu.com/community/MuttAndGmail

This setup has been working solidly for me for a long time and is very, very extendable....


Have you looked into claws-mail (http://www.claws-mail.org/). that's all I use for Linux. Postbox for Windows.

mutt and claws-mail. My two favorites and I use both daily.

Claws can look early 2000ish out-of-the-box last time I checked out the default, but there are several nicer themes available at the claws site. Probably not as nice as the OP would like, but I can understand the desire for functional aesthetics. I never went back to Thunderbird after Claws made me realize how slow it was. This was back when TB used the "all emails in a single file" format. Maybe it's better now.

How about making your own Thunderbird or Claws theme?

[Elfy]

Thread moved to The Community Cafe.

Not a support request.

[MG&TL]

Geary is fairly cool: http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/tag/geary - build-from source or PPA job at the moment though.

[3rdalbum]

The same could be said of many, if not most, Linux programs.

We've got a simple, modern, aesthetically beautiful desktop UI and web browser; but most other programs are complicated and ugly. And non-touch-friendly, which matters if Canonical is serious about making a play for tablets.

I wish I could do something to help revamp Linux software such as Scribus and Audacity (to unfairly pick out two extreme examples), but alas I only have rudimentary programming skills.

[wilee-nilee]

Postbox you have to buy and sparrow looks to be an apple product.

Surely you could have better examples.

Neither look to be open source.

[CaptSaltyJack]

Geary is fairly cool: http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/tag/geary - build-from source or PPA job at the moment though.

YES. Something like this! Clean interface, not cluttered. Modern features like conversation threading a la Gmail. These are the things I'm looking for in a mail client. Thanks for that link.

[philinux]

YES. Something like this! Clean interface, not cluttered. Modern features like conversation threading a la Gmail. These are the things I'm looking for in a mail client. Thanks for that link.

I've got conversation threading in evolution plus google calendar integration. I dont find it bloated. It just gets the job done for me. YMMV.

[CaptSaltyJack]

Postbox you have to buy and sparrow looks to be an apple product.

Surely you could have better examples.

Neither look to be open source.

Who cares how much it costs? Again, I'm speaking in terms of user interface, user experience, design.

[CaptSaltyJack]

I've got conversation threading in evolution plus google calendar integration. I dont find it bloated. It just gets the job done for me. YMMV.

Evolution is absolute garbage. I'm forced to use it when I freelance for clients who use Exchange Server as their corporate mail server because sadly it's the only mail client that supports it. I get lock-ups, wrong calendar appt times, all sorts of mess. Absolute rubbish. I tried Thunderbird + DAVmail, and that solution is rather quirky and doesn't allow calendar use.

For using IMAP servers though, Thunderbird is fine.

Having spent over a decade on Windows, nearly six years on Mac, and having dabbled off and on with Linux about a decade, with recent years seeing more serious use, I get the sense that Linux users are generally too accepting of poorly-designed software. I don't know why this is. I think Linux users ought to be more demanding of software that works, and works *well*, and is designed in a way that makes our workflow more efficient. I don't think this is too much to ask, yet we have these goliath applications like Evolution that frankly I think need to just be scrapped and done from scratch, and NOT just be a team of developers, but have actual experienced UX architects on the team who know how to design interfaces.

Ok, off my soapbox.

[wilee-nilee]

Who cares how much it costs? Again, I'm speaking in terms of user interface, user experience, design.

Ubuntu is a free release, you can buy stuff from the software center, but as far as with a release, there will be no purchases I believe.

Your speaking from what you think needs to be done, and not considering the whole schema.

Basically your argument makes no sense.

No biggie but you might consider just what is an actual possibility, and not tying it to the release.

[fatality_uk]

Let's face it, Thunderbird and Evolution aren't so hot. I've logged extensive time with both, and they're bloated, tired, ugly applications. I'm surprised no one has thrown their hat into the ring to create a new mail application with a fresh interface.

Something like Postbox (http://www.postbox-inc.com/) or Sparrow (http://sparrowmailapp.com/) would be awesome. Why must Linux apps always look so thrown together? Ubuntu has done a lot to step up things in the design/UI/UX department, but many of these very basic applications still suck.

Thoughts?

I agree, but possibly for different reasons. Most Linux email clients and exchange don't mix well. You can get various "hacks" to scrape webmail etc, but none cut the mustard. The fact is Linux will remain a niche product until IT Directors and managers can be assured that deploying Linux to the work place will be as smooth as possible.

Evolution does a better job all round I think, but is not "loved" by many so doesn't get the attention it deserves.

[CaptSaltyJack]

Ubuntu is a free release, you can buy stuff from the software center, but as far as with a release, there will be no purchases I believe.

Your speaking from what you think needs to be done, and not considering the whole schema.

Basically your argument makes no sense.

No biggie but you might consider just what is an actual possibility, and not tying it to the release.

You miss my point. Again, I'm strictly speaking on how to improve Linux apps such as mail clients, from a UX/UI/design standpoint. I never said anything about cost, so I'm not sure why you brought it up. Does it *need* to be free and open source? Not necessarily. I'd pay $15-$20 for a really well-designed and solid mail client on Linux, if it's something I use daily. But hey, if a team decides to open source it, then great.

[wilee-nilee]

You miss my point. Again, I'm strictly speaking on how to improve Linux apps such as mail clients, from a UX/UI/design standpoint. I never said anything about cost, so I'm not sure why you brought it up. Does it *need* to be free and open source? Not necessarily. I'd pay $15-$20 for a really well-designed and solid mail client on Linux, if it's something I use daily. But hey, if a team decides to open source it, then great.

Yes it has to be if you want it as a default on the install.

I have missed nothing, you have a opinion that some will agree with but it makes no sense in the overall scheme of things in the way you have presented it.

What you want or would do has no bearing except on your activities.

[CaptSaltyJack]

So I am presenting the idea that we ought to have higher standards in UI/UX, and we need better mail clients. And this somehow makes no sense to you? Or you don't agree, and you put no value in clean, usable designs? Please enlighten me as to how my posts make no sense, because I think they're pretty clear.

[Simian Man]

So I am presenting the idea that we ought to have higher standards in UI/UX, and we need better mail clients. And this somehow makes no sense to you? Or you don't agree, and you put no value in clean, usable designs? Please enlighten me as to how my posts make no sense, because I think they're pretty clear.

The problem is you are speaking objectively. As if Evolution and Thunderbird are unquestionably flawed rather than that you simply don't like them. If you just said you don't like them and asked for alternatives, people would not argue with you.

[CaptSaltyJack]

The problem is you are speaking objectively. As if Evolution and Thunderbird are unquestionably flawed rather than that you simply don't like them. If you just said you don't like them and asked for alternatives, people would not argue with you.

Well sure, my singular opinion is subjective. However, I'd argue that if I presented Evolution to a team of UX architects & designers, they would wince at it, and pick it apart and find hundreds of ways to improve it. Sometimes, there is such a thing as just poorly-designed software. Not everyone will see that. It's like taking a poorly-composed photograph and showing it to a crowd of people. Only the experts will see what's wrong with it.

[qamelian]

Evolution is absolute garbage.
Sorry, but no. You may not like Evolution, but for my needs, it is the only email/PIM application worth using. It does everything I need it to do, and it does it very well. I've been using it for years without any issues and have yet to find any other app on Linux that even comes close.

Maybe it doesn't suit your needs, but that does not mean it is garbage! :)

[CaptSaltyJack]

Sorry, but no. You may not like Evolution, but for my needs, it is the only email/PIM application worth using. It does everything I need it to do, and it does it very well. I've been using it for years without any issues and have yet to find any other app on Linux that even comes close.

Maybe it doesn't suit your needs, but that does not mean it is garbage! :)

Ok, fair point. Perhaps not *absolute* garbage. If you've ever used it with Exchange servers, you'd see it's completely unreliable with appointments though. This bug (https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=543517) has been around for AGES, and remains unfixed. This, to me, is unacceptable. Yes, I know it's free, but it's frustrating that we don't have *more* options to choose from that actually work properly.

Evolution is, in the grand scheme of things, pretty crappy. It may work for you and you're used to it, but I bet if someone dropped a better solution in front of you that made your life easier *and* did everything you needed it to do, you'd drop Evolution in a heartbeat.

[Simian Man]

Not everyone will see that. It's like taking a poorly-composed photograph and showing it to a crowd of people. Only the experts will see what's wrong with it.
Oh I didn't realize you were an expert. Please educate us.


This, to me, is unacceptable. Yes, I know it's free, but it's frustrating that we don't have *more* options to choose from that actually work properly.
Better get cracking then. (http://docs.python.org/tutorial/)

[CaptSaltyJack]

Oh I didn't realize you were an expert. Please educate us.

Developer for many years. Worked a lot on user interface design, usability. Obviously your request is facetious and sarcastic as I couldn't just hand over this knowledge/experience via a forum.



Better get cracking then. (http://docs.python.org/tutorial/)

Knowing Python isn't the issue. Having the time to actually contribute is.

[UltimateCat]

Let's face it, Thunderbird and Evolution aren't so hot. I've logged extensive time with both, and they're bloated, tired, ugly applications. I'm surprised no one has thrown their hat into the ring to create a new mail application with a fresh interface.

Something like Postbox (http://www.postbox-inc.com/) or Sparrow (http://sparrowmailapp.com/) would be awesome. Why must Linux apps always look so thrown together? Ubuntu has done a lot to step up things in the design/UI/UX department, but many of these very basic applications still suck.

Thoughts?

As crazy as it sounds; I haven't been able to get Evolution to work since I've had Ubuntu 10.04 ; since summer of 2011-

[qamelian]

Ok, fair point. Perhaps not *absolute* garbage. If you've ever used it with Exchange servers, you'd see it's completely unreliable with appointments though. This bug (https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=543517) has been around for AGES, and remains unfixed. This, to me, is unacceptable. Yes, I know it's free, but it's frustrating that we don't have *more* options to choose from that actually work properly.

Evolution is, in the grand scheme of things, pretty crappy. It may work for you and you're used to it, but I bet if someone dropped a better solution in front of you that made your life easier *and* did everything you needed it to do, you'd drop Evolution in a heartbeat.
Well, I do use Evolution with Exchange servers everyday at my day job, and I have yet to encounter any issues. I genuinely don't understand what your problem is with it, because I consider it to be a real gem of an application. Any other application would have to be pretty spectacular to get me to consider dropping Evolution which literally does everything I need and want it to do, exactly the way I want. There are a lot of apps I'd be willing to do without. Evolution isn't one of them.

[urukrama]

What about Postler, elementary's email client?

http://elementaryos.org/discover/postler

http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/tag/postler/

[eric-yorba]

What about Postler, elementary's email client?

The Elementary guys stopped development on Postler and are now contributing to Geary. The goals of the two projects were so similar that it didn't make to duplicate the effort.