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pochu
June 6th, 2006, 02:42 PM
I don't use Evolution, and if I try to do a

sudo aptitude remove evolution
I get this

Next packages will be REMOVED
evolution evolution-exchange evolution-plugins ubuntu-desktop

So I would like to see Thunderbird in Edgy

What do you prefer?

/dev/clast
June 6th, 2006, 02:47 PM
ubuntu-desktop is just a meta package, you can safely remove it.

and i prefer Thunderbird, as well. If Evolution finally got some love, it could really be a great app, though

clast

mlind
June 6th, 2006, 02:57 PM
Thunderbird wins hands down. I only need a email client and it suits my needs perfectly.

dabear
June 6th, 2006, 02:57 PM
ubuntu-desktop is just a meta package, you can safely remove it.

and i prefer Thunderbird, as well. If Evolution finally got some love, it could really be a great app, though

clast
Please tell me what features you prefer in thunderbird that does not exist in evolution? I really enjoy using evolution, but I also believe mozilla-thunderbird is a nice app.

/dev/clast
June 6th, 2006, 03:11 PM
Please tell me what features you prefer in thunderbird that does not exist in evolution? I really enjoy using evolution, but I also believe mozilla-thunderbird is a nice app.

well, it's not any features i'm missing, it's just that evolution is slow, rather buggy and the spam blocker doesn't work as well.

my opinion...that is

tuggy
June 6th, 2006, 03:29 PM
Please tell me what features you prefer in thunderbird that does not exist in evolution? I really enjoy using evolution, but I also believe mozilla-thunderbird is a nice app.
its more like "please tell me what feature are there in evolution that i do not need" :D
i like to keep things as simple as possible... and i just need an email client.

pochu
June 6th, 2006, 03:42 PM
its more like "please tell me what feature are there in evolution that i do not need" :D
i like to keep things as simple as possible... and i just need an email client.

Yes, I agree, but I think Thunderbird should have a tray icon integrated, because the "Tray Icon" extension only works on Windows, and we have Ubuntu for something...

Pochu

dabear
June 6th, 2006, 03:49 PM
Yes, I agree, but I think Thunderbird should have a tray icon integrated, because the "Tray Icon" extension only works on Windows, and we have Ubuntu for something...

Pochu
Try alltray for the moment:
http://alltray.sourceforge.net/downloads.html

mlind
June 6th, 2006, 03:49 PM
Yes, I agree, but I think Thunderbird should have a tray icon integrated, because the "Tray Icon" extension only works on Windows, and we have Ubuntu for something...

Pochu

Do you mean http://moztraybiff.mozdev.org ?

aysiu
June 6th, 2006, 03:55 PM
Please tell me what features you prefer in thunderbird that does not exist in evolution? I really enjoy using evolution, but I also believe mozilla-thunderbird is a nice app. I'll tell you one right now: detaching of attachments or deleting of attachments.

Sometimes people will send me a huge image file or a PDF, and I don't want that cluttering up my inbox. I still want the message I was sent (maybe the accompanying text had some important information), but I want the attachment to be on my hard drive, not on my email account.

How do you delete an attachment in Evolution?

mjm115
June 6th, 2006, 04:13 PM
I prefer Evolution for it's PIM capabilities. I followed the instructions at http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=99603 and I've had no problems with spam. It goes a little slower than I would like it to, but the whole integration thing is nice.

alaithea
June 6th, 2006, 04:36 PM
I switched from Evolution to Thunderbird late last year, because while I enjoyed Evolution's tight integration with GNOME, its UI was very uncourteous at times. Notably, there was a status box that blocked all access to the app whenever I connected to the server to check my mail. There shouldn't be any reason I can't use my email app while it's checking for new mail.

I also wanted the ability to view my email in a threaded view, which Evolution didn't offer, either.

In case my complaining about the UI hasn't already pegged me as an OSX devotee, let me just say that I'm waiting for the day when I see a mail app for Linux that's as clean and elegant, and is as much of a joy to use as Mail.app.

imagine
June 6th, 2006, 06:22 PM
Thunderbird.
I only need a MUA and nothing else, although it could integrate better into Gnome.

bites
June 6th, 2006, 06:24 PM
Thunderbird: I just need a simple mail-client and I used the combination of Firefox and Thunderbird on Windows as well.

David A Knight
June 6th, 2006, 06:25 PM
Evolution didn't offer a threaded view? That must have been a seriously old, pre Thunderbird existance version of Evolution.

These polls just confuse me, people choose a Gnome based distro, then say it should use firefox, not epiphany, thunderbird, not evolution. Sounds like many people would prefer a Xulbuntu that used chatzilla, firefox, sunbird, thunderbird and any other xul based apps.

Turgon
June 6th, 2006, 06:36 PM
I used Thunderbird efore and I still do in windows, but for ubuntu/gnome Evolution is simply the best (more integrated and more features).

curtis
June 6th, 2006, 06:37 PM
I voted for Evolution, personally I feel it looks a lot better compared to Thunderbird. Also, Thunderbird currently lacks as much integration as Evolution.
It also lacks PIM capabilities as well.

alaithea
June 6th, 2006, 06:40 PM
Evolution didn't offer a threaded view? That must have been a seriously old, pre Thunderbird existance version of Evolution.

Perhaps I was mistaken on that one. The version of Evolution was Breezy-era.

MichaëlVD
June 6th, 2006, 06:45 PM
I don't think that evolution is that slow really... I can search my 600MB mbox full text almost instantly. Also, I like the integration of the calendar with the clock applet. I've used Thunderbird and KMail before, but I see no reason to go back to those programs.

bento
June 6th, 2006, 06:50 PM
I would go for the Firefox/Thunderbird/Sunbird option.

One reason is the fact that they are all available on Windows (and other os's) and many users are used to this apps so it would make it esier to switch to Ubuntu.

For people who are used to Linux (in this case Ubuntu), installing the preferred apps is done in less than 5 min anyway.

swhit
June 6th, 2006, 07:09 PM
I voted for Evolution. Mainly for two reasons. 1) Thunderbird's contact list doesn't cleanly import vcards, and 2) integration of Evolution's calendar into Gnome.

I honestly tried switching to Thunderbird about 6 months ago, but transfering my contacts from Evolution and Mail.app (I'm on linux at work and OS X at home) was such a pain that I gave up.

Anthem
June 6th, 2006, 07:37 PM
Thunderbird's a better app for most people, but it doesn't have some features that are deal-breakers for power users.

That said, I'm pretty sure Evolution can't be removed without screwing some other stuff up. I don't remember what those things are, though.

Belathor
June 6th, 2006, 07:50 PM
I'd love to see Sunbird actually reach 1.0. Then, I think Thunderbird/Sunbird would be a viable alternative to Evolution. Unfortunately, Sunbird has taken 3 years to make 0.3alpha2! At that rate, it will be ready by 2012-13...

Nano Geek
June 6th, 2006, 08:16 PM
I prefer Evolution over Thunderbird if I'm in GNOME because it intergrates with the GNOME calender nicely. I also think that it would be better for people comming from Windows because it includes a calender, tasks, and a few other things that Thunderbird dosen't have and we don't want Windows migraters to think that Linux can't beat Outlook.;)

mattisking
June 6th, 2006, 08:20 PM
I prefer Thunderbird though honestly I don't care which one is the "default". I can always change the "default" myself.

Generally, the only reason I like Thunderbird better is that the Junk mail handling works better for me (of course it takes a while to get it working 100%). The other reason is simple: I have regular problems with Evolution... if I start it up and don't mess with anything else, it's fine. However, if I do what I normally do... and click 3 to 5 buttons across my top menu bar as soon as I sit down (Firefox, "Email", Blam, Terminal) in almost every case I get errors from Evolution... something about the mailbox is screwed up. Hit ok a couple of times, close it, restart it, all is well. Since I'm not married to it I eventually just switched back to Thunderbird.

tmcastberg
June 6th, 2006, 09:43 PM
Please tell me what features you prefer in thunderbird that does not exist in evolution? I really enjoy using evolution, but I also believe mozilla-thunderbird is a nice app.

I'll tell you what I personally don't like.
Times are by default in 12h not 24h, I can't seem to change it for message view.
There is no button for reading the next unread message across all folders and accounts. "." and "ctrl+]" are not helpful at all.
All the shortcut buttons are completely different that any other mail application I've ever tried. They make no sense! And I can't even change them!
Every time I've tried it it's been really buggy. I'm giving it another try right now though.
I'd love there to be some extension/plugin repository like there is for thunderbird.
Interface is just not very friendly and it feels like it's wasting space.

bongobonga
June 6th, 2006, 09:56 PM
Personally I think that evolution is probably a better application than Thunderbird, but I don't think I will ever use it. The reason? I hate the way that evolution forces the user to use global inboxes. As long as it is not possible to separate different email accounts completely, I will never use it.

I can't think of a possible reason to force people to use global inboxes!! I know this feature was once possible in Evolution, does anyone know why it was removed?

pochu
June 6th, 2006, 11:21 PM
Everybody who thinks that Thunderbird hasn't got some features that Evolution has should know that Thunderbird has thousands of Extensions which you can install with a simple click. What will happen if we integrate all that features in the initial package? We will have a houndred MB install package. So they aren't in Thunderbird by default, but you can install all you want. As I don't use them, Thunderbird is better for me. Only I have installed a tray notification when I a receive new mail.

Pochu

aysiu
June 6th, 2006, 11:23 PM
I hear the same thing when people talk trash about Firefox (in comparison to Opera). Extensions--that's what it's all about.

pochu
June 6th, 2006, 11:27 PM
Try alltray for the moment:
http://alltray.sourceforge.net/downloads.html

Yes, I used it with Breezy, but when I installed Dapper (when Flight 4 was released) Alltray wasn't at the repositories, and I have not installed it (I know how to install a .tar.gz package, but I didn't want, I can't remember why). But now, I will let it another oportunity. However, I prefer a extension or this feature in Thunderbird, not another program which isn't designed for Thunderbird.


Do you mean http://moztraybiff.mozdev.org ?

No, that's a new mail notification. I have it installed, but what I said was a Thunderbird icon tray.

scabies
June 7th, 2006, 04:20 AM
Everybody who thinks that Thunderbird hasn't got some features that Evolution has should know that Thunderbird has thousands of Extensions which you can install with a simple click. So they aren't in Thunderbird by default, but you can install all you want.
Pochu

I can dig that, but I use evolution since I work in an exchange-based shop. Built-in exchange support and integration with gaim and other gnome apps, really can't be beat. Also, I'm pretty lazy and I want stuff to just work :). Don't really have the energy to go grep through a bunch of extensions that may or may not help me out.

The new evolution had some nice buxfixes for exchange accounts that they fixed, now it seems to work like a charm. (Auto email check intervals, and calendar alarms both work properly now).

Nice work everyone!

pochu
June 7th, 2006, 11:12 AM
Also, I'm pretty lazy and I want stuff to just work :). Don't really have the energy to go grep through a bunch of extensions that may or may not help me out.

Yes, but I don't need them, only the new email notification at the system tray. And now I have a mail app that has everything I need, and it doesn't have some features I don't use, as Evolution has.

SHodges
June 7th, 2006, 11:20 AM
I've never really used either one, I've set them up just to see what was what and all, but I much prefer just leaving my mail in it's gmail box and seeing it online, no need to download it to my harddrive. For what it's worth though, I'd go with Thunderbird, seemed like the superior product to me.

dré
June 7th, 2006, 03:04 PM
I also prefer TB because it has much better IMAP support (IDLE extension, highly customizable trash, sent and drafts folders, less buggy...).

Although I think that TB as well as Firefox (both use XUL) could integrate better with GNOME. Support for native Themes (Currently selected gtk-engine + icon-theme + fonts + (Portland-)dialogues) would be cool. Proxy settings and keyring integration comes to mind, too. (Spec for edgy?)

Nonno Bassotto
June 7th, 2006, 03:13 PM
I voted fo Thunderbird. I know Evolution is Gnome's default, but I never understood why. It seems soooooo much more complicated than Gnome applications. I thought the Gnome philosophy was to make interfaces as simple as possible. I really can't believe that with the 2.14 Gnome release I cannot choose anymore which screensavers will be used at random, but still have that bloated evolution.

tmcastberg
June 7th, 2006, 08:01 PM
While we're on the topic of Evolution, does anyone know of a nice serverside daemon that performs the same functions as exchange for evolution? Calendar/mailbox/contacts/tasks sharing?

briguy
June 8th, 2006, 03:54 AM
Kontact!

Sianis
June 8th, 2006, 05:40 AM
For KDE users, but Gnome users....:???:

I also voted for Thunderbird

| MM |
June 8th, 2006, 09:59 AM
Evolution for me is a kinda finichity, like it often stops responding when dealing with attachments. That said, i think until thunderbird can be indexed by beagle, evolution should be default, beagle is a godsend these days.

duff
June 8th, 2006, 01:42 PM
Neither. Evolution is too heavy for simple email and I'm one of those weirdos that likes having everyting integrated with GNOME. So I'd prefer something new, simple like Epiphany (possibly based on tinymail (http://pvanhoof.be/blog/)) that works like GMail.

frodon
June 8th, 2006, 01:48 PM
For me evolution is just fine and like duff i will always use well GNOME integrated apps that's also why i love the so damn good epiphany web browser.

kounavi
June 17th, 2006, 02:14 PM
I've always been using Thunderbird.
I'd sure like to taste Evolution's Integration but having no way to import my settings for the million of email accounts i've set up with thunderbird etc (especially those filter rules..) to Evolution really hurts me.

Am I wrong? I've googled it up multiple times but it seems there is either no way to import Thunderbirds data/settings to Evolution, or there is no way for me to choose the right search words/options to end up with the desired result.:confused:

Thanks !

shakespeare
June 18th, 2006, 06:37 AM
Thunderbird. I tried Evolution, and although it was quite nice, it lost out to Thunderbird on several important (to me) points:
- Evolution could not import my TB mailbox! Even if Evolution were better than TB in every other way, this would prevent me using it.
- TB on Ubuntu and TB on Windows (I have to dual boot for some apps) can use the same mailbox files if they are in a suitable place. This way, it does not matter which OS I use to access my mail, and everything stay in sync.
- TB handles multiple mail accounts better.
- TB handles large attachments better, with the option to detach them so they don't bloat the mailbox.

henriquemaia
June 18th, 2006, 07:07 AM
On the presented options, I prefer Evolution. But it would be nicer to have a simpler alternative email reader. Does everyone like to have a PIM installed by default or would most people be happy with just an email reader, like sylpheed-claws?

mlind
June 18th, 2006, 07:44 AM
My favourite email client is xbiff, no bloat and it just works.

Cheeky@Boinc
June 18th, 2006, 07:57 AM
On Windows, oh that must be years ago :D , i Loved Thunderbird.

Now on Ubuntu -> Evolution rocks

tom-ubuntu
June 18th, 2006, 12:58 PM
Voted for Evolution. Using it for a while, and there aren't many features missing. Actually only 2 which are coming to my mind:
- Junkmail filtering: even i setup it up according to the Howto, it does not really work for me (why do I need to set it up manually?)
- Archiving: Haven't found this option yet. Is there one? Like in MS Outlook for example. Compress old stuff to save space.

u.b.u.n.t.u
June 18th, 2006, 01:26 PM
Thunderbird wins hands down. I only need a email client and it suits my needs perfectly.

I agree with that. I used Thunderbird on XP and I use it on ubuntu. My profile transferred without error. I don't need Evolution and would prefer it if Thunderbird were officially used.

aysiu
June 18th, 2006, 05:07 PM
I agree with that. I used Thunderbird on XP and I use it on ubuntu. My profile transferred without error. I don't need Evolution and would prefer it if Thunderbird were officially used.
It seems about 64% of the people who answered this poll would agree with you.

Thunderbird is the default for Xubuntu, actually.

intel
June 21st, 2006, 08:20 AM
neither i guess

need to access winmail.dat sent by the lookout(outlook) people

can't get everyone to use plain-text

tnef not working in ubuntu
ytnef not working in ubuntu

unable to open any winmail.dat in any of these
thunderbird, evolution, opera9(mail client)

there's got to be a better soln. than to use lookout 2003 or express


intel

pochu
June 21st, 2006, 10:26 AM
I haven't undertood very well your question, but I think you want to use thunderbird or other mail client in windows, instead of outlook.

What I do when I used windows was install thunderbird, then open thunderbird and it told me if I wanted to import the data (mails, adresses...) from outlook, I did it and then I had everything in outlook and in thunderbird.

nocturn
June 21st, 2006, 10:31 AM
I'll tell you what I personally don't like.
Times are by default in 12h not 24h, I can't seem to change it for message view.


Actually I struggled with this too. It seems that Evolution uses your locale to determine the time format. My locale in my own language (Dutch) does use 24h clock as this is the standard here.

Unfortunately, I wanted English as my default language but the currency symbol set to Euro and the time to 24h. So I use the English-Denkmark locale. It's working fine so far, even gdm is in 24h format.

Amon_Re
June 21st, 2006, 12:37 PM
Actually I struggled with this too. It seems that Evolution uses your locale to determine the time format. My locale in my own language (Dutch) does use 24h clock as this is the standard here.

Unfortunately, I wanted English as my default language but the currency symbol set to Euro and the time to 24h. So I use the English-Denkmark locale. It's working fine so far, even gdm is in 24h format.


Shouldn't this be filed as a bug then?

Hg80
June 21st, 2006, 12:52 PM
It has to be thunderbird for me, been using it on windows aswell as linux so i know whats what etc and like the interface

Iandefor
June 21st, 2006, 06:29 PM
Thunderbird. I hate Evolution- if I start it up, it begins running five different processes and eats up ~200 MB of my RAM... for an e-mail client. It's also pretty crashy. I like Sylpheed-Claws better, but if it came down to Thunderbird or Evolution, I'd go for Thunderbird.

Jeffery Mewtamer
June 21st, 2006, 07:56 PM
I use Firefox for checking my e-mail. I honestly don't see the appeal of having another program for e-mail(unless your e-mail service sucks). Plus I dought if evolution or thunderbirds either have as nice an interface as Gmail.

tom56
June 21st, 2006, 08:35 PM
I honestly don't see the appeal of having another program for e-mail(

pop3!

I use Thunderbird right now but only because Evolution kept mucking up my contacts.

Things I like about Evolution:
* GNOME integration (a must have and why I prefer Evolution)
* Nicer layout in general

Things I don't like:
* Too many over-complex dialogues by default (Address book is a perfect example: does it really need 4 phone number boxes and 3 mailing address boes by default? Couldn't there just be an add button?). Would be nice to have different modes, e.g. home, office, etc
* Junk filter is rubbish, catches nothing.
* Anything put in junk is marked unread, so no way of knowing if new junk has come. Annoying when the filter is still being trained and thinks emails from friends are junk.
* Needs a UI split. I only use mail, don't want to bother with options for calendars, etc. This would help alot with my first point.
* Contacts/address book is broken for me. Add and it doesn't appear until a restart.

It has to be said that despite all these flaws, it'd still be better than Thunderbird if it wasn't for that last point. Definitely needs some serious love though.

JoWilly
June 21st, 2006, 10:29 PM
Thunderbird. I tried Evolution, and although it was quite nice, it lost out to Thunderbird on several important (to me) points:
- Evolution could not import my TB mailbox! Even if Evolution were better than TB in every other way, this would prevent me using it.
- TB on Ubuntu and TB on Windows (I have to dual boot for some apps) can use the same mailbox files if they are in a suitable place. This way, it does not matter which OS I use to access my mail, and everything stay in sync.
- TB handles multiple mail accounts better.
- TB handles large attachments better, with the option to detach them so they don't bloat the mailbox.

Yes, and for my needs I will add :

- TB handles newsgroups (integrates nicely as mail folders)
- TB handles rss (integrates nicely as mail folders)

pvdg
June 22nd, 2006, 12:26 AM
I'm using Thunderbird now and quite happy with it. I have used Thunderbird in the past in a Debian system at work, with no complaints. Reasons why I moved:

I was planning to install ubuntu in 2 computers at home. One of them ran Win98 and I wanted an email client that would give me full compatibility and allow me to easily back up my mail and transfer it and contacts from Windows to Ubuntu when I made the switch;

It's very easy (and increasingly so) to set up multiple (pop and stmp) accounts in Thunderbird. I've never found out how to do this in Evolution.

Strong point of Evolution: the other office applications. I've heard Mozilla will be including these in Thunderbird soon.

YourDoom123
June 22nd, 2006, 12:34 AM
pop3!


i'm not sure what u mean... pop3 isn't a reason to use another mail client... thats like saying because i can hit my head into the wall ](*,) , i will. i also prefer to check my email /w firefox. i have yet to find an email client that organizes threads into conversations (or it may just be that i've never spent time customizing them), or displays them in such a nice, easy to view manner.

josuealcalde
June 22nd, 2006, 02:03 AM
Both Evolution and Thunderbird do it. And it is not very difficult (view menu in evolution, and a column icon in thunderbird)

I don't want to go to the mail office every time I want to read my mail. I prefer to take it from my mailbox in my home.

I used thunderbird in windows, and in ubuntu when I used to dual-boot. Soon, I forgot windows, and I changed to evolution. I give an oportunity to TB 1.5, but it was the same.
When I used evolution, I couldn't remove evolution because it was a dependecy of ubuntu-desktop, and I prefered to have it installed. Many users uses thunderbird so I would like to have an ubuntu-desktop which can replace evolution by thunderbird

ctgray
June 22nd, 2006, 06:35 AM
What about Wine + Outlook Express?

pochu
June 22nd, 2006, 09:53 AM
I use Firefox for checking my e-mail. I honestly don't see the appeal of having another program for e-mail(unless your e-mail service sucks). Plus I dought if evolution or thunderbirds either have as nice an interface as Gmail.

I use thunderbird because I have 4 mail accounts, and I don't want to enter with firefox in all of them, that spends a lot of time. With TB I have set up 3 of them (gmail and 2 of my domains), the other is hotmail, but microsoft sucks, and it only works in outlook.

peterwr
June 23rd, 2006, 05:51 PM
Thunderbird, I'm afraid. I really want to like Evolution - mainly because of its simple interface and the PIM stuff - and I've tried hard to use it, but the fact that it freezes in the face of IMAP is a total killer for me. It freezes every time I try to shut it down, and every time I let it check my IMAP mail account more than once. Thank the Powers I know how to kill it.

Plus Thunderbird is cross-platform AND cross-desktop. As a user of all the major OSs (lin/win/mac), I find that a big plus.

My 2p...

fuscia
June 24th, 2006, 09:10 PM
the only thing i need thunderbird for is 'presenting' images. and even then, most people don't receive the presentation the way i've presented them. so, i've gone back to sylpheed-claws, which i love. best reason to use sylpheed-claws - rockin' icon!

http://www.thewildbeast.co.uk/sylpheed-claws/app_icon/claw_128x128.png

netrat
June 24th, 2006, 11:41 PM
I use Evolution, because of the Calendar feature it has.. and how it's integrated with my Google Calendar (import the iCal url - I can see my calendar, my friends.. etc)

Unfortunately, i think, this isn't available in ThunderBird. I also like how Evolution is integrated with the system timer on gnome's clock. If i click on the clock I can see all my calendar events right on my desktop.

I never did used Thunderbird for some mysterious reasons I can't put my hands on. In Windows, it was Outlook and now that I switched to Ubuntu, it's Evolution.

runes
June 28th, 2006, 08:55 PM
I was using Evolution for the PIM, Contacts, and Calendar organization but it is missing the option of setting up multiple mailboxes for multiple email accounts..

If you know of any good PIM that can set up a calendar of appointments and share the contacts from Tunderbird pls let me know (that is untill they add the option for multiple mailboxes in Evolution)


I use Evolution, because of the Calendar feature it has.. and how it's integrated with my Google Calendar (import the iCal url - I can see my calendar, my friends.. etc)

Unfortunately, i think, this isn't available in ThunderBird. I also like how Evolution is integrated with the system timer on gnome's clock. If i click on the clock I can see all my calendar events right on my desktop.

I never did used Thunderbird for some mysterious reasons I can't put my hands on. In Windows, it was Outlook and now that I switched to Ubuntu, it's Evolution.

Wolki
June 29th, 2006, 12:38 AM
I was using Evolution for the PIM, Contacts, and Calendar organization but it is missing the option of setting up multiple mailboxes for multiple email accounts..

I'm probably just being stupid, but what is the real difference between different mailboxes and filtering the same mailbox into different folders?

GuitarHero
June 29th, 2006, 12:42 AM
Is there a way we can get this changed in edgy or will it most likely stay evolution? I mean this isnt really something that requires dev time.

Jedeye
June 29th, 2006, 04:15 AM
I enjoy Thunderbird, Im not a heavy email user, but I like the way the address book is set up

ShanghaiTeej
June 29th, 2006, 07:47 AM
I use Evolution, but my main gripe is that there is no way to group one's contacts. For instance, my band and I email each other frequently. In Thunderbird I could group the contacts and email them in about one click. In Evolution, I have to add all their addresses to the email that I'm sending. Major Bummer. I don't think Kmail has this option either.

Wolki
June 29th, 2006, 10:56 AM
I use Evolution, but my main gripe is that there is no way to group one's contacts. For instance, my band and I email each other frequently. In Thunderbird I could group the contacts and email them in about one click. In Evolution, I have to add all their addresses to the email that I'm sending. Major Bummer. I don't think Kmail has this option either.

Have you tried New -> Contact list?

burlap
June 29th, 2006, 01:27 PM
Evolution in Gnome:
+ drag and drop (try importing a mailbox and dropping it over evolution folder, dragging and dropping pictures from gthumb, dragging evolution mail into tomboy notes)
+ beagle (thunderbird backend is under development, but so far for gnome the only option is evolution)
+ calendar integration
- speed
- linux only (I don't use windows at all, but for some it may be a problem. Windows version of evolution is under development though)

I started using evolution (1.4 or something) in pre-thunderbird era. There was rss support, threaded view and nice addressbook. For rss I use liferea now, so I don't miss it in evolution. I tried thunderbird but I found th UI not too convincing (the idea of separate folders for separate accounts), 1.5 is better though.

vFolders/ Search folders in evolution are good enough to make any kind of email sorting, filters can do any kind of junk filtering.

My choice is definitely Evolution.

MBro
June 29th, 2006, 06:41 PM
burlap, evolution was just ported over to windows a few weeks ago. Just so you know.


I used to use thunderbird but switched over to evolution around dapper flight 5 just for the heck of it. My problems with evolution is that it doesn't handle junk mail well at all and there is no option to leave the messages on the server for X number of days like in thunderbird which was really usefull for me. I'll probably still stick with evolution but I do kind of miss thunderbird.

ShanghaiTeej
June 29th, 2006, 07:37 PM
Yeah, but if I create a new contact list, I can't easily send them an email through the addressbar or deskbar applet.

Iandefor
June 29th, 2006, 09:53 PM
Hmm... a little under 65% prefer Thunderbird to Evolution.

brentoboy
June 29th, 2006, 10:33 PM
My beef with evolution is this:

It feels like a windows app not a unix app. Windows wants one app that does everything under the sun. The Unix philosophy sais that each app should do one thing and do it well.

I never understood why the gnome and kde projects think they need to have email / office / calendar / text editor / browser apps. They Should have control panel type applications, and they should have widgets. Apps should be written to support either set of wigits. Why does a desktop manager like gnome even have a program like Evolution? Xulbuntu all the way. choose the best app for the job, not the default one for the desktop. Honestly now, if 2/3rds of the ubuntu population prefers thunderbird, and it isnt even installed by default, what does that say? how many would prefur it if it was default.

survival of the fittest (email client, that is).

runes
June 30th, 2006, 01:27 AM
Wolki sometimes filters aren't as accurate as having separate inboxes for each mail account you have..and if oyu run a SOHO (Small Office Home Office) you don't want to make the mistake of replying with the wrong account.

runes
June 30th, 2006, 01:44 AM
Fair enough but work smarter not harder is also a good saying...if you have a busines..and a schedule and contacts and mailing lists...appointments etc...one app that does it all and well is better than having to break down each job into meanial task. IE:

Your way:

Client calls

use one app to look up his contact info...next app to log in the appointment he made and third app to send him an email..and hopefully the first app can talk to the email client or we have to reenter in all the contacts..oop..he had an order put in last week..sec..have to open the spreadsheet (or template..or web form linked to a database)

your way=4 apps

My way:

Client calls:
Use app (such as Evolution) pull up his name, address and in the notes something about his last call..then click the calendar and add his appointment..check his order? ok that's the webb/database app


While I understand the aversion to windows based apps and windows in general..developpers of the aplications have really had their head wrapped around centralization and standardization....this can also be done in the opensource world without "locking" in the user with propietary standards.

My way=2 apps (could problaby shrink it to 1 app with a module that calls up the clients info from the contact database and a mailer frontend)


My beef with evolution is this:

It feels like a windows app not a unix app. Windows wants one app that does everything under the sun. The Unix philosophy sais that each app should do one thing and do it well.

I never understood why the gnome and kde projects think they need to have email / office / calendar / text editor / browser apps. They Should have control panel type applications, and they should have widgets. Apps should be written to support either set of wigits. Why does a desktop manager like gnome even have a program like Evolution? Xulbuntu all the way. choose the best app for the job, not the default one for the desktop. Honestly now, if 2/3rds of the ubuntu population prefers thunderbird, and it isnt even installed by default, what does that say? how many would prefur it if it was default.

survival of the fittest (email client, that is).

Wolki
June 30th, 2006, 01:48 AM
Wolki sometimes filters aren't as accurate as having separate inboxes for each mail account you have..and if oyu run a SOHO (Small Office Home Office) you don't want to make the mistake of replying with the wrong account.

I don't see how filtering is less accurate. at least not if done correctly. CAre to give me an example?

And while I can fullty understand you other point, Evo seems to do the correct thing here - replying via the mail account you've received the mail you're replying to from.

burlap
June 30th, 2006, 03:23 PM
burlap, evolution was just ported over to windows a few weeks ago. Just so you know.

I know, the project to port evolution to windows is probably more than 1 year old. Evolution for windows works, but it is not production ready, so in fact it's linux only (for now).

See for example:
http://ftp.gnome.org/pub/gnome/desktop/2.14/2.14.2/win32/README.evolution

djst
July 1st, 2006, 11:53 AM
Being the author of the original Thunderbird Help website at www.mozilla.org/support/thunderbird/, my opinion might come as a surprise. I vote for Evolution as the default mail application for one major reason: support for Exchange 2000/2003 and GroupWise.

*Many* corporate businesses run Windows-based servers e.g. Windows 2003 Business Server with the built-in Outlook 2003/Exchange support. There is just no way that I know of to hook Thunderbird up with that. Don't get me wrong, I love Thunderbird and use it myself (although I tend to use gmail.com more nowadays), but I'd rather read my mail in a less enjoyable mail client than being forced to stay on Windows/Outlook.

Also, until Thunderbird (or a third-party extension) hooks up with the built-in Gnome calendar, Evolution will simply be a more compelling alternative.

cod3r3d
July 1st, 2006, 12:14 PM
Please tell me what features you prefer in thunderbird that does not exist in evolution? I really enjoy using evolution, but I also believe mozilla-thunderbird is a nice app.

Two reasons (not features): stability and speed. Evolution looks great, but crashes a lot and is very, very slow.

wilbur.harvey
July 5th, 2006, 02:40 AM
I have to use evolution because we have an exchange server at work.

I like the calendar in evolution, and I like that beagle indexes it.

I like to use thunderbird much more than evolution. If it had the calendar stuff integrated with exchange I would even do without the beagle intgration.

swamytk
July 5th, 2006, 10:14 AM
I have used both Thunderbird and Evolution.
1. User interface: TB wins since it is neat and clean where evolution is somewhat cluttered with more options and menus. When GNOME is considered, evolution fits naturally.
2. Features: Evolution wins like Exchange Server support and more configurations. Though TB has features like deleting attachments, it is an exception
3. Integration: Evolution wins since tightly integrated with OS - GNOME calendar and beagle search

If I need just mail client, I will prefer TB. But what I need is E-Mail, Task Manager and Calendar = Evolution. My vote is for Evolution.

traveller.ct
July 5th, 2006, 01:14 PM
I prefer Evolution for all the good reasons stated many times over. I don't seem to experience instability and speed issue, but that's probably because I don't use Evolution to a very great extent.

The last time I tried Thunderbird in Breezy, I couldn't quite get it to send emails correctly. I created two Gmail accounts and Thunderbird would only authenticate with one account. If I needed to send emails with the other account I needed to change the login username in the SMTP server configs. This prompted me to use Evolution and I have no problems since.

pochu
July 5th, 2006, 05:51 PM
The last time I tried Thunderbird in Breezy, I couldn't quite get it to send emails correctly. I created two Gmail accounts and Thunderbird would only authenticate with one account. If I needed to send emails with the other account I needed to change the login username in the SMTP server configs. This prompted me to use Evolution and I have no problems since.

That was because you configured only one smtp account. You should have configured two, one for each mail account, and everything would be fine. I have 3 accounts, with 3 differents smtp and I have no problem with them.

onehotcutey
July 5th, 2006, 07:08 PM
Oh the woes of choosing different apps.

Evolution: drives me crazy, because it's Exchange support crashes all the time, the program looks ugly, and interacting with it is horrible.

Thunderbird: doesn't have exchange support.

So I vote for evolution, but would run MS Office just for outlook and work email.

traveller.ct
July 6th, 2006, 03:30 AM
That was because you configured only one smtp account.

Ah, that was quite unexpected. Perhaps Thunderbird need to work on auto-configuring smtp accounts. Thanks for the info.

pochu
July 6th, 2006, 10:47 AM
Perhaps Thunderbird need to work on auto-configuring smtp accounts.
Yes, it would be great!


Thanks for the info.
No problem!:wink:

runes
July 6th, 2006, 01:26 PM
Coming from windows the only thing I can compare to is Outlook. What I meant to say is the disadvantage of Evolution is the lack of a separate "container" for each email account. I checked the reply to in using each account and yes you're right it does reply with the correct account. Is there any way aside from filters to have the email in a separate folder?



I don't see how filtering is less accurate. at least not if done correctly. CAre to give me an example?

And while I can fullty understand you other point, Evo seems to do the correct thing here - replying via the mail account you've received the mail you're replying to from.

saphil
July 6th, 2006, 05:29 PM
Evo and Tbird both have some issues when you are attempting to keep accounts separate. Tbird has issues with deleting corrupted accounts and evo has real issues with routing the emails to separate acct-x-inboxes. The spam filter in Evo works really well, with the spam-filter web-service turned on. I like the evo calendar feature, and use it as often as I use any such calendar. I am still happiest with the paper and pencil appt book, so I don't use it as much as if I was a palm-pilot person.

I cannot seem to get the evo version up to current development, but the "expunge error" that is evo's major bug (or at least the one I see all the time) seems less prevalent when I use the "empty trash" menu item every day rather than going several days without expunging. "Empty trash" seems to do an automated expunge, unlike the tbird function. Tbird's "compact folder" function needs a global setting so one can expunge all deleted messages at once. I do not see the value of having to go to each folder individually and "compact" them.

RawMustard
July 7th, 2006, 02:15 PM
Thunderbird crashes constantly on this system, I don't believe it deserves to be a default. It doesn't even have a help file. Even on windows, it's prefs file gets corrupted way to many times to be considered a stable program. I use it everyday have been for over 3 years and it's just not ready. I wish the mozilla foundation would put some serious effort into it like their poster child, but alas it won't win any browser wars :(

lordlollo
July 7th, 2006, 04:32 PM
Thunderbird, but it's just a feel...

Matthew Bartram
July 7th, 2006, 06:10 PM
I have used gmail for a while now, and am considering moving to either Evolution or Thunderbird since I presume they are quicker than web-based for most actions.


I would probably go for thunderbird because I use firefox and would expect a similarly good job to have been done on thunderbird. Instead I am considering evolution, because of the gnome integration. The calander on the clock on the taskbar is evolution, so to use that properly I need evolution. Also, the contacts are shared with ekiga.

What I would most like is an easy and reliable way to move mail, contacts and settings between evolution and thunderbird, so one could try both out without having to start all over again, and having old e-mails split between programs.

Kimm
July 7th, 2006, 10:18 PM
I also prefer Thudnerbird. In my opinion... it handles Spam much better.

bruce89
July 7th, 2006, 10:28 PM
Again the question comes up "Should the program that I use be default". Evolution is the GNOME default, mind you firefox isn't.

Quix
July 7th, 2006, 10:45 PM
I go for Thunderbird with shame... I would love to see a good mail client with excellent GNOME integration, Evolution just missed the point way ago, its huge, slow, the UI don't feels right.

Maybe the solution could be small, faster, well integrated apps with concrete functions (email, calendar, contacts, etc). GNOME desktop should be the central point for this integration.

Just my 2 cents...

andrewfn
July 8th, 2006, 04:18 AM
Having tried them both extensively I am only satisfied with Evolution. As far as I know there is no way to re-direct email from Thunderbird (i.e. forward it to another person, but leave the FROM as from the original sender). I use this feature all the time.

gonniff
July 8th, 2006, 07:25 AM
Seems like things are pretty evenly divided. I'm new to Ubuntu (used Hedgehog very briefly some time ago for a few days, but now have a spare laptop, so have put Dapper on it) and so decided to give Evolution another chance after hating it under Red Hat. It *looks* great! I like the feel and all that, too. But I've just added some contacts to the address book and now want to type a mail. Guess what? If I click on the "Contacts" tab, it displays the contacts. But if I open a new mail, click on "To:" and want to select a contact, there are none there. Is it just me or have other people seen this, too? Think I might be going back to Thunderbird. ;)

atoponce
July 8th, 2006, 07:47 AM
I definitely prefer Thunderbird for a number of reasons. Mainly, extensions. While not near as extensive as Firefox, there are enough to keep me happy. The RSS reader is nice too, although there are issues there that I wish would get resolved.

cotcot
July 8th, 2006, 07:53 AM
Opera for me. I did not vote because i never used evolution. I used thunderbird for a couple of years, but now use opera. It is easy to have email and internet in the same app. I did not miss anything in opera till now. Their forum is good.

Mishal
July 8th, 2006, 07:20 PM
Why can't we have both? It's not gonna take up too much space, is it? Thunderbird for fast e-email and Evolution for Calendar, tasks, memos etc.

In my opinion, we must care least about ourselves (the regular Linux users) and think of how to stop Windows users shifting to Ubuntu from being worried about getting the right software. So if a Windows user shifting to Linux finds Thunderbird and Evolution in the desktop menu, he can choose for himself which one suits him better or may even use both - one for email and the other for all other tasks as I already mentioned.

Hender
July 8th, 2006, 08:15 PM
Why can't we have both? It's not gonna take up too much space, is it? Thunderbird for fast e-email and Evolution for Calendar, tasks, memos etc.

In my opinion, we must care least about ourselves (the regular Linux users) and think of how to stop Windows users shifting to Ubuntu from being worried about getting the right software.Because this is not user friendly at all. :( Someone who sits down to use Gnome doesn't know the merits of neither Evolution nor Thunderbird, and would be unable to make an informed choice.

Right now, Evolution is deeply integrated into Gnome (personal information, calendar data for the calendar applet, etc.), that it shouldn't be removed anyway. Now, I never use it (Gmail! :KS), so I don't really know its ups and downs, but Thunderbird is right there in the repositories if you want it. ;)

Two more concerns with actually including Thunderbird: Firefox has public support because ~10% of the web use it for browsing. Thunderbird has not gained similar momentum, and can't count on popularity to win people over. :| Secondly, a lot of people have mentioned how extensions make Thunderbird powerful and on par in features to Evolution. This may be true, but only techies can be relied upon to use and understand extensions. :mad:

CarpKing
July 8th, 2006, 11:52 PM
I use Thunderbird because that's what I use in Windows. Before that, I used Outlook Express, to which Thunderbird is very similar in terms of features (excluding junk filtering, of course). For people used to Outlook, Evolution might be a better choice.

Aggienator
July 9th, 2006, 05:48 PM
For me it would be Thunderbird, but my wife is heavily dependant on outlook for calendar, contacts etc. If I'm to move her to Linux it would have to be evolution. I think the folk who will want thunderbird are more likely to be able to install it for themselves, the non-techies are more likely to go for evolution, so that has my vote.

lapsey
July 10th, 2006, 12:26 AM
Any move towards the gnome versions of email client, browser or calendar is regressive at this point. Maybe one day we could even see sunbird instead of the evolution calendar?

RawMustard
July 10th, 2006, 01:09 PM
Maybe one day we could even see sunbird instead of the evolution calendar?

Yeah and Microsoft are going to release the source code for windows vista :)

Really, I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for Sunbird, it's only been in development for about 5 years and is still only at version 0.3alpha and doesn't work :( You would have more chance getting source code for vista directly from Bill Gates I reackon :)

bruce89
July 10th, 2006, 02:30 PM
In my opinion, we must care least about ourselves (the regular Linux users) and think of how to stop Windows users shifting to Ubuntu from being worried about getting the right software.
So it's alright to force them to change every other program, but have the same web browser and e-mail program?

jinacio
July 10th, 2006, 06:55 PM
i simply dislike evolution because even though it seems to have anything and everything, my personal feeling when using it as a simple email client is... awkward to say the least.

i dislike it's interface, bloat, and lack of simple features.

I'm not saying that evolution sucks, but for my needs (a decent email client) thunderbird suits me much better.

Another thing: why can't i select a file in nautilus and email it using <my email app here> instead of *just* evolution (yes, i have thunderbird as prefered mail reader)?

bruce89
July 10th, 2006, 06:56 PM
Anyway, it doesn't matter what's default, people will complain about it, and install what they want.

tageiru
July 10th, 2006, 10:43 PM
I am a pretty strong advocate of keeping Evolution. Why?

* It integrates nicely with GNOME, it lets me see my calendar items in the GNOME clock, nice! Platform integration should be high on the list when designing a distribution like Ubuntu.

* It looks nicer than thunderbird. It actually looks like a GNOME application, Thunderbird looks more alien with its XUL based interface.

garba
July 11th, 2006, 11:43 AM
since i switched to kubuntu and never had to deal with that piece of crap that evolution is, my life is taking a turn for the better :)

jinacio
July 11th, 2006, 03:53 PM
I am a pretty strong advocate of keeping Evolution. Why?

* It integrates nicely with GNOME, it lets me see my calendar items in the GNOME clock, nice! Platform integration should be high on the list when designing a distribution like Ubuntu.

* It looks nicer than thunderbird. It actually looks like a GNOME application, Thunderbird looks more alien with its XUL based interface.

I actually don't use the calendar and would bet many people don't use it either. i just want a good mail client.

Yes, it looks like a gnome app but imho the interface kinda sucks, so i rather have a usefull XUL-based one.

burlap
July 12th, 2006, 12:27 AM
If I click on the "Contacts" tab, it displays the contacts. But if I open a new mail, click on "To:" and want to select a contact, there are none there. Is it just me or have other people seen this, too? Think I might be going back to Thunderbird. ;)
Go to Edit->Preferences, select Autocomplete and mark address books you want to use. Probably "Personal" should be default, but on the other hand it's not that difficult to find.

calande
July 12th, 2006, 01:02 AM
I tried both but I prefer Opera's embedded e-mail client, I found it faster and lighter. I like the way it's designed too :rolleyes:

matthias_k
July 19th, 2006, 06:52 AM
These polls just confuse me, people choose a Gnome based distro, then say it should use firefox, not epiphany, thunderbird, not evolution. Sounds like many people would prefer a Xulbuntu that used chatzilla, firefox, sunbird, thunderbird and any other xul based apps.
I hope you also draw a conclusion from your observation...

It's really simple: GNOME can't manage to deliver stable, polished and /functional/ applications in this area at the same time. They focus on quantity, while they should focus on quality. Evolution is a big pile of... buggy components. I tried migrating to Evolution after installing Dapper, and it crashed 3 times on me on day one, I also found more bugs in these few hours of usage than I have ever found in T-Bird.

Regardless how you put it, the Mozilla-Foundation apps are of way better quality, saying one should use Evolution or Epiphany just because they're standard components in GNOME is jsut stupid (and undermines the idea behind Linux and free software by the way).

I also miss the desktop integration with Firefox and T-Bird though.

mirak63
July 19th, 2006, 11:02 AM
The way application are integrated as default into Ubuntu is really questionable.
For exemple who could use totem and rythmbox in warty hoary or breezy ?
It was almost unusable,crashing a lot or missing a lot of features, and I think something like gxine is still superior to totem as of know, and Listen is also way better than rythmbox, despite a lot newer.

matthias_k
July 19th, 2006, 12:21 PM
Yes, not to mention the lack of support for the most important media codecs in gstreamer (if they wanna stick with totem, why not use XINE as the backend??).

The GNOME standard solutions are just not of much practical use, so they could as well integrate the proper tools from the very beginning. It probably boils down to license issues, which is funny, since it shows again that the backbone of Linux software which made it so popular is as well its biggest flaw. :-/

lazyd2
July 19th, 2006, 01:13 PM
Bird of Thunder for me as well...

bela42
July 20th, 2006, 03:42 PM
Well, Evolution isn't just a mail client. If you don't need it, don't use it. But I need contacts, I need a calendar, I need PDA or mobile sync.

Thunderbird may be a nice mail client, but it cannot substitute Evolution. Therefore I doubt Evolution will ever be removed for Thunderbird, this doesn't make sense. A fully functional desktop needs a Evolution like app, that's why it's in "ubuntu-desktop"!

Greetz,
bela.

Buffalo Soldier
July 20th, 2006, 04:55 PM
Whenever I read the arguments here (for either application) I'm reminded of an advertisement in the local (Malaysian) television channel.

It's about a car driver complaining and cursing. Why? Because he's stuck in a traffic jam. The cause of it is a construction... people digging holes on the road or roadsite to change the aging-rusty water supply line to a new pipe.

Here are just my personal view... people always want something better, newer, cleaner, faster, more powerful and etc etc than what they have right now. Yet at the same time, people are not willing to sacrifice or suffer some hardship in the short term for a betterment in the long term.

I believe no GNOME developer (or any other software developer) wish their software/creation to be buggy. Nor do they wish to impose suffering and pain on the users of their creation. I don't believe that they are that evil.

Whenever a developer develops Application B as an alternative to Application A. I'm sure he/she did not set out to create something that is lesser than what is already available. BUT, for sure something that is newly created (relative to what already exist) can't work as smoothly as the older application.

I'm sure their intent is for a better application, system, OS or what ever. I'm sure they would want very much to achieve that end objective without making us suffer along the way. But after long deliberation and consideration, some compromise were made so that improvements can be made in some other more fundamental or critical sectors (modularity, scalability, security, etc etc.)

Let's take GStreamer for example. Gstreamer 0.8 was a terrible experience. It works for some codec, but it was disastrous for some. But now we have version 0.10 and a lot improvement has happened. Yes, things can still be improved... but take a step back and see how much better it has become.

For me, the combination of GStreamer plugins (bad, ugly & pitfdll) + w32codec = 95% satisfaction. There are only some version of WMV videos that I can't play.

I'd say lets put some faith on the developers and the people that are at the helm of Ubuntu. Remember, this OS that we are using now... in it's infant days... are no match for the OS that came out from Microsoft (I mean in terms as a Desktop OS). But look how far Linux has come? We are where we are today because we took that risky step in the beginning.

-Humanity to everyone-

aamukahvi
July 20th, 2006, 06:30 PM
Evolution 2.8 looks to be way better than 2.6. Vertical mail view (love this), reworked calendar, smaller memory footprint. I'm all for Evo.
Lookie here: http://blogs.gnome.org/view/sragavan/2006/07/19/0

fmo
July 20th, 2006, 07:05 PM
Why compare Thunderbird and Evolution???

For me they are not in the same category, Evolution is an office tools where Thunderbird is just a plain mail client.

Definitely Evolution for me.

jimmygoon
July 20th, 2006, 07:31 PM
Evolution 2.8 looks to be way better than 2.6. Vertical mail view (love this), reworked calendar, smaller memory footprint. I'm all for Evo.
Lookie here: http://blogs.gnome.org/view/sragavan/2006/07/19/0
I just switched my vote

+1 Evo

Johnsie
July 21st, 2006, 01:43 AM
I like them both so I'm not going to vote. Evolution would be great if it wasn't so heavy.

Buffalo Soldier
July 21st, 2006, 02:22 AM
Evolution 2.8 looks to be way better than 2.6. Vertical mail view (love this), reworked calendar, smaller memory footprint. I'm all for Evo.
Lookie here: http://blogs.gnome.org/view/sragavan/2006/07/19/0

Nice... the Vertical View in Mailer (http://blogs.gnome.org/attachment/sragavan/2006/07/19/0/search-small.png) makes me wish I had a wide screen monitor.

macogw
July 21st, 2006, 07:43 AM
I think I would prefer Thunderbird/Sunbird because I really don't see the point of mixing calendar and email together. Actually, I'd like just Sunbird. I use all web-based email (like yahoo or school email), and I can't use Evolution's calendar unless I set up the email thing on it. That's not cool. I want a by-itself calendar.

If anyone wants to tell me how I can use Evolution without having to set up the email part of it, that'd be nice.

mishranurag
July 21st, 2006, 04:43 PM
I don like either. I like Kontact better than both.

dmery-segp
July 21st, 2006, 07:21 PM
I used Thunderbird because is so simple and I only need a simple email-program.
Regards,
dmery

cataenry
July 23rd, 2006, 11:58 AM
Why not to use a vpackage?
like this:

ubuntu-desktop: depends mail-agent-desktop
mail-agent-desktop: depends(evolution|thunderbird)

as default will be installed the most voted one, and if someone prefer the other, can switch to him without removing ubuntu-desktop.

Is it so bad?

leech
July 24th, 2006, 07:28 AM
Exactly, or better yet would be something like;

evolution provides: mail-agent-desktop
thunderbird provides: mail-agent-desktop
ubuntu-desktop depends: mail-agent-desktop

That way there wouldn't have to be a virtual package of mail-agent-desktop, which when you went to install it wouldn't know if it should install thunderbird or evolution.

Personally, I think that they should stick it out with evolution. The integration is great, and since Ubuntu is trying to get corporate support, they need exchange connectivity. I know it sucks, and I hate exchange server myself, but even without that, there needs to be a groupwise client (which is what Evolution is, it is NOT just an email client, Groupwise is the direction almost all businesses are headed.)

I think what would be cool is for Ubuntu to have full support of Hula on the server end and Evolution on the client end. That would make for a great corporate environment. I just hope the hula packages for debian/ubuntu get some love soon. Hula is extremely easy to set up, and is looking mighty fine.

Leech

zxee
July 31st, 2006, 08:42 PM
I didn't see this poll earlier. I prefer balsa.

Llwyd
July 31st, 2006, 09:21 PM
I use Thunderbird in Windows, but have used "Evolution" since installing ubuntu.

I can't see any real difference between the applications. Thunderbird has limitations and so does Evolution.

Amaranth
July 31st, 2006, 09:42 PM
Thunderbird is a joke compared to Evolution, it doesn't do nearly as much. Why do you want to take away my calendar?

MadMan2k
August 1st, 2006, 12:03 AM
Thunderbird is a joke compared to Evolution, it doesn't do nearly as much. Why do you want to take away my calendar?
but the things it does it does better than evolution. if you really need the features of evolution youre out of luck, since youve got no choice but otherwise...

gnomeuser
August 1st, 2006, 12:05 AM
I'd prefer something simple like the upcoming Modest interface for the Nokia 770 which uses Tinymail. This would save a lot of memory and be much more performant for the general use cases within an Ubuntu desktop.
We could use Contacts and Dates to make up for the remaining functionality in Evolution.

Baring that not happening, Evolution with spamassassin replaced with bogofilter is my solution.

loserboy
August 1st, 2006, 05:30 AM
thunderbird cuz i can't get aol mail in evolution

gnomeuser
August 1st, 2006, 05:35 AM
thunderbird cuz i can't get aol mail in evolution

That sounds like a bug, you might want to file it.

LookTJ
August 1st, 2006, 05:54 AM
im used to thunderbird email client

Shapierian
August 1st, 2006, 06:20 AM
Though not nearly feature complete I'm really starting to like launchpad mail/groupware http://chrislord.net/blog/Software/just-for-fun.essay powered by tinymail. This or a deriviative may be an option for edgy+1

gnomeuser
August 1st, 2006, 07:11 AM
Though not nearly feature complete I'm really starting to like launchpad mail/groupware http://chrislord.net/blog/Software/just-for-fun.essay powered by tinymail. This or a deriviative may be an option for edgy+1

Why oh why do we need all that in one application, seperate applications like the rest of the desktop would work much better, they are totally different use cases anyways.

I'm very anti groupware, such applications tend to be error prone and confusing, a simple email client covers what 90% of everyone is using Evolution for anyways.

Simple seperate applications sharing data via e-d-s or straight through D-Bus.

Mathiasdm
August 1st, 2006, 09:28 AM
Why oh why do we need all that in one application, seperate applications like the rest of the desktop would work much better, they are totally different use cases anyways.

I'm very anti groupware, such applications tend to be error prone and confusing, a simple email client covers what 90% of everyone is using Evolution for anyways.

Simple seperate applications sharing data via e-d-s or straight through D-Bus.
Because some people actually need all of those applications. For some people, it comes in handy to have them all together.

MadMan2k
August 1st, 2006, 11:22 AM
Because some people actually need all of those applications. For some people, it comes in handy to have them all together.
some people is not enough. besides there is no real isadvantage of ahving sperate applications...

Corbelius
August 1st, 2006, 11:28 AM
Evolution is the best mail/calendar/contacts application on Linux.

stoft
August 1st, 2006, 12:15 PM
Neither. Getting Evolution to play with my IMAP was difficult but once it was working it was quite ok, however, after my shift to Kubuntu from Sarge I never reinstalled it. Thunderbird plays well, I've been using it for the last 6 months or so but now I'm going back to Opera again. I just love Operas interface and have no need for calendars etc.

loserboy
August 1st, 2006, 02:49 PM
That sounds like a bug, you might want to file it.

no its not a bug, aol is just retarded

Mathiasdm
August 1st, 2006, 03:13 PM
some people is not enough. besides there is no real isadvantage of ahving sperate applications...
That's what people use as an excuse to keep their applications Windows-only :p (Sorry, couldn't resist!)

Anyways, I think the main reason Evolution is in there, is because the Gnome devs put it in by default.
It integrates nicely, and I like that.

aamukahvi
August 1st, 2006, 03:45 PM
[re:evolution] It integrates nicely, and I like that.
Me too. And the fact that it's getting better all the time doesn't hurt.

gnomeuser
August 1st, 2006, 05:12 PM
Evolution is the best mail/calendar/contacts application on Linux.

Please don't make such depressing yet true statements.

Amaranth
August 1st, 2006, 11:44 PM
What? It's not that bad. Certainly better than Outlook (well, I haven't used Outlook in awhile but every release got slower for me).

cssutto
August 2nd, 2006, 02:58 AM
I decided to try Thunderbird just to see.

Evolution works fine for me. Bogo and smapassin have by spam whipped 99.99%.

But I decided to have a look.

How do I move all of my address book from EVO to TB?

Why can't TB talk to bogo?

CSSJR

cssutto
August 2nd, 2006, 03:00 AM
I decided to try Thunderbird just to see.

Evolution works fine for me. Bogo and spamassassin have my spam whipped 99.99%.

But I decided to have a look.

How do I move all of my address book from EVO to TB?

Why can't TB talk to bogo?

Typso, typos, typos....yuk

CSSJR

nekr0z
August 6th, 2006, 01:38 AM
Well, I have to say I voted for TB, but neither of them is perfect.

TB is great with its extensions, but definitely lacks PIM component (although Calendar + ReminderFox do well for me, Evolution is better at this aspect). TB's address book is poor: where are the photos? Why can a person have only one cellular phone number?

Evolution, OTOH, is much more buggy than I can bare, has extremely bad threaded view support and very poor filters. TB's filtering is better, but in TB messages can't be send through some pipe of programs, which would be very nice.

Anyway, both Evo and TB, when speaking about mail component, are not even close to The Bat! (http://www.ritlabs.com/en/products/thebat/) in filtering, address book and comfort of use. This software is definitely a thing opensource mail clients should be heading to compete...

And in PIM component nothing can be compared to MS Outlook, and neither Evo nor Mozilla Calendar/Sunbird are close...

Anyway, I hope that some opensource software will finally head for the leaders and beat them, and then I'll be using that thing, be it Evo or TB or whatever else. With the extension system, TB seems to have more chances, so I'm keeping on it for now.

gnomeuser
August 6th, 2006, 05:35 AM
I was reading Philip Van Hoofs blog and he mentioned wanting to do something like this: http://www.roundcube.net/ with Tinymail for the OLPC project instead of a classic mail client. I've become a HUGE fan of that idea. It just looks like a sexy solution to the problem, in addition he posted a 62 line python mail client using Tinymail and that just plain rocks as well.

I'm growing more and more tired of the big complex mailclients like Thunderbird and Evolution, I really think we need something smaller that would fit better into GNOME and something with a focus on not eating up my ram and CPU.

Amaranth
August 6th, 2006, 05:40 AM
tinymail uses the same backend as evolution for it's mail. It's not impossible to make evolution just as snappy, it's just hard.

nekr0z
August 6th, 2006, 11:10 AM
I don't like the very idea of this simplification. The software itself doesn't have to lack features, it has to have them hidden from unexperienced user. That's the bigger mistake GNOME development team makes...

Maybe 100 people don't need power button to immediately switch the PC off without bringing extra screen, but I need just this. Give me an OPTION, maybe hidden deep in config files, but there HAS TO BE AN OPTION! With no options there's no choice, and with no choice there's no freedom.

So I'm seriously against this simplification. Personally I need the complex mail filtering, and I want an option to do this, even if via plugin or something — so I never use that simple mail client.

I don't remember the author, but the quote rock:
"Make a software even an idiot could easily use, and only idiots will!"

RawMustard
August 6th, 2006, 12:00 PM
@nekr0z

That's it isn't it? We all like simple and clean, but when it comes to the crunch we need the tools to do the job. Gnomes philosophy has been to remove the tools to create simplicity. In contrast, KDE threw in the sink as well to give the tools but just confused everyone. Both ways are not the way it should be done, there must be a middle ground or a way to have both!

nekr0z
August 6th, 2006, 01:25 PM
@RawMustard:

I like "the way to have both" more that the "middle ground". And I think GNOME is doing better than KDE: KDE just gives you all, and this causes overloaded interface and lack of clear look. GNOME doesn't give you anything, but that's not a problem so far things can be ajusted via config files. Unexperienced users get their desired simplicity, while advanced people have all the options they need.

The only thing I would advice si to keep these options available, at least in config files, not the way gnome-screensaver is.

MadMan2k
August 6th, 2006, 02:28 PM
not the way gnome-screensaver is.
hey it got an preview button in edgy!

runes
August 7th, 2006, 07:01 PM
If I really had the choice I'd go with thunderbird, but only when it has calendaring integrated..I need a simple PIM to keep track of meetings and appointments so I'm stuck with Evolution..for now.

toasterofirony
August 7th, 2006, 09:04 PM
Do you mean http://moztraybiff.mozdev.org ?

But does that allow "minimise to tray" which is a feature that I really miss.

That said, I was a Thunderbird user in XP, so I'm a Thunderbird user in Ubuntu. It does pretty much everything I want, has some easy install/ use plugins, isn't an alien terrain like Evolution is.

I'm still toying with the idea of Mozilla, though, just for the integrated experience in a format I'm familiar with.

mik9dt
August 9th, 2006, 01:31 AM
I am very new to Ubuntu, so here is one newbee point of view.
I initially used Evolution and was pleased to see a windows version.
Great, I can install Evolution on my wifes windows xp desktop and we can have one family wide email prog that we can all learn and use on each others computers.....
Not great, the windows xp version just can not be made to run on my wifes windows xp computer, well, not in any way that makes it look useable....
Guess what, Thunderbird works perfectly for me on Ubuntu and for her on the Windows xp pc. It's working for us and we are both happy.
If Evolution had worked on the windows computer we would both be using it now, almost by default. As Evolution is promoted as a cross platform application that is supposed to be helping tempt Windows users to move to Linux.... well, so far it just isn't doing the job. In fact it's performance on her Windows XP pc was really poor, not a great advert for Ubuntu.
Sadly, windows is wagging my Ubuntu tail.

mik9dt
August 9th, 2006, 01:41 AM
P.S.
With all this swapping between Outlook, Evolution and Thunderbird something really annoyed me.
Now, I probably just missed it, but Evolution is really keen to import data from other email progs..... I'm driving myself insane trying to find any way to export data.
Someone please jump in to correct me if I'm wrong about this.

audioboxer217
August 12th, 2006, 04:17 PM
If I really had the choice I'd go with thunderbird, but only when it has calendaring integrated..I need a simple PIM to keep track of meetings and appointments so I'm stuck with Evolution..for now.
Mozilla is working on a Calendar that is integrated with Thunderbird. Actually, they are testing both a standalone (sunbird) and an integrated (lightning) calendar app. I really like lightning myself

basse1989
August 12th, 2006, 09:19 PM
I like evolution more simply because it's a native gtk app, not something that doesn't fit into the GNOME desktop.

Not that I ever use a mail app tho, I only use webmail. But that's what I think.

Schalken
August 13th, 2006, 07:10 AM
I use Evolution because it's part of GNOME, uses its themes etc. One thing I love is being able to click on the GNOME clock/calendar in the top right and double-click on a date to create an appointment in Evolution. Brilliant. Official GNOME Applications always win over for me because of their integration.

it.henrik
August 13th, 2006, 10:36 AM
Thunderbird is great .. but I am thinking of swtiching to evolution because its desktop integration .. maybe its possible to write a gnome desktop integration plugin... that would be awesome :)

robzon
August 13th, 2006, 11:43 PM
If I needed only a mail client - Thunderbird.
Evolution has this nice calendaring thru WebDAV and an address book thru ldap. I like networked stuff, as I work on different computers (all Ubuntu! :D) and want to have this basic information whereever I am :]

AlexC_
August 14th, 2006, 07:54 AM
But does that allow "minimise to tray" which is a feature that I really miss.

That said, I was a Thunderbird user in XP, so I'm a Thunderbird user in Ubuntu. It does pretty much everything I want, has some easy install/ use plugins, isn't an alien terrain like Evolution is.

I'm still toying with the idea of Mozilla, though, just for the integrated experience in a format I'm familiar with.

Yeh it does have a "minimise to tray" feature, when the Thunderbird Icon appears in the erm, "tray" ( I've forgot what its called in Gnome >< ) then Thunderbird will not appear in the application list, but just in that system tray thingy - click it again to open thunderbird.

Ahhh I hate mornings.

bruce89
August 14th, 2006, 01:49 PM
It's bad enough that Ubuntu uses Firefox instead of the Gnome default Epiphany, so I vote for Evolution. It is a much more comprehesive program, even if people on Edgy just now (I have a seperate install of Edgy) can't use it at the moment.

ubuntu_demon
August 14th, 2006, 09:53 PM
I personally prefer thunderbird so I voted thunderbird.

I prefer evolution on default for Edgy because it more resembles outlook. People who want thunderbird probably know they want it and have little trouble installing it (add/remove menu).

skidawg
August 15th, 2006, 01:09 AM
I have been using Evolution for about 3 years now. For the most part I do like it, but the one thing that bugs me (alot) is that is a pain to update. The repositories don't always update to the latest version. If you need to update it by hand, it is a very difficult thing to do.

This is made more difficult for me, since I primarily use KDE, not Gnome.

The thing that I like about Thunderbird, it is it not tied to the Operating System or Window Manager. That is one reason I stopped using windows, I got tired of IE crashing and taking down the entire OS.

My biggest gripe about Thunderbird, is that importing the addressbook and messaage fileters, and my account setting is not very easy. It was very easy to import my mail from Evolution to Thunderbird, so at least that was a plus.

graigsmith
August 15th, 2006, 09:25 AM
as long as you have bogofilter and its plugin turned on in evolution, spam filtering works great. There is nothing wrong with evolution.

However mail filtering should come as a default. EVERYONE NEEDS junk mail filtering!!!! otherwise if we dont have it, its completely useless as an email client. i get 1-2 real emails a day, and like 40 or so junk ones.

graigsmith
August 15th, 2006, 09:30 AM
It's bad enough that Ubuntu uses Firefox instead of the Gnome default Epiphany, so I vote for Evolution. It is a much more comprehesive program, even if people on Edgy just now (I have a seperate install of Edgy) can't use it at the moment.

but epiphany doesn't work with the little side mouse buttons. no back and forward :( on the mouse :(

not having the side buttons working in nautilus is mildly permissible, but in a web browser? i would freak out if i had to click the back button every time. ](*,)

epiphany does seem a bit faster than firefox, but its actually slower, cause there is more mousing around because of the side buttons. and also there are less timesaving plugins available.

kernelpanicked
August 16th, 2006, 04:41 AM
1 here for thunderbird. With enigmail, thunderbird's pgp integration rocks hard. Also, the real deal breaker with Evolution is that I have to install probably 10 ssl certificates a day on customer's servers. These get emailed to me from Verisign and Thawte, and Evolution happily screws the format and makes them useless.

donar73
August 16th, 2006, 06:39 AM
One more for Thunderbird. Evolution isn't that bad at all, and with bogofilter enabled even spam-filtering works quite well, but in my opinion the handling of html-mails is much better in Thunderbird.

tuxcantfly
August 18th, 2006, 10:41 PM
thunderbird, for better migration purposes. lots of ubuntu folks are coming from the windows world, where they used firefox/thunderbird, not epiphany/evolution. bundling thunderbird as default would make their lives easier

nw15062
August 19th, 2006, 01:33 AM
Evolution has some great new features coming up as well as some new UI improvments, I love evolution although I think it wouldnt hurt to seperate the email aspect from the Calender and contacts features, ofcourse that is what Tiny mail is all about.

Dbus is to allow seamless integration from diffrent applications without having them as one giant app. Having to many purposes actually detract the user.

Microsoft has finally realized this and aple has knwon for some time, look at vista calender and contacts and look at apples calander and contacts.

Both Dates and Contacts for ubuntu work really well and they communicate seamlessly with other evolution based features, although origianlly designed for Nokia 770 it still works great on the desktop and is fast and flexible.

woedend
August 19th, 2006, 01:43 AM
im with nw completely. I dont need a calander, a date book, an alarm, notes. I just want a FEATURED email client, which is why I use thunderbird. Evolution and MS outlook make me dizzy.

dmitry_roslyakov
August 19th, 2006, 09:17 PM
What do you prefer?

I use Thunderbird. I tried Evolution but it displays subjects incorrectly for messages in Russian. Thunderbird does it well. So no chance for Evolution.

engla
August 19th, 2006, 11:46 PM
Since I voted (Some months ago) I've switched from Thunderbird to Evolution. Evolution launches faster, has the calendar module and is better integrated to Ubuntu.

Matchless
August 20th, 2006, 09:00 AM
Thunderbird! When installing Kubuntu, Thunderbird, Firefox and Synaptic are the first to be installed to replace the unpopular default installations.
The fact that it can run on windows and linux, has outstanding support and documentation and has the fabulous extention facility, makes it a winner all the way!! Why its still not on the Kubuntu install CD no-one knows.

caryb
August 20th, 2006, 09:08 AM
I was wondering the same myself, I use Kubuntu & have to install it manually.


Cary:mrgreen:

toasterofirony
August 21st, 2006, 08:31 PM
Can I change my vote?

I've been playing about with KDE and ending up using KCal just to keep a track on appointments and the like; but when that went belly up, I went back to gnome and Evolution. Everything translated nicely, but no system tray icon still.

If I knew how, I'd make a plug in for it - Honestly, I don't know why there isn't one yet :-k

nekr0z
August 21st, 2006, 08:45 PM
I tell you why Thunderbird is not the default mail client for Kubuntu: because kmail is at all times better! Seriously.

The problem is, using kontact/kmail in GNOME is quite a pain in the ****, so in GNOME we need Thunderbird.

graphic23
August 21st, 2006, 11:10 PM
I honestly think Evolution 2.8 is shaping up really nicely and I am really liking it. It uses less memory, has some nice new features, and does everything that I want it to do and more.

wilbur.harvey
August 22nd, 2006, 12:14 AM
I have used thunderbird since it was beta. It is nice, easy to use, and reliable. You can point all your machines clients to one set of files on a newtork share and sumultaneously access your email from multiple machines (some windows, some linux).
My company uses Microsoft products so I had to start using Evolution (about 4 months ago) to have access to the company calendar.
The antispan doesn't work as well in evolution, it is not as convient to use, I cannot have my different email providers in seperate folders, but most importantly it crashes and hangs fairly often. Sometimes I can go several dayes without a crash, so far it has crashed 4 times today. It often times hangs my complete gui and I have to ssh into the machine and do a pkill -U username to get my machine back. In the past every time I tried evolution I quite because it was so unstable, it seems that they haven't made much progress as far as stability goes. If I didn't have to use it for work, I would definitly NOT use it.

jimmygoon
August 22nd, 2006, 02:41 AM
If I could change my vote... I like Evolution a lot better now and i'm not even using the newest version (I'm still in dapper... I might dual boot edgy once knot2 comes out)

ivoks
August 22nd, 2006, 02:27 PM
I've used evolution and thunderbird quite a lot. Both have their advantages and disadvantages. With the time, thunderbird got a lot slower, and evolution got a lot quicker.

At some point evolution got quicker than thunderbird. But that wasn't enough for me to switch back to evolution. One serious bug made me totaly forget thunderbird and never touch it again - it doesn't save attachments right. This happens in 1 of 100 attachments, but it's annoying.

Finaly, I don't use neither of those two, but sylpheed-clas-gtk2. Still, I miss some nice features from Evolution and I'm thinking to get back to it.

(i didn't vote)

aamukahvi
August 22nd, 2006, 08:43 PM
At some point evolution got quicker than thunderbird. But that wasn't enough for me to switch back to evolution. One serious bug made me totaly forget thunderbird and never touch it again - it doesn't save attachments right. This happens in 1 of 100 attachments, but it's annoying.
One feature I loved about Thunderbird was that you could delete an attachment from a message in the mailbox without deleting the message itself. I haven't found this in Evolution. Maybe in 2.8?

ivoks
August 22nd, 2006, 09:21 PM
No such feature in evolution 2.8 :)

Zelut
August 28th, 2006, 06:00 AM
I'm using Evolution mainly because I need connection to our office Exchange server. If anyone has any alternatives that are compatible with Exchange I'd be willing to check them out. Evolution works for what I need now, but I like the rest of Thunderbird better.

lithorus
August 28th, 2006, 11:09 AM
I'm using Evolution mainly because I need connection to our office Exchange server. If anyone has any alternatives that are compatible with Exchange I'd be willing to check them out. Evolution works for what I need now, but I like the rest of Thunderbird better.
IMAP

Imap supports server side storage and things like server side search. If you need contacts lookup you might want to check out the ldap support in both Evolution and Thunderbird. Even though Evolution supports exchange servers it's pretty much just a wrapper for the OWA page. It has tons of problems.
IMAP ofcourse doesn't let you use the exchange calendar :(

Zelut
August 28th, 2006, 07:00 PM
Yeah, I understand that Evolution just basically wraps the OWA--I thought that was the only way anyone has figured out to do it yet.

Right now my contacts don't work anyway & I don't use the Calendar. All I need is the email in/out & archivable/searchable. If someone can point me to how to get that set up in Thunderbird I'd definitely give it a try. I do like Thunderbird overall more, just reverted to Evolution for the OWA.

LosD
September 1st, 2006, 04:17 PM
The Evolution IMAP freezes is an Ubuntu problem... I used Gentoo before, and never had that problem. Almost went back because of it!

Evolution kicks Thunderbird's *** in every single way, looks better, feels better, is much faster with big IMAP mailboxes and has better spam filters (If configured). Oh, and vfolders rules.

Thunderbird's spamfilter stops almost nothing anymore, a few random words in the end of the mail, and it's game over.

dbasis
September 3rd, 2006, 05:19 AM
well some posted to exchange evolution by all these mozilla standalones,but i think, first itīs pretty handy having an all-in-one office-programm, and second, I think itīs the better choice to deliever the distro with a programm that has great chances, but still some bugs, than with a completed one;itīs a challenge for everybody and challenges are what brought us (as humans) as far as we are.

anelson77388
October 11th, 2006, 07:12 PM
I am converting my wife (a long time Windows user) to Dapper on a new laptop we bought her. It looks like we will switch her to Thuderbird based on the fact that when she replies to email messages she wants her reply and her signature on top of the text she is quoting. Thuderbird will let her do this, Evolution won't as far as I know.

Allan

ivoks
October 12th, 2006, 08:16 AM
Heh, but that's wrong use of email. It's like 'I don't like Firefox cause it doesn't support viruses" :)

SpinesN
October 12th, 2006, 08:41 AM
Evolution for the gnome calendar and task list integration :)

Magnes
October 12th, 2006, 09:37 AM
I use thunderbird (because I'm used to it and I set not to download full e-mail but only headers - Evolution can't do that as I heard but it's posibble I heard wrong), but I think for beginners Evolution is better (and I'm considering moving to it some day).

Kateikyoushi
October 12th, 2006, 11:01 AM
TB, I do not use gnome that's one reason to prefer TB and I keep some of my mails but to cut down the size have to save the attachments.
I can compress the TB interface to take up much less space than Evo.
Spamfilter of TB seems to be better.

But I wish TB's vertical layout would look like Evo's, hopefully it is coming soon.

Zelut
October 13th, 2006, 10:50 PM
I hear rumour of Thunderbird offering support for Exchange in the next version? I have become comfortable with Evolution (need Exchange support for work), but I do overall like Thunderbird more.

If anyone can verify that I'd be interested in following the progress & upgrading when available.

George W. Tush
October 14th, 2006, 05:33 PM
I've not mastered Evolution, but I still prefer it to Thunderbird. The Thunderbird program is fine, but the development and administration of its development is chaotic. I need a calendar function combined with my email client and I had it with Thunderbird... until... the email client was upgraded in a way that conflicted with the calendar. Then I lost access to a lot of important data and important functionality.

Thunderbirds is fine, but beware the extensions. Beware.

rabideau
February 9th, 2008, 03:20 PM
Truth be told the question/ poll is a bit like asking if you prefer a text editor to an office document processor....

Thunderbird is a very good email client (but that's about it)
Evolution is Groupware
To my mind, Evolution is analogous to Outlook (full sized) with exchange-like properties. So if you need the power of a toolset similar to Outlook running with Exchange in the Linux world then Evolution is the choice (albeit not perfect)...
if you need a reliable analog for Outlook Express that works in the Linux world then Thunderbird is an excellent choice.

Just my two cents.... personally I'm moving from T'bird to Evolution even though I LOVE the customizing aspects of T'bird (Evolution seems to lack those, for the most part).:(

nekr0z
February 9th, 2008, 03:36 PM
That's true, rabideau, but to my mind, Thunderbird+Lightning is quite close to what one can expect of a Groupware. Compared to that, slow and heavy Evolution looks too bloated to me.

Lucamaxx
February 14th, 2008, 10:32 AM
Hello to everybody !

Does anybony knows how to set Evolution for fetching only headers of incoming messages ?

I connect often with my portable phone and I have only few megabytes per day with my web provider .

I use a POP3 mail server , in Evolution preferences I did not found anything to get this feature that is easy to set in thunderbird.

rabideau
February 14th, 2008, 03:21 PM
I thought I knew how to do the headers thing but can't seem to find the settings for that either.

Along similar vein, does anyone know how to make an open message close automatically after a reply?:confused:

simon_ives
August 14th, 2008, 06:41 AM
Evolution for me too.

The only thing that I reminisce for in my Thunderbird days is its better support for html email. Evolution seems to only support inline css whereas Thunderbird could support styles in the header and, if I remember correctly, linked css too.

hessiess
August 14th, 2008, 10:14 AM
Thunderbird, could never get Evolution to work propaly

NWAdawg
August 14th, 2008, 10:44 AM
thunderbird wins hands down. I only need a email client and it suits my needs perfectly.

+1 I like it keep it simple.

cdillard-hsp
August 26th, 2008, 04:42 AM
I actually like Evolution and Thunderbird. The reason I switched to Tbird is because people were complaining that attachments sent from me via Evolution showed up as ATT0001.DAT files, not the intended file format.

abdulwahed
September 28th, 2008, 08:37 PM
i have been using TB before i shift to linux world, TB is better than evolution in customization and platform supporting, its more easy to use with nice UI.

klange
September 28th, 2008, 08:39 PM
I've been using Shredder (Thunderbird nightly) for the past two weeks, combined with Lightning (also a nightly build). The improvements to the GTK interface that crossed over from Firefox are phenomenal.
Before making the switch to an unreleased build, I tried one last time to use Evolution and I couldn't stand it.

Skorzen
September 28th, 2008, 11:43 PM
Actually, I prefer Thunderbird. But Evolution is also a good e-mail client.

celem
December 30th, 2008, 03:20 AM
I really use web based mail, primary is Yahoo mail, secondary is gmail. For me using my Palm Pilot is vital. The calendar in evolution is poor, at least for me. It is fixed to a five day week and has Saturday and Sunday in a single box AND it cannot be changed. For my use, each day must be separate. I ended up deleting evolution and installing Thunderbird and J-Pilot. Thunderbird is there for a resident email client and J-Pilot does my Palm stuff, with, I might add, a perfect calendar implementation.

johann_p
February 17th, 2009, 09:51 PM
Evolution has a better integration of calendar and email, for example you can easily convert an email to a task.
You can also define "follow-up" actions and deadlines for emails which is extremely important and useful when your work is based on emails to a large part.

Evolution also has a couple of additional useful features, e.g. one can pipe an email through a program as part of a filter action.

I have also read that evolution allows synchronization of PIM information with mobile phones with the msynctool command while Thunderbird does not.

docus
February 22nd, 2009, 03:54 PM
Thunderbird's faster and more stable than Evolution on my system. Evolution crashes every time it tries to check my Gmail folders for changes (i.e. every time I load it).

EDIT: I take that back... I've got Evolution up and running now and it seems stable. Still prefer Thunderbird though...

runes
March 24th, 2009, 02:23 PM
Thunderbird's faster and more stable than Evolution on my system. Evolution crashes every time it tries to check my Gmail folders for changes (i.e. every time I load it).

EDIT: I take that back... I've got Evolution up and running now and it seems stable. Still prefer Thunderbird though...

Coming from a Windows background I tried to find a similar application to MSOutlook. While Thunderbird is a fantastic mail application, it is still lacking integrated scheduling and calendaring although I do see Lightening 0.9 Mozilla plugin for calendaring...hmmm.
I will keep reviewing the application though as I always liked Mozilla's work but for now it's Evolution.

hachel
March 28th, 2009, 09:08 PM
I switched to evolution 30 minutes ago.

I read everywhere about it's integration, but the only integration seems to be the calendar into the system-clock.
I wish there was a new-mail-notification without having to leave evolution open all the time.

Also I'm not able to filter new mails to check whether the sender is in my addressbook/contacts. That is actually the one thing I miss from thunderbird

coolbrook
April 2nd, 2009, 11:59 PM
I've been trying both today and while I won't need reminders on the user's PIM, I do notice that currently Thunderbird (Lightning) needs to be open for event reminder notifications. Evolution doesn't have to be open for the reminders to pop up. That's a plus. But there's parity. Eventually I'll be using a smartphone again, so whichever syncs best with it will be my choice in the future.

manishtech
April 3rd, 2009, 12:21 AM
I am using Thunderbird 2 and I want to have one more feature.
I want to choose mail signatures even after I have clicked on Compose. The email signature is sort of hard-coded attached to the profiles.

stchman
April 3rd, 2009, 12:26 AM
I use Evolution. I use to use Outlook and Evolution's interface is very familiar. Easy to use and already comes with the distro OOB.

rygle
May 11th, 2009, 03:57 AM
I am using Thunderbird 2 and I want to have one more feature.
I want to choose mail signatures even after I have clicked on Compose. The
email signature is sort of hard-coded attached to the profiles.

There is a plugin called something like Signature Select that will allow you to choose different signatures. It will default to a particular signature based on the email address you are using, but can be easily changed.

manishtech
May 11th, 2009, 07:42 AM
There is a plugin called something like Signature Select that will allow you to choose different signatures. It will default to a particular signature based on the email address you are using, but can be easily changed.
Thanks a lot, will check it out

starcannon
May 11th, 2009, 08:53 AM
Depends on what I'm doing; email from family and friends, Thunderbird everytime. Email for work related topics, Evolution every time.

I use both, I have seperate email accounts, and where necassary filters (for the occasional gave out the wrong email adress). I don't let the client delete mail from the server, I do a clean up every few months.

Thats how I like to do things; probably not the most effecient, but it works for me.

docus
May 12th, 2009, 10:37 PM
Hmmm, I've been using Thunderbird for a while and I like it but I've been trying out Evolution since 9.04 and I like it too.

I've done side-by-side tests on my system and they seem to download and send messages almost as fast as each other (perhaps T-bird shades it, not sure). I can't yet decide on one over the other in terms of functionality or aesthetics.

The experiment continues...

Choice is good!

raktarna
June 2nd, 2009, 04:21 AM
is it possible to detach attachments in Evolution? how?

timzak
June 10th, 2009, 08:27 PM
Evolution is a little behind Thunderbird/Lightning in event reminders. That's the only area I really knock Evo. Otherwise I really like it. My favorite part is how it integrates into Gnome and the panel clock. You click on the clock and you get a mini calendar and can see all your upcoming appointments and birthdays!

Specifically, in my experience, Evolution by default will not pop up reminders in Ubuntu (I hear it does in SUSE, though). It sends the reminder to the notification area, and only after clicking on the notification icon will the reminder pop up. Apparently you can fix this manually: http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=5841961&postcount=9

Also, Evolution seems not to trigger reminders if you turn your computer on after a reminder was set to go off. So if your reminder was set to activate at 5pm on a given day and you turn your computer on at 5:01pm, you will never get the reminder.

Thunderbird/Lightning, in contrast, keeps reminding you even past appointment times, and will not stop reminding you until you "dismiss" the appointment yourself.

lazyart
June 21st, 2009, 04:47 AM
My beef with Evolution is the lack of the option to Delete Mail from Server when deleted in Evolution. Yeah, I know POP wasn't meant for that, but every other mail client does it and it's convenient to see your mail on multiple machines... or web mail in a pinch. Until that is an option, it's Thunderbird for me.

JordyD
June 21st, 2009, 06:47 AM
I don't use either of them. I'm perfectly happy with the Gmail interface.

elamericano
June 26th, 2009, 02:01 AM
I used Evolution for a couple of years, and I'm glad Thunderbird finally has a decent calendar so I could switch. Evolution mostly had the features I wanted, but it was so slooow. It also had a hard time dealing with being out of touch with my IMAP server. If I was connected to a LAN, but no VPN to the mail server, it would spin. You would think that when the server came back it would find it then, but no. I would have to kick it offline and back on. Too often, clicking the offline button would make it hang, and I would have to kill it.

So in summary, bad IMAP, unstable. Good luck, but good riddance.

Thank you, Lightning developers. You don't import meeting updates at the moment, but Evolution didn't either.

Ojustaboo
June 26th, 2009, 10:15 AM
Due to having to dual boot, I have my email on a separate partition and access it from either windows or Ubuntu, hence I have to use Thunderbird

stinger30au
June 26th, 2009, 12:11 PM
putup with thunderbird for a year, gave it the flick and switched to evolution

best thing i ever did, so glad i did it

jolo
June 27th, 2009, 07:48 AM
Let us not forget how active and generous the Mozilla community is. Thunderbird (as it is with Firefox), has a constant flow of new and free contributions of add-ins. To me that is major. It gives enormous flexibility to Thunderbird as well as Firefox and we shall see what happens with Songbird.

Jon


Coming from a Windows background I tried to find a similar application to MSOutlook. While Thunderbird is a fantastic mail application, it is still lacking integrated scheduling and calendaring although I do see Lightening 0.9 Mozilla plugin for calendaring...hmmm.
I will keep reviewing the application though as I always liked Mozilla's work but for now it's Evolution.

starcannon
June 28th, 2009, 10:54 AM
I prefer both.

I use Evolution; my Wife and Kids use Thunderbird.

izak
July 15th, 2009, 12:28 PM
Thunderbird for three reasons.

With Lightning and the googlecalendar extension I can read AND write to my google calendar.

It supports Afrikaans dictionary for spell checking.

Easy migration from Windows Thunderbird usage.

psylem
July 28th, 2009, 06:17 AM
If you are looking for MS Exchange integration, Thunderbird+Lightning+DavMail is currently the best (free) thing for it. I used Evolution for a long time on 8.04 before switching to Thunderbird due to the following (of course, these may have been fixed or may not apply to everyone):


Password manager is broken and has been for about 12 months it seems. No one cares to fix it. You have to type your password in each session.
A bug with the Evolution/Nvidia/Compiz combination of packages causes the cursor to leave garbage on the screen when you use the cursor keys in a new mail message.
HTML support sucks, the development community seem hell bent against it.
It can't handle contacts with ">" in the name, which is a convention we use to keep mailing lists at the top of the list. This character will cause it to generate invalid mail headers, destroy the html layout of the email and makes me look like an ***, especially when sending announcements to groups like ">ALL STAFF".
Occasionally the evolution-exchange plugin cache gets corrupted and you loose random mails, but you wouldn't know unless you check occasionally in OWA or Outlook. You have to delete the whole cache and download them all again.


These were just the most serious down sides of my Evolution experience, coupled with the upsides of Thunderbird, it was a simple decision once I figured out how to get the MS Exchange integration working.

Two months now on Thunderbird and I'm still happy as a clam! Further details about my adventure can be read here... http://ubergeeky.com/blog/94-bye-bye-evolution-welcome-back-thunderbird

CyberLegionX
August 13th, 2009, 01:59 PM
It supports Afrikaans dictionary for spell checkingThank you for this information, now I won't have to worry about it anymore myself, I use Thunderbird because it is all I need and its add-ins are pretty nifty to have as an option

hoppipolla
August 14th, 2009, 12:21 PM
I don't use Evolution, and if I try to do a

sudo aptitude remove evolution
I get this

Next packages will be REMOVED
evolution evolution-exchange evolution-plugins ubuntu-desktop

So I would like to see Thunderbird in Edgy

What do you prefer?

Haha that code quote is amazing lol xD

But yeah I prefer Thunderbird, I find it cleaner and more impressive, but then I haven't used Evolution much to be fair.

MC707
October 24th, 2009, 04:30 PM
Haha that code quote is amazing lol xD

But yeah I prefer Thunderbird, I find it cleaner and more impressive, but then I haven't used Evolution much to be fair.

Why is that? Remember ubuntu-desktop is just a meta package... nothing that will destroy your desktop if you remove it :P

hoppipolla
October 24th, 2009, 07:14 PM
I actually prefer Evolution, but then I prefer KMail to Evolution :)


EDIT -- haha I just noticed my quoted post!

That's old though, my opinion has changed since then! I tried Evolution instead of Thunderbird and found it worked better for me and had a clean interface. Then I switched to KMail when I went onto KDE and discovered it had some features I wanted which I couldn't find in Evolution :)

kimda
October 24th, 2009, 07:54 PM
Evolution. Thunderbird doesn't support ldap addressbook editing. I need a central ldap addressbook at my office. I also use squirrelmail to access my mail remotely and mutt (via ssh).

kvarley
October 24th, 2009, 07:56 PM
Thunderbird should be the default mail client in Lynx!

misfitpierce
October 24th, 2009, 10:10 PM
I used to use Thunderbird but I like Evolution for Ubuntu/*Nix. It's actually a really good app and everything is quite useful (calendar, phonebook, email, etc.). I prefer Evolution over Thunderbird now.

brookie
October 24th, 2009, 10:20 PM
Thunderbird with the following add-ons installed:
- Google Contacts
- Lightning
- Provider for Google Calendar

These add-ons let you sync your gmail google calendar and contacts. I could never get Evolution to write to my google calendar properly.

Cheers,
brook :-)

Groucho Marxist
October 24th, 2009, 11:50 PM
I'm currently an Evolution user, as the calendar feature is extremely important for me. However, I am going to give Thunderbird a try and then decide which one I will continue to use.

Barriehie
October 25th, 2009, 03:00 AM
I would like to use evolution except:
1) It's kind of buggy and crashes sometimes.
2) It can't deliver mail to bluebottle.com

I do like the calendar it's got and would rather have one app running instead of two, i.e. thudnerbird and sunbird.

Barrie

Bachstelze
October 25th, 2009, 03:14 AM
I use Horde sitting on my server, as it allows me to have an identical mail system regardless of where I happen to be.

If I had to choose one of them, Thunderbird, but Kontact is superior imo.

Foster Grant
October 28th, 2009, 01:12 AM
I love how certain topics keep bubbling back up. :D

I've used all three of the major Linux mail clients discussed in this thread for several months at a run and I always end up coming back to Thunderbird with the Lightning extension added on. I love the extension framework and the capabilities it adds to the program (Track Package (https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/thunderbird/addon/908), for instance---you don't realize you need it until you use it; then you can't live without it).

Is there any way to get GNOME's Clock panel applet to sync its calendar with Thunderbird instead of Evolution?