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View Full Version : Windows "secure boot" is busted.



Linuxratty
June 3rd, 2012, 11:34 PM
That was fast.
Now what,Microsoft?


At the upcoming MalCon security conference in Mumbai, Austrian independent developer and security analyst Peter Kleissner is scheduled to release the first known "bootkit" for Windows 8—an exploit that is able to load from a hard drive's master boot record and reside in memory all the way through the startup of the operating system, providing root access to the system. The exploit allegedly defeats the security features of Windows 8's new Boot Loader.

http://arstechnica.com/business/2011/11/security-researcher-defeats-windows-8-secure-boot/

wilee-nilee
June 3rd, 2012, 11:53 PM
I'm surprised it took this long, the race begins, lol. ;)

ExSuSEusr
June 4th, 2012, 12:07 AM
It's a band-aid. The new user isn't going to know how to install a bootkit, much less where to get it. And, the language that is used "defeats the security features" will ward off a lot of people.

I won't be happy till MS is sued and this issue is deemed a violation of anti-trust laws and disallowed completely.

inashdeen
June 4th, 2012, 12:10 AM
Lol. Apparmor and SElinux still strong. thank you very much Ubuntu. I stick to you, forever :)

KiwiNZ
June 4th, 2012, 12:22 AM
This is a bad thing.

cprofitt
June 4th, 2012, 12:43 AM
I agree KiwiNZ.

While many may have had issues because it was a Microsoft 'thing'... secure boot in theory was a step in the right direction for end user machines.

VTPoet
June 4th, 2012, 02:38 AM
This is a bad thing.

Oh for God's... CUT! No. No. No. No. No. No. No...

Look at the script, Darth.

The line is: I've got a bad feeling about this. OK? Think you can remember that? NOT "This is a bad thing." OK, can we try this again?

KiwiNZ
June 4th, 2012, 02:48 AM
Oh for God's... CUT! No. No. No. No. No. No. No...

Look at the script, Darth.

The line is: I've got a bad feeling about this. OK? Think you can remember that? NOT "This is a bad thing." OK, can we try this again?

This is a bad thing

MisterGaribaldi
June 4th, 2012, 02:50 AM
oh for god's... cut! No. No. No. No. No. No. No...

Look at the script, darth.

The line is: i've got a bad feeling about this. ok? Think you can remember that? not "this is a bad thing." ok, can we try this again?

+1!!!!!!!!

VTPoet
June 4th, 2012, 02:54 AM
This is a bad thing

OK, can we give the line to Han Solo? Think Han Solo can do this?

KiwiNZ
June 4th, 2012, 02:57 AM
This is bad, very bad Chewy

MisterGaribaldi
June 4th, 2012, 03:16 AM
This is bad, very bad Chewy


http://lh4.ggpht.com/-JunsyKhP-Bk/Tkg5-XSS9zI/AAAAAAAAAU0/PYAYjsAdedI/Dana%252520Elcar_thumb%25255B1%25255D.jpg

"This is wery bad for my asthma."

ExSuSEusr
June 4th, 2012, 03:29 AM
So, do you all think this is the begging of the end? If not what are your reasons... if so what are your reason?

KiwiNZ
June 4th, 2012, 03:31 AM
So, do you all think this is the begging of the end? If not what are your reasons... if so what are your reason?

Beginning of the end of what?

Bucky Ball
June 4th, 2012, 03:32 AM
Beginning of the end of what?

Time? That's what springs to my mind ...

KiwiNZ
June 4th, 2012, 03:36 AM
"Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. but it is, perhaps, the end of the beginning."

Bucky Ball
June 4th, 2012, 03:45 AM
"Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. but it is, perhaps, the end of the beginning."

@Bucky: Disappeared into black hole ...

ExSuSEusr
June 4th, 2012, 03:47 AM
Windows 8 comes out... and is shipped with every new computer. With this in play we aren't going to be able to wipe Windows and install an alternative. No?

With that said, the only people who are going to have the ability to get past that so-called "security" are those who are far far far more advanced with Linux / hardware than the majority of us.

If you can't install a distro on a new laptop - wellllll...

If you can't even install a distro on a home built box because the hardware is locked down thanks to Microsoft...

MisterGaribaldi
June 4th, 2012, 03:48 AM
So, do you all think this is the begging of the end? If not what are your reasons... if so what are your reason?

Someone is begging around here again? 'Cus it sure as h*** ain't me! :p

Oh, and KiwiNZ...


http://i.ytimg.com/vi/NfLgUX4Bkrk/0.jpg

"It's the end, but the moment's been prepared for..."

ExSuSEusr
June 4th, 2012, 04:00 AM
Y'all making jokes... I guess we'll see - since we'll probably wait and then complain after it's happened.

Irihapeti
June 4th, 2012, 04:52 AM
And if it is the beginning of the end?

Maybe it's time to jump ship and quit wasting time on something that's doomed.

Now, where's my Windows install disk?

MisterGaribaldi
June 4th, 2012, 05:07 AM
Y'all making jokes... I guess we'll see - since we'll probably wait and then complain after it's happened.

Couple quick thoughts on this.

1. Usually things touted as "grand design conspiracies" aren't;
2. The masses are dumb and ignorant, but fortunate people pulling this crap are as well.

ExSuSEusr
June 4th, 2012, 05:55 AM
The end users may not be so bright - but the minds behind this? They own 90% of the PC market - practically own the hardware industry - and have managed to "beat" the DOJ in anti-trust suits. They don't sound too dumb to me.

http://www.fsf.org/campaigns/secure-boot-vs-restricted-boot/

But you all are right - there's nooooo reason to be alarmed. None at all.

Microsoft is smiling.

Bachstelze
June 4th, 2012, 06:00 AM
The end users may not be so bright - but the minds behind this? They own 90% of the PC market - practically own the hardware industry - and have managed to "beat" the DOJ in anti-trust suits. They don't sound too dumb to me.

http://www.fsf.org/campaigns/secure-boot-vs-restricted-boot/

But you all are right - there's nooooo reason to be alarmed. None at all.

Microsoft is smiling.

You are a bit too pessimistic. As long as there is demand for non-Microsoft-locked hardware, there will be money to be made by selling it, and there will be someone who will do it.

As for the article at hand, as an academic I consider that new knowledge is always a good thing, so I am of course very pleased to see this.

inashdeen
June 4th, 2012, 06:03 AM
Why is it bad?

Bucky Ball
June 4th, 2012, 06:04 AM
I just had a read of the article. Won't this only be an issue if you want to dual-boot with Windows???

How would this have any effect on running Win inside Ubuntu as a virtual machine???

ExSuSEusr
June 4th, 2012, 06:08 AM
I just had a read of the article. Won't this only be an issue if you want to dual-boot with Windows???

How would this have any effect on running Win inside Ubuntu as a virtual machine???

Because if you are not given the option to disable this... you won't be able to install Linux at all. Never mind being able to dual-boot.

The "new" computer you buy that has the feature of disabling disabled - will block any operating system (except for Windows 8 ) to be installed. That means, you get home from Best Buy with your shiny new laptop and pop in the Ubuntu install disk.... and nothing will happen. The system will be locked to run Windows and Windows only - oh and any program that Microsoft tells you, you can.

Everyone is acting like this is no big deal - that Microsoft won't take it to the next level to eventually ensure that they will have total control over the entire PC market - hardware, software, OS's and PC/Laptop manufacturers.

Essentially, with these keys - MS could theoretically have control over which software you can and can't use.

This isn't some "security" measure. What? After all these years, after showing the world time and time again that MS doesn't really give a flip about the security of their OS... now? Now suddenly they want to take this precaution to "protect" the end user.. BS... it has nothing to do with security - it has everything to do with positioning themselves to own your computer.

But, yeah it's no big deal...

Bachstelze
June 4th, 2012, 06:14 AM
Everyone is acting like this is no big deal - that Microsoft won't take it to the next level to eventually ensure that they will have total control over the entire PC market - hardware, software, OS's and PC/Laptop manufacturers.


It's only in your delusions that Microsoft can "have total control over the entire PC market".

Bucky Ball
June 4th, 2012, 06:15 AM
Always build my own desktops (and for others) so that really is no big deal. As for laptops ... I smell the courtroom and I smell MS in it ... this is a looooooong way from over.

Yes, it is a deal, but at this point not a big one. PANIC buttons are fun to press though, I suppose ... apparently the sky's falling also ... ;)

ExSuSEusr
June 4th, 2012, 06:17 AM
It's only in your delusions that Microsoft can "have total control over the entire PC market".

Ok so when you can't install Linux on any new computer... What then?

You tell me how Microsoft wont have total control over the PC market when you can't install any other OS except for the version of Windows that the computer was shipped with.

Really... I'm all ears smart guy.

Bachstelze
June 4th, 2012, 06:20 AM
Ok so when you can't install Linux on any new computer...

Yeah, call me when this happens.

Bucky Ball
June 4th, 2012, 06:20 AM
Ok so when you can't install Linux on any new computer... What then?

You tell me how Microsoft wont have total control over the PC market when you can't install any other OS except for the version of Windows that the computer was shipped with.

Really... I'm all ears.

Press button here ... Like I mentioned, unless they are intending to doctor all hard drives with this technology (as well as laptops).

This could be the best thing to happen. The market might open up for building your own laptop (and I would expect it to) which, at the moment, is a virtual impossibility. We can't predict what avenues may open if this happens but I think it is a little early to start making stark, generalised predictions that 'Linux is uninstallable on all machines as of now or soon!!!' Kneejerk reaction.

PS: While I'm at it; a third of the people living in houses have no running water. That is a big deal the world has no intention of doing anything about. This? The moment it looks like being a reality there will be court cases left, right and centre, and nerds, geeks, boffins and others furiously working away at getting around yet another hurdle MS has thrown up to slow down technological sophistication by another decade (they're good at that). Nerds, geeks, boffins and others will prevail, as they have in the past.

Can anyone cite a previous supposed cause of ruination of open-source that has turned into a furphy???

gingermark
June 4th, 2012, 06:41 AM
I'm not a smart guy like you fellas above me, but I like the FSF's stance campaigning to ensure that the end user can authorise what OS / Software runs on their hardware.

It might not happen, but this seems to be a sensible and achievable goal, one that I think could hardly be called unreasonable. And if this happens, I would not have a problem welcoming secure boot...

sffvba[e0rt
June 4th, 2012, 09:57 AM
Seems that many smart people struggle to understand and keep within this forums CoC...

There is a rugby saying, "Play the ball, not the man..." perhaps that would make more sense to some here?

Thread closed.


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