The Netbook and its Last Stand

[Lucradia]

it began with Asus, it will end with Asus:

http://reviews.cnet.com/laptops/asus-eee-pc-1025c/4505-3121_7-35136090.html

This is the latest netbook to be pushed by any computer maker. Thoughts on how long it will last?

[Copper Bezel]

In other news, Apple will continue selling 11" MacBook Airs, Asus will continue its Transformer line, and computers are thinner and faster than they were three years ago.

What's not being pushed anymore is the word "netbook" or the godawfully restrictive 1024x600 display. Luckily, we have new nonsense words like "ultrabook" to make up the difference.

[drawkcab]

I just bought a 12" Lenovo Thinkpad x120e for the same price.

[JDShu]

I hope I will always be able to get something similar to netbooks. Since I need to do real work, including word processing and programming, everywhere I go, my eeepc has been invaluable to me - and the price point is great. I don't think this would be easy (yet?) to do on a tablet.

[Grenage]

I used to think that netbooks were pointless little devices, with no practical purpose. I still think that, but appreciate that many people have found a use for the things. I wouldn't worry too much; if there is a consumer market, it will probably be catered to.

[ssam]

for me 12inch seems the best size for a laptop. i dont need much cpu power. so i have a lenovo S12.

[wyliecoyoteuk]

They had their time in the spotlight.
The netbook is a great tool for casual internet use, unfortunately many people thought that they were getting a small laptop to play games on, and were disappointed.
The other thing is that most people who want a netbook now have one.There is not the upgrade cycle of a laptop or PC.
I still use my AA1 a couple of times a week, (or constantly on holiday), a single core Atom, 1.5GB ram,an 802.11n wifi card and a 16Gb SSD running Ubuntu is fine for internet use.
I have edited a couple of articles on it, but I wouldn't want to use it fulltime for that.
Phones and tablets are taking over the sales point, and a tablet with a bluetooth keyboard is basically a netbook with a touchscreen.
:D

[JayKay3OOO]

Ultrabook is simply the competition copying Apple or realising that people are generally more mobile and don't want to carry a hunk of plastic around. It's got to be good for the environment too right. Use less materials to make same product.

I've never really seen what's so good about netbooks. They are still fairly big and the low end ones have big fugly batteries with not a huge battery life for their size.

The tablet computer will probably take over in a few years when it can do more multitasking with Windows 8 out soon with it's tablet style interface there could be scope for a tablet with 'real' computer usage. The Ipad is still a bit of a toy at the moment. A good one at that.

Although as a consumer I think the whole tablet space is a bit of a shambles at the moment. There seems to be a flood of them with so many versions of Android not to mention hundreds of ipad nock offs. It's a consumers nightmare because not only do you have to take into consideration the OS version or pre-packed features and style, the size, the screen sensitivity, it's real world abilities, expansion options, battery life and screen clarity, but as I stated there is no consistency with the OS. I mean. C'MON! I don't have a whole day to look through ALL the tablets and compare EVERYTHING then check the reviews. Yeah. I don't know what one to get so................... IPAD! It's not apples an oranges you are buying, these devices often cost a fair amount for the average consumer and buying the wrong one could be a disaster or a big pain having to send it back.

The netbook is simple. The low spec ones you know can do basic tasks and come with a solid OS (Windows) or if you know what you are doing then you can switch it for Linux. Naturally if you have the cash then the macbook air is a perfect option for the style concious consumer.

For people like myself it's going to take some convincing to get rid of our trusted laptops and invest in tablets because at the moment they are more a luxury item, but that's changing fast. A years time I'll hopefully be wrong based on the explosive leaps towards this space so far.

However. I can't wait for gesture recognition to filter down to the mainstream. NO MORE FINGER PRINTS!

[TeamRocket1233c]

What about netvertibles (netbooks that you can turn into tablets)?

[kurt18947]

<snip>
Phones and tablets are taking over the sales point, and a tablet with a bluetooth keyboard is basically a netbook with a touchscreen.
:D

Yup, that's how it looks to me.

[Paqman]

Thoughts on how long it will last?

Quite a while. There will continue to be a market for small highly portable laptops, it just won't be quite as huge as it used to be.

Most of the people you find still using netbooks are geeks who want a fully versatile machine with a good keyboard running a desktop OS, but with the portability of a tablet. I don't think netbooks ever really fulfilled their original aim of being digital media consumption devices, they've been beaten to that post by phones/tablets/phablets. But there will still be a demand from some folks for laptops that are ultra portable.

[dpny]

Although as a consumer I think the whole tablet space is a bit of a shambles at the moment.

The non-iPad, non-Kindle/Nook tablet space is a shambles, but it's a tiny part of the tablet space. For the time being, those three are, for all intents and purposes, the only tablets out there.

[rg4w]

What about netvertibles (netbooks that you can turn into tablets)?
Yes. Personally, I see that as the more optimal next step beyond today's tablets. Put a touch screen on a MacBook Air, make it detachable, and it's better than an Asus Transformer (which is currently both my favorite tablet and my favorite netbook).

[BeRoot ReBoot]

Netbooks were basically "cheap and portable, whatever it takes". Now the hardware vendors are finally compromising on the "cheap" part, and we get Ultrabooks - a much more sensible half-way product between smartphones and laptops. I don't mind paying more for a system I can customise to my liking that doesn't feel like a plastic piece of crap and can run desktop software without stuttering like crazy.

[wolfen69]

Whatever the next great thing is, is what takes over. I'm ready for it and not afraid of change. It doesn't change the basics of life. We still have to deal with depression, death, taxes, relationships, etc. Until my smartphone or computer can sort these things out, they are just a tool which I use once in a while.

[Copper Bezel]

Phones and tablets are taking over the sales point, and a tablet with a bluetooth keyboard is basically a netbook with a touchscreen.
As others have said, netbooks generally run a full desktop OS. Unless the tablet can run Ubuntu, it wouldn't be remotely equivalent for my purposes, at least; I need a small device that runs real applications, and I like to have some versatility, too, like plugging in an external display to extend the desktop at home. A tablet is a better secondary device, but it can't be a primary. (An 11" "ultrabook," of course, would be interchangeable with the netbook.)

I have one of the thinner netbooks out there, though - most of them really don't have an immense portability advantage, and the ones with extended batteries make me really question the concept. (Mine wasn't $300, either, and I know that the price point was a big advantage for the class.)

The netvertibles that are really touchscreen netbooks seem pointless to me - a 1 kg tablet is a bit of a joke. Something like the Transformer Prime (preferably with a nice-sized Synaptics trackpad) with 2 Gb RAM and running Ubuntu would be beautiful.

That's for dreaming, though. In practical terms for me, it all just means that my next machine is going to cost more than this one did, but probably look just a bit nicer, too.

[viperdvman]

Well, my AMD-powered Asus was the most powerful single-core netbook on the market when I got it. Only the ION-powered dual-core Atoms were more powerful... and unfortunately more expensive... way beyond the $300 I paid for my netbook.

It's been a really good secondary and mobile computer for me, and still is to this day despite being a year and a half old. I run Windows 7 and Ubuntu 11.10 on it without any problems, even with a 1024x600 screen (note: even the iPad and iPad 2 run 1024x768). If I do replace it anytime soon, it'll likely be with a 11" or 12" ultrabook... nice and cheap yet still decently powerful and acts like a laptop instead of a tablet.

Tablets are great for a lot of basic stuff and all, but they aren't ready to replace laptops and ultrabooks yet... not even netbooks. The only tablet I've seen that comes close to emulating a netbook/ultrabook is the Asus Transformer and Transformer Prime. The ARM architecture is very tempting for computer manufacturers, especially when a lot of major OS's are implementing ARM support (Windows and most major Linux distros). They are decently powerful and consume less power than comparable x86-based units.

Do I see netbooks being completely replaced? No. Do I see them going the Transformer direction? Absolutely.

[SemiExpert]

The original Asus Eee PC was a clever and unique device back in 2007. The netbooks that followed weren't very clever at all, just smaller, slower, cheaper notebooks. The netbook concept might have continued to evolve if Microsoft hadn't gotten involved with bargain priced XP licensing and the crippled, ironically named Windows 7 "Starter Edition."

[3rdalbum]

My main computer is a netbook. I love the portability, the full function OS and the keyboard for typing.

If they don't release an Ubuntu tablet with a keyboard dock, then my next computer will be an Ultrabook. Not as portable as a netbook, and a little more expensive, but faster and sadly soon to be the only choice.

Netbooks will go away soon.

[Warpnow]

In 2-3 years we'll the exact same thing being said about tablets. How silly people were to buy them, how they were underpowered and just a fad, or that they were a misunderstanding.

What people fail to realize is that netbooks sold well because technology came to an efficiency point where they could be produced at a price that was considered a good value for the time.

Tablets are the same things. Increases in technology have lead to an affordable option that was once unaffordable.

Neither technology is really what consumers want but provides much of what they want for the right cost during its window of opportunity.

They weren't bad purchases on the behalf of the consumer, in fact they were good purchases. Good economic products, but technologically inferior to what will come and be affordable in only a short time.

As such, I feel most of these "bridge" products, such as netbooks, tablets, and to a lesser degree ultrabooks and smartphones, will eventually be viewed as silly by everyone in a few years. We'll have something new we consider better and couldn't possibly imagine why someone would go for any less.

[SemiExpert]

In 2-3 years we'll the exact same thing being said about tablets. How silly people were to buy them, how they were underpowered and just a fad, or that they were a misunderstanding.



I don't think that a tablet with the hardware specs of the iPad 3 are underpowered given the intended use - content consumption. In contrast, many netbooks were decidedly underpowered, especially in terms of graphics.


What people fail to realize is that netbooks sold well because technology came to an efficiency point where they could be produced at a price that was considered a good value for the time.

I'm not sure there was ever an efficiency point for the very conventional netbooks that eventually defined the segment. Combine an Intel Atom processor with a 2.5 inch hard drive, a stick of DDR2 RAM, an undersized keyboard and a subnormal 1024x600 resolution screen and what do you have? A very small, very slow PC notebook that doesn't have a notable price advantage over an entry level full sized (15.6 inch) PC notebook.
Tablets are the same things. Increases in technology have lead to an affordable option that was once unaffordable.

Neither technology is really what consumers want but provides much of what they want for the right cost during its window of opportunity.

They weren't bad purchases on the behalf of the consumer, in fact they were good purchases. Good economic products, but technologically inferior to what will come and be affordable in only a short time.

As such, I feel most of these &quot;bridge&quot; products, such as netbooks, tablets, and to a lesser degree ultrabooks and smartphones, will eventually be viewed as silly by everyone in a few years. We'll have something new we consider better and couldn't possibly imagine why someone would go for any less.

The touchscreen interface isn't going anywhere any time soon, while the 10 inch netbook is probably going to go extinct in coming months. The irony of the netbook is that the original Eee PC 700 represented a decent concept, and the short term success of the concept lead to its marginalization. I can still remember when the Intel Atom line was intended for the strange Mobile Internet Device (MID) segment, basically really thick and heavy 5 or 6 inch PDA gadgets that very few people ever bought. Then the netbook came along and Intel jumped on the bandwagon along with Microsoft. And the netbook market quickly shifted away from early adopters.

Truth be known, the artifical ultrabook segment isn't the next netbook style fad, if only because the ultrabook concept has never reached the same level of popularity as the original Eee PC of 2007. Nobody is paying above MSRP for ultrabooks. Other than the Macbook Air, I don't see a single one that's selling very well at all. I think it says a lot when Linus Torvalds buys his kid a Macbook Air, even if he is running OpenSuse on it.

[Hylas de Niall]

I still love my three year old Akoya Mini. It's had much travelling about, loads of different OS's installed, and is still perfect for whatever i want to do on a computer - except (natch) gaming.

Long live netbooks!

[Copper Bezel]

I'm not sure there was ever an efficiency point for the very conventional netbooks that eventually defined the segment. Combine an Intel Atom processor with a 2.5 inch hard drive, a stick of DDR2 RAM, an undersized keyboard and a subnormal 1024x600 resolution screen and what do you have? A very small, very slow PC notebook that doesn't have a notable price advantage over an entry level full sized (15.6 inch) PC notebook.
Yes, that's the point. = ) An "entry-level" 15" notebook is two to three times the volume and weight of the netbook.


I don't think that a tablet with the hardware specs of the iPad 3 are underpowered given the intended use - content consumption. In contrast, many netbooks were decidedly underpowered, especially in terms of graphics.
But that works both ways. What's the intended use? Certainly not gaming.

Incidentally, it has to be said - the new Eee line is kind of ugly, isn't it? Particularly in contrast to the Meego-based X101s (http://www.asus.com/Eee/Eee_PC/Eee_PC_X101/) that they're selling now?

[Paqman]

Yes, that's the point. = ) An "entry-level" 15" notebook is two to three times the volume and weight of the netbook.


Exactly. I still find my netbook useful purely because I can slip it into my normal rucksack. I've never found a laptop to be as portable.

Laptops have been getting too big for years. Many of them are massive now, you'd have to have a hell of a lap to find it comfortable to use without a table. The market has proved there's a genuine demand for devices in the 9-11" range, and at the 13" small end of the laptop market. Personally I think Apple have done well to keep their laptops at the sane end of the size spectrum, and other manufacturers are starting to wake up to that. There seems to have been a lot of runaway "bigger is better" thinking, which is pretty stupid for a portable device.

[SemiExpert]

Exactly. I still find my netbook useful purely because I can slip it into my normal rucksack. I've never found a laptop to be as portable.



Yes, but how do you prevent damage to a very small plastic notebook when you slip it into a rucksack? I've never seen a single netbook with a screen hinge, and very few with rugged cases.


Laptops have been getting too big for years. Many of them are massive now, you'd have to have a hell of a lap to find it comfortable to use without a table. The market has proved there's a genuine demand for devices in the 9-11&quot; range, and at the 13&quot; small end of the laptop market. Personally I think Apple have done well to keep their laptops at the sane end of the size spectrum, and other manufacturers are starting to wake up to that. There seems to have been a lot of runaway &quot;bigger is better&quot; thinking, which is pretty stupid for a portable device.

Looking at recent history, it looks as if 11.6 inches in the new minimum size for netbooks, notebooks or notbooks, whatever you want to call them. That's basically the minimum footprint for a fullsized keyboard. As far as the size and weight of notebooks, screen sizes increased with consumerization. Go back to the 1990s, and the average laptop user was a business user and 12 inches represented a practical minimum - not that much different than today. The keyboard is the limiting factor.

[SemiExpert]

Yes, that's the point. = ) An &quot;entry-level&quot; 15&quot; notebook is two to three times the volume and weight of the netbook.




Yes, but it also has 2 or 3 times the processing power, storage and RAM. Compare the relative computing value a 10.1 inch Atom netbook to a 15.6 inch B940 notebook. The value comparison doesn't favor the netbook.


But that works both ways. What's the intended use? Certainly not gaming.to three times the volume and weight of the netbook.

I have a feeling that casual gaming is migrating to iOS and Android platforms.


Incidentally, it has to be said - the new Eee line is kind of ugly, isn't it? Particularly in contrast to the Meego-based X101s (http://www.asus.com/Eee/Eee_PC/Eee_PC_X101/) that they're selling now?

I really don't think that Asus sells on the basis of external design. They're just an ODM that branched out into retail. I can't honestly remember exactly what the original Eee PC 700 looked like, other than being small and plastic - it was the concept that sold, not the execution. As far as the X101, it's tragic it was launched at about the same time MeeGo was cancelled in favor of Tizen. Yes, MeeGo is still supported, but with such a small user base, for how long? Yes, the X101 can apparently be updated with a standard 2.5 inch, 7mm thick SSD, so it's not a dead end device, just a very strange reiteration of the original Asus Eee PC 700 concept.

[Paqman]

Yes, but how do you prevent damage to a very small plastic notebook when you slip it into a rucksack? I've never seen a single netbook with a screen hinge, and very few with rugged cases.


They generally come with covers. Hinges breaking is a problem on any size laptop. The damage I've seen to netbooks has been the usual laptop stuff really, spills in keyboards and worn our hinges. One thing I haven't seen much of in netbooks that's really common in bigger laptops is knackered power plugs, as they're not left plugged in as much due to having good battery life.

[Paqman]

Yes, but it also has 2 or 3 times the processing power, storage and RAM. Compare the relative computing value a 10.1 inch Atom netbook to a 15.6 inch B940 notebook. The value comparison doesn't favor the netbook.


There is such a thing as having enough power. For a portable device, trading raw power for portability and a considerable extension in battery life is a great tradeoff, especially if the computing power is enough to do 90% of what you'd ever want to do.

The exception would of course be if for some reason you're using Windows instead of Linux, in which case you'd want more power than most netbooks have got if you want to run a decent version of Windows well. But for a Linux user it should be no problem to get good enough performance out of that hardware.

[mamamia88]

There is such a thing as having enough power. For a portable device, trading raw power for portability and a considerable extension in battery life is a great tradeoff, especially if the computing power is enough to do 90% of what you'd ever want to do.

The exception would of course be if for some reason you're using Windows instead of Linux, in which case you'd want more power than most netbooks have got if you want to run a decent version of Windows well. But for a Linux user it should be no problem to get good enough performance out of that hardware.
Running windows 7 home premium on my netbook right now. Did a fresh install after failed upgrade to 12.04 and it runs great with 2gb ram. I don't want netbooks to go away. The only thing it doesn't do is hd video which i would like but it's not a dealbreaker. sure stuff like ultrabooks look great but is it worth 3x the price? not in my opinion

[Paqman]

it runs great with 2gb ram.

Did your netbook come with 2GB though?

[SemiExpert]

There is such a thing as having enough power. For a portable device, trading raw power for portability and a considerable extension in battery life is a great tradeoff, especially if the computing power is enough to do 90% of what you'd ever want to do.



Portability is more a function of the form factor of a full-sized keyboard than outright computing power. Moreover, people often do buy computers on the basis of the other 10% of what you'd ever want to do, as you put it. And to take it a step further, netbooks typically had fairly poor battery lives considering the level of performance. Blame the relative inefficiency of past generations of the Intel Atom processor. There's a reason why it took so long for Intel to even contemplate Atom powered smartphones.

[SemiExpert]

Running windows 7 home premium on my netbook right now. Did a fresh install after failed upgrade to 12.04 and it runs great with 2gb ram. I don't want netbooks to go away. The only thing it doesn't do is hd video which i would like but it's not a dealbreaker. sure stuff like ultrabooks look great but is it worth 3x the price? not in my opinion

There's a lot fun things that come along with greater processing power and memory. Virtualization is one example. And video playback isn't especially demanding in terms of hardware, it's just an Intel Atom issue. Do I want to see netbooks go away? I think that the world would be a better place if Intel dumped the Atom brand with Medfield. Medfield is coming, and there will be x86 tablets and smartphones, but it would be bad marketing to brand any conventional clamshell devices as netbooks. So yes, the netbook is dead, at least in terms of semantics.

[Copper Bezel]

Portability is more a function of the form factor of a full-sized keyboard than outright computing power. Moreover, people often do buy computers on the basis of the other 10% of what you'd ever want to do, as you put it.
Right, which is why it's a niche product. I feel like you're trying to prove not that netbooks don't have much of a market, which is fairly obvious, but that those of us who use them don't really use them, which is nonsense.

And again, it's semantics, because as far as I'm concerned, the 11" MacBook Air is an expensive netbook. I couldn't imagine the same Atom processor and 10x6 screen resolution existing much longer than it has. There are, simply, those of us who prefer the form factor and don't actually need the extra cycles. (It's not as if I'd complain to have a faster CPU. But for various reasons, mostly work ones, I need something I can hold in one hand and fit in a bag made for paper documents.)


Yes, but how do you prevent damage to a very small plastic notebook when you slip it into a rucksack? I've never seen a single netbook with a screen hinge, and very few with rugged cases.
If I'm dropping it into the bottom of a bag I intend to toss around, I've taken to using the leather sleeve that came with it, but over the year and a half I've had it, it's been dropped and tossed around and generally been through hell. It's held together a hell of a lot better than my last 15", which I had to shoot when it broke a hinge, but then, that was a Compaq.

For that matter, weight scales by the cube, and material strength scales by the square....


I have a feeling that casual gaming is migrating to iOS and Android platforms.
Yeah, but what I said was that netbooks were useless for gaming. So.


I really don't think that Asus sells on the basis of external design.
They sometimes try. They have as much ugly kit as anyone else, but there are some exceptions that go well above, or below, the usual expectations.

I have this one, (http://www.notebookcheck.net/Review-Asus-Eee-PC-S101-Mini-Notebook.14128.0.html) but with the later island-style keyboard; the photos are not exaggerating, and there really are rhinestones in the hinges and glitter baked into the trackpad. They add weird things (http://asia.cnet.com/product/asus-eee-pad-memo-me171-dual-core-processor-1-2ghz-7-inch-display-45428902.htm) to tablets for aesthetic reasons, and occasionally try some really random ****. (http://usa.asus.com/Notebooks/Special_Edition/U6V_Bamboo/) Recently, they released a Macbook Air clone with aluminum keys. (http://www.engadget.com/2011/10/21/asus-zenbook-ux31-review/)

Nothing quite as nice as the Samsung Series 9, though. Yum.

Edit: So it's less like design-consciousness for Asus and more like some of their machines come pre-Etsy'd. = )

[keithpeter]

Hello All

The first time I took an Asus EeePC 700 around to show staff and students there were two reactions:

Chaps (majority): huh, low powered toy.

Ladies (majority): where do I get one? Can it run Word? Will it work on a projector?

We got very good use out of a class set for a good three academic years. I could carry a class set in a padded bag.

My personal Samsung NC10 was second hand off ebay and it has the long life battery, and has a reasonable keyboard. Does fine for most of what I do including basic statistics using R/Rstudio and a spot of sound recording/processing. Can hook into a projector and be used for presentations. Lives in a messenger bag.

I lugged a 15.4 inch HP monster around for a couple of years. Lovely keyboard and fast but I have back problems...

Ethnography: I see far more laptops in the wild on the daily commute than tablets. Tablets mostly iPads in leather wallets being used by management types.