Give me one reason why GNU is still developing Hurd

[zombifier25]

...and one of the world's biggest mysteries is solved. (others include aliens, ghosts, JB fans,...)

[szymon_g]

because they have a plenty of spare time- so they can do whatever they want with it.

[forrestcupp]

because they have a plenty of spare time- so they can do whatever they want with it.

You beat me to it. :)

The same reason other people build model cars and airplanes. They like doing it.

[Dry Lips]

I didn't even know what Hurd was... I had to Google it. So, it's a replacement for Unix?

Wow! That's a really good idea... No wait, we've already got BSD and Linux, don't we?

[HappinessNow]

I didn't even know what Hurd was... I had to Google it. So, it's a replacement for Unix?

Wow! That's a really good idea... No wait, we've already got BSD and Linux, don't we?

...and Haiku?

[Seq]

With that answered, maybe we can try and figure out why emacs is still being developed when vi is so awesome. We don't need both Chrome and Firefox, either. And why are there so many obscure window managers...

[mips]

So, it's a replacement for Unix?


More like Linux :biggrin:

Reason I say this is there was a boat load of GNU userland stuff available but no kernel for it, Linux filled that role hence the term GNU/Linux. GNU & Linux are not the same thing, GNU was suppose to be a complete OS with it's own kernel but seeing they did not have one they adopted Linux which is not part of GNU.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GNU/Linux_naming_controversy

[Dry Lips]

Is Hurd so mature that it is possible to use it as a more or less functional system?

[Paqman]

Sheer bloody-minded refusal to face reality?

[dpny]

sheer bloody-minded refusal to face reality?

+5

[donkyhotay]

because they have a plenty of spare time- so they can do whatever they want with it.

+1

[KiwiNZ]

Sheer bloody-minded refusal to face reality?

Hmmmm, I was under the impression the OSS/GNU movement was about freedom

[Dry Lips]

Have anyone here actually tried Hurd?

[Paqman]

Hmmmm, I was under the impression the OSS/GNU movement was about freedom

The freedom to choose doesn't imply that all choices are equally valid. The GNU system already has an excellent, mature, widely supported kernel. Wasting developer time on building another might be a fun technical exercise, but it's not going to achieve anything useful.

We're all free to punch ourselves in the face any time we like. Doesn't mean anyone will applaud you for doing so.

[KiwiNZ]

The freedom to choose doesn't imply that all choices are equally valid. The GNU system already has an excellent, mature, widely supported kernel. Wasting developer time on building another might be a fun technical exercise, but it's not going to achieve anything useful.

We're all free to punch ourselves in the face any time we like. Doesn't mean anyone will applaud you for doing so.

Freedom is allowing those developers to select what project they work on.

Your logic could easily be applied to Linux desktop, after all it has only achieved +/- 1% and could be deemed as achieving nothing useful.

[lykwydchykyn]

Is there currently a FOSS kernel out there with a microkernel design? HURD is a microkernel, with a unique design. It's possible that someday the monolithic kernel approach will fail to scale (or at least be inappropriate for a given application), and won't it be nice to have a readily available microkernel to drop in and go?

BTW, last time I heard, Debian Wheezy is supposed to have a HURD flavor by the time it's released.

[BeRoot ReBoot]

Because why not? I'm still hoping to one day be able to use a fully GNU-based OS, preferably with the HURD kernel and Emacs as the userland.

[forrestcupp]

Is there currently a FOSS kernel out there with a microkernel design? HURD is a microkernel, with a unique design. It's possible that someday the monolithic kernel approach will fail to scale (or at least be inappropriate for a given application), and won't it be nice to have a readily available microkernel to drop in and go?If there were a viable one, you would probably know about it.


BTW, last time I heard, Debian Wheezy is supposed to have a HURD flavor by the time it's released.
Just because Debian is going to have a HURD version doesn't mean HURD is going to be any less crappy than it always has been. ;)

It's got a long way to go before it supports enough hardware to be viable.

[Copper Bezel]

Honestly, I'm surprised that there isn't more support for it, for the reason lykwydchykyn raised. Yes, kernels are hard, and it's more straightforwardly applicable to real life to do work on the Linux kernel than to work with another esoteric alternative. Yes, the hardware support is a very serious issue, because that's most of what a kernel does and most of the limitations that even GNU / Linux faces. But it's rather broadly accepted that the microkernel model is just better than the monolithic kernel strategy. To me, Haiku or *BSD offers less distinction from Linux than does Hurd, yet people do develop them. If each project were really seriously considering what the practical outcomes of its enterprise really might be, as the question assumes, then I'd think that people interested in providing another option that isn't Linux would flock to Hurd.

[szymon_g]

I didn't even know what Hurd was... I had to Google it. So, it's a replacement for Unix?

no. Plan 9 was a replacement for Unix.

[dpny]

But it's rather broadly accepted that the microkernel model is just better than the monolithic kernel strategy.

Not unless they've solved the messaging latency inherent in microkernels.

[BrokenKingpin]

Is there currently a FOSS kernel out there with a microkernel design? HURD is a microkernel, with a unique design. It's possible that someday the monolithic kernel approach will fail to scale (or at least be inappropriate for a given application), and won't it be nice to have a readily available microkernel to drop in and go?
This. They feel it is a better design than the current kernels... simple as that.

That being said I think Linux is doing a damn fine job and Hurd is a long way out from being usable on the desktop IMO.

[Bandit]

...and one of the world's biggest mysteries is solved. (others include aliens, ghosts, JB fans,...)

Becuase its hurd to build :D

[wolfen69]

Is Hurd so mature that it is possible to use it as a more or less functional system?

As far as I know, you would have to have a pretty generic type setup for it to be compatible. No thanks, it's too plain to have any practical use for me.

[lykwydchykyn]

I don't see anywhere -- even on the HURD project site -- that it's suggested that HURD is faster, more stable, or provides a better user experience than Linux or BSD. It's just a different design for a kernel, one that some developers find interesting and want to hack on. One that may one day prove to be more applicable to some technology stack than Linux. Or may not.

Who knows where technology is heading? 5 years ago most of you would have wondered why anyone bothered to keep up an ARM port of Linux, since x86 was so obviously the only platform that mattered. Now ARM is the next big thing, and other OS vendors are scrambling to support it. Linux is already there. Not because someone had a crystal ball and knew that ARM would be the next big platform, but because some people (for whatever reasons) were "wasting their time" maintaining a port to some obscure platform.

Be happy that people are hacking on HURD, or plan 9, or AROS, haiku, Syllable, etc. They aren't competing with Linux, they're enriching FOSS.

[mbarland]

Is there currently a FOSS kernel out there with a microkernel design

Minix is about as close as I can see. Version 3 isn't really feature complete for desktop use, but it does present a useable desktop OS.

[zombifier25]

With that answered, maybe we can try and figure out why emacs is still being developed when vi is so awesome. We don't need both Chrome and Firefox, either. And why are there so many obscure window managers...
Because emacs and vi are not the same. Chrome and Firefox are not the same. But Hurd wants to do what Linux has already done 10 years ago: A kernel for the GNU project, a free/libre operating system.

I support competition, but with GNU already adopting Linux AND still working on Hurd (for 20 freakin' years), it's the same as using cars and still working on horse chariots.

because they have a plenty of spare time- so they can do whatever they want with it.
Convinced:lolflag: